ghost, your case is awful. I'd address each point but i've already addressed it before a case even started to avoid this. Ones flip isn't alignment indicative of the other.

On April 28 2012 05:40 BroodKingEXE wrote:
@johnny If we lynch him noe we have a 50% chance of lynching a goon or GF. I'd rather we take the chance than lynch another townie. Great if it he is a goon as they lose a KP, if not we take out a GF which is fine too. In terms of information, people having been defending and accusing him why dont we look at that?

wat?

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 22:37 GMT

#1756

On April 28 2012 07:30 ghost_403 wrote:
@marv: I clearly state there are two positions. Either Risen is bad/emotional/whatever, or Risen is scum. I'm saying the second one of those is the better conclusion.

hows it a better conclusion though? what makes you think thats more likely? i don't want opinions i want quotes that say that he did that on purpose

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 22:38 GMT

#1757

ebwop: not on purpose, i mean he switched and switched back to change vote, with him being aware of what he did. i want to see a quote that says that he knew that.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 22:47 GMT

#1762

There is no reason for town risen to do what he did other than he's terrible?

indecisiveness? fear? theres quite a few reasons a town risen would do what he did.

just so you know, it seems to be that risen thought the lynch would go back to ottox. so what's the point of your argument?

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 23:13 GMT

#1767

Yeah I guess you're right marv. I've said time and time again that I think that this wasn't alignment indicative.

looking on ottox's filter....and yeah he seems scummy now.

+ Show Spoiler +

On April 24 2012 16:57 Ottoxlol wrote:
I don't get the sloosh kill btw, he contributed scarce, voted on VE. If not lynched he would have been pressured a lot today. Risen was the only one they both suspected to be scum, since sloosh kill has no other explanation then defending Risen I think he is town.

he's criticizing scum for a kill (lol?).. and the other part of the post i can't get my head around. They both suspected risen to be scum, so risen is town?

another thing: he avoids a lot of accusations and has a lot of useless posts (if not all), and he votes me by sheeping MG then unvotes me for this reason:

On April 26 2012 05:21 Ottoxlol wrote:

Show nested quote +

.

##unvote:johnnywup

if you can call that a reason. I "defend" him, so he gets off my back.

then "has to vote zeph" while soft defending risen

On April 26 2012 07:25 Ottoxlol wrote:
I have to

##vote Zephirdd

The Risen case is weak in my opinion, I can understand that points 1 and 4 can be suspicious but 2-3 doesnt seem scummy to me. He tried to defend VE, but not with the best tools, he tried to defend himself but not with the best tools.

theres an awful lot of soft defending risen UNTIL....RIGHT BEFORE NIGHT ENDS?!

On April 26 2012 08:52 Ottoxlol wrote:
So its seems like ill get lynched, ill post my thoughts

MG + Risen are most likely scum.

Zeph Sent Mementoss laya are my other candidates.

Zeph had some very strange logic and posts

Sent is getting better, but the VE lynch is still there.

Mementoss said his problem with me that i did not scumhunt at all, I posted the case on VE d1, d2 I tried to be helpful, posted case, took a stance, he did not lift his vote contrary to his post.

laya stated that i am most likely town, zeph is maybe then he voted me for the kill.

in that same post, he says MG IS MOST LIKELY SCUM! Remember who he sheeped and voted me because of it? MG! WOW! 2 PEOPLE HE SEEMED TO THINK WAS TOWN ENDED UP IN HIS SCUM LIST RIGHT BEFORE DEADLINE!

And I mean he was soft defending risen a LOT. in fact, a little more than an hour before that he posted:

But wait, in an hour he says that MG and Risen are most likely scum? ..

so yeah, I think ottox is scum now. I want to note: NONE OF THIS is based on the vote/unvote from risen. But it does incriminate Risen and MG as possible scum buddies.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 23:14 GMT

#1768

err, right before day ends, not night ends

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 23:25 GMT

#1770

yeah i think the most telling thing is that risen said he would give a shit ton of reads then kept making excuses why he couldnt post at all, let alone make reads. I'm starting to think Risen and ottox ARE scum together, but not based on the voting shit.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 23:44 GMT

#1775

Marv, I wouldn't call it an early strong case on ottox. The first time risen MENTIONS ottox it's on page 33, and it's one sentence. The next time is 29 pages later...which is when he makes his case, and says a lot, and then votes for him.

The case risen makes against ottox is good the first time i read it. Re-reading it, it's a lot of empty text with a lot of "commentary" of what ottox is posting...not many actual points. The points he does make are mostly on small points. The big points he does make are good though, imo. But that's only like 10% of the actual post. I do find it odd it took him 33 pages to have a one sentence blurb, then on page 62 he makes a case on him. With no mention of ottox in between. NONE.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 27 2012 23:48 GMT

#1777

Yeah, I thought the points he did make that weren't empty space were good. No interaction into full on "he's my biggest scum read" is suspicious though, imo.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 00:01 GMT

#1780

yeah that wouldn't make sense if they're both scum. I think it's safe to assume they're opposite alignments (i'm ruling out the both townie part because I feel that ottox is scum, and I don't think they could both be scum because risen did put in a lot of pressure unnecessarily). Seeing as Risen changed his vote last minute, if he was scum, he wouldn't care which one was lynched since they're both town, I think that makes it safe to assume Ottox is scum, Risen is town.

Thoughts?

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 00:13 GMT

#1786

Because scum would want to make a case on town and town would want to make a case on scum. His case on you unnecessarily makes it show it's not a bus. And I don't think both of you can be town (I can't really get a reason for this, more of a gut feeling).

Also paqman you're not really helping either. Last time you posted anything more than ~3 sentences was about 2 days ago, with the exception o your latest post (saying you're not helpful by not helping) and this:

On April 28 2012 07:54 PaqMan wrote:

Show nested quote +

This.
I went through Mementoss's posts to see if he dropped any hints, but I couldn't find anything definite.
MT was really wanting to lynch Ottox but I didn't catch him saying that he was totally sure ottox was scum or not.

Right now Ottox is a good lynch but we still have more than a day and plenty other options that we need to look at. If votes start piling up on one person pay attention to everyone's reasons. We're one away from lylo, Town needs to take a close look at everything and everyone.

which just states the obvious in the second paragraph and the first paragraph is just restating a quote.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 00:22 GMT

#1790

Yeah ok, finding scum isn't a priority paqman. -_- Speculation is discussion.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 02:33 GMT

#1800

If you're going to link to a game where janaan is town, link to the most recent..stop trying to mislead town.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=325046&user=195329

his town meta and scum meta look very similar, stop trying to put them on the wrong track mattchew.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 16:18 GMT

#1816

bkexe, you're going to kill him because he thought that town was in a good position(wrong but hows that scummy?).

I'm not saying he's not scummy, he is, but hows he any more scummy than St,Daniel, etc?

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 19:13 GMT

#1829

On April 29 2012 03:38 marvellosity wrote:
Is town absolutely set on Ottoxlol today?

Or are Risen/MG/anyone else still a possibility?

It seems like we've not discussed MG at all today despite him being basically the dead layabout's strongest read for some time.

Is everyone so sure ottoxlol is scum ahead of MG?

PERSONALLY I'd like a MG lynch more but it doesn't look like it's going to happen :X

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 19:28 GMT

#1832

I haven't made a full on case (at least that I can remember), but I've posted things I found scummy about him here and there. My first vote today was immediately on MG, but when people started voting ottox I looked for reasons he could be scummy. I found some, so I voted him. I would like a MG lynch over ottox but no one was really expressing interest at all :\

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 19:29 GMT

#1833

actually yeah all these votes on ottox are probably to misguide town. I'm gonna revote MG.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 19:35 GMT

#1835

Yeah, if you're looking for something scummy, you're going to find it, whether it is actually scummy or not.

I'm on the same boat as you, I'm not confident in myself right now, I pushed zeph hard too.

johnnywup

United States3858 Posts

April 28 2012 22:19 GMT

#1843

PS guys I'm going to be at a SoCal LAN for most of tommorrow, I may or may not be able to post/check whats going on when I'm there