TL Mafia XXXVIII

On April 09 2011 11:49 tnkted wrote:
Which of the following is in your PM?

1) "You are the MAFIA"
2) "Try to look clean or something"
3) "Justice.... law... Order..."
4) "Three banhammers"

On April 11 2011 07:29 Kavdragon wrote:
As part of my plan to help newer people out, I present the first part of my guide to analysis. I was hoping to post this after i had finished the whole thing, but it would seem that we could use it already.


      Over the my past four games, I've had the opporunity to participate with scum teams twice. The experiance of being on a scum team was really helpful in identifying ways of finding scum, because I got to know how scum teams work; the challenges they are faced with, the reasons why scum still act scummy even though they know to avoid it, and so forth. Now that I'm not scum, I'd like to pass these things on. So without further ado, here's my two cents on scum.





      When I first started playing mafia, I was confused how a scumtell would ever work. If there was such a thing as a scum tell, why wouldn't mafia just NOT do that thing? I didn't understand why mafia would NOT participate as much as the town, or why they would try to not contribute, while looking like they really are. Then I got on a scum team, and i figured it out: Scum tells are things that are extremely difficult to avoid even when you know about them.

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When you are on a scum team, there are two key factors that alter your play: You are on a team, and you know who is scum. These are both things that you cannot avoid. Because of this, scum tells can be built off of them.

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Because you are on a team, you will be talking to the other members of your team. This takes away a significant portion of your time, especially if you had team members that were as funny as mine were. Beginner scum players want to look like they are contributing because they are not good at hiding a lack of contribution yet, so they actually try to contribute. Unfortunately they don't have as much time to evaluate what is happening and what is the best plan for town at the moment. Because of this, they fall back on giving general advice, and give no real opinions on the current situation. Better/Veteran scum players actually try to look like they are contributing, but are really good at hiding the fact that they aren't. Activity can be increased to accommodated this, or excuses can be given for not contributing as much, so it can be somewhat unreliable, but it is still a good hint to work off of. (Especially when you are dealing with older players)

The second difference between you and scum is that they know who is scum. Obvious, no? But it has implications that are ridiculously hard to shake. When you are scum, it's really, hard to form opinions on who looks scummy. I don't mean that it's hard to say "Incog looks scummy". I mean that it's hard to actually believe that someone looks/is scum, because you know that they aren't. This is compounded by the fact that you talking to your scum buddies when you otherwise would be going over people's posts trying to figure out who looks scummy.

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To recap, the things you are looking for are a lack of contribution, and a lack of clear opinions (especially when it comes to the alignment of someone). What does this look like?

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Well, the lack of contribution for new scum players will look like people posting a lot of one liners and other stuff that shows that they are there, but aren't actually contributing new ideas/opinions to the discussion. If there's a player that's just sitting around posting things like "I agree" or making non-committal statements about the situation, there's a large chance they are doing something else. It makes no sense for a townie to be around posting on the thread all day but not spending time to contribute. As players get better, the lack of contribution becomes harder to spot. Some will disguise it with relevant and helpful information. On the surface it looks like they are helping people out, but if the knowledge is common, then what have they helped with? Nothing. I'm not an advanced scum player by any means and I've not played with any, so I can't inform you as well as I'd like in this area, but ask foolishness if you have more questions.

The lack of strong opinions of people is one of my favorite ways to hunt scum, because I know how hard it is to avoid it as scum. It usually manifests itself in contradiction, and will something like this: A player says that Qatol looks really scummy, and then a day later votes Qatol for mayor. When you are scum, you're thinking about what will be beneficial for your team, so you will support a lynch at one point, then forgot that you did, and say something contradictory later. A player says that they have a town read on someone, and then a while later they vote for their lynch without giving a reason for the change of mind. Contradictions like these are awesome when you catch them. Another one: Someone says that the mayor is overrated, and not that powerful, and proceeds to talk about nothing other than the mayor for the next day.


The next section is on analysis and arguing/pushing for your target.

On April 11 2011 21:48 GMarshal wrote:
First of all, let me say that those of you saying that you aren't voting for me because I have votes are being silly, but w/e. I'm playing to my usual town abilities, and while I may not be the best I assure you I am town. While you guys may find my PbP analysis of wiggles, lackluster, im at least trying to find scum. Also those of you linking me to ON and M0nsterChef are being stupid, they voted for me, for who knows what reason. I'm willing to lynch ON on the provided analysis, since it seems solid and he fits the description of the type of lurkers I seek to punish.

If he flips red you can feel free to scrutinize the hell out of me. If he flips green, well then I expect you to reconsider the intelligence of voting Protactinium for anything at all, although by then if the town has been foolish enough to vote him in it will be too late.

On April 11 2011 22:01 Mig wrote:
It's pretty shitty for me that the one person to look at my posts and decide that I was probably green suddenly became #1 on everyone's lynch list. It's definitely a lose lose for me. If he flips green it doesn't clear me and if he flips red I am going to be targeted super hard.

Personally I do think there's a good chance ON is green but I only say that because I know I am green. If ON is red I don't really know what motivation he would have for saying I am green when he can easily just analyze me as red and most people will agree with him.

Also this is the same situation for you GMarshal. If ON flipped green I don't think it would clear you of being a red at all. Especially since you said you would be fine lynching him and if you were both reds then that seems kind of suicidal.

On April 11 2011 23:02 kitaman27 wrote:
DarthThienAn - Quotes one of Kav's newbie posts to tell us that he agrees and then proceeds to vote for pandain, the fake dt claim.

On April 11 2011 23:03 Mig wrote:



Right I don't know about anyone else for sure all I said was that I know that I am green obviously and I made a guess that there's a decent chance ON is green just because if he were red I figured he would have fingered me as red.

On April 12 2011 09:30 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
How am I relying solely on myself to win the game? I mean obviously town discussion will influence me but I'd never adopt a policy of "mayor must vote with the majority"

The mayor is not the only player in this game. Every town aligned player must bring it on themselves to do their own analysis and help guide the discussion toward killing scum. Just because I'm not going to vote how everyone else wants me to vote does not = town relying on just me.

If you sheep me and rely only on what I say and do that's a choice YOU make. Don't make that choice. I'm making the choice not to sheep with the majority and do my own scumhunting. Everyone in this game should do the same thing.

On April 12 2011 11:06 Coagulation wrote:
Fuck no i dont

On April 13 2011 23:31 Jackal58 wrote:

Why lynch Proact? An assassin or scum will kill him tonight. Don't protect him let him die. If he doesn't ignore him. He's a liar. Anything he says is now pushing a liars agenda. We don't know what he is. All we know is anything he says has to justify his lies. Which one is the lie? How the fuck do I know? All I know is he has 0 credibility with me. He's not worth wasting a lynch on atm. Lynches are priceless to us. Why waste one on an Assassin/DT/Liar? Let the assassins deal with him.

On April 18 2011 04:43 DoctorHelvetica wrote:

very