• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 14:41
CET 20:41
KST 04:41
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Dark completes military service, returns to SC29[BSL23] RO16 Group Stage19Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?2Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175
StarCraft 2
General
Dark completes military service, returns to SC2 Greetings.. No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Serral's getting trashed by New Catsle's Mind Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Dark returns! GSL CK #7 4v4 Team Battle (Nov 19) soO & FanTaSy return! SC2 Kevin Scrim 4v4 (Nov 16) RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 551 Robotic Revival Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles
Brood War
General
List of top players active on ShieldBattery BW General Discussion Recommended BW Settings for Mouse and Video Starcraft:Brood War Discord Servers [BSL23] RO16 Group Stage
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League Bisu's Team vs Shuttle's Team 2026-11-14 2v2v2v2 Tournament Stage 1: Community Poll [BSL23] Ro16 Group C - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Pluto's TvP 5Marine 2Medic Push Simple Questions, Simple Answers Infested Terran strategies in 2026 Nuke strategy worked in K-League 2026-11-09
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Free Space RTS Game, optimised f. Phone/Tablet etc List of Game Threads The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Trading/Investing Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The time I organised my…
AssyrianKing
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 12664 users

DQs: A2 and Pomi - Page 7

Forum Index > TSL2 Forum
Post a Reply
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 9 Next All
purgerinho
Profile Joined June 2008
Croatia919 Posts
December 13 2009 12:00 GMT
#121
On December 13 2009 12:40 IdrA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2009 12:03 purgerinho wrote:
his act doesn't deserve respect but he as a player deserve is whatever you or nayone else said.. all other players had to get in top48 if he had same chances he wouldn't do that so don't judge him so easily or call him a cheater coz of this thing..

how did he not have the same chance as everyone else


he had to be in top12 not top48.. yes, it's not fault of anyone else but still..
SUMMARIZED (by DeMu): You CANNOT surprise a top level Protoss with a build
Pulimuli
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Sweden2766 Posts
December 13 2009 12:03 GMT
#122
wow this is so retarded, why would A2 who could beat almost everyone on the ladder easy go and abuse? I hope he's kicking himself pretty good now,i was rooting for him


AND WTF YOSH?!
iSCd
Profile Joined October 2009
80 Posts
December 13 2009 14:47 GMT
#123
On December 13 2009 21:00 purgerinho wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2009 12:40 IdrA wrote:
On December 13 2009 12:03 purgerinho wrote:
his act doesn't deserve respect but he as a player deserve is whatever you or nayone else said.. all other players had to get in top48 if he had same chances he wouldn't do that so don't judge him so easily or call him a cheater coz of this thing..

how did he not have the same chance as everyone else


he had to be in top12 not top48.. yes, it's not fault of anyone else but still..


i dont get your morals man!
For the swarm!
ZhenMiChan
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Netherlands1181 Posts
December 13 2009 14:48 GMT
#124
wow!
Studying Chinese~
synapse
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
China13814 Posts
December 13 2009 15:13 GMT
#125
sadface ((((
:)
HeavOnEarth
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States7087 Posts
December 13 2009 15:38 GMT
#126
On December 13 2009 07:29 disciple wrote:
the TSL administration has indeed a very particular set of skills. I'm sure, if ppl just admit their ladder abuse, that will be end of it.

Anyway, good luck

heh
"come korea next time... FXO house... 10 korean, 10 korean"
purgerinho
Profile Joined June 2008
Croatia919 Posts
December 13 2009 15:39 GMT
#127
On December 13 2009 23:47 iSCd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2009 21:00 purgerinho wrote:
On December 13 2009 12:40 IdrA wrote:
On December 13 2009 12:03 purgerinho wrote:
his act doesn't deserve respect but he as a player deserve is whatever you or nayone else said.. all other players had to get in top48 if he had same chances he wouldn't do that so don't judge him so easily or call him a cheater coz of this thing..

how did he not have the same chance as everyone else


he had to be in top12 not top48.. yes, it's not fault of anyone else but still..


i dont get your morals man!


well, i'm not like many of you, i can't judge ppl so easily coz of this... i'm sad that chinese players can't play coz they don't lag so much everyone likes to show.. many of top48 played against chinese players to gain points.. isn't it so funny... f91 played liqubition without lag (nony was the only one that felt it but we all know it was a bullshit) against many players...
SUMMARIZED (by DeMu): You CANNOT surprise a top level Protoss with a build
iSCd
Profile Joined October 2009
80 Posts
December 13 2009 15:57 GMT
#128
On December 14 2009 00:39 purgerinho wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 13 2009 23:47 iSCd wrote:
On December 13 2009 21:00 purgerinho wrote:
On December 13 2009 12:40 IdrA wrote:
On December 13 2009 12:03 purgerinho wrote:
his act doesn't deserve respect but he as a player deserve is whatever you or nayone else said.. all other players had to get in top48 if he had same chances he wouldn't do that so don't judge him so easily or call him a cheater coz of this thing..

how did he not have the same chance as everyone else


he had to be in top12 not top48.. yes, it's not fault of anyone else but still..


i dont get your morals man!


well, i'm not like many of you, i can't judge ppl so easily coz of this... i'm sad that chinese players can't play coz they don't lag so much everyone likes to show.. many of top48 played against chinese players to gain points.. isn't it so funny... f91 played liqubition without lag (nony was the only one that felt it but we all know it was a bullshit) against many players...


As I said before f91s case is kind of understandable, BUT its a huge mistake non the less, which cant be excused. I can see him getting a relatively mild punishment, BUT I cant see how you argue for him staying in this TSL!
For the swarm!
.risingdragoon
Profile Joined January 2008
United States3021 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-13 21:24:01
December 13 2009 21:12 GMT
#129
well he's out already, it was his decision, can't be in top12 means no go for him anyway.

you get nerdy artosis going ohohohmeegod gtfo meee comooonity~~ wtf, posing as rekrul who you foolin?

then bam 10 more disqualifications, instant BLACK EYE with more to come I'm sure

it sucks cus these players playing it honest would've made TSL2 a lot more exciting, especially F91 who has to deal with extraneous rules,and flying out to compete, etc. Any honest person would agree that the no chinese rule is cus of the potential lag BUT also cus if chinese players are allowed in they'd OWN the joint.

TSL2 just got a lot less exciting, but them's the rules.
......::::........::::........::::........::::........::::.......::::.......::::... Up☆MaGiC ...::::.......::::.......::::........::::........::::........::::........
qwstarplayer
Profile Joined August 2004
Sweden5 Posts
December 14 2009 05:46 GMT
#130
idra is an asshole /thread
BroOd
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Austin10833 Posts
December 14 2009 05:58 GMT
#131
On December 14 2009 06:12 .risingdragoon wrote:
well he's out already, it was his decision, can't be in top12 means no go for him anyway.

you get nerdy artosis going ohohohmeegod gtfo meee comooonity~~ wtf, posing as rekrul who you foolin?

then bam 10 more disqualifications, instant BLACK EYE with more to come I'm sure

it sucks cus these players playing it honest would've made TSL2 a lot more exciting, especially F91 who has to deal with extraneous rules,and flying out to compete, etc. Any honest person would agree that the no chinese rule is cus of the potential lag BUT also cus if chinese players are allowed in they'd OWN the joint.

TSL2 just got a lot less exciting, but them's the rules.


do you have to leak your annoying nationalism into every thread about this?
ModeratorSIRL and JLIG.
Sharp-eYe
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada642 Posts
December 14 2009 06:00 GMT
#132
all these dqs make me sad and happy at the same time.

sad: cuz people are such idiots..
happy: TL admins rock!
Are you truly so blinded by your vaunted religion, that you can't see the fall ahead of you? - Zeratul III AKA WikidSik ingame (anygame)
SirKibbleX
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
United States479 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-14 09:11:05
December 14 2009 09:10 GMT
#133
I'm saddened because of the disconnect between the purpose of this ladder and its actual methods employed.

The purpose of the ladder is to select the 48 strongest Starcraft players out of the entire pool of players. Tragically, the fact remains that external factors make it impossible for this system to actually work. If a large number of mediocre players are using 'ladder-abuse' techniques (which may or may not actually be affecting their in-game performance, i.e. not everyone plays 'auto-wins) to inflate their scores, how can the top 48 reflect the 'strongest' players?

And if players as strong as F91, A2, Pomi, and Yosh aren't in the top 48, hasn't the selection system failed us?

The real tragedy is that the TSL won't be as good as it could have been.
Praemonitus, Praemunitus.
IdrA
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
United States11541 Posts
December 14 2009 09:21 GMT
#134
actually the purpose of the ladder was to have 48 players qualify for tsl prelims. if they wanted to choose the 48 best players they would have handed out invitations. the best players can qualify over ladder abusers anyway, and mediocre players who deserve spots but got ousted by the abusers could just as easily abuse themselves.
a2 is better than morrow, therefore he can beat more people than him and will have a higher win percentage vs the players they can both beat. that means that if a2 plays the ladder the way morrow had he should end up with a higher score than him. instead he chose to be lazy. thats his fault. no one elses.

http://www.splitreason.com/product/1152 release the gracken tshirt now available
thopol
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Japan4560 Posts
December 14 2009 09:22 GMT
#135
No, that's not the real tragedy. The real tragedy is that respected and admired players cheated in the biggest and most meticulously planned foreigner tournament ever.

The ladder isn't even to find the best players. It is to find the players who are most qualified. The best at playing in a ladder, under pressure, with rules.
.risingdragoon
Profile Joined January 2008
United States3021 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-14 09:41:53
December 14 2009 09:23 GMT
#136
On December 14 2009 14:58 BroOd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 14 2009 06:12 .risingdragoon wrote:
well he's out already, it was his decision, can't be in top12 means no go for him anyway.

you get nerdy artosis going ohohohmeegod gtfo meee comooonity~~ wtf, posing as rekrul who you foolin?

then bam 10 more disqualifications, instant BLACK EYE with more to come I'm sure

it sucks cus these players playing it honest would've made TSL2 a lot more exciting, especially F91 who has to deal with extraneous rules,and flying out to compete, etc. Any honest person would agree that the no chinese rule is cus of the potential lag BUT also cus if chinese players are allowed in they'd OWN the joint.

TSL2 just got a lot less exciting, but them's the rules.


do you have to leak your annoying nationalism into every thread about this?


da hell you talking about Forewick Holm? maybe if you thought about it you'd know that it's kinda hard to be a monolithic chinese nationalist when I'm flying the US colors? why do I have to be labeled? as uncomfortable as this is, I just called it as I saw it.

yeah, I think it was artosis with the bonehead nationalist comment, and I'm trying to make up for it with the "yea I get it, you said that cus of lag reasons /rolleyes." F91 is a draw for me cus I like his style, muthafucka, just like lovett's pvp, and pj's pvz (not so much lx, dunno why) just like how I and a whole buncha people discovered brat_OK in the last TSL and like his play. Does that make me a russian nationalist now? This is sad as it is already and I think I've been diplomatic, don't you twist things any further.
......::::........::::........::::........::::........::::.......::::.......::::... Up☆MaGiC ...::::.......::::.......::::........::::........::::........::::........
mijellin
Profile Joined November 2008
China740 Posts
December 14 2009 09:23 GMT
#137
On December 14 2009 18:10 SirKibbleX wrote:
I'm saddened because of the disconnect between the purpose of this ladder and its actual methods employed.

The purpose of the ladder is to select the 48 strongest honest Starcraft players who don't cheat out of the entire pool of players. Tragically, the fact remains that external factors make it impossible for this system to actually work. If a large number of mediocre players are using 'ladder-abuse' techniques (which may or may not actually be affecting their in-game performance, i.e. not everyone plays 'auto-wins) to inflate their scores, how can the top 48 reflect the 'strongest' players?

And if players as strong as F91, A2, Pomi, and Yosh aren't in the top 48, hasn't the selection system failed us?

The real tragedy is that the TSL won't be as good as it could have been.


fixed
SirKibbleX
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
United States479 Posts
December 14 2009 09:30 GMT
#138
You're misinterpreting what I'm saying. IdrA, you're more or less agreeing with me. What I'm saying is that I want to see the top 48 foreigner STARCRAFT players play in the TSL, not the top 48 LADDER players. You're saying that the best players should rise to the top and I agree. If they're lazy and not putting in the effort, then that sucks that we won't be able to see them in the tournament.

And thopol the respected and admired players should have been able to just qualify. For someone to do something, they typically need means, motive, and opportunity. 1 and 3 and there for certain, I just don't see why people would cheat when they could just as easily play and win. It's tragic for me, someone who just enjoys watching high-level Starcraft matches, that I will be watching the people who are the best at 'manipulating' a ladder in some way, even if it's within the rules, rather than the absolute best qualified STARCRAFT players.
Praemonitus, Praemunitus.
SirKibbleX
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
United States479 Posts
December 14 2009 09:34 GMT
#139
The strongest player shouldn't need to cheat because the ideal ladder would be designed in such a way that the strongest player would never need to cheat. Let me be clear, such a system is theoretically, and therefore also in practice, impossible to create. So I'm not trying to BM the TL staff, I'm just saying I'm sad I won't be seeing the best foreigner players playing in the TSL. Why do they have to be such cheaters... : (
Praemonitus, Praemunitus.
thopol
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Japan4560 Posts
December 14 2009 09:41 GMT
#140
I don't think we are leagues apart in our thinking. I do think that you probably would prefer an invitational instead of a ladder, which is certainly a point on which our opinions diverge. I think that good players not making it is part of the drama and intrigue inherent in a ladder stage. I would prefer that these facets not arise from cheating on the part of players with respect ranging from name-recognition to fanbases. Still, the ladder offers unpredictability, a fluid pool of players who are considered among the best, and an opportunity for upsets, all of which are beneficial to the viewer experience. The point here is that I prefer an initial qualifying period (in this case ladder as opposed to invite) that offers these exciting elements. My desire to see the best players possible surmount the challenge of this stage is surpassed by my demand for integrity in the players that make it into the qualifiers.
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 9 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
02:00
FSL s12, week2: POG vs PTB
Freeedom28
Liquipedia
IPSL
02:00
Ro24 Group E
TerrOr vs IJ_Terran
rasowy vs Hazorath
Airneanach87
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
LamboSC2 235
EmSc Tv 21
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 3069
ggaemo 141
Dewaltoss 103
Trap 29
Rock 23
soO 23
Aegong 12
LuMiX 0
Dota 2
420jenkins620
League of Legends
gofns6968
JimRising 712
Counter-Strike
pashabiceps1573
zeus178
jkaem111
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor350
Liquid`Hasu349
MindelVK11
Other Games
tarik_tv2584
Grubby2217
B2W.Neo771
XaKoH 200
mouzStarbuck191
dupreeh122
Trikslyr52
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1571
EGCTV1171
BasetradeTV157
StarCraft 2
angryscii 21
EmSc Tv 21
EmSc2Tv 21
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• printf 67
• StrangeGG 25
• Shameless 4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 7
• Pr0nogo 6
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV691
League of Legends
• Jankos4342
Other Games
• imaqtpie561
• Shiphtur240
• tFFMrPink 15
Upcoming Events
BSL
20m
TerrOr vs OyAji
UltrA vs Gosudark
Sparkling Tuna Cup
14h 20m
WardiTV Invitational
16h 20m
IPSL
21h 20m
Art_Of_Turtle vs KameZerg
Radley vs George
BSL
1d
Artosis vs Dewalt
Ret vs Tech
SOOP
1d 14h
soO vs FanTaSy
WardiTV Weekly
1d 16h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
[ Show More ]
GSL
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-12
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
Individual League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

YSL S4
Sector 591
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
StarCraft2 Weekly Open Tournament 2026 Grand Finals
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
IEM Kraków 2027
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.