EPTIts unfortunate the way it was handled on both ends to be honest but I just wanted to let it out there that Graham (the interim admin) was nothing but helpful towards xO and was a great admin all in all, I just hope that they do another season and maybe fix some of the problems they had with the 1st... Thats my 2 cents for what is worth.
1000$ Sixpoolgaming/Z33ktv Team League Play-offs - Page 3
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Hoodlum
United States350 Posts
Its unfortunate the way it was handled on both ends to be honest but I just wanted to let it out there that Graham (the interim admin) was nothing but helpful towards xO and was a great admin all in all, I just hope that they do another season and maybe fix some of the problems they had with the 1st... Thats my 2 cents for what is worth. | ||
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ChadMann
Australia128 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:33 Hoodlum wrote: but throwing a public fit about it so quickly is a bit much. . Just to be clear - if the admin had of address my concerns privately and fairly, I wouldn't have made a public statement about it. but he just linked a picture of a trophy and called me a sore loser. | ||
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:33 Hoodlum wrote: Hmmm, I just don't understand the upset, problems are gonna happen and it is their first season... I guess I just want to add that I also had my own small problems with the league, I was sad that after playing CoL in regular season we played CoL in first round of playoffs even though we should have had a higher seed because we only dropped one game but throwing a public fit about it so quickly is a bit much. Its unfortunate the way it was handled on both ends to be honest but I just wanted to let it out there that Graham (the interim admin) was nothing but helpful towards xO and was a great admin all in all, I just hope that they do another season and maybe fix some of the problems they had with the 1st... Thats my 2 cents for what is worth. I feel like a lot of the issue though was his condescending tone and his implication that because Fray had legitimate concerns, they were being sore losers. That's not how an admin should handle a situation like that. | ||
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John Madden
American Samoa894 Posts
You don't fucking know him, you don't know what he's been through you sick fuck. "1- Sore losers do not need to stir the pot. Fray, you played well but congradulations on your great sportsmanship, http://www.sierraexpressmedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/trophy.gif for participation.— " What the fuck is this you worthless cunt, your mother took 9 months to take a shit. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Rif_king
Canada66 Posts
Edit: On November 12 2012 08:43 ChadMann wrote:+ Show Spoiler + Worst organised a run tournament I've ever been involved in. My concerns - I will summarise for you here but first, the response from the tournament admin was to call me a sore loser and remove me from the Skype group that communicated the tournament. The first issue was team HENRI - a team of smurfs, Comprising of Hendralisk (NaDasBody), Scarlett (QuanticFlo), coL.Ryan (SaladToss) and ROOTMaSa (Surprisingly, playing as himself). They all play under smurfs and don't have to tell anyone who they are till the finals, when the Admins told them they have to reveal who the players are as they are being played. Therefore a team is still not capable of preparing for this unknown line up. Also note this team has 4 members... yep, just throw in another QuanticFLo to round off the required 5 members - all good  Then the seeding for the play-offs bracket saw my team vsing this HENRI team first up. Even though our team placed 1st in their group and 4th overall. And HENRI placed 2nd in their group - about 7th overall..... Even tho teams were told seeding would be important and absolute (not only top 4 seed, rest random - all the way, seeded)... Nope At the start of the playoffs - admins inform all teams that they will not be able to make roster changes when matches are posted and should check their line up and ensure everything is right - as they will be strict on the roster. After ROOTMeSa falls to one of our players in the match - HENRI takes over 20 minutes to get their next player (z33k team league has a rule - after 15 mins if a player can not be found the team is walked over). HENRI plays coL.Ryan - who is not in their roster and wins the match against my team.. Well played to team HENRI. z33k admins stated that the team rosters had to be correct and they would be "strict" on this. It seems that the admins where excited about such high profile players in their league - and the exposure this would attract, errr.. they are playing as smurfs. Admins response to my concerns about their 'rules' was to say "sore loser, here is a jpg of a medal - thanks for coming" - then removing me from the skype group. WITHOUT addressing any of my issues or concerns. Icing of the cake.. admins don't want W.O and one of the teams in the playoffs breaks up and to fill this spot they run a FFA with 1 player of each eliminated team... yes thats right - a competitive Free For All for a 2nd chance at a $1,000 prize pool.. I know, baffling. I think they've since decided this was a bad idea and just gave the walk over. From a league that started being run by VeraLynn and ended with Fanboys of famous american's not applying the rules across the board - this has been the worst run event I've been involved in. Marketing dollars well spent 6pool gaming.  My concerns - I will summarise for you here but first, the response from the tournament admin was to call me a sore loser and remove me from the Skype group that communicated the tournament You were removed from the tournament skype group because your team lost (A point I'd like to emphasize, since you have been taking it as a personal attack) I could paste the multiple conversations between the admins and team fray here, but it would be a large waste of space. immediately after losing to team Henri in the league, the nit picking began, [10/11/2012 10:11:08 PM] Rifkin: The admins and I will discuss this in the morning as the other 2 are asleep right now thank you for bringing it up This was the immediate response I gave. Ignoring this, the issues were brought up impatiently over the span of 5 hours, and then again in the Tournament-group-chat (which was the point when I realized fray hadn't been removed/left graciously after losing) The smurfing issues are definitely complicated, but have been dealt with in an appropriate manner. The players have been revealing who they are on these "smurf" accounts (even though, it's apparently obvious everyone knows who they are anyways!) HENRI plays coL.Ryan - who is not in their roster and wins the match against my team.. Well played to team HENRI. z33k admins stated that the team rosters had to be correct and they would be "strict" on this. The roster issue menitoned above was simple/clerical on their part as the player Saladtoss was part of the roster during the entire open season leading up the play offs, hardly ban worthy, which resulted in the following judgement: + Show Spoiler + 2 - Addressing the Henri issues: As soon as the issues was availible to be discussed, we came to the conclusion that SALADTOSS Was banned from their next match up. Normally this doesn't seem like a severe punishment however considering the team only has 5 players, that means you only need 4 wins to beat Henri, not 5, seems more than fair to me. (please note that all the players mentioned above have also been tweeting about their matches, it's hardly a secret conspiracy. They have been very compliant in dealing with all teams in this league) Lastly to address the concept of the FFA, with Pulse suddenly and unexpectedly dropping out of the league, we had a large gap to fill and thought it was a creative way to give teams and players a second chance. AS STATED ABOVE it was determined in the end to be an ineffective idea and not used (Thus, the pr0perty walk over http://www.z33k.com/games/starcraft2/tournaments/9293-sixpoolgaming-z33ktv-s-teamleague-playoffs/brackets ) + Show Spoiler + From a league that started being run by VeraLynn and ended with Fanboys of famous american's not applying the rules across the board Not sure if petty ![[image loading]](http://wayofthemoneysaver.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/suspicious-fry.jpg) or just racist | ||
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mYiKane
Canada1772 Posts
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Hoodlum
United States350 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:36 Zennith wrote: I feel like a lot of the issue though was his condescending tone and his implication that because Fray had legitimate concerns, they were being sore losers. That's not how an admin should handle a situation like that. I agree, I did mention that it was handled poorly on his end as well... I just wanted to say that Fray obviously didn't take it well and probably had some poor usage of phrasing when addressing his concern, sometimes thats enough to make someone do what Graham did even though that doesn't make it right... In the end I had a great experience with the league and with Graham so I am more sad than anything that some other teams didn't have as good of an experience  | ||
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MetricYAO
United Kingdom69 Posts
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Rif_king
Canada66 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:42 MetricYAO wrote: So apparently Sixpool gaming bought "Graham Rogers" in to belittle people. I was hardly "bought" I think a lot of people forget that admins and casters don't make money or are even paid to handle events like this. Thanks though :-) | ||
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MetricYAO
United Kingdom69 Posts
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:40 Hoodlum wrote: I agree, I did mention that it was handled poorly on his end as well... I just wanted to say that Fray obviously didn't take it well and probably had some poor usage of phrasing when addressing his concern, sometimes thats enough to make someone do what Graham did even though that doesn't make it right... In the end I had a great experience with the league and with Graham so I am more sad than anything that some other teams didn't have as good of an experience Totally. This has actually been a great team league for us as well. It's a shame this has happened so close to the finish. | ||
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Rif_king
Canada66 Posts
On November 12 2012 09:28 ChadMann wrote: Good job calling me racist to discredit my post. I'm referring to the statement as racist sir, not you my apologies if it's been misinterprutted. I want to stress there is no Favouritism for Americans or any other nationality in this event. Chat logs: + Show Spoiler + Chat logs between teams prior to the maches even being played (only being posted to show fray nit picking prior to anything happening) [10/11/2012 4:57:32 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: np's [10/11/2012 4:57:56 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: so Henry, who is behind all the smurfs? [10/11/2012 4:58:29 PM] HenryZ - Henri: we'll say when each player goes up, as graham instructed [10/11/2012 4:59:07 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: zzzz okay then. [10/11/2012 4:59:45 PM] Graham Rogers: Btw henri [10/11/2012 4:59:49 PM] Graham Rogers: two things [10/11/2012 4:59:54 PM] HenryZ - Henri: yea? [10/11/2012 5:00:05 PM] Graham Rogers: well, actually, just 1 [10/11/2012 5:00:24 PM] Graham Rogers: we'll be doing hotkey /sc2gears analysis with the matches today. It's nothing personal and I don't expect you guys to cheat by any means [10/11/2012 5:00:30 PM] Graham Rogers: But safe than sorry etc [10/11/2012 5:00:31 PM] HenryZ - Henri: u mean like [10/11/2012 5:00:35 PM] HenryZ - Henri: in case we have somenoe play twice? [10/11/2012 5:00:39 PM] Graham Rogers: Yea [10/11/2012 5:00:41 PM] HenryZ - Henri: oh ya [10/11/2012 5:00:42 PM] HenryZ - Henri: of course [10/11/2012 5:00:43 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: ahh.. yeah well u are playing on smurfs. [10/11/2012 5:00:49 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: (y) [10/11/2012 5:00:49 PM] HenryZ - Henri: thats totally fair [10/11/2012 5:00:58 PM] Graham Rogers: I don't expect anything bad from you guys though [10/11/2012 5:01:04 PM] HenryZ - Henri: me neither [10/11/2012 5:01:06 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: neither.. [10/11/2012 5:01:26 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: I've heard QuanticFlo is either really Flo, Hendralisk or Scarlett... yuss? [10/11/2012 5:01:38 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: or.. 'you'll wait till before the matches?' [10/11/2012 5:01:46 PM] Graham Rogers: He will message your team rep [10/11/2012 5:01:51 PM] Graham Rogers: as matches happen [10/11/2012 5:02:01 PM] Graham Rogers: so you can plan accordingly ^^ [10/11/2012 5:02:16 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: zzzzzz zero prep.. lucky half our roster isn't known to the NA scene.. [10/11/2012 5:02:17 PM] HenryZ - Henri: flo is terran [10/11/2012 5:02:18 PM] HenryZ - Henri: and not gm [10/11/2012 5:02:24 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: thats true..  [10/11/2012 5:02:28 PM] Graham Rogers: First match is always blind pick anyways [10/11/2012 5:02:29 PM] Graham Rogers: smurf or not [10/11/2012 5:02:30 PM] HenryZ - Henri: yea [10/11/2012 5:02:39 PM] Graham Rogers: Not like they know who you guys are sending [10/11/2012 5:02:53 PM] Graham Rogers: I've gone over this extensively with Henri over the week [10/11/2012 5:03:01 PM] Graham Rogers: Nothing shady should happen Expressed right after post-match issues were brought up [10/11/2012 10:11:08 PM] Graham Rogers: The admins and I will discuss this in the morning as the other 2 are asleep right now thank you for bringing it up In the tournament group chat: [9:50:50 AM] Graham Rogers: Going to sleep will be back later for the Light vs TAC match tonight if there are any issues please feel free to PM myself or one of the admins. 1 on 1 chat with Nicolas Russo Nicolas Russo - fray: Hey mate.. Apparently HENRI used a player not on their roster... And tool 15 mins to get them... Resolves this plz.. IMO either walker over/ disqualification or we can regame them. But there should be a penalty. Like they drop a map for it. [11:31:43 AM] Nicolas Russo - fray: Are you there?.. [12:02:02 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: [11:45 AM] Nicolas Russo - fray: <<< ANYWAY... I'd also like to openly bring up the HENRI issue - as other people have msg'd me about it. 1) Henri used a player not on their roster in the match 2) They took londer than the 15 walk over time to get this player - there was a 20 min delay inbetween matches as they tried to find a player 3) their team are all smurfs, however I understand some highly well-known US players are part of it. And special consideration may be being applied to accomodate such well known players.regardless of site bugs - you can say that MaSa comes up as SaladToss or there was bugs there.. the list still only shows ONE of them. [12:02:11 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: and they didn't check their roster - and played both of them [12:02:47 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: and YOU applied strict rules on the rosters being correct and asked everyone to check them. So I don't care about sign up glitches.. he should have checked - he didn't, played people NOT on the roster. [12:03:16 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: And took longer than the walk over time to select his third player. [12:05:13 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: This league is run at an awkward time for Australians - I couldn't be at the match for the entirity of the games.. so I wasn't able to push for the rules so my team was treated fairly. [12:19:56 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: Also, RE: the FFA - first game was a stalemate, with the fray player clearly in the lead but couldn't engage.. but others didn't have AA vs Terran.. so base race in his favour. then regame - so HuT is tired, its 6am so he all in's one player, beats them then gg's out giving the guy from Megashock the win. [12:20:00 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: [12:16 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: <<< so much on the line.. in such a rediculous format play a 1 player from each team round robin.. much smarter.. (y) FFA.. derp.but this. [12:28:40 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: How does a team prepare to vs a team of smurfs... its an unfair advantage.. if we knew who was behind the smurfs a week ago - we would have researched the opponent and prepared for them.. I can see that on the teams list ROOTMaSa = SaladToss.. but its not two different people.. ROOTMaSa isnt on the roster OR SaladToss isn't.. but both played. Roster error or bug - you asked everyone to check.. [12:44:13 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: anyway, you've got a wall of text to get thru for this - but I'll just leave you with this, I was very proud how our team did in the main season.. and then excited to play the finals.. Happy if we lost and didn't make the money.. but the manner in which we are going out is really unfair and disappointing. 1)the reasons above, players not in roster, not having players available and taking 20+ mins to get a player (W.O rule 15 mins) 2) seeding. We played one of the top 3 teams (imo) in this league first up.. sure HENRI dropped maps in the main season and they came out 2nd in their group.. we came out 1st.. and shouldn't have bee matched vs them. 3) the 2nd chance to get back in - is a FFA?.. at 5am Australian time...??? 1 on 1 chat with Nicolas Russo after being removed from group chat [2:55:30 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: your response... omfg [2:55:35 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: shitest league ever.. what the fuck. [2:55:52 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: Learn some respect mate [2:56:28 PM] Graham Rogers: ok, I will do that, thank you. [2:56:42 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: do not address ANY of my concerns?.. and just remove me from the league saying sore loser? [2:56:48 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: what. the. fuck? [2:58:44 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: do you actually think that is fair? [2:59:09 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: I think I deserve a response. Otherwise I'll ensure 6pool knows how you ran this. [2:59:19 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: along with many, many other people. [3:01:34 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: any other team break the rules and you'd probably do something about it.. but lets not upset the famous american, right? [3:04:09 PM] Graham Rogers: The pettiness of the way your team behaved after losing (and now even) is really going to add credibility to any claims you have. I was in the middle of pasting the reponse that was created after you were removed from the chat (as it did address your concerns) [3:04:29 PM] Graham Rogers: Skype has the "Person is writing a message" for a reason, maybe before you attempt to threaten someone you should learn some patience. [3:04:52 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: Pettiness?.. they used a player not on their roster? [3:05:33 PM] Graham Rogers: [Paste from group chat] [2:07 PM] Graham Rogers: <<< 2 - Addressing the Henri issues: As soon as the issues was availible to be discussed, we can to the conclusion that SALADTOSS Was banned from their next match up. Normally this doesn't seem like a severe punishment however considering the team only has 5 players, that means you only need 4 wins to beat Henri, not 5, seems more than fair to me. the smurfing is a problem that we as admins had our hands tied about. Jamie and I were brought in by sixpoolgaming becuase the z33k admins had let things run amuck (Ie the old admins telling them ITS OK FOR U TO SMURF)I know you were hoping for a disqualify, but it isn't/didn't/won't happen in this instance [/end paste] [3:06:49 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: I don't want DQ.. I want a fair match [3:06:54 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: their player was also 20 mins late. [3:07:03 PM] Graham Rogers: We're done here. [3:07:04 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: isn't there a W.O ruling about not having players online? [3:07:07 PM] Graham Rogers: Thanks for raising the issues. [3:07:07 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: yeah I know [3:07:19 PM] Nicolas Russo - fray: but you have rules.. and don't enforce them. Great admin work (y) | ||
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MetalPanda
Canada1152 Posts
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ChadMann
Australia128 Posts
My concerns are in no way directed at z33k or SixPoolGaming. They do a great job to promote and grow eSports! Thanks to them. However the particular from BaseTradeTV and a particular admin of the tournament have caused this issue. Another side note, one of the other admin's messaged me saying he wasn't involved in the decision and thought it was harsh and unprofessional. So my issues lay solely with Graham 'Rif_King' Rogers. | ||
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ChadMann
Australia128 Posts
On November 12 2012 10:24 MetalPanda wrote: I'm pretty sure Ryan isn't playing for Henri. I remember Hendralisk say they dropped a player on the team as they didn't need him. As per the rules stated by the admins, HENRI had to inform us as they sent out players who was behind the smurf. The player SaladToss was said to be Ryan by Henry. whoops, excuse double post. | ||
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[Erasmus]
Australia286 Posts
That seems a little dubious. Why should a team known to break the rules be allowed to continue? (ignoring whether their opponent should advance over them) | ||
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
On November 12 2012 10:24 MetalPanda wrote: I'm pretty sure Ryan isn't playing for Henri. I remember Hendralisk say they dropped a player on the team as they didn't need him. Well, he played yesterday. Whether or not it was actually him. | ||
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ChadMann
Australia128 Posts
On November 12 2012 10:28 Zennith wrote: Well, he played yesterday. Whether or not it was actually him. Perhaps after searching for 20 mins to find a player when the match was going ahead - they realised they did still need him?.. so they got him in - even tho he wasn't in their Playoff's line up. Actually, the player SaladToss yesterday played Zerg. The player they said played under that account was Protoss... So either someone else played on that account - or they broke the rule about telling us who was playing under that smurf... I guess Ryan could have offraced too but I doubt that... | ||
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coL.hendralisk
Zimbabwe1756 Posts
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ChadMann
Australia128 Posts
On November 12 2012 10:39 NMxhendralisk wrote: Why would it be colryan it's mMeRyan (zerg floating around top 20-50 of gm since last season) My mistake - I was told it was coL.Ryan.. no probs Ryan =/= Ryan... easy mistake to make. Thanks for the response | ||
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