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On November 03 2012 12:07 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 12:02 Djodref wrote:
It is confusing, especially when you are attacking the same guy over semantics just after your joke. It could be also a nice way to influence our read on debears while looking clean.
I agree that he was making a joke but please consider the motivations for it.
Town motivations
I don't see town motivations for making a joke about a scumtell
Mafia motivations
Creates confusion and disturbs the thread. Allows to influence our read on debears while looking clean You have to be kidding me. Cheese jokes a lot. Did you not read the scum qt from last game? The motivation from both perspectives is to have fun, especially early d1 when there's nothing to talk about."Influence your read on debears". Really? Its early day 1. You all have plenty of time to read me.. ill have a big filter most likely. That's bullshit. Scummy bullshit
Please expand on the bolded part of your post I quoted debears.
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On November 03 2012 12:12 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 12:09 Clarity_nl wrote:On November 03 2012 12:07 debears wrote:On November 03 2012 12:02 Djodref wrote:
It is confusing, especially when you are attacking the same guy over semantics just after your joke. It could be also a nice way to influence our read on debears while looking clean.
I agree that he was making a joke but please consider the motivations for it.
Town motivations
I don't see town motivations for making a joke about a scumtell
Mafia motivations
Creates confusion and disturbs the thread. Allows to influence our read on debears while looking clean You have to be kidding me. Cheese jokes a lot. Did you not read the scum qt from last game? The motivation from both perspectives is to have fun, especially early d1 when there's nothing to talk about."Influence your read on debears". Really? Its early day 1. You all have plenty of time to read me.. ill have a big filter most likely. That's bullshit. Scummy bullshit Please expand on the bolded part of your post I quoted debears. D1 starts out with nothing to actually talk about. That's why policy is a starter in newbies. Everything starts out of complete nothingness in terms of accusations
Okay, but you just meant early D1 right, not the entirety of it? It seems rather odd to go: "Yeah we should just joke around for now"
On November 03 2012 12:13 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 12:08 Rad wrote:
@djo
I don't think there's too much mafia motivation in throwing out 1 joke this early in day 1, especially with us all coming from the other game and it being a pretty friendly environment at the moment. I'd consider it the pre-game bleeding into the real game. I'm sure we will all start hating each other soon enough. Rad cheeses joking is a null tell. Check the scum qt from last game. Its his personality
He kept it to the QT though, he was serious in the thread, as he pointed out.
We shouldn't try to meta read someone with a sample size of 1, but he is acting quite different than last game, and he was scum in that.
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On November 03 2012 12:34 Obzy wrote:
I don't think that getting a read off of whether or not Cheese has a joking tone or not really means anything at all. At least, the fact that he's aware of it means that he could manipulate it either way.
I agree, this isn't much better than making a Djodref smiley case.
I think the two things to take away from all this though:
- Debears defended Cheese
- Djodref tunneling Cheese
Might become useful later.
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On November 03 2012 12:53 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 12:49 Clarity_nl wrote:On November 03 2012 12:34 Obzy wrote:
I don't think that getting a read off of whether or not Cheese has a joking tone or not really means anything at all. At least, the fact that he's aware of it means that he could manipulate it either way. I agree, this isn't much better than making a Djodref smiley case. I think the two things to take away from all this though: - Debears defended Cheese - Djodref tunneling Cheese Might become useful later. Besides stating the obvious, do you agree with me or djo on this?
I agree with you. The joking is a null tell and we should note it and move on, that was the point of my post.
I'm actually more interested why djo talking about the fact that it's a plurality lynch, he never actually talked about it, he just mentioned it. What of it, Djodref?
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Okay re-reading your post you're saying we shouldn't focus on one/two people, instead considering everyone and not consolidate on a lynch?
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On November 03 2012 13:22 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 13:11 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 13:04 Clarity_nl wrote:
Okay re-reading your post you're saying we shouldn't focus on one/two people, instead considering everyone and not consolidate on a lynch? @ ClarityExactly, I think you everyone should just vote for his top scumread while giving enough reason to do so and then we start again from there and see who is likely to be lynched, be it 2 or 3 players. I think it's the best way to use plurality lynch. Considering only 2 possibilities narrows the discussion and allows mafia players to have some excuse to lynch town (cf Cheese last game lynching daoud in the daoud/ini match-up). The downfall is that the end of the day could be a bit messy. seriously.....why are we having to explain this? 1) Scumhunt 2) Vote for your top scumread 3) When the voting comes down to 2 candidates and lynch is near, pick one of two said candidates and give reasoning why you're voting them Is that clear enough for all of you to understand? Please stop talking about policy
Because he mentioned it here:
On November 03 2012 12:13 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 12:04 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On November 03 2012 12:02 Djodref wrote:
It is confusing, especially when you are attacking the same guy over semantics just after your joke. It could be also a nice way to influence our read on debears while looking clean.
I agree that he was making a joke but please consider the motivations for it.
Town motivations
I don't see town motivations for making a joke about a scumtell
Mafia motivations
Creates confusion and disturbs the thread. Allows to influence our read on debears while looking clean You also neglect to realize that my joke was in a RESPONSE to his joke. (I don't wear hats). You're really trying to dig where there is nothing. @ CheeseOk, you had motivations for doing this joke but it doesn't really help town while it could be done with mafia motivation. And, at least, I'm trying to dig something. Would you prefer me to discuss how we should use plurality lynch ?
Which got me curious what he had to say on the subject. Turns out the answer is nothing new.
Which begs the question: Why did he mention it in the first place?
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On November 03 2012 13:28 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 13:25 Clarity_nl wrote:On November 03 2012 13:22 debears wrote:On November 03 2012 13:11 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 13:04 Clarity_nl wrote:
Okay re-reading your post you're saying we shouldn't focus on one/two people, instead considering everyone and not consolidate on a lynch? @ ClarityExactly, I think you everyone should just vote for his top scumread while giving enough reason to do so and then we start again from there and see who is likely to be lynched, be it 2 or 3 players. I think it's the best way to use plurality lynch. Considering only 2 possibilities narrows the discussion and allows mafia players to have some excuse to lynch town (cf Cheese last game lynching daoud in the daoud/ini match-up). The downfall is that the end of the day could be a bit messy. seriously.....why are we having to explain this? 1) Scumhunt 2) Vote for your top scumread 3) When the voting comes down to 2 candidates and lynch is near, pick one of two said candidates and give reasoning why you're voting them Is that clear enough for all of you to understand? Please stop talking about policy Because he mentioned it here: On November 03 2012 12:13 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 12:04 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:On November 03 2012 12:02 Djodref wrote:
It is confusing, especially when you are attacking the same guy over semantics just after your joke. It could be also a nice way to influence our read on debears while looking clean.
I agree that he was making a joke but please consider the motivations for it.
Town motivations
I don't see town motivations for making a joke about a scumtell
Mafia motivations
Creates confusion and disturbs the thread. Allows to influence our read on debears while looking clean You also neglect to realize that my joke was in a RESPONSE to his joke. (I don't wear hats). You're really trying to dig where there is nothing. @ CheeseOk, you had motivations for doing this joke but it doesn't really help town while it could be done with mafia motivation. And, at least, I'm trying to dig something. Would you prefer me to discuss how we should use plurality lynch ? Which got me curious what he had to say on the subject. Turns out the answer is nothing new. Which begs the question: Why did he mention it in the first place? Clarity, I think it was meant to be read as more of this: Do you want me to push something and try to get the thread going, or do you want me to talk about useless policy? Would you agree with that?
I.... didn't even consider that. Yes, that actually makes much more sense.
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On November 03 2012 13:31 debears wrote:
Very well Clarity,
anything else that you find jumps out weird so far?
Last three pages was djo, you and me. Still no word from da0ud and sylver.
I think you are wrong in saying Obzy is useless. He might not have posted a lot but he makes good points or asks decent questions when he does, maybe you feel that way because he's biggest post is directed at you?
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EBWOP he's = his
Think I'm gonna go to bed soon, but I wanna finish watching MLG...
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Ugh TL 
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Well I mean, it's 6:40 am so I guess now's a good time to bandwagon on the bed.
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On November 03 2012 16:06 Obzy wrote:
@Cheese
>:l The no newb cards comment seems specifically aimed at me. Not really a fan. I'm not wholly sure why he dropped his argument against debears so quickly - pointing out previous meta, etc, and then it just absolutely falls off the face of the planet. Why? (I disagree with this statement, by the way:
I don't think it's directed at you specifically, but it's interesting that you think it is.
The reason Cheese said to not drop the newbie card is because it's not town behavior. When you are town you want people to believe you, if you come out of the gate saying you're awful and no one should listen to you then that's anti-town.
It also prevents scum from using "omg sorry I'm just new!", the less excuses scum have available the better for town.
My reads at this point in time:
Obzy: Leaning slightly town. He hasn't quite come out of his shell yet but he seems genuinly interested in discussion and progressing.
@ Obzy
Do you think you can get over this "I'm new" thing and give us the best reads you've got? Instead of posting something that's obvious to everyone perhaps post something that stands out to you.
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Rad: Null. He's being more careful than last game, lurking a bit more. He mentioned he would be more careful, but not in pregame, he did this after the role PMs were sent. He also seems really invested in helping Obzy out as he's the newest, the only one here who wasn't in XXIX.
@ Rad
Why the interest in Obzy? Are you going to use MLG as an excuse at any point this weekend?
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Alsn: Leaning slightly scum, very little info about him though. He opened super aggressive this game, which is the opposite of how he played in the majority of XXIX. Perhaps the only reason he snapped at debears so hard is because debears said
On November 03 2012 10:04 debears wrote:
If I'm not here for lynch, its irl conflicts 99% of the time. Don't pull an Alsn
@ Alsn
Why the change in behavior from last game? What do you think of debears at this point?
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Mr Cheesecake: Null. He went SUPER defensive when he was called out about making a ton of jokes, but that discussion got blown way out of proportion. The fact that he's acting more like the way he was in mafia QT XXIX than in the actual XXIX thread is indicative of town.
@ Cheese
You did have some jokes in the XXIX thread. Can you tell us if these were jokes for the sake of jokes or if you used them to push a scum agenda? An argument can be made for both.
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Djodref: Leaning slightly scum, He was obsessed with policy. Everyone was ready to move on but he kept mentioning it over and over. He's also the person that blew up the whole *Cheese's scum joke* thing, which bogged us down for a couple of pages.
@ Djodref
If you had to lynch someone right now, would it be da0ud or someone else?
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Debears: Null. Regardless of if he's scum or town, he is getting the ball rolling which is good for us. Problem is... that was what he was doing in XXIX as well and he was scum in that. Older games suggest this is simply his meta so there is no read to be made about his opening. What I'm curious about is if he's going to pull a vanishing act in D2 / D3 again.
@ Debears
What's your ready on Obzy?
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Sylverfire: Null. Only have 3 real posts to read him on. He opened really aggressive onto debears, even though he's keeping the ball rolling, an odd choice. He showed up way late but Rad pointed out that he is sticking to the same schedule he's had in previous games.
@ Sylverfire
You've only shared your read on debears, is there anything else that stands out to you?
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So with all that said, I only have two slight scumreads on Alsn and Djo, so I hope they defend themselves as soon as possible.
Even if we end up lynching da0ud for lurking, currently with 0 posts, we can at least gather as much information as possible
Hopefully this gets some discussion going, please comment on as much as possible in my post and point out any flaws.
Do no avoid answering the questions I addressed to you, it would be a very scummy thing to do.
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Good to see you da0ud! Please give us more of your thoughts.
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I'm not sure how you can say that after you witnessed how destructive lurkers are for town, even if they are town.
Either way I don't think we have to worry about it since you showed up, as long as you and sylver get active and Alsn shows up there will be no lurkers.
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Where did I make a list? Unless you're talking about my reads on everyone, which I don't see can ever be a bad thing.
You are the one who pointed out that it is a plurality lynch, and that we should not focus too deeply on a select few.
My "list" forces everyone to comment on it, and perhaps gain insight on others through my observations or sees a flaw in my logic and helps me out by pointing it out.
Yeah, I've read that lists are generally a mafia tell, or newbie town, but this is only the case if they do not contribute.
Are you saying that my post will not contribute?
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My two weak scumreads are still you and Alsn, but that's what they are... weak.
My post is simply to gather as much info as possible. I will end up making a case before the day is over, but I figured giving this thread a good kick would help.
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I didn't read it as "make someone look suspicious by voting for them" I read it as "show who I am suspicious of by voting for them"
I would've rather waited to say that until after he answered though.
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EPT
