On May 25 2023 20:25 TankTopTiger wrote: So I guess my first question is why Marv is just getting a free walk here? What makes everyone so certain he's town when for the most part he's not exerted any influence?
He didn't get a free walk. We attacked marv and then welcomed him in the town circle after vetting him. It's ok if you missed that. You might have read discussions about a mebaby post saying marv looked town that scammed people in a previous game and now everybody is attacking him.
Also. You say some people feel fake (because we force reads most likely), and then you don't like marv for "not exerting" any influence. That is a contradiction you should try to get rid of. marv is indeed a calm player, and is not yelling and swearing. But he did get his preferred target 5 votes. So he influenced at least that. Or was that somebody else his doing?
Can you give me a time frame for when this vetting occurred? Because IMO that early nonsense where people push and pull based on nothing but farts means zero so establishing someone's alignment forevermore during that primordial soup is not a strong foundation for a town.
RE: Contradiction It's not a contradiction. Having genuine reads is not the opposite of passivity. He asks a lot of questions (good), but then doesn't seem to take them anywhere in service to anything but his survival.
I don't like fake reads, I think they muddy shit up. They're necessary to get the ball rolling, but once the ball is rolling I expect genuine reads not empty accusations. The ball is rolling and has been for a while, so IMO we don't need them.
Again, to reiterate, confirmed town VIvax made the same case at almost the same time as me on MZ
Seriously, think about it a bit. Vivax’s read is literally confirmed townie. Mine, made at the same time is …… ?
On May 25 2023 20:25 TankTopTiger wrote: Hi, I'm the sub for Sentinel. I'm caught up, but just pushed 1400 posts through my brain at top speed so don't expect me to be 100% on the ball. I'm going off vibes, so please feel free to correct me.
I've played before, maybe 10 newbie games. I'm an IRL friend of DP. I've also played meatspace werewolf a fair amount. I haven't played forum mafia in close to a decade, and don't really plan on approaching the game the same way anyway.
From what I see, there seems to be some mutual respect between Rayne, DP, and Marv. Almost like they are playing for who controls the endgame and the rest of you are just the social environment that facilitates it. Out of the three, I have no idea why people are acting like Marv is obviously town. He plays like an empty vessel. I'm obviously not part of whatever meta you guys have, but IMO MZ's aggression towards Marv has been warranted.
I would have voted for Vivax over MZ, who I get a town read off.
So I guess my first question is why Marv is just getting a free walk here? What makes everyone so certain he's town when for the most part he's not exerted any influence? IMO both Rayn and DP have provided insight, and in my eyes are earning their status, but not Marv.
Regarding VE, they strike me as committed to a bit. I'm not sure why they had such insane confidence, but honestly, a lot of how you guys talk comes off as fake to me.
Not exerted any influence? My target would have been lynched if not for some crazy EOD shenanigans and the fact i was asleep. How Much more influence do you want?
if you are town you will die in the first night for shure. Mafia are to scared of good players like you, so they make you die, because they know people would vote me out directly and so we lose 3 town people in D1 N1 and D2. If you don´t die in this night you are more likly to be mafia (for me) and people would vote on you on d2
... ... ... Can I please get shot so I can see marv defending himself against MZ, TTT and Mebaby while DP is cackling maniacally in the corner?
why you think dp?
I am stuck between thinking he cant think, or that he really should stop trying.
I am town then? so you calling me mafia was not genuine?
On May 25 2023 09:24 DarthPunk wrote:This is very strange to me because I asked you earlier why I shouldn't lynch vivax and you said you wouldn't stop me but now the Vivax vote from VE is wrong and we are not going to lynch mafia.
I think you both may vote for Vivax if you want to, i am not gonna stand in the way. I just don't think you're likely to lynch mafia, although there is a chance he is mafia lol.. I guess that's me saying it's not my preferred lynch in a way, or i dont even know what i am saying anymore, havent slept in almost a day.
Do what you do, i dont think there is any more players for me to change their opinion onto what i want o be the lynch, so up to you. If you dont want Meapak lynched, do something about it.
On May 25 2023 09:31 raynpelikoneet wrote: Disclaimer; i am not voting vivax over meapak whatever the situation is when i am awake during D1. Just that you know.
I will need to analyse this further.
So rayn made a comment that opened the gate to make 6 people vote Vivax. And all these posts I read in his filter saying MZ was a better lynch in his eyes were inefficient.
So which voodoo did he use to make that 1 message so much more powerful?
I shall need to contact the Brown for this.
Have you read all the posts yet?
I literally asked him why, and he gave no reasons, and then later tacitly agreed with VE that it was because of the fact that you had all agreed to the lynch prior and he didn't want scum to influence at the end.
The next time I take a shit I will put some glitter on it, look at it for 30 seconds and flush. I think that will be more tasteful than reading the 350 posts before the Vivax lynch.
Well in the interest of accuracy then, maybe you shouldn't put weight on that section of the game if you don't care to read. it.
Or ask questions about it
Or declare you will lynch half the town as a result of it.
Not having read it and all.
Half of the town (the bad part) and all the mafia.
The broken clock is correct twice per day.
As far as we know that is twice times more than you.
On May 25 2023 21:32 TankTopTiger wrote: Nah this is BS. Absence of evidence and all that. I'm asking you to substantiate your town status. You say you made a case but can't point to it. Now I have to remember or reread every single post or can't question you. Bullshit.
Koshi says you were vetted but that's not what I remember. You say you made a case but that's not what I remember.
I'm not reading it all again. There's an easy way to clear this up.
I don't need it right now, we've got three days until next lynch. Do you have access to a computer in that time?
He did make a case FWIW.
On May 24 2023 17:14 marvellosity wrote: First post of the game on a computer for me, hurrah! And first post of today with clothes on, you'll all be thrilled to hear. I'm going to summarise where I'm at.
Koshi and rayn seem pretty-to-very town to me, at least if they are not I am not going to be catching them very soon. rayn thinks what I think a good bunch of the time. Koshi loves to vote for me d1 as town (not that that's the reason for the read, but ya know)
DP I am no longer particularly suspicious of, I don't think I have a reason to be.
VE I don't think I am suspicious of either. Some of his posts are very ?????? to me, but I don't think that makes him mafia. VE loves a big or crazy sort of play as mafia and he's not afraid to put himself out there, but I don't think it's like this?
Vivax I am unsure of. Tonally I think he looks fairly town, but before I looked at his filter just now I'm at least somewhat suspicious of him. It feels to me that a town-Vivax should be using all his irl leverage to really question and dig into MB's alignment, rather than giving occasional summaries of his thoughts. I just imagine myself in Vivax's position - I would want nothing more than to determine the alignment of my friend. I did re-read his filter though and it also didn't scream mafia particularly apart from that, random comment about MB being mafia spews me town, is that something he writes as mafia?
Slam could be anything (if there's a way to tell that I can't remember, enlighten me). LS I am also very null on.
MB I don't have much else to add than what Koshi said and my response to what Koshi said not long ago. Could easily be mafia, meatbaby - I really encourage you to post your thoughts and reasoning behind them as much as possible today
MZ I think is mafia. It was floating around in my brain yesterday, but the case against me at least looked clean and (some) of his posts maybe looked okay, so I wasn't sure how to pinpoint what I was thinking. But rayn's comments about MZ and how his posting style appeared to him in past games really resonated to me and helped me make sense of my thoughts. Actually his case against me is too clean/obvious, and I don't think he's actually trying to discern my alignment. I think he is playing the way an old-school scum player plays, relatively unruffly comments, targeting someone (me) that has at least some thread traction, a case that 'makes sense' but doesn't dig any further.
##vote: MZ
P.S. I am slightly sad that we have 2 non-posters, I hope at least 2 mafia sit in the people actually playing, or it's gonna be sucky.
On May 25 2023 21:35 TankTopTiger wrote: TBH You could just summarise it and I'll trust the collective other 10 people to fact check you. This doesn't have to be hard. We could already be done.
He follows that post I linked with heaps prodding about MZ reads etc.
Basically, you can know this is the case because multiple people discussed sheeping marv, which means they were following his read and case, and that wouldn't be possible without Marv having made the case in the first place.
On May 26 2023 10:41 VisceraEyes wrote: Hypocritical how? Because I haven't done anything this night-phase?
I meant THEY look bad for not doing anything overnight because they didn't do anything OVER THE DAY. I did a lot of stuff over the day, haven't I fucking done enough for 1 cycle?
Yeah we lynched the fucking doctor. Pretty fantastic aren't we.
On May 26 2023 09:11 TankTopTiger wrote: RE: DP I just reread his filter. I think I consider him more reasonable a lot of the time which is not the same as insightful. Other than his strong town read on Marv, I see a lot of this game the same. So I came away with the impression he had demonstrated more insight than he had. I didn't like DP's posts early on (first 400 posts or so). It came across as corporate placation speak to me. But as there was more to talk about I felt he was consistently providing reads I agreed with.
On May 24 2023 07:46 raynpelikoneet wrote: People i don't want to lynch: Koshi Lightningstrike marvellosity
Probably not Darthpunk either. From what i know DP is very aware of the state of the game when he is mafia, not afraid to engage in conversations with his scumbuddies, basically he tends to look very town especially early on. This game i feel like DP is more like.. clueless(?) at times, and i think it's more likely genuine "i don't know what's going on" rather than "i pretend i don't really know what's going on". If DP would be mafia he would probably be mafia with two peopel who haven't posted yet.
VE goes to the same category. I don't really agree with his conclusions, hell i don't even know why he writes what he writes but i don't really think VE as mafia would write what he writes.
Vivax looks active and i'd say more likely town too. I didn't hate his last post, although there is a creeping suspicion about him and meatbaby goin like "hey can i say this in thread" -- "yeah it's fine, noone will believe you anyways and it's great distancing anyways", but i don't really have any other reason to think Vivax is mafia atm, and that reasoning in itself is stupid.
Would lyncherino:
meatbaby -- what Koshi said
MZ is tricky. Last couple (three?) games i have been mafia and every time MZ goes to post something D1 i go like "man how the hell can anyone think anything like that (he has been town)?!?!?!" and then i go "man, how the hell can anyone think MZ is mafia?!?!?" and everyone wants to lynch him.. I don't get the same feeling at all here. Maybe it's because i am not mafia and i am looking at the game differently with not all the information. I can see MZ genuinely thinking marv is mafia but something just doesn't sit right there.
Slam is the least of these three. It's not really alignment indicative for him to "cling" on someone and answer to (all of) their posts, but nothing really makes me think he is town. Probably not mafia together with marv is my best conclusion atm.
Everyone who has not posted can also die for all i care. Or anyone who has posted and i had not in my list.
I liked Rayn's take on DP and on others. It feels like they have meta takes, but don't just regurgitate them and assume everyone shares them. I'm not privy to past games (or don't have the time to read them), so them sharing this insight is appreciated. In comparison, Koshi and Marv feel like they're trying to make me shut up if I don't agree with the thing they refuse to explain. Which is how to survive but not how to lead IMO.
This ^^ is why people listen to rayn btw @Koshi.
TTT who would you like to lynch next cycle? aside from marv who do you think is most suspicious right now?
On May 26 2023 10:41 VisceraEyes wrote: Hypocritical how? Because I haven't done anything this night-phase?
I meant THEY look bad for not doing anything overnight because they didn't do anything OVER THE DAY. I did a lot of stuff over the day, haven't I fucking done enough for 1 cycle?
Yeah we lynched the fucking doctor. Pretty fantastic aren't we.
I imagine D2 is going to be A FUCKING LOT of DP and VE filtering and giving our opinions so we aren't the lynch. If you're mafia I look forward to sweating alongside the enemy lmao
Yeah I know, the least fun part of the game tbh. But it is what it is.
So I am going to address the shit where Rayn thinks I am soft blaming him for the lynch on vivax, and I guess I sort of am, (although I also take responsibility for being wrong/bad or whatever makes you feel better) because from my perspective I was very open to being on either wagon at the time.
On May 25 2023 08:30 DarthPunk wrote: I could also get on the MZ wagon by the way.
Out of all the people who want to kill me, this one makes me the most sad
Im really open minded, just do more, tell me why I should lynch Lightning strike? Cause that dude is seriously not engaged. Is that normal?[/QUOTE
On May 25 2023 08:37 LightningStrike wrote: Hey just got home from dinner and I see a Vivax train is started -_- Seriously though I don't like it and it formed very fast too like wtf?????
I just love when people who aren't very active magically show up when their name is mentioned, especially close to the deadline.
I don't know enough about his meta game to say that low activity is alignment indicative but I will say I've hated how all of his reads are either "town" or "null"
Also his above post has the exact same vibe as this one:
On May 25 2023 05:58 LightningStrike wrote: And all caught up now if MZ is town he been 100% confirmed bias towards Marv unless Marv is actually mafia which I doubt because Marv rolls over and let people lynch him as mafia more than anything. MZ if you are town please just chill out take a deep breath and reevaluate Marv. Regarding dmb: I get why people are scumreading her but how fast the wagon is forming is giving me second thoughts to be honest.
Who do you want to lynch LS? Since all the wagons are forming "too fast"
Ok I like this post, but it could be argued that I just love when people who aren't very active magically show up when their name is mentioned, especially close to the deadline. could also apply to you.
On May 25 2023 08:54 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: AND TO BE CLEAR ONEGU IS NOT EVEN MY TOP SCUM READ.
I feel like people aren't reading my posts clearly. I'd still rather lynch Vivax or LS or even Marv like I've been saying for a while. But again, town can play bad, one of my current suspects could flip town, Marv could wow me and turn into the towniest townie who ever town'd and I'd almost immediately slot Onegu into that spot.
I really don’t get how you can think Marv is a good lynch at this point.
Because I was open, and I had a strong town read in the thread with me, I asked rayn several times why I should not be on vivax.
On May 25 2023 08:52 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway, Rayn tell me why we shouldn't lynch vivax today for not being curious as to the alignment of others when that is, by his own admission, the primary reason for his engagement as town, when in this game he has posted a lot and not been curious?
On May 25 2023 08:52 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway, Rayn tell me why we shouldn't lynch vivax today for not being curious as to the alignment of others when that is, by his own admission, the primary reason for his engagement as town, when in this game he has posted a lot and not been curious?
Just putting it out there.
I dont mind if you lynch Vivax. You may do as you please.
On May 25 2023 08:52 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway, Rayn tell me why we shouldn't lynch vivax today for not being curious as to the alignment of others when that is, by his own admission, the primary reason for his engagement as town, when in this game he has posted a lot and not been curious?
Just putting it out there.
I dont mind if you lynch Vivax. You may do as you please.
Ok let me rephrase. Tell me (why) you won’t lynch vivax
On May 25 2023 09:04 raynpelikoneet wrote: VE is town though, bad imo, but town. No questions asked.
Why bad? Genuinely curious.
youre voting wrong
In the post you linked you literally acknowledge that vivax could be mafia? Why is he voting wrong?
because things may and will change in hours between the posts.
OK, that is fine.
But that is the reason you gave for not voting him. If there are other reasons since then, could you let me know what they are?
I am also voting Vivax, so if that vote is wrong, hen I would like to know why.
This is very strange to me because I asked you earlier why I shouldn't lynch vivax and you said you wouldn't stop me but now the Vivax vote from VE is wrong and we are not going to lynch mafia.
Like I was genuinely frustrated that I wasn't given clarity at the time when I was repeatedly trying to get some.
On May 25 2023 09:31 raynpelikoneet wrote: Disclaimer; i am not voting vivax over meapak whatever the situation is when i am awake during D1. Just that you know.
Yeah I know this. I just don't know why this is the case. Are you just being stubborn?
On May 25 2023 09:31 raynpelikoneet wrote: Disclaimer; i am not voting vivax over meapak whatever the situation is when i am awake during D1. Just that you know.
Yeah I know this. I just don't know why this is the case. Are you just being stubborn?
Because from his perspective it's optimal play, mafia whoever they are are going to try and influence the vote IF his reads are right. Taking his vote out of the manipulable votes reduces mafia's power to affect the outcome IF his reads are right. And he's reinforcing anyone who values his reads that he's not moving his vote so they shouldn't either in the case that I keep trying to lynch Vivax.
Which rayn says is very smart post. So I take that to be the reason that Rayn is giving for not wanting to lynch Vivax. I actually don't like this reason because it prevents me from being able to play the game, if every lynch is already decided by the euros before a lynch, so in my mind I discount it.
Trying to figure out where the scum are and the town reads are. ( a major criticisim later) At this point Rayn has left the thread.
I am posting this and then dropping the topic mainly because I want to:
1.) be clear around my thinking at the time of the wagon on vivax forming
2.) clarify that yes, if Rayn had given me any strong reason to vote MZ over Vivax when we were interacting in the thread prior to the lynch I would have done so.
3.) Point out that I don't think it was as clear and obvious as people are making it out to be prior to the lynch, and if it was, then some clear communication about that fact would have changed the outcome.
On May 26 2023 11:13 VisceraEyes wrote: Yo the bravado and absolute certainty ABSOLUTELY ARE a bit, but it's not alignment indicative, it's just the only way to get anything done around here. I'm not mafia, I've just played this game quite a bit and know what gets results. It's a very Palmaresque way to play.
That said, I definitely was that sure about Vivax. I was just wrong. I factored in my own experience too much into the read, I can own that.
On May 26 2023 11:21 Chezinu wrote: Scumhunting during the night is how you get killed by mafia. You got to look clueless to live through the night but funny enough to keep around. Now let the hunt begin!
Koshi tried his best to look clueless that is for sure.
On May 26 2023 11:21 VisceraEyes wrote: DP I'm going to be honest with you - I have no fucking idea. It's like I said before the flip - if MZ is town too then that means who is on what wagon when is utterly meaningless. Mafia could have flowed freely from one to another and it make no difference to them. MZ flipping green actually helps MAFIA more than it helps us.
I want to say that mafia are in the lurker class because I'm so fucked up right now, but that feels like a copout. That just tends to be the case when a game is so fucking hard like this. It's actually WHY I advocate lurker lynches early, but I digress. I'm looking at Onegus and LSes and Chezes like I was before the flip I think. While keeping an eye to active players not making any sense.
On May 26 2023 11:21 Chezinu wrote: Scumhunting during the night is how you get killed by mafia. You got to look clueless to live through the night but funny enough to keep around. Now let the hunt begin!
Koshi tried his best to look clueless that is for sure.
Can you quote a post that made you laugh beside koshi dying?
I ahven;t laughed since vivax flipped, and the lol to koshi dying was sarcasm.
On May 26 2023 11:41 LightningStrike wrote: First off what. Second of all the fuck. Not only we lynched the doctor but the Vig got shot and shot the other wagon to the doctor lynch and they were town w t f..........
On May 25 2023 18:16 marvellosity wrote: Don’t disagree with most of your targets though, not sure if I am happy or sad about that.
Super sad. Those reads now while we (the not baddies and his townreads) were there before the lynch.
And the rayn blaming on the bottom is the icing on the glittered shitcake.
What are your reads then? And I feel ok criticising rayn, because after the flip apparently it was super obvious that Vivax was town, but if that was the case there was an opportunity for that to not happen, and he didn't try and stop me, but I don't think it was as clear that he was super town as you have implied post flip.
I understand the salt, but I also think you are engaged in results orientated thinking and I feel bad enough about the mis lynch already.
Do you think I am town or mafia? If I am mafia then please make a case and try and lynch me, if you think I am town, can you please try and engage with me in a way that is productive.
I think you could be mafia. I will never make a case on you. I will yell all future days that I think you are mafia. I will never respect any read you make this game.
I think this is why Koshi was shot he thinks DP is a mafia on the Vivax wagon (which he did think 2 or all 3 mafia there)
You realize that both wagons being town substantially changes things, right?
On May 26 2023 12:55 TankTopTiger wrote: @the more experienced players I know that the setup is semi-open, but presumably hosts tend towards balanced setups. What does a balanced setup with a doctor and a vigilante look like? e.g. two blue, one power red, two vanilla red, rest green?
Can we reasonably expect there to be more blue roles in the game?
I think there may be a cop or a tracker, but that might be wishful thinking. Why do you want to know?
EPT
