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Braavos36375 Posts
![[image loading]](http://teamliquid.net/staff/pachi/xd/TSLworld_t.jpg) + Show Spoiler [Results] +Strelok wins 3-1 vs Tarson in finals Replays: first pack is all the replays, second pack is only from round 4 and beyond when all games were BO3 or BO5 + Show Spoiler +TSL Weekend Tournament
Sign ups for the tournament will open at in about 12 hours at 17:00 CET on April 5th. now this is not the only step in signing up for the tournament. At roughly 19:30 CET check ins will open. At this point the first 64 players to check in on the website will get the spots in the tournament. The tournament then starts at 20:00 CET, you will be able to find both of the links at the following once both stages are set by me. I will be using the clock on sc.iccup.com at the right not the server time for all 3 times.
http://sc.iccup.com/icctourney/300/
Signups - 17:00 CET / 11:00 EST / 00:00 KST (TL Time)
Checkin - 19:30 CET / 13:30 EST / 02:30 KST (TL Time)
Start - 20:00 CET / 14:00 EST / 03:00 KST (TL Time)
Now more important than the details of this tournament are different than normal tournaments so if anyone asks I'm going to refer them back to this post.
TSL Tournament Rules: - This tournament is for TSL players ONLY to make up for the fact that normal tournaments dont count for them. I will be checking people against the TSL team roster before the start so don't test this. Checking in when you are not a TSL player will result in a disqualification period. Make sure you are on your TSL name before you check in. Signing up under the wrong name is not a problem as long as you do not check in.
- Pausing is allowable if the opponent agrees but they are allowed to unpause at any time, if you start a game it is your responsibility to finish it. It is too hard for admins to regulate pauses.
- All games in the tournament through the first 5 rounds must be played in Ladder Mode, Round 6 (Finals) will have myself observing and additional observers if the players allow them.
- Auto replay is a requirement of TSL. You must have your auto replay on in the case that a iCCup or TSL admin needs to view your game.
- All other tournament rules apply, if you have a question ask the tournament admin not other players.
Format: - This is a 64 player single elimination tournament consisting of 6 rounds with a different starting map for each round.
- This is a pay in tournament, it costs 50 ladder points to check in to the tournament, and the top 4 players will receive ladder points as prizes beyond the points earned through the tournament.
- Prizes are as following: 1st - 1000 ladder points, 2nd - 750 ladder points, 3rd/4th - 450 ladder points.
- Rounds 1-3 are single elimination, Round 4 and 5 are BO3, and the Finals Round 6 are BO5.
- The BO3 and BO5 rounds are loser picks next map using any map in the iccup map pool, use the /maps command to check if a map is in the pool before choosing a map as the next map.
Notices: - By checking in you are in effect signing a contract saying that you will show up for the tournament. When you check in you are agreeing to have 50 ladder points removed from your account as payment to join the tournament.
- Failure to show for the start of the tournament after checking in will result in a penalty of 200 ladder points beyond the 50 point pay in.
- Reporting a false match result on the website or to the admin will result in a disqualification if necessary and a 200 point penalty.
- Submitting a false replay will result in a 200 point penalty.
Good Luck to all who attend,
--Rael
PM iCCup.Raelcun with any further questions.
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Cool, can't wait to see who will take #1!
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sweet! i hope i can participate, even though i'm big noob =(
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Will be in channel: Tournaments on the iCCup server
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8748 Posts
Playing B vs D ladder game during the tournament will be interesting.
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this tour doesnt reward playing. it costs 6400 points in total. and only gives back 2200 to the people.
that should be more leveld if you ask me.
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On April 05 2008 20:43 NonY[rC] wrote:
Playing B vs D ladder game during the tournament will be interesting.
Yeah, I don't get this. Will different ranks be forced to play ladder games against one another? Sounds unfair.
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TeamLiquid was worried about players not playing ladder games throughout a tournament and not risking losing any points then getting 1000 points for a win which was unbalanced. As for only giving back 2200 to the people they play ladder games the entire way through the rewards are added to what they gain through the tournament so even if people make it to the 2nd or 3rd round usually they get more than what they paid back. The only way to run a tournament for TSL was required ladder type.
5 rounds of play two of those are BO3 so thats 7 ladder games minimum leading up to the ifnal if someone goes undefeated to the final thats 7 wins + 750 for at least second place thats a pretty big jump in ratings
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why not just have a bigger buy in and give prize points to more places, it accomplishes the same purpose but is more fair.
the reasoning makes sense, but it doesnt change the fact that it sucks for B players to be forced to play D players on ladder games.
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just some clarification.. how do we sign up? and does signing up guarantee that we'd be able to participate?
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8748 Posts
The way it's set up now, it's a gamble for a top player to play. A huge gamble. It shouldn't be like that. A tournament is supposed to have the same or better risk/reward than playing the normal ladder. In a tournament, the difficulty level is higher than normal ladder games, so to keep the same risk/reward, failing needs to result in a smaller loss of points and succeeding needs to result in a greater gain of points. As it is, succeeding has about the same gain as succeeding in normal ladder games and failing is a much much bigger loss.
To fix it, make it so players only need to play ladder games if they are within 1 rank of their opponent, and give points to everyone in the top 8 for a 32 man tournament or top 16 for a 64 man tournament.
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none of this was possible for this tournament the TL staff I was talking to in order to set up this tournament was worried about higher rewards giving a top player enough of a boost they could almost guarantee a top 16 or top 48 place with those extra points. We are giving you a chance to play tournaments if only 3 of them something which normally wouldnt happen during TSL. It's an additional option and if one of the top players were to join its not as big of a risk as it seems as its rather hard to create a smurf in the TSL to abuse low rank.
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yeah Idra is in  ) he got balls!
let's hope even more topplayers will join
balls to the walls guys! balls to the walls!
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doesnt have to be a smurf. lamer started playing recently and is D or D+ rank. hes capable of beating most of the B rank players, why should he benefit so much more from the tournament than high ranked players?
just increase the buyin, that gives a more proportionate risk, and give prize points to more players, pretty much the same having them win points from the individual games. its almost the same end result, but it doesnt favor low ranked players for no reason.
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I can't increase the prize points manifesto wouldnt really allow anything more than the 1000/750/450/450 scale because the boost would be pretty large above that. If this goes over decently I'll be having one of these each weekend for 3 total, thats a total prize pool of 2650 per tournament and 7850 total thats quite a lot of extra points to be putting into the ladder for just a 3 week event. I did realize that the payin was marked wrong on a 64 player tournament it should be -50 not -100 I fixed it on iCCup news but since I had to have Hot_Bid post here I can only make ac omment and see if I can get him to edit it.
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Another question: Will this tournament be locked to 64 spots, or will you open more spots if there seems to be an interest for it?
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i didnt say increase the prize points
i said increase the buyin, and give lower spots smaller prizes. like, add 200 or 300 point prizes for places 5-8.
that simulates having each match count as a ladder game, but without penalizing the higher ranks.
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Only top four getting points should be good for the more skilled players. Gamble, yes. But one that pays off. If the 2200 points are rewarded to the top 50% then that will be less good for the most skilled players.
Sure, this is good for new accounts owned by skilled players because they get to play against higher ranked players. And thus bad for those higher ranked players who end up having to play against those. Maybe having each match be considered as a match between equals would have been better. It's a tournament after all.
More of the top 10 better sign up. You don't want Idra to take this, do you?
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Is there any way to sign off tourney. My internet is lagging rather badly so I can't really game.
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Hmm, if I can somehow register a TSL account, this might be my chance to 4-pool Monodragon
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I'm checking all registrations vs the TSL team theres already one person who thought they could get in with a TSL tag but wasnt on the team
On April 06 2008 00:57 Sean.G wrote:
Another question: Will this tournament be locked to 64 spots, or will you open more spots if there seems to be an interest for it?
It's hard for one person to run a 128 person tournament lol for the first week it probably wont be necessary I might have to have back up next week and the third week just in case there is a demand for 128.
And Idra this format is designed to be fair throughout the 3 weeks it's hosted, it may be a little tilted the first week due to people starting slowly but in week 2 and week 3 I believe it will be considered much better and there will be less complaints because by then people be ranking up except for the couple people who reset.
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I agree with Idra.
Increase Buyin slightly and spread distribution to more players = Win Win
A tourney is only a good tourney if lots of topplayers battle it out in epic matches. Anything to pull more of them in should seriously be considered
Also some kind of stream with commentary and lots of replay updates would be over the top =)
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all the replays will be uploaded onto the site under the tournament replays tab I can pack them all together into a replay pack once the whole thing is done but its up there for anyone to choose what games they want to see once its over. And its hard to change the structure on short notice I can take it into account next week but its probably too late for this week
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yay i'm the first check-in !!!
i am so screwed. =(.
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Had to play brat_ok in 1st round o_o Was going to play standard but instead did 9 pool into 1 hatch lurker. 
haha, but good tournament, thanks!
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Netherlands4511 Posts
I had to play a russian who couldn't play on Lan Latency.
I refused to play without lan latency but Realcun made me play.
1) If he can't play lan latency, why is he even in the tournament or in the league?
2) how am i supposed to play on b.net latency after playing Lan Latency only for 4 months?
I feel so gay'ed right now.
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Where exactly is the "tournament replays tab"?
I'm kinda new here and a little confused 8(
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8748 Posts
On April 06 2008 03:51 ret wrote:
I had to play a russian who couldn't play on Lan Latency.
I refused to play without lan latency but Realcun made me play.
1) If he can't play lan latency, why is he even in the tournament or in the league?
2) how am i supposed to play on b.net latency after playing Lan Latency only for 4 months?
I feel so gay'ed right now.
Yep, LAN latency should be a requirement. I had to play my 3rd game without LAN latency and it was really tough
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the fact is not all connections can support LAN latency and to require it would prevent them from playing at all, though in most cases if you play with LAN latency on and it lags its still better than playing without so you can politely ask them to try it. If they absolutely refuse then theres not much for the admin to do about it. This was not brought up as an issue by TLNet if they want LAN latency to be required in the next TSL tournament then they should bring it up but the fact that LAN isnt a requirement for the league play at least not mentioned in the rules doesnt help your argument either
@Sappling on the top of the iccup page under files click tournament re plays
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If it's laggy on LL, use High latency; it'll still be a lot lower than B.net. If it's still laggy, use Extra High (still lower than B.net Low setting if MoC's formula is correct).
You can't expect every pair of computers on the internet to have less than 200ms latency between them. (that's directed at whoever refused to use LL)
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thx realcun, I was looking for the reps on TL.net 
nice games so far, especially strelok vs nony was very enjoyable to watch!
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Will there be a replay pack at the end of it, or do I have to start picking them off?
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FInals delayed between Strelok and Tarson because it was 2am and 1am for them respectively they will play BO5 April 6th (sunday) at 19:00 CET
replays up to this point can be found http://sc.iccup.com/tour_reps/300/ there. I will make a pack once the finals are done
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Awww, I'm gonna be clicking links for the next 40 minutes x(
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8748 Posts
Wow why the fuck was it delayed again? Cuz the time was inconvenient for them? You shouldn't make exceptions like that. Sign up = play. Don't play = forfeit. Those are the rules I've seen for every tournament on iCCup. They both deserve no points and a 200 point penalty for signing up and not playing.
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This is the way I have always run tournaments online and there is no rule against it it was late for the both of them and they both wanted to sleep, and if both players can guarantee they will be able to show up at a later time not too much later then I don't see the harm in letting them play tomorrow it's even before the tournament started today. Are you really going to make them play a bo5 tvt at 2am?
They were manner about it which was the most important factor if they were I NEED SLEEP GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOOGOGOGOOGOGOGO then I would have been less forgiving. I'm sorry if you disagree with this but since they both asked for it seperately I saw no problem with it. If one of them fails to show up they -will- be dealt with extremely harshly BECAUSE they asked to delay it. Trust me I don't take delaying a tournament final lightly, it will be DQ no point award and -200 and a possible ban from the next TSL weekend tournament trust me it's in their best interest to show up.
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On April 06 2008 07:56 NonY[rC] wrote:
Wow why the fuck was it delayed again? Cuz the time was inconvenient for them? You shouldn't make exceptions like that. Sign up = play. Don't play = forfeit. Those are the rules I've seen for every tournament on iCCup. They both deserve no points and a 200 point penalty for signing up and not playing.
What a crybaby soreloser omg,just becoz strelok owned u shouldnt be bm
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LL should be mandatory, if you can't play with it then oh well dont sign up? If people have to play ladder games then yes make the points more of a spread not such a risk to play - this drives people away. One's gotta put some thought into these things.
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4492 Posts
On April 06 2008 07:56 NonY[rC] wrote:
Wow why the fuck was it delayed again? Cuz the time was inconvenient for them? You shouldn't make exceptions like that. Sign up = play. Don't play = forfeit. Those are the rules I've seen for every tournament on iCCup. They both deserve no points and a 200 point penalty for signing up and not playing.
LOL
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The fact that LL isn't mandatory is kind of a joke. Even if it lags you can put it on high or extra high and it'll still be much, much lower than bnet low.
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it should be but it's not and it's not really something thats easy to change I'd have to run it by the other super admin and the head admin first. It makes sense for it to be mandatory at least in tournaments. I'm going to work with Manifesto and Hot_Bid to try and set some kind of max rank differential for the ladder requirement for next weeks tournament as well. This tournament was a learning experience for all of us because we don't normally have completely open tournaments rank wise on iCCup. I would have preferred if people were a little *ahem* more polite and considerate with their suggestions but it won't stop me from taking them into consideration.
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IdrA, atm Lamer is ranked C- with a 23-0 record..
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how do u download replays on iccup? i go file/tourney replays click on the tournament and then i just see 2 links, 1 for bracket and 1 for player list. i lick on bracket and there's no link for replays?
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wtf?
When the whining will stop??? Some guys are working hard for a thing that is a privilege for you... and you guys are still whining? Whining about everything I can imagine...
Every news, every thread = mass whining... Come on.
really..
wtf!
the guy can't play on LL = omgbbbxxkakaka its the apocalypse! I played with bnet latency for 8 years but I can't play anymore, omg! its so unfair!!!
Deal with it. Bnet its not a lan.
both guys accept to delay the final = omggmahamaoahaoam omg! its the apocalypse! I couldn't beat one of them and I'm mad! omgbbbchahaorurprj omg! its so unfair!!!
Dealt with it. The tournament didn't had an online broadcast programed and both players wanted to delay the final...
PS: I don't even play bw anymore... I just play poker but i'm trying to enjoy a big tournament by those great guys that made tl.net(and its 'affiliates') the best sites I(and much others) visit... We rarely see one "thanks" in those threads...
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I agree with nony. I think that Strelok and Tarson should be banned from TSL,tlnet and from life.
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Hm, I am agreed in the thought of play UMS, while in tournement so the ranked differ doesn't matter.
Secondly I think it is okay to delay the T on T Bo5, since both parts agree.
But I think we should start such a tournement ealier so we can be done in one night, not cool to be on a rampage and have to stop because of it is getting late. And then it should be madatory to play whole the tour in one night, so we avoid these problems.
The LL should be madatory as well, if not we should all have GG client and use that as replacement in stead of b.net which in my opinion basicly sucks.
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On April 06 2008 18:35 mcmascote wrote:
wtf?
When the whining will stop??? Some guys are working hard for a thing that is a privilege for you... and you guys are still whining? Whining about everything I can imagine...
Every news, every thread = mass whining... Come on.
really..
wtf!
the guy can't play on LL = omgbbbxxkakaka its the apocalypse! I played with bnet latency for 8 years but I can't play anymore, omg! its so unfair!!!
Deal with it. Bnet its not a lan.
both guys accept to delay the final = omggmahamaoahaoam omg! its the apocalypse! I couldn't beat one of them and I'm mad! omgbbbchahaorurprj omg! its so unfair!!!
Dealt with it. The tournament didn't had an online broadcast programed and both players wanted to delay the final...
PS: I don't even play bw anymore... I just play poker but i'm trying to enjoy a big tournament by those great guys that made tl.net(and its 'affiliates') the best sites I(and much others) visit... We rarely see one "thanks" in those threads...
/agree
TL.net and Iccup brings us one of the biggest tournaments ever and people are just complaining, it's the first time for them, take it easy! So far I must say that they have handeld every problem very nice.
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just a little unclear on the pause thing, your opponent can agree to pause the game, and then un pause when you are away and its your fault ?
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On April 06 2008 17:17 Fearsome wrote:
IdrA, atm Lamer is ranked C- with a 23-0 record..
indeed
he has won games in the day since i posted that. hard to believe, isnt it?
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@gg_hertz when you click tournament replays to the right click the replays link next to the brackets link
@Craixs I can't start the tournament earlier because of the clanwars on saturdays like it or not this time slot is about the only available time for a tournament that doesn't interfere with the clanleague and allows at least most of the foreign players a chance to show up
@besiger.cry You're allowed to pause at any point but since it's so hard to find out how long you paused the game for we can't regulate it. In a case where someone pauses and just leaves hoping the opponent either leaves or unpauses it (which would have been against the rules) it's hard to tell if they did that or if the opponent just unpaused immediately. So therefore the rule is you can pause but your opponent may unpause it as well, sucks but thats the way we have to do it because we can't regulate it
@everyone else mcmaste has the right point with the wrong words. I worked very hard trying to find out a format that works for TLNet and iCCup it could use some fixing but the fact is I could have not tried at all. I'm still working on trying to improve it despite the fact that people seem to think flaming is a valid form of criticism I'll keep you guys posted on what happens and then it's your decision to play or not but I got several people who showed up didnt read the rules and then when they found out OMG LADDER REQUIRED? they left in a huff, I have no patience for people who dont read the rules when it's posted on 2 websites, my profile, and mentioned in every /ann that I made on the server.
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UPDATE: Strelok wins 3-1 vs Tarson, finishing up tournament details and will make replay pack soon
REPLAYS: first one is all replays, second is only from round 4 and beyond when all games were BO3 or BO5
+ Show Spoiler +
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Braavos36375 Posts
Thanks Raelcun for running this.
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Strangely, the second pack contains the game of nony against JuanJo (round 3) but the game of nony against Strelok (round 4) isn't there. Maybe a little mistake?
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hmm apparently, I'll check that, yeah I went through and renamed them so people could watch the ones they wanted to see and since they were a complete mess with series split up all throughout the folder. I have no idea why nony played JuanJo twice, I saw two games and figured it was one of the bo3 matches hang on I can upload a fixed version
edit- Thanks for pointing that out I counted out 7 bo3 games and didnt realize I missed that game because of it, fixed version of the round4 and on here
+ Show Spoiler +
I left the extra nony vs JuanJo in there just cuz they apparently played a bo3 lol
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thanks for the replays ^^
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I have no idea why nony played JuanJo twice
He did not, the two games are in fact the same game with two different titles.
Thanks a lot for uploading these replays; it's great to have access to TSL games!
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Congrats Strelok.
Thanks Raelcun for your tireless efforts; seems like you took some flak this time around.
Thanks for the replay as well.
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On April 07 2008 13:14 War_Minister wrote:He did not, the two games are in fact the same game with two different titles. Thanks a lot for uploading these replays; it's great to have access to TSL games!
wow interesting I wonder how it got uploaded twice under different names? because they didnt have the same name when they still had the autoreplay naming
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Is it me or is 1000 points a bit much?
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1000 points is a lot to a good player which is supposed to be to draw them into playing, thats the standard amount of points but keep in mind they played a 64 player tournament and had to fight through a lot of games, several of the top players by the time they got to the points were down points because they were winning so few by beating the lower ranks. Nony vs Sen I think it was he won 20 points by beating Sen twice and lost 200 when he lost one game in the bo3.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://teamliquid.net/staff/Hot_Bid/TSL_Launch/tournament1.jpg)
