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The KY
United Kingdom6252 Posts
On April 17 2011 16:25 Geo.Rion wrote: i'm pretty damn sure you re not the first with that Somehow I can't see Mondi losing to Cruncher. I know people are terminally underestimating Cruncher but...it's MONDRAGON. | ||
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RolleMcKnolle
Germany1054 Posts
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Zane
Romania3916 Posts
On April 17 2011 21:56 RolleMcKnolle wrote: just imagine the whine if mondragon loses to deathballs three times in a row^^ A 4gate, a 6gate and a deathball would be way more epic than three deathballs IMO. | ||
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hagrin
United States278 Posts
On April 17 2011 22:01 Zane wrote: A 4gate, a 6gate and a deathball would be way more epic than three deathballs IMO. I'd throw in a proxy gate and a cannon rush too if possible.  | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
I put all my hopes for TSL on the right side of the bracket now, which is Boxer and Mondragon. One of them must make it to the finals. | ||
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Ansinjunger
United States2451 Posts
On April 17 2011 21:56 RolleMcKnolle wrote: just imagine the whine if mondragon loses to deathballs three times in a row^^ He'll counter with roaches :D | ||
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Full.tilt
United Kingdom1709 Posts
On April 17 2011 05:14 Full.tilt wrote: Which games specifically? There was only one game where Sen had a big advantage for the majority of the game. So I just watched the VODs to check if I was seeing things last night. Game 1 Boxer 2 proxy rax, into marine/bunker pressure vs Sen's hatch first. Fails to do any damage loses 1 SCV, Z loses nothing but about 30-secs mining time for about 4 drones. @ 10 min mark it's 2 base vs 2 base with Sen expanding to gold, supplies even. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 2 Boxer makes a forward rax into expand vs Sen's hatch first, no real early pressure from either player. @ 10 min mark Boxer Ovie hunting with vikings but it doesn't supply block Sen, 2 medivac drop but Sen has ling/bane to clean up. Supplies even, Sen on 3 base Boxer on 3 base but 3rd only just finishing. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 3 Boxer double proxy rax vs Sen hatch first. Bunker and marine pressure does nothing except makes 5 drone lose mining time for about a minute, loses 1 scv, 2 bunkers cancelled. @ 10 min mark Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 base, roughly even supply although it's not really important in this game because there's been no early engagements. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 4 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. Fake bunker pressure only 1 marine used. Does nothing, cancels bunker, loses SCV, Sen loses nothing but 4 drones mining time for 30 secs. Only one minor engagement at 6 min, Sen donates 4 lings but still has 10 supply advantage. @ 10 min mark Sen just finished 3 base Boxer on 2 base, supplies roughly even. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 5 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. No early pressure. @ 10 mins Boxer double drops, kills a few overlords, a queen and several drones/lings. Sen still has drone advantage and supplies roughly even but loses 2 base worth of mining time. Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 bases but must have advantage after the harass. No huge advantage early on, Boxer gains upper hand after 10 min mark drops - Boxer wins. In summary there was only one game where I agree one player may have gained a significant advantage 10 mins before gg. The first 4 were too close to call before or at the 10 minute mark, especially when there are banelings and mass marines in play, anything can happen. (The game I referred to in my previous post when Sen had a big advantage for while before winning was game 2 when he had about 20 muta's and he could harass with impunity, but those mass muta still only became effective after about 14 mins) | ||
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thepuppyassassin
900 Posts
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
good luck in the tournament hasuobs protoss | ||
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samaNo4
Spain245 Posts
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mprs
Canada2933 Posts
On April 17 2011 21:56 RolleMcKnolle wrote: just imagine the whine if mondragon loses to deathballs three times in a row^^ Mondragon isn't bad enough to go against a deathball 3 games in a row. I would leave it for lesser zergs to try to clash 200 v 200 armies | ||
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Pippi
Sweden540 Posts
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Ghostcom
Denmark4782 Posts
On April 18 2011 00:51 MorroW wrote: great tournament really i wish i could have gone farther good luck in the tournament hasuobs protoss Was a good match though! Hope you'll just bounce back stronger! | ||
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nakam
Sweden245 Posts
Because there's no "To" in Morrow.... | ||
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See.Blue
United States2673 Posts
On April 18 2011 00:51 MorroW wrote: great tournament really i wish i could have gone farther good luck in the tournament hasuobs protoss Good games morrow. Hope to see you bounce back next time! Also, boxer's series is probably the most incredible series I've seen since SC2 dropped.... | ||
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statikg
Canada930 Posts
On April 17 2011 22:37 Full.tilt wrote: So I just watched the VODs to check if I was seeing things last night. Game 1 Boxer 2 proxy rax, into marine/bunker pressure vs Sen's hatch first. Fails to do any damage loses 1 SCV, Z loses nothing but about 30-secs mining time for about 4 drones. @ 10 min mark it's 2 base vs 2 base with Sen expanding to gold, supplies even. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 2 Boxer makes a forward rax into expand vs Sen's hatch first, no real early pressure from either player. @ 10 min mark Boxer Ovie hunting with vikings but it doesn't supply block Sen, 2 medivac drop but Sen has ling/bane to clean up. Supplies even, Sen on 3 base Boxer on 3 base but 3rd only just finishing. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 3 Boxer double proxy rax vs Sen hatch first. Bunker and marine pressure does nothing except makes 5 drone lose mining time for about a minute, loses 1 scv, 2 bunkers cancelled. @ 10 min mark Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 base, roughly even supply although it's not really important in this game because there's been no early engagements. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 4 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. Fake bunker pressure only 1 marine used. Does nothing, cancels bunker, loses SCV, Sen loses nothing but 4 drones mining time for 30 secs. Only one minor engagement at 6 min, Sen donates 4 lings but still has 10 supply advantage. @ 10 min mark Sen just finished 3 base Boxer on 2 base, supplies roughly even. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 5 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. No early pressure. @ 10 mins Boxer double drops, kills a few overlords, a queen and several drones/lings. Sen still has drone advantage and supplies roughly even but loses 2 base worth of mining time. Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 bases but must have advantage after the harass. No huge advantage early on, Boxer gains upper hand after 10 min mark drops - Boxer wins. In summary there was only one game where I agree one player may have gained a significant advantage 10 mins before gg. The first 4 were too close to call before or at the 10 minute mark, especially when there are banelings and mass marines in play, anything can happen. (The game I referred to in my previous post when Sen had a big advantage for while before winning was game 2 when he had about 20 muta's and he could harass with impunity, but those mass muta still only became effective after about 14 mins) Game 1: Boxer gains a significant advantage when he successful takes out the gold, at this point he takes the gold and zerg is forced to take back base and be behind on bases (3 vs 2 +gold). Whenever you see 3base - 3base, zerg is in alot of trouble. Although this isn't deciding the game from the start or anything, it is definitely a serious midgame advantage. Game 2: Map favors zerg, they both play fairly well but zergs bases are just too easy to defend/too far in this map for terran to get into a good position. Sen does a very good job of defending the early drop harass and although I don't feel this decides the game, becasue of the map, it is very bad for boxer as sen gets to take all the advantage of close air. Maybe boxer should have considered the map and tried a different strategy. I felt that boxer was a bit behind the whole time because of the failed drops but not significantly. Game 3: Boxer again takes a significant lead when he successfully takes out zergs 3rd, sen makes a good effort to fight back, but Boxer plays smart with his advantage and gets PFs and lots of turrets and just consistently denies 4th/5th bases. Theres just no way a zerg can win when its 4v3 bases (nevermind a gold). Game 4: Boxer doing effectively the same thing every game, this time his ~13min push fails to take out the 3rd, he takes significant muta damage at his 3rd, in general he just can't seem to thin out the mutas this game. The the muta numbers just get uncontrollable and boxer cant afford thors because of serious dmg at his 3rd. Game 5 I don't agree with your analysis on this one at all, boxer did do some dmg, but it was mostly just lings and ovies, but sen was on 3 pretty early and boxer was unable to do anything about that this time. This one was the closest of all IMO. So yeah, every game was basically decided by the success/failure of boxers first big push except for game 5. BUT, having said that, I didn't feel that in any of the games except for game 4, that is was IMPOSSIBLE for either side to come back. Each game was pretty amazing and only in game 4 did I really think, man this is definitely over. Probably the best series of the week, however, best game of the week was in the Nada/DDE NASL series, + Show Spoiler + the game where nada is way behind and does an amazing marine drop at DDEs main and pulls off a massive comeback victory | ||
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Full.tilt
United Kingdom1709 Posts
On April 18 2011 01:53 statikg wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 17 2011 22:37 Full.tilt wrote: So I just watched the VODs to check if I was seeing things last night. Game 1 Boxer 2 proxy rax, into marine/bunker pressure vs Sen's hatch first. Fails to do any damage loses 1 SCV, Z loses nothing but about 30-secs mining time for about 4 drones. @ 10 min mark it's 2 base vs 2 base with Sen expanding to gold, supplies even. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 2 Boxer makes a forward rax into expand vs Sen's hatch first, no real early pressure from either player. @ 10 min mark Boxer Ovie hunting with vikings but it doesn't supply block Sen, 2 medivac drop but Sen has ling/bane to clean up. Supplies even, Sen on 3 base Boxer on 3 base but 3rd only just finishing. - No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 3 Boxer double proxy rax vs Sen hatch first. Bunker and marine pressure does nothing except makes 5 drone lose mining time for about a minute, loses 1 scv, 2 bunkers cancelled. @ 10 min mark Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 base, roughly even supply although it's not really important in this game because there's been no early engagements. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Boxer wins. Game 4 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. Fake bunker pressure only 1 marine used. Does nothing, cancels bunker, loses SCV, Sen loses nothing but 4 drones mining time for 30 secs. Only one minor engagement at 6 min, Sen donates 4 lings but still has 10 supply advantage. @ 10 min mark Sen just finished 3 base Boxer on 2 base, supplies roughly even. No huge advantage early on or mid game - Sen wins. Game 5 Boxer forward rax into expand vs Sen hatch first. No early pressure. @ 10 mins Boxer double drops, kills a few overlords, a queen and several drones/lings. Sen still has drone advantage and supplies roughly even but loses 2 base worth of mining time. Sen on 3 base, Boxer on 2 bases but must have advantage after the harass. No huge advantage early on, Boxer gains upper hand after 10 min mark drops - Boxer wins. In summary there was only one game where I agree one player may have gained a significant advantage 10 mins before gg. The first 4 were too close to call before or at the 10 minute mark, especially when there are banelings and mass marines in play, anything can happen. (The game I referred to in my previous post when Sen had a big advantage for while before winning was game 2 when he had about 20 muta's and he could harass with impunity, but those mass muta still only became effective after about 14 mins) Game 1: Boxer gains a significant advantage when he successful takes out the gold, at this point he takes the gold and zerg is forced to take back base and be behind on bases (3 vs 2 +gold). Whenever you see 3base - 3base, zerg is in alot of trouble. Although this isn't deciding the game from the start or anything, it is definitely a serious midgame advantage. Game 2: Map favors zerg, they both play fairly well but zergs bases are just too easy to defend/too far in this map for terran to get into a good position. Sen does a very good job of defending the early drop harass and although I don't feel this decides the game, becasue of the map, it is very bad for boxer as sen gets to take all the advantage of close air. Maybe boxer should have considered the map and tried a different strategy. I felt that boxer was a bit behind the whole time because of the failed drops but not significantly. Game 3: Boxer again takes a significant lead when he successfully takes out zergs 3rd, sen makes a good effort to fight back, but Boxer plays smart with his advantage and gets PFs and lots of turrets and just consistently denies 4th/5th bases. Theres just no way a zerg can win when its 4v3 bases (nevermind a gold). Game 4: Boxer doing effectively the same thing every game, this time his ~13min push fails to take out the 3rd, he takes significant muta damage at his 3rd, in general he just can't seem to thin out the mutas this game. The the muta numbers just get uncontrollable and boxer cant afford thors because of serious dmg at his 3rd. Game 5 I don't agree with your analysis on this one at all, boxer did do some dmg, but it was mostly just lings and ovies, but sen was on 3 pretty early and boxer was unable to do anything about that this time. This one was the closest of all IMO. So yeah, every game was basically decided by the success/failure of boxers first big push except for game 5. BUT, having said that, I didn't feel that in any of the games except for game 4, that is was IMPOSSIBLE for either side to come back. Each game was pretty amazing and only in game 4 did I really think, man this is definitely over. Probably the best series of the week, however, best game of the week was in the Nada/DDE NASL series, + Show Spoiler + the game where nada is way behind and does an amazing marine drop at DDEs main and pulls off a massive comeback victory The original discussion was based on people saying the game was over early on and the game was decided 20 mins before gg, clearly it wasn't. The engagements you mention were all 5 mins at most before gg. I was just disproving the following statements. "a lot of the time, a player gained a huge advantage early on, and managed to keep it to win." and "in hindsight they were all decided kind of early on. Then Sen/Boxer just took 20 minutes to realise they'd lost." | ||
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See.Blue
United States2673 Posts
On April 17 2011 07:53 vrok wrote: Somehow I feel this is almost banworthy under the no balance whine clause. Stop trolling. The QQ is strong with these people Hasu defended like a boss. Morrow just played sloppy, sorry guys | ||
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mysticcharlie
Mexico1 Post
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Odoakar
Croatia1837 Posts
I'd really love to watch that again. | ||
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