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@Dirkzor:
You say:
"Tunkeg counter claims the cop claim. I don't get why he had to fake-claim going to bed in order to be able to counter-claim. It just seems very townie-like to stay up like that. I've never been scum, but as town I have set my alarm in the dead of night to vote just to be sure I did everything I could as town. ".
The reason for me saying I am going to bed was that I wouldn't send in my nightactions and then go to bed, only to see that straight after I go to bed the nightpost goes up. Pretty much revealing to the scum that I had a nightaction. I did not stick around to counterclaim, I stuck around because I wasn't going to bed yet, but wanted to avoid what I wrote above.
You also say:
Anyone in this game should suggest a cop claim. The game revolve around the cop. It's WIFOM to say "I would never as scum..." I find it interesting that he think (and points out) that scum would never suggest a cop claim. We have 2 people who were both for the claim and one of them have to be scum. So scum would suggest the claim. Looks to me like he is saying he is town with very very poor logic.
I think scum wouldn't want to bring attention to a cop claim from the get go, but thats my opinion, and it is impossible for you to see whether I reallly mean it or if it is some scumtactics trying to portray my first posts as only something a townie would do. When it is allready out there well then it is just a matter of what the scumteam prefer, do they support a copclaim (which then will lead to a CC) or do they try to shut it down. I would go for the latter.
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On April 14 2012 18:13 Dirkzor wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2012 17:49 Tunkeg wrote:@Dirkzor: You say:
"Tunkeg counter claims the cop claim. I don't get why he had to fake-claim going to bed in order to be able to counter-claim. It just seems very townie-like to stay up like that. I've never been scum, but as town I have set my alarm in the dead of night to vote just to be sure I did everything I could as town. ".
The reason for me saying I am going to bed was that I wouldn't send in my nightactions and then go to bed, only to see that straight after I go to bed the nightpost goes up. Pretty much revealing to the scum that I had a nightaction. I did not stick around to counterclaim, I stuck around because I wasn't going to bed yet, but wanted to avoid what I wrote above. You also say:
Anyone in this game should suggest a cop claim. The game revolve around the cop. It's WIFOM to say "I would never as scum..." I find it interesting that he think (and points out) that scum would never suggest a cop claim. We have 2 people who were both for the claim and one of them have to be scum. So scum would suggest the claim. Looks to me like he is saying he is town with very very poor logic.
I think scum wouldn't want to bring attention to a cop claim from the get go, but thats my opinion, and it is impossible for you to see whether I reallly mean it or if it is some scumtactics trying to portray my first posts as only something a townie would do. When it is allready out there well then it is just a matter of what the scumteam prefer, do they support a copclaim (which then will lead to a CC) or do they try to shut it down. I would go for the latter. I just don't understand why you'd have to lie about going to bed. Wouldn't it have been easier to just stop posting? It seemed you wanted to lure a reaction but at the same time you later wrote that you didn't think scum would claim cop so it just doesn't add up. The cop claim is already on the spotlight due the nature of the setup and the name. There is no avoiding a cop claim at some point during this game. All we had to figure out was when it was the best time to claim. So I don't agree with you here at all. With your logic anyone who talked about the cop claim and tried to figure out how it worked best/worst for us is town? Or am I mistaken here? Or is it only because you were the first one to bring it up that you are town?
As I brought up the subject of the cop claim I think it is only fair to say when you leave. Starting a discussion and then just not answering isn't right in my book. Reason for not going to bed straight away was that I wanted to put some distance between the sending in of my n0 action, and my departure from the thread, just to not make it obv to scum that I got nightactions. If BH had waited lets say 20 more minutes before he claimed I wouldn't have been around. Were closing up a Dota2 and were waiting to respawn when I refreshed the thread and saw the claim. I was by no means sticking around for the counterclaim (but more so for a possible nightpost and a pm with my check, after I sent in my nightactions).
I agree that a copclaim have to come eventually in this setup. But my logic is that it would be better for scum not to have it happening on n0. My logic is (although I am biased as hell in this) that scum would not be the one who bring this up early in n0, when first brought up they can swing whatever way (for or against), but I would definately not bring any attention to it if it weren't previously mentioned.
Now I don't think BH thought I was the cop, and that this caught him offguard. This is also why I think his post after my counterclaim is abit inconsistent with his actual claim (saying he wanted to discuss it before doing it and so). His claim would have been way stronger if someone who had not previously talked about it was the cop. In fact if they had a single suspicion about me being cop he would just not do it, and just kill me as I would never had gotten a doc protection n0 in this lineup.
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On April 14 2012 18:34 Dirkzor wrote:
If you think it was bad for scum that the cop claimed n0 why didn't you claim? Why wait?
Because I wanted the towns input on this. In a game like this I think not just the cop should decide when to claim. There is both pros and cons, I clearly thinking more pros than cons. But again my decision alone shouldn't decide whether I claim or not.
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On April 14 2012 18:40 wherebugsgo wrote:
there is no reason not to claim as cop.
The faster you claim the harder it is for scum to CC IMO. It's not much usually but it's something (e.g. scum would have to choose which player CCs and stuff)
Well, I don't have the experience nor confidence to take that decision straight from the get go. I don't want to fuck up the game by doing something not thought through. Hopefully post game discussion can give a clear guideline to what is optimal play though.
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This game was won because of good scumplay, and to an extent low activity by town. You might say it is random, and sure there will allways be some randomness, but in the end it came down to scum outplaying town, again.
Don't apologize BL. Yeah, you may be hard to read, but thats part of the game, some players are harder to read. If everyone was easy to figure out this game would be pointless. As long as you try your best to win regardless of alignment don't apologize.
And also for you johnny, don't feel down for beeing wrong. I love how these pro veteran comes in after the game and tell how easy it was to see that Dirkzor was scum. Don't know if their motives is to make you look bad or to make themselves look great. But in hindsight everything is easy, so don't feel bad.
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On April 18 2012 19:48 Dirkzor wrote:BH spamming and me calling it out was intentional. Was about to point out that BL interacted with BH spam-fest making BL more scum... I decided against it though. I'm looking forward to radfields take on this... looking through the scum qt it seemed I fooled a lot of people  I don't understand how people could find radfield scummy at all. Everything he posted made so much sense even though he was wrong....
Radfield was to good as a townie. His reads were almost to perfect early on, which is why some of us got suspicious of him. What should have made me stop suspecting him though was him pushing for a no-lynch on day 2, which clearly is very town favored.
Also you were basicly a Radfield light in this game, so if there was no way he should be scum, there should be no way you could be scum. Most scummy thing you did in the game was the halleluja post you made about Radfields last analysis post. And I said in obs QT if Radfield die Dirk is scum because of it. But I changed my mind, so it doesn't really count.
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On April 18 2012 20:34 Bluelightz wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2012 19:49 Tunkeg wrote:
This game was won because of good scumplay, and to an extent low activity by town. You might say it is random, and sure there will allways be some randomness, but in the end it came down to scum outplaying town, again.
Don't apologize BL. Yeah, you may be hard to read, but thats part of the game, some players are harder to read. If everyone was easy to figure out this game would be pointless. As long as you try your best to win regardless of alignment don't apologize.
And also for you johnny, don't feel down for beeing wrong. I love how these pro veteran comes in after the game and tell how easy it was to see that Dirkzor was scum. Don't know if their motives is to make you look bad or to make themselves look great. But in hindsight everything is easy, so don't feel bad. Its fucking hard not to because I was the one scummy in the first place and that's why johnny voted me. EDIT: and this time I was called worst player evar by everyone town!
Well you were the only player ingame to figure out the secound scum, that have to count for something, right?
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EPT
