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On October 04 2016 03:45 Xatalos wrote:
How is Doc+Vet OP though? I think Doc+Cop is more powerful for example. Cop can claim and live forever etc.
But the problem is if it's just Vet+Cop. Then Cop claiming would be stupid.
To roles that stop KP sounds pretty townfavored to me.
Idk I guess this is all moot until we get a claim or a blue flip but with a flipped Miller and scum having a GF I'd bet there is a cop.
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On October 04 2016 03:52 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2016 03:46 Tictock wrote:On October 04 2016 03:26 Xatalos wrote:On October 04 2016 03:18 Tictock wrote:
That post you quoted was right after the lynch Skynx, not right before Daypost.
I do kinda like your point though.
Actually if I were to rate everyone in the game I would say Jealous and Calix have been the most sidelined players.
By that I mean they aren't doing much thats Super towny and they aren't doing anything that raises an eyebrow. Like I stand by what I said about Xata putting so much effort into that Stutters read vs his scumreads, but at the same time that doesn't fit mafia play at all. It just stands out like a sore thumb. It's really hard to solve the game since most people aren't doing enough of anything noteworthy in the game. Myself included, kinda. I'm pretty sure scott is scum now, but with how this game has been, it's getting harder to clear even Dan/Calix for their D1 stuff anymore.. I was quite sure of stutters being town, at least. Too bad he was the one who got lynched even so.... Well, I sure hope you're town or there's not going to be much of town thread presence left at this rate. I'm not sure how much more obv town I can get, and it's a problem imo if I'm the towniest person in the game Can we play another game? Comparing Scott and Calix, who's posts have a more cautious constructed nature to them? Hm. Calix doesn't seem like he's shared much of his thoughts. Mostly questions. scott has shared, but they've been pretty much safe/sheepish reads (for example, some pretty random/NAI reasons to scumread me after it became fashionable). I guess you could say Calix would have been more careful in the sense that he hasn't pushed much of anything lately.
That seems like a pretty fair assessment.
I like that Calix seems to consider stuff from a few points of view, but I also can't help but get the sense that Calix is the caliber of player that can use logic and reason as a front pretty well.
Since you like doing team stuff, would a Calix/Jeal team make sense to you or maybe a Calix/Scott?
No need to go too deep with this, just speculating.
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On October 04 2016 03:59 Xatalos wrote:
Two blue roles will be randomized between the following roles: Doctor, Vigilante, Cop, Veteran.
Fine spoil my fun with your rules.
Vet/Doc alive in LyLo plz, lol
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On October 04 2016 04:16 Skynx wrote:
You know what, Calix/ptmc would make so much sense cuz I based my 100% tr on ptmc D2 on immediate Luna push and Calix warned me not to trust it. Double insta bus D1?
I mean hey if we are considering one epic buss, sure why not 2?
Though tbh look at the interaction between Dane and Lunatic. I saw that sometime during the night and it doesn't really read like scum talking to scum.
How do you feel, or what are your thought about Xata atm? I'm starting to find myself considering him town.
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On October 04 2016 04:26 Tictock wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2016 04:16 Skynx wrote:
You know what, Calix/ptmc would make so much sense cuz I based my 100% tr on ptmc D2 on immediate Luna push and Calix warned me not to trust it. Double insta bus D1? I mean hey if we are considering one epic buss, sure why not 2? Though tbh look at the interaction between Dane and Lunatic. I saw that sometime during the night and it doesn't really read like scum talking to scum. How do you feel, or what are your thought about Xata atm? I'm starting to find myself considering him town.
Sorry smoking too much I guess, and I completly misread this post.
I really have a hard time seeing ptmc as scum. Unless he lied about this being his first game or something, I mean you remember your first game here as scum don'tcha skynx? ^.^
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On October 04 2016 04:43 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2016 04:30 Tictock wrote:On October 04 2016 04:26 Tictock wrote:On October 04 2016 04:16 Skynx wrote:
You know what, Calix/ptmc would make so much sense cuz I based my 100% tr on ptmc D2 on immediate Luna push and Calix warned me not to trust it. Double insta bus D1? I mean hey if we are considering one epic buss, sure why not 2? Though tbh look at the interaction between Dane and Lunatic. I saw that sometime during the night and it doesn't really read like scum talking to scum. How do you feel, or what are your thought about Xata atm? I'm starting to find myself considering him town. Sorry smoking too much I guess, and I completly misread this post. I really have a hard time seeing ptmc as scum. Unless he lied about this being his first game or something, I mean you remember your first game here as scum don'tcha skynx? ^.^ Oi sush you, you guys were nearly getting rolled by an all 1st timer scumteam if Moosy didn't hit the miracle copcheck ^^
I actually barely recall that game tbh, I just remember you stood out to me as first time scum.
But my point was do you think ptmc is playing from that position?
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On October 04 2016 04:45 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2016 07:02 Xatalos wrote:
Wow.
He was the Miller. Now if there's a Cop, it should be a lot more effective. See TT, these posts just trigger me soo much but I think he's town in the end.
Just kus he's stating the obvious?
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Also lets shift a bit and talk about Jealous.
What do you make of him?
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Actually I realize I barely said anything before about Jealous besides my gut reaction to his filter.
I don't recall anything specifically now that set me off and I'm pretty happy to just play off my gut atm so I hope somebody can find some good stuff to talk about.
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WoW didn't expect that.
On October 04 2016 05:20 Calix wrote:
Also this means that TT tried to use "Calix is scum for being logical" as an argument without the excuse of a red check.
I'm dying.
I was so close to checking you actually, if it weren't for your early vote on Lunatic I prob would have.
I did check Xat, so that's funny.
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Oh and nice, I thought you were the medic Synx with that "TT you are 100% town"
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On October 04 2016 05:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:![[image loading]](http://puu.sh/rwGeo/c624b1f3d1.png) :D
Xata -> Calix -> Scott -> Xata
I was pretty on point despite even going back and forth so much.
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Humm did you guys think I was Cop due to knowing that Jealous was the check?
I think I'm pretty hard to read as blue, though I was starting to hint at it a bit more today since I dropped clues to my checks in that last, last will post.
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On October 04 2016 06:02 Calix wrote:
Yeah, I saw people doing that in my first game here although I didn't bother myself. (died N1)
Not sure if it's a habit that I'll get into though - I am lazy when it comes to night phases because my reads are liable to flip-flopping after a night kill - but I'll try to keep it in mind and post a short LW or some updated thoughts or whatnot.
I really hope the "she hasn't died by Day X, must be scum" argument doesn't get used against me again. I've had that thrown at me back on the old site if I lived past N1 and it was always annoying to deal with >_>
This argument does get used sometimes, so I'm sorry to say it may become a thing if you play here enough. I can't speak too much for it though kus I tend to use the method that I did this game ^.^
As for the associations stuff I can sorta agree they can be weak and hard to use. However...
On September 28 2016 00:01 Tictock wrote:Ok I'm still about 20 pages behind but I gotta take a break and go run a couple errands so I wanted to drop some thoughts. You guys got some great interactions from Lunatic, and based on them I think we can be nearly certain that Skynx, Rels, and DandelH are town for the way they started pressure on Lunatic. Stutters also kinda got spewed town, though tbh I kinda doubt his early game play comes from scum anyhow. Calix also brought up some stuff early on about Lunatic, but the associative read here isn't as strong as the others. I'm tempted to think Calix is town for other reasons though.Oh and Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 20:53 Tictock wrote:
Ok almost done with other stuff and I'll sink a couple hours into reading.
Tempted to start out by giving ptmc a quick and dirty townread for that little series of posts on pg 40 though.
That instinct was spot on. I think I've also got a decent scum read based on associative stuff with Lunatic, but I want to get fully caught up before I get into that.
On September 28 2016 01:57 Tictock wrote:Well I'm still a bit behind, but I did get through D1 and I might as well post this now. I think Xatalos is scum. Reading through the game I had the distinct impression that he waited as long as possible to discuss Lunatic, and when he did was always very wishy-washy about it. + Show Spoiler +This was the post that first made me raise an eyebrow. On September 24 2016 22:14 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2016 08:26 DanelerH wrote:On September 24 2016 08:21 Jealous wrote:On September 24 2016 08:19 Stutters695 wrote:On September 24 2016 08:04 Xatalos wrote:
Unfortunately, looks like you can't vote for yourself in this setup :/ To everyone else, this is why we should lynch him today. He's always one step ahead, we'll never catch him. On a more serious note, how does everyone feel about going with the scummiest of the inevitable inactives? Activity always seems to be a struggle in these games and I won't be lynchbait for once. I'm usually pro-PL but it's too early to make such a decision. We need to see how others are posting. It's odd that you suggest this so early. This, plus there's Shutter's first post: On September 24 2016 07:46 Stutters695 wrote:
I'm here and not scum. How disappointing.
Anyway, as it stands I'd be all for a d1 Xata lynch. Pretty sure he's fooled me like the last 3 times he's been mafia and that's no good.
It's not technically a role claim, but it's certainly something unnecessary to say. Why would your first sentence be the equivalent of "I'm not a Mafia."? While it's nothing definite, it seems rather odd to me. Probably the worst post in the game so far (and definitely the worst of the opening posts). It's a wishy-washy suspicion riding on already existing suspicions. Pretty much the safest possible suspicion to make as scum, and leaves you with plenty of options to proceed (vote for him if it gains steam or forget it if not). Even the tone is so passive and uninvolved.. This was well after Lunatic's entrance and after he had fallen under some pressure. I suppose part of this is simply a "What game is he reading?" sort of reaction because this was far from any of the posts that I found interesting. What really struck me though was that this post implied that Xat had caught-up with the game, but besides asking Rel's his opinion and talking about blues there is literally no mention of Lunatic's posts until here. Which is especially Ironic given Xat was just accusing Skynx of having "no real stance on Lunatic events?" and that was literally my first thought about him while reading. It's worth noting his later posts as he decides to vote Lunatic as well. + Show Spoiler +Sorry not 100% these are in order, these start on pg 3 of Xata's filter On September 25 2016 21:05 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2016 17:20 Calix wrote:
Actually Lunatic looks like a better lynch with how he's reacting to the pitiful amount of pressure he's getting and aside from "over-reacts to pressure and is making bad posts out of frustration" I'm confused as to why he's acting like this in the first place. I haven't seen anything explicitly townie from him either.
Anyway, he says he's one of the more productive players - if that's productive then this game is a spam-fest. He also claims he's building a town circle which I have yet to see on both points. (his weird-ass town-read on Stutters doesn't count) I recall him saying he was going to investigate the first few posters or something - has he followed up on that?
With regards to TPR-hunting, again, that's anti-town because scum would just post their TPR-reads into their private chat. It's also insanely retarded to do as town and if Lunatic thought that Stutters was blue then he should have just defended Stutters using his posts to avoid this. I have no idea what he was trying to achieve there but I guarantee that the execution was terrible.
This read is shit because a lot of his actions require a crapload of WIFOM to decipher. His mindset doesn't make any bloody sense to me and I don't see a coherent explanation for his actions for town or scum, so I'd like to clear that up.
This reasoning is similar with Daneler to an extent as I am finding him difficult to place. However he is less disruptive to the chat compared to Lunatic. Yeah, that whole situation seems pretty stupid from any perspective. No reason to out a blue read in any form as town (even in the form of a non-reasoned strong town read -> pretty obviously a blue read), but no reason to start talking about that as scum either (just putting negative attention on himself for no reason). I guess it was some panic decision under pressure. Maybe leaning scum after all because why would he panic so much as town under a little pressure? Hmmm. Well, let's say he would be a lynch candidate, definitely over Stutter. On September 25 2016 21:10 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2016 18:23 Lunaticman wrote:
I wonder how not wanting to state a read because it will reveal a blue role is equal towards being mafia. The reason for not saying anything is because that is based o information town dont want mafia to know.
This game is just full of paragraf knights. I told you why I didnt want to say my SINGLE read and I got forced. Saying I wasnt forced is a lie.
And when I do say why Im a coward, so either way Im scum. And that dosent even make sense.
It is also intresting to see that town once again town reads the people with most posts as town.
Remember that mafia always sound smater and better because they know who is mafia and are working with perfect information.
Lastly I yet to see a day one lynch of a mafia player so anything that happens day one usually is just speculation.
My time is precious this weekend the little spare time I have not working is spent defending myself. I dont really have time to do what I want which is identify townies and lookig for mafia in the top posters day one.
A good example is my last normal game in which I found the gf day one and was unsuccessful in lynching him 3 days in a row because the mafia undermined me constantly. But why did you say that Stutter was a strong town read in the first place without any reasoning? Isn't that the same as claiming that he's potentially a blue in your opinion (from scum perspective)? Granted, it could also be a complicated meta reason or something, but having a blue read is often the reason if someone doesn't want to say his reasons for a read. And then why reveal the blue read so quickly anyway under a bit of pressure? It's just... pretty much a disastrous chain of events, especially if you're town and correct. It's also disastrous if you're scum, so... Just why? On September 25 2016 21:15 Xatalos wrote:
On second thoughts, I can think of two potential scenarios where those events would make some sense. I think the scum scenario makes a bit more sense, given that he's a newbie. I'll wait a bit more before saying them out loud. On September 25 2016 23:39 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2016 23:26 Lunaticman wrote:On September 25 2016 21:10 Xatalos wrote:On September 25 2016 18:23 Lunaticman wrote:
I wonder how not wanting to state a read because it will reveal a blue role is equal towards being mafia. The reason for not saying anything is because that is based o information town dont want mafia to know.
This game is just full of paragraf knights. I told you why I didnt want to say my SINGLE read and I got forced. Saying I wasnt forced is a lie.
And when I do say why Im a coward, so either way Im scum. And that dosent even make sense.
It is also intresting to see that town once again town reads the people with most posts as town.
Remember that mafia always sound smater and better because they know who is mafia and are working with perfect information.
Lastly I yet to see a day one lynch of a mafia player so anything that happens day one usually is just speculation.
My time is precious this weekend the little spare time I have not working is spent defending myself. I dont really have time to do what I want which is identify townies and lookig for mafia in the top posters day one.
A good example is my last normal game in which I found the gf day one and was unsuccessful in lynching him 3 days in a row because the mafia undermined me constantly. But why did you say that Stutter was a strong town read in the first place without any reasoning? Isn't that the same as claiming that he's potentially a blue in your opinion (from scum perspective)? Granted, it could also be a complicated meta reason or something, but having a blue read is often the reason if someone doesn't want to say his reasons for a read. And then why reveal the blue read so quickly anyway under a bit of pressure? It's just... pretty much a disastrous chain of events, especially if you're town and correct. It's also disastrous if you're scum, so... Just why? So you don't have hunches? I'm just saying nothing that has been said today has been nothing but speculation and you are accusing me of not giving reasons? God ok I'll play your game: Stutters is town because I have a meta read on him. Satisified? "No, how can you know that?" "Because I played with him before" "Really explain!" On and on this goes. the TL mafia community really has a hard time dealing with people playing emotionally rather than using logic. I'm probably not going to respond to anything related to my first town read anymore. It feels like beating a dead horse. Wasn't it a blue read earlier....? On September 26 2016 02:16 Xatalos wrote:
Huh. Yeah, I wanted to see some more posts before revealing my thoughts on Lunatic, but doesn't seem like anyone is really posting...
So here are the two scenarios that I could imagine earlier:
1) Scum: He was trying to gain some easy credibility by pointing out a town read based on actual reasoning (blue read on Stutters after bluehunting him, as scum tend to bluehunt more often than town). Then he went into a bit of a panic after he got pressured for not reasoning his read and immediately claimed the blue read, which doesn't make much sense as town, but makes a bit more sense as scum since he wanted to relieve the pressure on him ASAP. In hindsight the play was a mistake (claiming Stutters was town without saying the reason), but it would make some sense from scum perspective at the time of doing it, especially since he's a newbie.
2) Town: Actually it was all a big WIFOM play as town to gather reactions and confuse scum bluehunting. However, this seems less likely since he's a newbie and still hasn't claimed anything of this sort despite lengthy posting on the topic.
So all things considered, him being scum makes quite a bit more sense IMO. On September 26 2016 02:21 Xatalos wrote:
Well, actually there's also a third scenario, where he's town and simply messed up by making a blue read, including it in his read list for some reason (without specifically saying that he thought he was a blue) and then saying it out loud in the heat of the moment. I guess that's a bit more likely than the scenario #2 after all since he's a newbie... But scenario #1 seems the most credible one, I guess. Hm. Any opinions? On September 26 2016 02:25 Xatalos wrote:
Meh, not totally sure, but I think he still seems a bit worse than DanelerH atm.
As for others, can't say I've found anything especially suspicious otherwise. Stutters' thing against Soul still confuses me. As for Jealous, I guess he could be scum, he's been pretty passive/blendy, but nothing really jumps out as scummy from him that I've noticed. There is a lot there, the stuff that I noticed was just how hard of a time Xata had calling Luna scum, he seems like he really wants to try and defend him in some of these posts, yet just can't quite do it. It reads exactly to me like a mafia who realizes he needs to bus and over-elaborates theread on his mate. It's weaker, but I also get the distinct impression that around the time of the quote from the top of this post (around pg 14) that Xata was kinda drawing attention away from what was some mounting pressure on Lunatic. That might be a bit of confirmation bias there though.
I didn't do a half bad job with em.
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On October 04 2016 06:14 Calix wrote:
That Jealous comment was really conspicuous, TT. Only reason you didn't die N2 was because we thought you might have been the player that the host gave the check to.
So only because you guys knew that Jealous was who get checked then?
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On October 04 2016 06:46 Rels wrote:
Fucking awesome play by TT all game too
WP mate
Thanks and you too man, you were a super easy read this game.
I think I need to work on pushing my scumreads a bit better, bring back some of the Tunneltock. Both this game with Xata and the last game (not HM, the last one I actually got to play in) with HF I had pretty solid scumreads on them but failed to get them lynched.
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On October 04 2016 07:08 NeverUnlucky wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2016 05:43 Calix wrote:TT is probably my pick for the best town player. He made us overthink things way too much with regards to his posts  Oh, same here. Well played, TicTock.
Thanks, I'm glad my strat to stir things up worked out so fantastically this last phase ^.^
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On October 04 2016 07:18 disformation wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2016 07:07 NeverUnlucky wrote:On October 04 2016 05:39 disformation wrote:
i agree that calix played quite well esp. d1.
i think i called out one early post by her in obs.
staying motivated as scum is not easy, though. Yeah, your reads were really good, pal. Do you play games sometimes or are you subscribed to /obs? Would like playing with you. tyty <3 be warned that i waffle a lot (esp. as town) when i sm playing. currently on a break, cause i take these gsmes too serious and exploded in my last one. should startcplaying again soonish, probably after cohosting the upcoming dota themed game or something.
I'm not so secretly holding out for that, ever since I noticed it in Active games list.
I'm about ready for another game of PYP levels of epicness and awesomeness.
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Note to the newer players:
You guys all did great, even Lunatic kept at it despite being called out so early. It seems like we've been getting a nice influx of new and more importantly active players which is great to see.
I hope you all stick around to play more games.
Especially SoulEaterQUEEN, as I understand it you just had another game or something else come up but you did good catching scum D1 and I thought you were fairly towny from your posts (Obs chat seems to agree). You setup our slot with quite a bit of towncred, such that I started to worry I was being too towny and was gunna got shot N2. When you have the time you should give it another go.
GG's all around.
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On October 04 2016 07:41 Skynx wrote:
Disfo played better than all town combined lol
Pretty sure he sheeped my Xata read...
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EPT
