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READ POLL THREAD FIRST. Should we... - Page 2

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maareek
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
United States2042 Posts
September 24 2006 14:56 GMT
#21
I think the point is that the team doesn't want the scandal. Even if it's proven that he didn't get someone else to play for him (which is pretty damned impossible at this point, I think) why should mani and the rest of the site/team have to put up with that drama? He made a mistake regardless, and he handled it in the worst possible way. I'm all for giving people another chance, but in this case he pretty much has to be removed from the team for its own good.
FrozenArbiter: Obless PvT master
zonbi
Profile Blog Joined April 2006
Hungary514 Posts
September 24 2006 15:00 GMT
#22
Se7en
Have you ever had sex with a zonbi?
chris672
Profile Joined August 2006
Korea (South)80 Posts
September 24 2006 15:11 GMT
#23
On September 24 2006 14:51 NeVeRDiEDrOnE wrote:
Sorry for caps but this is really important:


I wrote in PGR about the TL vs FiFo result yesterday, here is the page:

PGR's Sandlot 1st week results


And today, Polaris[ArnC] from team PGR, who is a friend of Kosiro, saw the post and replied:


"Hello, I'm Polaris
I want to talk about the Kosiro issue a little bit.

After I saw the TLvsFIFO result post, I rushed to him asap to ask, and show him the news, since I know him personally.
As I was assuming, he didn't know about it at all and was completely suprised by it. And he asked me to post the real circumstances for him here:

Kosiro said that he was actually preparing for the Sandlot match.

On that day he was in a very bad shape because of the aforementioned Pentech meeting after PL, but he didn't dare to fail the tournament so he went to a nearest internet cafe in the middle of the meeting for the games.
But the settings in that place was really horrible, so after game 1 he decided to move to Pentech headquarters.

So he played then HIMSELF game 2 and 3 there, and he went all-in strategies in both games because of his low shape. And won both.

To the suspicion that the replay analysers claimed firefist to have played instead, he replied that he unquestionably played the game himself, and replay shall be analysed as much as needed.

He did his usual in that game, so everything shall be the same and he's innocent.When the final result of replay analysis says forfeit, he will accept it to get kicked out of the tournament.

I(Polaris) have personally varying APM's between 270 and 450 depending on my shape. APM shouldn't be the mesure since progamers have varying APM's too quite often.

We both feel sorry for the issue, and Kosiro said he was aiming to achieve good results so he practiced the non-pro maps quite a lot. And he absolutely couldn't do anything about the scandle.

He further asked to consider that he tried his best actually although he was in a real bad shape.

He've heard about getting kicked out of team TL, but he will give his best for the team victory when he's allowed again to play the tournament.

I(Polaris) really hope this post gets through to TL master, and he feels regrets for the unlucky circumstances.

I know him quite well personally, he is a very nice boy and well-mannered gamer. I really hope that TL shows understanding and Kosiro does well again."



He added his email adress p.s. but I think he doesn't speak eng so I excluded. You can ask me or go to the link or just use this forum.




On September 24 2006 22:53 OneOther wrote:
[[From pgr]]


μ•ˆλ…•ν•˜μ„Έμš”
Hello
Kosiro λΌλŠ” 아이디λ₯Ό μ“°λŠ” μ΄μž¬μ–΅ 이라고 ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I am Lee Je Uk aka Kosiro
여기에 저에 κ΄€λ ¨λœ 글을 보닀가, 글을 λ‚¨κΈ°κ²Œ λ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I saw posts regarding what happened so I decided to go ahead and write one..
직접 아이디λ₯Ό λ§Œλ“€μ–΄μ„œ, 글을 올리렀 ν–ˆμœΌλ‚˜, μƒˆλ‘œ λ§Œλ“  μ•„μ΄λ””λŠ” κΈ€μ“°κΈ°κ°€ μ•ˆλ˜λ”κ΅°μš”,, κ·Έλž˜μ„œ 아이디λ₯Ό μž μ‹œ λΉŒλ ΈμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I am using Polaris' ID because making a new ID would not let me post.
μš°μ„ .. 상황뢀터 λ§μ”€λ“œλ¦¬μžλ©΄, λŒ€νšŒμ „ κ°‘μž‘μŠ€λ ˆ 개인적인 일이 μƒκ²¨μ„œ λŒ€νšŒλ₯Ό ν”Όμ‹œλ°©μ— κ°€μ„œ ν•˜κ²Œλ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. μ»¨λ””μ…˜λ„ 맀우 λ‚˜μœμƒνƒœμ˜€κ΅¬μš” ν•˜μ§€λ§Œ μ „ κ·Έλž˜λ„ 이길렀ꡬ μƒκ°λ§Žμ΄ν–ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. 일딴 μ»¨λ””μ…˜μ΄ μ•ˆμ’‹κΈ° λ•Œλ¬Έμ— 3판2승제 μ˜€λŠ”λ° λͺ¨λ“ κ²Œμž„ 올인으둜 κ²Œμž„ μ‹œμž‘ν•˜κΈ°λ„ 전에 μƒκ°ν–ˆκ΅¬μš”. λͺ¨λ“ κ²œ 10뢄도 μ•ˆλ©λ‹ˆλ‹€.

First of all, to explain what happened, I suddenly had a personal problem so I was forced to play at a PC Cafe. I was in a bad contiion also but I wanted to win really bad. But since it was Best Out Of 3 Match I decided to go all-in in all of them - not one of them lasts more than 10 minutes.
ν”Όμ‹œλ°©μ—μ„œ 1차전을 ν•˜κ²Œλ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. κ·ΈλŸ¬λ‹€ μ‘Œκ΅¬μš”, μ…‹νŒ…μƒνƒœκ°€ μ’‹μ§€ μ•Šμ•„ κ·Όμ²˜μ— μˆ™μ†Œλ‘œ 자리λ₯Ό 옴기고자, μ–‘ν•΄λ₯Ό κ΅¬ν•˜λ €κ³  κ·Έλ•Œμ˜ 제 상황을 λ§μ”€λ“œλ Έκ΅¬μš”.. ν•˜μ§€λ§Œ 그게 제 λœ»κ³ΌλŠ” λ‹€λ₯Έ μ •λ³΄λ‘œ μ‚¬λžŒλ“€κ·€μ— λ“€μ–΄κ°„κ±° κ°™μ•„ 개인적으둜 많이 μ•ˆνƒ€κΉμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I played the first game at the Cafe, and I lost. I disliked the setting so I asked pardon so I could go back to my practice room...and I am disappointed people were misinformed of what really happened during that period of time.

μ œκ°€ μ†Œμ†λœ TLνŒ€μ—μ„œ 이 일둜 μ €λ₯Ό μ œμ™Έν•œλ‹€ 해도 μ €λŠ” μ „ν˜€ 상관이 μ—†κ΅¬μš”, λ‹€λ§Œ μ €λŠ” μ’‹μ€μ·¨μ§€λ‘œ μ—΄λ¦¬λŠ” λŒ€νšŒλΌ, μ΅œκ·Όμ— 쀀비쀑인 λŒ€νšŒλ„ μ—†κ³ ν•΄μ„œ 많이 μ€€λΉ„ν•˜μ˜€μŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
μ°Έ μ˜λ„μ™€λŠ” λ‹€λ₯΄κ²Œ 뢈미슀러운 일둜 λ²ˆμ§€κ³  λ§μ•˜λ„€μš” 정말 μ£„μ†‘ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€.
μƒλŒ€μ„ μˆ˜ Draco μ„ μˆ˜κ»˜λ„ μ£„μ†‘ν•˜κ΅¬μš”, ν•œκ΅­μ— κ³„μ‹œλ‹ˆ λ‹€μŒμ— 볼수 μžˆμ„κ²ƒμž…λ‹ˆλ‹€. κ·Έλ•Œ λΆˆμΎŒν–ˆλ‹€λ©΄ μ‚¬κ³Όν•˜λ©΄ λ˜λŠ”κ²ƒμ΄κ΅¬μš”,,
이 pgr μ΄λž€κ³³μ— 글을 첨 μ“°λŠ”λ°, λͺ‡μ€„ μ•ˆλ˜λŠ” κΈ€μ“°λŠ”λ°λ„ μ°Έ νž˜λ“œλ„€μš” γ…œγ…œ
It won't matter that much to me if TL.Net excludes me from the team because of what happened, but since this tournmanet was a important/fun one and I did not have any other upcoming ones, I practiced a lot for them. I am really sorry for all the unexpected trouble I caused. I apologize to my opponent Draco for what happened, especially considering I will meet him sometime soon since he is in Korea.

[[SKIPPED THE USELESS PARAGRAPH]]

정말 λŒ€νšŒκ°€ μ„±κ³΅μ μœΌλ‘œ μΉ˜λ€„μ‘ŒμœΌλ©΄ 쒋겠ꡬ, TLνŒ€μ˜ μš°μŠΉμ„ λ°”λžλ‹ˆλ‹€.
뢈미슀러운 일이 λ°œμƒν•˜κ²Œ λ˜μ–΄ λ‹€μ‹œν•œλ²ˆ μ‚¬κ³Όμ˜ λœ»μ„ μ „ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€. μ£„μ†‘ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€
μƒˆλ‘œμš΄ν˜•μ‹μ˜ λŒ€νšŒλΌ 많이 κΈ°λŒ€ν•˜κ³  μ€€λΉ„ν–ˆλŠ”λ° 이젠,
μ–΄λ ΅κ²Œ μƒˆλ‘œμš΄νŒ€μ— 듀어와 μ†Œμ†νŒ€μ— λˆ„κ°€ λ˜μ§€ μ•Šμ„κΉŒ 많이 κ±±μ •λ˜λ„€μš” γ…œ γ…œ
I sincerely hope this tournament goes well, and I wish the best and victory for teamliquid.net
I apologize again for the unexpected mess. I am sorry.
It was a new and creative style of tournament so I was excited and prepared for it.
It worries me that I harmed the team instead...
iNsaNe-
Profile Joined January 2005
Finland5201 Posts
September 24 2006 16:34 GMT
#24
Well whatever, but definately not yosh though. Lionking is fucking good though.
It takes a fool to remain sane.
DuSkie
Profile Joined November 2004
Czech Republic451 Posts
September 24 2006 17:01 GMT
#25
On September 25 2006 00:11 chris672 wrote:
Β Β Β Β Β [removed quote within quote]



Show nested quote +
On September 24 2006 22:53 OneOther wrote:
[[From pgr]]


μ•ˆλ…•ν•˜μ„Έμš”
Hello
Kosiro λΌλŠ” 아이디λ₯Ό μ“°λŠ” μ΄μž¬μ–΅ 이라고 ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I am Lee Je Uk aka Kosiro
여기에 저에 κ΄€λ ¨λœ 글을 보닀가, 글을 λ‚¨κΈ°κ²Œ λ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I saw posts regarding what happened so I decided to go ahead and write one..
직접 아이디λ₯Ό λ§Œλ“€μ–΄μ„œ, 글을 올리렀 ν–ˆμœΌλ‚˜, μƒˆλ‘œ λ§Œλ“  μ•„μ΄λ””λŠ” κΈ€μ“°κΈ°κ°€ μ•ˆλ˜λ”κ΅°μš”,, κ·Έλž˜μ„œ 아이디λ₯Ό μž μ‹œ λΉŒλ ΈμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I am using Polaris' ID because making a new ID would not let me post.
μš°μ„ .. 상황뢀터 λ§μ”€λ“œλ¦¬μžλ©΄, λŒ€νšŒμ „ κ°‘μž‘μŠ€λ ˆ 개인적인 일이 μƒκ²¨μ„œ λŒ€νšŒλ₯Ό ν”Όμ‹œλ°©μ— κ°€μ„œ ν•˜κ²Œλ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. μ»¨λ””μ…˜λ„ 맀우 λ‚˜μœμƒνƒœμ˜€κ΅¬μš” ν•˜μ§€λ§Œ μ „ κ·Έλž˜λ„ 이길렀ꡬ μƒκ°λ§Žμ΄ν–ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. 일딴 μ»¨λ””μ…˜μ΄ μ•ˆμ’‹κΈ° λ•Œλ¬Έμ— 3판2승제 μ˜€λŠ”λ° λͺ¨λ“ κ²Œμž„ 올인으둜 κ²Œμž„ μ‹œμž‘ν•˜κΈ°λ„ 전에 μƒκ°ν–ˆκ΅¬μš”. λͺ¨λ“ κ²œ 10뢄도 μ•ˆλ©λ‹ˆλ‹€.

First of all, to explain what happened, I suddenly had a personal problem so I was forced to play at a PC Cafe. I was in a bad contiion also but I wanted to win really bad. But since it was Best Out Of 3 Match I decided to go all-in in all of them - not one of them lasts more than 10 minutes.
ν”Όμ‹œλ°©μ—μ„œ 1차전을 ν•˜κ²Œλ˜μ—ˆμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€. κ·ΈλŸ¬λ‹€ μ‘Œκ΅¬μš”, μ…‹νŒ…μƒνƒœκ°€ μ’‹μ§€ μ•Šμ•„ κ·Όμ²˜μ— μˆ™μ†Œλ‘œ 자리λ₯Ό 옴기고자, μ–‘ν•΄λ₯Ό κ΅¬ν•˜λ €κ³  κ·Έλ•Œμ˜ 제 상황을 λ§μ”€λ“œλ Έκ΅¬μš”.. ν•˜μ§€λ§Œ 그게 제 λœ»κ³ΌλŠ” λ‹€λ₯Έ μ •λ³΄λ‘œ μ‚¬λžŒλ“€κ·€μ— λ“€μ–΄κ°„κ±° κ°™μ•„ 개인적으둜 많이 μ•ˆνƒ€κΉμŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
I played the first game at the Cafe, and I lost. I disliked the setting so I asked pardon so I could go back to my practice room...and I am disappointed people were misinformed of what really happened during that period of time.

μ œκ°€ μ†Œμ†λœ TLνŒ€μ—μ„œ 이 일둜 μ €λ₯Ό μ œμ™Έν•œλ‹€ 해도 μ €λŠ” μ „ν˜€ 상관이 μ—†κ΅¬μš”, λ‹€λ§Œ μ €λŠ” μ’‹μ€μ·¨μ§€λ‘œ μ—΄λ¦¬λŠ” λŒ€νšŒλΌ, μ΅œκ·Όμ— 쀀비쀑인 λŒ€νšŒλ„ μ—†κ³ ν•΄μ„œ 많이 μ€€λΉ„ν•˜μ˜€μŠ΅λ‹ˆλ‹€.
μ°Έ μ˜λ„μ™€λŠ” λ‹€λ₯΄κ²Œ 뢈미슀러운 일둜 λ²ˆμ§€κ³  λ§μ•˜λ„€μš” 정말 μ£„μ†‘ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€.
μƒλŒ€μ„ μˆ˜ Draco μ„ μˆ˜κ»˜λ„ μ£„μ†‘ν•˜κ΅¬μš”, ν•œκ΅­μ— κ³„μ‹œλ‹ˆ λ‹€μŒμ— 볼수 μžˆμ„κ²ƒμž…λ‹ˆλ‹€. κ·Έλ•Œ λΆˆμΎŒν–ˆλ‹€λ©΄ μ‚¬κ³Όν•˜λ©΄ λ˜λŠ”κ²ƒμ΄κ΅¬μš”,,
이 pgr μ΄λž€κ³³μ— 글을 첨 μ“°λŠ”λ°, λͺ‡μ€„ μ•ˆλ˜λŠ” κΈ€μ“°λŠ”λ°λ„ μ°Έ νž˜λ“œλ„€μš” γ…œγ…œ
It won't matter that much to me if TL.Net excludes me from the team because of what happened, but since this tournmanet was a important/fun one and I did not have any other upcoming ones, I practiced a lot for them. I am really sorry for all the unexpected trouble I caused. I apologize to my opponent Draco for what happened, especially considering I will meet him sometime soon since he is in Korea.

[[SKIPPED THE USELESS PARAGRAPH]]

정말 λŒ€νšŒκ°€ μ„±κ³΅μ μœΌλ‘œ μΉ˜λ€„μ‘ŒμœΌλ©΄ 쒋겠ꡬ, TLνŒ€μ˜ μš°μŠΉμ„ λ°”λžλ‹ˆλ‹€.
뢈미슀러운 일이 λ°œμƒν•˜κ²Œ λ˜μ–΄ λ‹€μ‹œν•œλ²ˆ μ‚¬κ³Όμ˜ λœ»μ„ μ „ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€. μ£„μ†‘ν•©λ‹ˆλ‹€
μƒˆλ‘œμš΄ν˜•μ‹μ˜ λŒ€νšŒλΌ 많이 κΈ°λŒ€ν•˜κ³  μ€€λΉ„ν–ˆλŠ”λ° 이젠,
μ–΄λ ΅κ²Œ μƒˆλ‘œμš΄νŒ€μ— 듀어와 μ†Œμ†νŒ€μ— λˆ„κ°€ λ˜μ§€ μ•Šμ„κΉŒ 많이 κ±±μ •λ˜λ„€μš” γ…œ γ…œ
I sincerely hope this tournament goes well, and I wish the best and victory for teamliquid.net
I apologize again for the unexpected mess. I am sorry.
It was a new and creative style of tournament so I was excited and prepared for it.
It worries me that I harmed the team instead...


if this is true, i think he should continue. !@#$ Draco
Patriot.dlk
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Sweden5462 Posts
September 24 2006 17:23 GMT
#26
take lionking
karelen
Profile Joined October 2003
Sweden2407 Posts
September 24 2006 18:23 GMT
#27
i dont care as long as we get to see nazgul at least once tearing it up
zzzzzz
TiQ.SinGi
Profile Joined December 2004
Norway385 Posts
September 24 2006 18:40 GMT
#28
Kosirio should play again! :/
β€œApproved attributes and their relation to face make every man his own jailer; this is a fundamental social constraint even though each man may like his cell.” -Goffman
denyo77
Profile Joined August 2005
Barbados220 Posts
September 24 2006 18:57 GMT
#29
7 player for gods sake
Asjo
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
Denmark664 Posts
Last Edited: 2006-09-24 19:04:43
September 24 2006 19:00 GMT
#30
I really hope to see Lionking join the ranks of Teamliquid.net. It's not just that this brings a talented Korean closer to this site, but it's also just a question of what people would rather see. Personally, I would rather see a very impressive display of skill in a tournament such as this, and Lionking would be most likely to give us that.

While I understand the sentiment of letting TL.net members fight for the money, this is really a decision between wanting to do as well as you can in a competition and helping out some friends. The question is whether TL.net have either the responsibility or desire to do as well as they can. In the beginning TL.net didn't just choose TL.net members as I would have thought. It would have been fun, but TL.net went for the strongest team instead. Granted, the situation is different now as the final seems far away, but TL.net still have the possiblity not to finish last and actually do well.

Returning legends such as ret and Nazgul (who I don't know of personally) sounds exciting, but I find it more likely that Lionking will perform, and don't put as much trust in anyone on the team but Lx, Fantasy and FA to do so.

Also, people, I would like to remind you that in the relevant thread Manifesto just said he talked to Pantech and Blizzard who confirmed Kosiro was guilty, so someone must have confessed. This thing is over with, unfortunately, we cannot have him back.
I am not sure what to say
Polemarch
Profile Joined August 2005
Canada1564 Posts
September 24 2006 19:50 GMT
#31
one thing to add to the case about sticking to 7 players... i think it's the manner thing to do.

you could look at taking lionking as being unfair, because other teams might've drafted him first if they knew he was available. having naz as our captain play i think is fine though.
I BELIEVE IN CAPITAL LETTER PUNISHMENT!!!!!
[GiTM]-Ace
Profile Joined September 2002
United States4935 Posts
September 24 2006 19:56 GMT
#32
i think u should get lionking he seems like a great pickup and i really wanna see Tl do good in this thing
I may not be the best player right now but I think I can beat any 'best' players. I'll beat all the best players and become the best player. Watch me. - Jju
aRai
Profile Joined August 2006
Sweden40 Posts
September 24 2006 20:00 GMT
#33
I think if TL want to have a great shot at this tournament i would get Lionking as the repalcement.
You simply cant afford to lose a top player like Kosiro and think u going to do MORE then fine in this kind of tournament with these kind of players imo.

Mani, great job so far!!! Just hang in there^^
Born to lose, live to win
Sfydjklm
Profile Blog Joined April 2005
United States9218 Posts
September 24 2006 22:13 GMT
#34
given the extreme importance of every single game this no doubt should be replayed
twitter.com/therealdhalism | "Trying out Z = lots of losses vs inferior players until you figure out how to do it well (if it even works)."- Liquid'Tyler
LemOn
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
United Kingdom8629 Posts
September 24 2006 23:04 GMT
#35
Gogo,pick Linoking.



P.S. What about Ret and Nazghul, how many games have you massed up guys?
Much is the father figure that I miss in my life. Go Daddy! DoC.LemOn, LemOn[5thF]
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32278 Posts
Last Edited: 2006-09-24 23:29:49
September 24 2006 23:22 GMT
#36
Nevermind!!
Moderator<:3-/-<
Luhh
Profile Joined October 2003
Sweden2974 Posts
September 24 2006 23:29 GMT
#37
Seven Samurais!
I wouldnΒ΄t call him stupid, but letΒ΄s just say heΒ΄s unlucky when thinking...
bine
Profile Blog Joined April 2005
United States2352 Posts
September 24 2006 23:49 GMT
#38
This is just staggeringly disappointing. We have to win 9/10 and FiFo has to be held to 5/10 to win? There's simply no chance of that happening. I just have to ask why this tournament is so poorly structured; it's really striking that one ill circumstance in one match (going 4-1) means you are out of the tournament no matter what. That's just silly.

I definitely think we should take LionKing. Even if we can't win, we should give the other teams a run for their money, and picking anyone yosh over lionking would be an indication that we have resigned ourselves to being uncompetitive. Let's just try to generate the best games possible with the best players possible, and show what could have been if we had gotten a fair lot.

We've been screwed the whole way: Logo contest, Other teams getting free players when they spent their minerals, Fisheye being so expensive and such a triumphant waste, this massive kosiro bungle that cost us the tournament.... We could never have won with so much force against us, but at least we can show them that we can win matches. Let's take LK, win the next two matches and claim ourselves a nice fat moral victory.
Asjo
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
Denmark664 Posts
September 25 2006 00:10 GMT
#39
bine, that the tournament is like that doesn't make it badly structured. Blizzard prefer to have one final to end it instead of dragging it along with semi-finals. Seems fair with so few teams participating. There is still the 1.000$ to fight about for the players, even if they know they cannot reach the final.

Four teams are competing for a spot, and obviously if you lose big time to one of the other three, you aren't likely to get to the final. Now, if Teamliquid had only lost 2-3, it would have looked somewhat better. There would still be three matches to get 15 points, whereas pgr21 couldn't get more than ten in those three matches if Teamliquid were to qualify. Most likely, TL.net won't win their next three matches 5-0, so, maybe if TL.net got 11 points, pgr21 could only get six points. That would be three 2-3 defeats, which wouldn't be impossible with this level of competitions.
I am not sure what to say
Wasabi
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States3085 Posts
September 25 2006 01:05 GMT
#40
--- Nuked ---
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