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On July 25 2011 13:30 Mr. Wiggles wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 13:14 redFF wrote:On July 25 2011 13:06 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
RedFF, how much do you read/watch Harry Potter?
Also, I'm wondering YM, because if you can use it today, it might be best to fire it off, and then WIFOM about your kill/protection.
That's assuming you're town of course. erm i've read the books and seen all the movies except the new one, so average i guess? So... Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 10:41 redFF wrote:
Can the Elder Wand be used at any time or only at night? How did you know the "stick", or "wand" was properly called the Elder Wand? (That's the first mention of it by that name in the thread) This leads me to believe you're in contact with Jackal or one of the role creators of ON/Jackal
erm because he said that the 3 objects were all horcruxes and the elder wand is the only stick horcrux i know of?
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Well I was reading through the thread and was ready to tell everyone to shut up about voldemort/hallows but that conversation seems to have ended, in a comfortably brutal fashion. The things I think about what went on now:
Jackal58, Harry Potter
The question raised now is whether or not the Voldemort/Potter duo is like Joker/Batman was in PTP 1. Is role a reflection of alignment in this case? It would have been natural to think voldy was mafia, but that turned out completely incorrect. It is also possible that they are both town aligned. This remains to be seen. A question I want to put forward is: Should we get Jackal to use the wand in the same way that ON was going to? A double lynch either today or tomorrow? This could prove to be a powerful tool, and is worth considering.
Sandroba, keeper of the wand
My big question is why was he willing to hand out a KP so early on day 1? Unless he knew ON was town somehow, but with the deal of it being handed back to him, that seems highly unlikely. At first I would say he is town, because he was ready to hand the wand over to someone who flipped town instead of someone on his scum team. But then...nobody says that the keepers of the hallows and the collectors have to be on the same team. We really have no guarantee of this either way, but if we see Sand flip before Jackal, we can rest assured that they are not mafia together or Potter would have the wand now.
In conclusion, I'm uncertain on him. This business has introduced a lot of wifom around Sand, and I've really got nowhere in writing out my thought process on him.
Curu, the naive planner
On July 25 2011 10:26 Curu wrote:
This game is Harry Potter Mafia? Did I miss something wut?
One idea: everyone can claim their own roles. That doesn't activate the penalty AFAIK. Then if anyone lies at all then their role creator can call them out.
This allows us to coordinate everyone's powers and dissenters can be lynched. Effectively we can coordinate everyone's actions and avoid hero syndrome or people using their powers in an Anti Town way (can also somewhat cripple the Mafia's powers).
The only weakness I can see is that it lets the Mafia pick and choose their targets among who has the most powerful roles. However, they already know many of the roles of Town (the ones they themselves created) so it's not all that debilitating.
Thoughts?
It's already been explained why this is a bad idea, and I agree with that wholeheartedly. This benefits scum far more than town, since they could eliminate mason or vigilante roles. However, as I often find myself pointing out, bad plan =/= scum. Based on this I think Curu is more likely town than mafia. If mafia were to propose a plan as high-profile as this, they would have thought it through and discussed it with their scumbuddies first, and it would not have ended up posted. But seriously Curu, don't push this plan. It doesn't help us.
redFF, the....redFF
On July 25 2011 11:55 redFF wrote:
imo give it to me.
This post makes me really uneasy. He asks for a KP with no explanation. Maybe he has a role that he can use it, or maybe he just wanted to hold on to it so it couldn't be used improperly.
On July 25 2011 10:33 redFF wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 10:30 OriginalName wrote:On July 25 2011 10:30 youngminii wrote:On July 25 2011 10:26 Curu wrote:
This game is Harry Potter Mafia? Did I miss something wut?
One idea: everyone can claim their own roles. That doesn't activate the penalty AFAIK. Then if anyone lies at all then their role creator can call them out.
This allows us to coordinate everyone's powers and dissenters can be lynched. Effectively we can coordinate everyone's actions and avoid hero syndrome or people using their powers in an Anti Town way (can also somewhat cripple the Mafia's powers).
The only weakness I can see is that it lets the Mafia pick and choose their targets among who has the most powerful roles. However, they already know many of the roles of Town (the ones they themselves created) so it's not all that debilitating.
Thoughts? Why would anyone, including scum, lie? Also, smooth one OriginalName.. Screw you I want powers. I think you should claim, your derailing town discussion by being cryptic about the horcruxes. We should either stop trying to get information from ON or he should claim.
This one as well. He accuses a now-confirmed townie, and tries to get him to claim. Couple this with his asking for the wand, it makes me think he also might have an HP themed role and would be capable of using it. What remains to be seen is whether this role is town aligned or not.
At the moment I have no strong reads on any other players. Hopefully I'll have more time tomorrow to read and do some proper analysis.
Something I really don't want to happen is that everyone gets wrapped up in the theme roles of this game. At the heart of it, it's a simple game of mafia. At no point in the game should role/HP mechanics come before good analysis. I realize that in my thoughts above I focused a lot on HP, and as you can see it only led to a lot of wifom. I will be doing my best to move away from this in the future and on to analysis based more in behavior.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
Can we please stop the mass role claiming now? I'm looking at the title of the game and it clearly has the word 'Mafia' in it, and nowhere are the words 'claim'.
Has there ever been an instance where a mafia claimed day 1 in a game such as this? Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think there has. TL mafia players aren't ballsy enough to do something like that. You guys can yap all you want about these people being mafia, but while you do players like kitaman get a  free ride as they make useless posts while pretending to be active.
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Morning all!
- I can safely say that my role has nothing to do with Harry Potter.
- I am very much against a mass roleclaim.
- I'm stunned that a plan made by sandroba was only met with derision and not outright indignation and abuse like usually happens regardless of merit. CONSPIRACY?!?!?
- youngminii is extremely impatient and that kill was not necessary. The thread is actually very readable compared to last PTP game.
- I don't know what to think about Jackal, it's too early to say. Bum ended up being the opposite alignment to batman last game, but he was unwillingly revealed in the day post whereas here Jackal claimed outright with no questions being asked of him. Not sure Mafia would do that.
Anyway, kitaman27 is always the opposite alignment to me and he's evil anyway so he must be Mafia. Voting kitaman27.
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On July 25 2011 13:33 redFF wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 13:30 Mr. Wiggles wrote:On July 25 2011 13:14 redFF wrote:On July 25 2011 13:06 Mr. Wiggles wrote:
RedFF, how much do you read/watch Harry Potter?
Also, I'm wondering YM, because if you can use it today, it might be best to fire it off, and then WIFOM about your kill/protection.
That's assuming you're town of course. erm i've read the books and seen all the movies except the new one, so average i guess? So... On July 25 2011 10:41 redFF wrote:
Can the Elder Wand be used at any time or only at night? How did you know the "stick", or "wand" was properly called the Elder Wand? (That's the first mention of it by that name in the thread) This leads me to believe you're in contact with Jackal or one of the role creators of ON/Jackal erm because he said that the 3 objects were all horcruxes and the elder wand is the only stick horcrux i know of?
Apparently you aren't knowledgeable enough. It's deathly hollows, not horcruxes. But ya, this is pretty general knowledge if you've read the books.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
On July 25 2011 13:37 chaos13 wrote:
Sandroba, keeper of the wand
My big question is why was he willing to hand out a KP so early on day 1? Unless he knew ON was town somehow, but with the deal of it being handed back to him, that seems highly unlikely. At first I would say he is town, because he was ready to hand the wand over to someone who flipped town instead of someone on his scum team. But then...nobody says that the keepers of the hallows and the collectors have to be on the same team. We really have no guarantee of this either way, but if we see Sand flip before Jackal, we can rest assured that they are not mafia together or Potter would have the wand now.
In conclusion, I'm uncertain on him. This business has introduced a lot of wifom around Sand, and I've really got nowhere in writing out my thought process on him.
In the  First game, Palmar got fistpounds right off the bat. People don't really stop and think about these kinds of things....
Although considering the Batman/Joker duo in the first game, I wouldn't be surprised if we had a similar issue going on here.
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What, the fuck is this shit? Multiple day 1 claims? people already lying. Day vig already shooting? The fuck is this shit. Purely for knowing better, and combination of a townie role designed around killing another player Jackal is now up for lynch.
Before anyone one goes "lets slow down here" He outright lied about his role, and we know based on a role flip that ON had a statement saying he was out to kill harry potter. As such the two should be opposite alignment, or at the very least, HP third party. As such he dies. We do not keep liars around, we do not keep people around who are on a quest to find bullshit items.
Also whoever made my role, go die in a fire.
##vote jackal58
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On July 25 2011 13:37 chaos13 wrote:redFF, the....redFFThis post makes me really uneasy. He asks for a KP with no explanation. Maybe he has a role that he can use it, or maybe he just wanted to hold on to it so it couldn't be used improperly. Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 10:33 redFF wrote:On July 25 2011 10:30 OriginalName wrote:On July 25 2011 10:30 youngminii wrote:On July 25 2011 10:26 Curu wrote:
This game is Harry Potter Mafia? Did I miss something wut?
One idea: everyone can claim their own roles. That doesn't activate the penalty AFAIK. Then if anyone lies at all then their role creator can call them out.
This allows us to coordinate everyone's powers and dissenters can be lynched. Effectively we can coordinate everyone's actions and avoid hero syndrome or people using their powers in an Anti Town way (can also somewhat cripple the Mafia's powers).
The only weakness I can see is that it lets the Mafia pick and choose their targets among who has the most powerful roles. However, they already know many of the roles of Town (the ones they themselves created) so it's not all that debilitating.
Thoughts? Why would anyone, including scum, lie? Also, smooth one OriginalName.. Screw you I want powers. I think you should claim, your derailing town discussion by being cryptic about the horcruxes. We should either stop trying to get information from ON or he should claim. This one as well. He accuses a now-confirmed townie, and tries to get him to claim. Couple this with his asking for the wand, it makes me think he also might have an HP themed role and would be capable of using it. What remains to be seen is whether this role is town aligned or not.
I don't have an hp themed role. First post was a joke, as everyone was asking for the wand. I was going to say AND MY AXE, but i went for imo give me the wand.
I didn't accuse him, i just noted discussion was being derailed by all this hp nonsense, so i wanted him to be as upfront as possible now we knew part of his role, i see that as a good townie post.
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Guys, I'm not getting the hesitation on jackal. ON's role explicitly tells him to kill Harry Potter. ON is a confirmed townie, not some 3rd party with his own win agenda.
Kill him right now, no need to use up the lynch. If Jackal is the lynch, it's insanely easy for the mafia to hide behind their vote for Jackal.
On July 25 2011 13:09 Amber[LighT] wrote:
I would be in support of a YM or Jackal lynch.
I'm fairly certain YM is not scum if Jackal flips red. He had to have known that killing ON would turn the town against Jackal. Why would scum allow YM to kill ON especially as ON was basically powerless? Also if he was scum, I feel he would have used the stealth kill instead and remain role hidden.
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On July 25 2011 13:51 redFF wrote:
I don't have an hp themed role. First post was a joke, as everyone was asking for the wand. I was going to say AND MY AXE, but i went for imo give me the wand.
I didn't accuse him, i just noted discussion was being derailed by all this hp nonsense, so i wanted him to be as upfront as possible now we knew part of his role, i see that as a good townie post.
The problem is that you're asking for an outright role claim on D1, and the person you encouraged to do so ended up as a conveniently dead townie by the claws of Wolverine shortly after this. A good townie post would have been to focus attention on something new and productive. Instead, you said "Don't talk about HP stuff" and immediately followed it with "claim more HP stuff".
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Calling the 3 Deathly Hallows examples of horcruxes is like calling Gandalf's asshole the one true ring. If we keep fucking up Harry Potter lore hear i'm going to call J.K.Rowling and then everyone will be sorry!
Apart from that I was shocked to see that day kill! Days are 48 hours long - surely sandroba having a stick up his...attic... is not worth 3 roleclaims, a day shot and the beginnings of a bandwagon. Chaos13 seems to be the only one who's done any analysis as opposed to 'i just read everything so do what i say'.
I myself haven't analysed much but seeing as I can't sleep i'll go back and try and generate a proper timeline of events...
Everyone take a chill pill and wash it done with some methodone...
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On July 25 2011 13:57 Tackster wrote:
Calling the 3 Deathly Hallows examples of horcruxes is like calling Gandalf's asshole the one true ring. If we keep fucking up Harry Potter lore hear i'm going to call J.K.Rowling and then everyone will be sorry!
Apart from that I was shocked to see that day kill! Days are 48 hours long - surely sandroba having a stick up his...attic... is not worth 3 roleclaims, a day shot and the beginnings of a bandwagon. Chaos13 seems to be the only one who's done any analysis as opposed to 'i just read everything so do what i say'.
I myself haven't analysed much but seeing as I can't sleep i'll go back and try and generate a proper timeline of events...
Everyone take a chill pill and wash it done with some methodone...
I'm alone
got no home
need a bone
at least I'm not on methadone
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At the risk of being mauled by youngminii, is there a reason why Foolishness is using TLPD in all his posts so far?
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On July 25 2011 14:13 DropBear wrote:
At the risk of being mauled by youngminii, is there a reason why Foolishness is using TLPD in all his posts so far?
Any reason why you chose to rhyme in your last post? Prob a random accidental click of tlpd
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On July 25 2011 13:54 heist wrote:Guys, I'm not getting the hesitation on jackal. ON's role explicitly tells him to kill Harry Potter. ON is a confirmed townie, not some 3rd party with his own win agenda. Kill him right now, no need to use up the lynch. If Jackal is the lynch, it's insanely easy for the mafia to hide behind their vote for Jackal. Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 13:09 Amber[LighT] wrote:
I would be in support of a YM or Jackal lynch. I'm fairly certain YM is not scum if Jackal flips red. He had to have known that killing ON would turn the town against Jackal. Why would scum allow YM to kill ON especially as ON was basically powerless? Also if he was scum, I feel he would have used the stealth kill instead and remain role hidden.
This is pretty accurate knowledge. I only wanted to lynch YM for being a dick and just day vigi'ing. Jackal is most likely scum.
##vote: Jackal58
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On July 25 2011 13:54 heist wrote:Guys, I'm not getting the hesitation on jackal. ON's role explicitly tells him to kill Harry Potter. ON is a confirmed townie, not some 3rd party with his own win agenda. Kill him right now, no need to use up the lynch. If Jackal is the lynch, it's insanely easy for the mafia to hide behind their vote for Jackal. Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 13:09 Amber[LighT] wrote:
I would be in support of a YM or Jackal lynch. I'm fairly certain YM is not scum if Jackal flips red. He had to have known that killing ON would turn the town against Jackal. Why would scum allow YM to kill ON especially as ON was basically powerless? Also if he was scum, I feel he would have used the stealth kill instead and remain role hidden.
Jackal's flip does not reveal anything about YM. For all we know jackal is third party and YM is red. Jackal's flip reveals absolutely nothing about YM. Just because you wouldn't choose to do what YM did if you were red/third party does not mean he would not do it.
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I still like my plan but it seems no one else does, so it's not going to fly anyways. My Vig plan in AA similarly got shot down, so apparently I'm super bad planner. I also thought of the possibility (probability?) of Mafia/third party having much more OP roles than Town so if someone's role had been altered from the original into making it stronger that could be a sign.
OriginalName's role line is quite interesting:
You are Voldemort, and you are on a mission to kill Harry Potter and keep him from uniting the three Deathly Hallows. Each item you or Harry Potter obtain will grant the holder a power, but unfortunately you can only use one item per night.
Is this just fluff or was it part of his win condition?
From Jackal's PM:
Be aware-- Voldemort has disguised himself as a member of the town and is trying to collect the items, same as you!
This seems really odd, why would the PM give any indication to Voldemort's alignment? It certainly didn't in OriginalName's. It's also worded ambiguously enough that were Voldemort to flip Town Jackal isn't damned right off the bat, but I really really doubt any original role PM would have any indication of another player's alignment.
It really doesn't make sense for Harry to be Mafia IMO since Voldemort's additional win condition (if that part wasn't just flavour in ON's role PM) would then just be the same as the normal Town win condition anyways. This leads me to believe Jackal is Town or 3rd Party, with a much heavier lean towards 3rd Party.
More speculation: if Jackal is Mafia then I think we can assume that everyone who has a Hallow is either Town or 3rd party. It would make no sense to have a Mafia aligned player have one of those items since they'd just immediately pass it to Jackal. Actually even if Jackal wasn't Mafia I think it'd be unlikely they'd give them to Mafia or 3rd Party since they have no reason to pass it around to benefit people they know are not allied with them. I wouldn't use it to paint people as absolute confirmed Town but I think it adds Town cred. It sucks that we don't know what happens to these items when people die because that might be a justification for Mafia to have one of these items but still I highly doubt it since they can just pass it around themselves when in danger of lynch.
I doubt youngminii is Mafia, he played exactly like this as Town in WaW2. Give him a KP he can use and he will fling it around at the smallest reason. In AA where he actually was scum he was much less rash although his opinion did change around ADHD style. He's doing very valid analysis too at the moment, which was sorely missing from AA.
kitaman's posting a whole bunch of one liner nothings, please share some more of your thoughts kita.
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On July 25 2011 14:17 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 14:13 DropBear wrote:
At the risk of being mauled by youngminii, is there a reason why Foolishness is using TLPD in all his posts so far? Any reason why you chose to rhyme in your last post? Prob a random accidental click of tlpd
Tackster mentioned methadone, which is the title of one of my favourite songs so I sang a few lines. It's just spam 
So quick to defend your fellow vet! CONSPIRACY?!?!?
I am being retarded at reading, can you point out where Jackal lied?
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On July 25 2011 10:46 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2011 10:40 sandroba wrote:
K ON, I'm giving you the stick. Claim your target before you use it. Please don't. Be aware-- Voldemort has disguised himself as a member of the town and is trying to collect the items. I'm Harry Potter. From: deconduo [ 2677 posts | Profile | Buddy | Report ] Subject: PTP2 Role Date: 7/25/11 08:50 "You are Harry Potter, and you are on a mission to unite the three Deathly Hallows. Be aware-- Voldemort has disguised himself as a member of the town and is trying to collect the items, same as you! Each item you or Voldemort obtain will grant the holder a power, but unfortunately you can only use one item per night. The Elder Wand - Allows you to shoot someone during the night. The Cloak of Invisibility - Allows you to survive a hit during the night The Resurrection Stone - Allows you to protect another player during the night. The problem is, you do not know where the items are! You suspect they may be in possession of other people in the town. Being muggles, they may not be aware of the magical properties of the items. In order to find the items, you have the ability to choose one correspondent every day. During the following night, and that night only, you can freely exchange PMs. But you cannot talk once the night has passed. If your correspondent happens to possess one of the items you seek, he may decide to give it to you by sending a PM to the hosts of the game. You must convince them to do so, however!"
bolded part is the lie. ON was town, not disguised as it. Also ON had a clause in his role requiring him to kill HP. It seems very well, odd to have 2 townies fighting over the same items to get a power role and then have 1 having to kill the other while the other just wants the items? Why would town be required to kill town.
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So we're not going to believe in randomization? Just wondering, because a huge point in PTP was that everything was random, and that role does not equal alignment. Joker and Batman could have both been town, they could have both been scum (lol), and neither ended up being an SK. Or at least, that's what I was led to believe.
The Jackal thing is different though, because of the part where it says something about another player's alignment, so I'm trying to figure that out. Could ON actually be mafia, but just flips green, thus the "disguised as town" from Jackal's PM? Like a GF that keeps working after death. Other than that, I'm drawing a blank, besides that Jackal's scum.
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EPT
