TL Mafia LII: JubJub Mafia - Page 3

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 20 2012 21:21 GMT

#1490

On March 21 2012 05:02 Curu wrote:
Because they don't -want- to kill him but they want to be able to claim Town cred when he flips. That's why they soft bus. They had to know with day shooting Townies Caller would bite the bullet sooner or later but they don't want to instigate it happening.

It looks like Wiggles put a lot of effort/thought into it but never ever made a real push for Caller in the thread at any time. Do you understand where I'm going? He says he is suspicious of Caller but never once acts like he actually wanted Caller to be lynched until it was painfully obvious he was scum.

Hey, if you look, I'm not one of the idiots running around screaming that I'm confirmed town. I haven't tried to claim any 'cred' for the Caller lynch. Next, Caller was my day 1 vote. He was inconsistent and contradictory, and would have been a much better choice for the lynch, if everyone wasn't so worried about whether Jackal's role was real or not. Day 2, it was revealed he was a day vig, so I decided to hold back. There's no reason for me to push him, especially after Kurumi made it completely obvious he was scum, and I thought that because he was a day vig, there was the chance he was town. Day 3, it was obvious he was scum. So, to say I never acted like I wanted to lynch Caller, is a lie. He was my choice for day 1, and my PMs reflect this.

Also, Curu, I don't know why you're so bent-over about a role-claim. I'm a Townie, but I would claim the same thing to you in private no matter what I am, because you aren't confirmed until you flip. The fact you keep claiming so and pushing for roleclaims just makes you look arrogant or scum to me.

Abenson has just masoned me.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 20 2012 21:37 GMT

#1493

On March 21 2012 06:28 Curu wrote:
So why have you not Masoned anyone?

And why Bill Murray? What about Abenson or Katina?

I haven't masoned anyone, because a bunch of people masoned me, so I figured I could save them for later in the game if I wanted to. After everyone claimed their contacts though, everyone talking to me went silent, for whatever reason. I don't see how that would reflect on my alignment at all.

If you're talking about the lynch, I said Bill Murray, because he's the most dangerous of the lurkers, and because Dr. H drew a link between them. If you look at my post, it's not a "Let's kill this person and ignore the others" kind of thing, it's meant to go systematically through the people and actually threaten them with the lynch to see how they react. If we still think they're scum, we follow through. That's basically what's happening to abenson right now. He's actually being threatened with the lynch, and if he can't do anything to stop that, he will be killed. I wanted to start with Bill Murray though, instead of abenson. Notice how I called him out, and then he suddenly jumps into the thread, OMGUS's, and promises future analysis which he has yet to deliver on. That show's he's actively lurking, not just inactive, and he wants to acquiesce the town. Also, now that we've seen mafia can have a role like day-vig, can't BM acting 'like a blue' also be interpreted as being a mafia power role?

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 20 2012 21:55 GMT

#1496

On March 21 2012 06:42 Curu wrote:
And the Town check on him? Did you just conveniently forget about that?

I have a real hard time believing you didn't think your Masons were worth using especially with sandroba entering the game. Waiting for an opportunity of what? You refused to talk to me and I'm more confirmed Town than Palmar.

Yes, I did forget about that, if it's even real. We don't know if the check is real or not until Matt flips town, and it doesn't mean anything because:

Cover: Cost .5KP makes a player appear as townie 1 night cycle.

Or did you just conveniently forget about that? Even if the check was real, and Matt is town and telling the truth, he could still have been covered. We have no confirmation if mafia have recruited the traitor or not, so we can't do the KP math. Also, no one has claimed RB yet, which means scum have been using their 'free' power on Checks, Frames, or Covers. Covers are a lot stronger than Frames for scum who are playing defensively, so that really narrows it down to Checks and Covers.

I didn't say I didn't think my masons were worth using, I said I wanted to save them. Still, there's not as much use to them now, unless I want to do something specific, since most people will claim them in thread. I still don't see how that reflects on my alignment. If you want to explain it to me, go ahead. . Also, not masoning you is not the same as refusing to talk to you. What do you want to talk about so badly that we can't say it here? And, I never considered Palmar confirmed town until he flipped, so throwing that word around means nothing to me.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 21 2012 22:30 GMT

#1546

On March 22 2012 07:17 Abenson wrote:
Can I still attempt to defend myself?
I went and checked the voting thread after my last post and saw that there was 7 votes for me.
So I just assumed that I am effectively dead and out of the game and should not be allowed to post anymore.

You're allowed to defend yourself until you die. The deadline's not until four and a half hours from now.

Also, I'm voting for you now.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 23 2012 03:27 GMT

#1584

Did Caller claim both of his picks, or only Sentinel? Also, I think scum might have been PMing people fishing for the traitor, just look at Caller and Sentinel.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 24 2012 06:17 GMT

#1608

Deconduo, what do you actually think of Dr. H's behaviour?

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 24 2012 18:10 GMT

#1610

I haven't lived to the late game in forever, it feels like. What are we supposed to be doing right now? It seems like we've ground to a halt, and that's probably not a good sign.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 24 2012 22:50 GMT

#1618

On March 25 2012 07:07 EchelonTee wrote:
Wat? in thread sandroba was way more on wiggles than drh, and how could mafia know what sandroba was saying in pms, to judge it on? He was only pming curu and palmar, did you just wildly scum slip? Voting based off "oh I was on wrong track i'm going to vote in a way that keeps me unaccountable" is rly dam suspicious curu.

No one has any rebuttal to the wiggles case. Several people have agreed that wiggles usually isn't this disinterested. Wiggles even says its weird for him to reach late game. Why the hell is no one voting him of everyone is suspicious and there its little backing him?

the only other cases presented are a meta filed case on drh which is just saying "oh you didn't tell usall your opinions and explain with an essay all of your thoughts, so your scum". Not only has no one explicitly explained their every LSAT idea, this would be detrimental as it would clutter thread. The other one is a very loose case on deconduo thatdoesn't explain anything.

Voting wiggles. I've made a case, half of the dead people were suspicious of him, we shouldn't let this slip away.

From phone might be typos. I'll be back before deadline, everyone please consider the cases put forth and make a sensible vote.

What does that have to do with anything? I actually think I haven't been shot because my reads are off, and I'm being pushed as scum in the thread. Instead, the people calling me scum were shot, and now you're in here trying to use them to push my lynch. Why are you acting so desperate?

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 25 2012 00:15 GMT

#1623

I'm trying to figure out if Decon's info actually means anything, and if he thinks Dr. H's behaviour matches what he's saying. He doesn't post though, so I can't learn anything about it. I think one of you or EchelonTee are scum, because scum wouldn't not PM me, especially if they aren't planning on shooting me. I'm leaning towards EchelonTee because of the fact that he never shared anything substantial in PM while constantly asking me what I thought, and then asking about Palmar and Matt. I told him I thought they could still be scum, and then I don't die, they do, and he tries to use that to push a mislynch on me. So what if I spent more time in PMs than spamming up the thread? I didn't need to scumhunt in the thread, because there were obvious scum in it, so I could instead spend my time trying to collect information. Lynching me is dumb. I'm voting EchelonTee. If people still care about the game, they can try to convince me otherwise.

Mr. Wiggles

Canada5894 Posts

March 25 2012 02:16 GMT

#1632

Lynch me, and when I flip, lynch EchelonTee, and whichever or Curu/Dr. H/decon is his scumbuddy.

+ Show Spoiler [Me and Layabout] +

[13/03/2012 10:00:00 AM] No name: it's layabout
[13/03/2012 4:00:23 PM] Jesse Huard: Jesse Huard has shared contact details with No name.
[13/03/2012 4:00:49 PM] No name: hello
[13/03/2012 4:01:03 PM] Jesse Huard: hey
[13/03/2012 4:01:30 PM] No name: any scumreads? i am stumped
[13/03/2012 4:02:00 PM] Jesse Huard: I"m debating about prpl/caller
[13/03/2012 4:02:13 PM] Jesse Huard: and then node/decon are afk, which is always scummy of them
[13/03/2012 4:02:29 PM] No name: has decon done anything?
[13/03/2012 4:02:41 PM] No name: other than tell me that sometimes its okay to kill town
[13/03/2012 4:02:57 PM] Jesse Huard: he voted for caller in the thread, and not the voting one
[13/03/2012 4:03:45 PM] No name: i thought caller looked likely town
[13/03/2012 4:04:12 PM] Jesse Huard: for what reasons?
[13/03/2012 4:04:17 PM] No name: but i am unsure why people feel he looks scummy
[13/03/2012 4:04:24 PM] No name: towards the start
[13/03/2012 4:04:34 PM] No name: he was trying to direct discussion towards the lynch
[13/03/2012 4:04:46 PM] No name: the DocH thing was a bit strange
[13/03/2012 4:05:12 PM] No name: but given that "Kaller game" is named after him i expected him to do something weird
[13/03/2012 4:05:50 PM] No name: though i would to skim some of his old games before making that kind a meta judgement
[13/03/2012 4:06:21 PM] Jesse Huard: Well, what looks weird to me, isn't really that he made a case on Jackal, or the weird DrH accusation, but more what happened afterwards
[13/03/2012 4:06:38 PM] No name: he went quiet?
[13/03/2012 4:06:42 PM] Jesse Huard: Instead of actually pushing for the jackal lynch, he spent all his time calling VE scum
[13/03/2012 4:06:58 PM] Jesse Huard: and saying that if jackal flips town, we lynch VE the next day
[13/03/2012 4:07:11 PM] No name: without a good reason for saying so
[13/03/2012 4:07:21 PM] Jesse Huard: Why wouldn't you try to ensure your first suspect is actually lynched?
[13/03/2012 4:07:49 PM] Jesse Huard: Then, why do you reveal the stuff about VE, when it would be much more powerful all at once, and if it depends on the flip, after you see the flip
[13/03/2012 4:08:33 PM] Jesse Huard: Also, the stuff he says, is pretty contradictory
[13/03/2012 4:09:05 PM] Jesse Huard: He calls VE out for what he sees as trying to set himself up to look good no matter what the flip is, while he does the same thing himself
[13/03/2012 4:09:33 PM] Jesse Huard: also, it's kind've weird, because if he was mafia, he should know what the flip is, so I don't get what he's saying, in a way
[13/03/2012 4:09:56 PM] Jesse Huard: if VE was mafia, he should know what the flip is, so why would he set himself up to look good both ways, according to caller*
[13/03/2012 4:11:29 PM] No name: plus the "thank you prplhz stuff" read like nonsense
[13/03/2012 4:12:01 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, I can't tell yet, whether he's actually scum, or just throwing crap around, though
[13/03/2012 4:13:58 PM] No name: It's seems a little odd
[13/03/2012 4:14:43 PM] No name: that most of his accusations against Jackal were based upon him criticising his own bad reasoning and suggesting "a plan"
[13/03/2012 4:15:44 PM] No name: when Jackal probably is the role he claimed and he managed to start a discussion that was not all that bad
[13/03/2012 4:16:09 PM] No name: and i think that was all he intended to do when he said we should announce PM's
[13/03/2012 4:16:54 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[13/03/2012 4:16:59 PM] Jesse Huard: Also, the idea had some merits
[13/03/2012 4:17:38 PM] Jesse Huard: Well, I'm going to go do some homework, now, I'll be back later. If you want to write stuff to me, I'll read it when I get back
[13/03/2012 4:17:48 PM] No name: cool
[13/03/2012 4:21:05 PM] No name: Now in my experience "scumslips" are not very common so when caller says he found one in this post http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=13896263 , i think that he is trying to make people doubt VE whilst making himself look useful
[13/03/2012 4:22:57 PM] No name: In spite of all of the accusations leveled against Jitsu and in spite of my argument with him i believe he has town's interest in mind when he is posting
[13/03/2012 4:24:00 PM] No name: his vote for prp is terrible
[13/03/2012 4:25:17 PM] No name: I am in contact with Bill Murray,we have not said much due to crappy timezones
[13/03/2012 4:31:33 PM] No name: Jaybrundage: when i read this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=13887349 i thought like Jay showed that his actions make more sense from a town persctive than scum one
[13/03/2012 4:34:16 PM] No name: i do not see why mafia would defend themself by saying that basically all they have done so far had been to fish for reactions
[13/03/2012 4:36:35 PM] No name: when he says " I say i do agree with lynching liars and Lurkers. However i suggest we use them as guidelines. " i he is making a mute point, that he did not need to make in the first place and that he didn't need to emphasise
[13/03/2012 4:37:01 PM] No name: I also think its strange that Jaybrundage says he thinks Kurumi would be the traitor, since I find it very difficult to figure out Kurumi's motivations for posting and he is not always serious.
[13/03/2012 4:37:35 PM] No name: I do not see why you would be speculating about the traitor like that as town
[13/03/2012 4:39:22 PM] No name: So Wiggles, when you are looking for scum do you differentiate between scum and traitors? and if you think a player is one of the two and you want to lynch them, wouldn't you call them scum rather than traitor as that is more likely to sway people to lynch them?
[13/03/2012 8:20:05 PM] Jesse Huard: When I look for scum, the first thing I do is just look for them acting scummily. If it's a game with multiple factions, i.e. 2 mafia families, sk and mafia, mafia and traitors, I might try to differentiate between them, especially if my read relies on associative tells
[13/03/2012 8:20:59 PM] Jesse Huard: If I had a choice between scum and traitor, and if the traitor wasn't called out as a traitor, I'd lynch the scum. Th e thing is, you can't be 100% sure, so if you think they're scum, you lynch them no matter if they might be traitor or normal mafia
[13/03/2012 8:21:50 PM] Jesse Huard: I'd probably just call them scum, but I think that's more of a personal choice, as people don't always follow optimal play, and it might just be an oversight
[13/03/2012 8:22:25 PM] Jesse Huard: personally, if I was the traitor, it seems pretty hard to actually get added to the scum team, so what I'd do instead, is just try to cause as much chaos in the town as I could
[13/03/2012 8:23:23 PM] Jesse Huard: this doesn't neccessarily mean act like Kurumi is, but it could be something like push a bunch of cases I know are wrong, to waste town's time, and push bad cases, or oppose things, and make stuff difficult. Basically, act as anti-town as I could, while passing it off as bad play, and avoid the lynch

+ Show Spoiler [Me and Decon] +

[13/03/2012 8:19:04 PM] Jesse Huard: I am Mr. Wiggles!
[14/03/2012 6:56:16 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Oisín De Condúin has shared contact details with Jesse Huard.
[14/03/2012 6:56:23 AM] Oisín De Condúin: sup
[14/03/2012 7:57:34 AM] Jesse Huard: so who do you want to lynch, today?
[14/03/2012 7:57:55 AM] Oisín De Condúin: hey

[14/03/2012 7:58:07 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm not too sure tbh
[14/03/2012 7:58:14 AM] Oisín De Condúin: porbably jackal
[14/03/2012 7:58:27 AM] Oisín De Condúin: there's too many things about his play that don't add up
[14/03/2012 7:58:35 AM] Oisín De Condúin: the only thing I'm aprehensive about
[14/03/2012 7:58:46 AM] Oisín De Condúin: is the fact that 3 people posted a case against him within20 min
[14/03/2012 7:58:47 AM] Oisín De Condúin:

[14/03/2012 7:59:00 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah, haha
[14/03/2012 7:59:10 AM] Jesse Huard: What do you think of palmar claiming scum in the thread?
[14/03/2012 7:59:19 AM] Oisín De Condúin: what>
[14/03/2012 7:59:28 AM] Oisín De Condúin: fuck I must have missed that
[14/03/2012 7:59:31 AM] Oisín De Condúin:

[14/03/2012 7:59:33 AM] Jesse Huard: he did the emperor Palpatine speech
[14/03/2012 7:59:38 AM] Jesse Huard: pretty sure that guy was scum
[14/03/2012 7:59:56 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I saw that
[14/03/2012 7:59:57 AM] Oisín De Condúin: and TL:DR
[14/03/2012 8:00:12 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I just assumed it was spam
[14/03/2012 8:00:23 AM] Jesse Huard: it prettymuch was
[14/03/2012 8:00:27 AM] Oisín De Condúin: hmm
[14/03/2012 8:00:38 AM] Oisín De Condúin: someone did that before, and I think it was palmar
[14/03/2012 8:00:39 AM] Oisín De Condúin:

[14/03/2012 8:00:48 AM] Oisín De Condúin: did a not so subtle brag about being scum
[14/03/2012 8:00:55 AM] Oisín De Condúin: got caught and lynched
[14/03/2012 8:01:15 AM] Jesse Huard: I just found it funny, because it was by Palpatine, who everyone thought would be a great leader on their side, but then he turned out to be a sith guy
[14/03/2012 8:01:21 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Something like the first word of each sentence spelling out 'I am scum'
[14/03/2012 8:01:31 AM] Jesse Huard: jeejee?!?!
[14/03/2012 8:01:33 AM] Oisín De Condúin: dammit, what game was that in
[14/03/2012 8:01:35 AM] Oisín De Condúin: oh yeah
[14/03/2012 8:01:42 AM] Oisín De Condúin: that was it

[14/03/2012 8:01:45 AM] Jesse Huard: then jacka 'found it'
[14/03/2012 8:01:53 AM] Jesse Huard: anyways, I'm off to school, see ya
[14/03/2012 8:01:54 AM] Oisín De Condúin: cya
[14/03/2012 8:02:30 AM] Oisín De Condúin: when you get back: What do you think of caller vigging node?
[14/03/2012 11:20:02 AM | Edited 12:07:41 PM] Oisín De Condúin: h
[14/03/2012 4:02:44 PM] Jesse Huard: I'm not sure what to think of that
[14/03/2012 4:02:59 PM] Jesse Huard: It seems like Palmar directed him there, and I"m not sure if Palmar is town or not
[14/03/2012 4:03:17 PM] Jesse Huard: his initial posting made me think he was town, but he's had a lack of follow-up in the thrad
[14/03/2012 4:03:19 PM] Jesse Huard: thread*
[14/03/2012 4:03:29 PM] Jesse Huard: though, that could be because he's chilling in PM land
[14/03/2012 4:10:41 PM] Oisín De Condúin: if node had flipped scum I would be a lot happier with Palmar
[14/03/2012 4:10:42 PM] Oisín De Condúin: now I'm not so sure
[14/03/2012 4:10:48 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[14/03/2012 4:11:04 PM] Jesse Huard: I was going to laugh in Node flipped scum, though, it'd be a repeat of my game with BC
[14/03/2012 4:11:05 PM] Oisín De Condúin: who did you pick for your PMs btw?
[14/03/2012 4:11:22 PM] Jesse Huard: he talked to a vig, and got him to shoot Node, who was on our team, because he was being useless
[14/03/2012 4:11:28 PM] Jesse Huard: instant town cred
[14/03/2012 4:11:31 PM] Oisín De Condúin: lol
[14/03/2012 4:11:39 PM] Jesse Huard: no one yet
[14/03/2012 4:11:44 PM] Jesse Huard: how about you?
[14/03/2012 4:11:49 PM] Oisín De Condúin: you and sheth
[14/03/2012 4:11:51 PM] Oisín De Condúin:

[14/03/2012 4:11:55 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so just you now
[14/03/2012 4:12:03 PM] Jesse Huard: that sucks
[14/03/2012 4:12:04 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I dunno why mafia killed sheth
[14/03/2012 4:12:10 PM] Oisín De Condúin: he wasn't exactly a threat
[14/03/2012 4:12:15 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[14/03/2012 4:12:22 PM] Jesse Huard: maybe they had a blue read?
[14/03/2012 4:12:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: only thing that makes sense really
[14/03/2012 4:12:45 PM] Oisín De Condúin: though I don't see how from his posts
[14/03/2012 4:13:12 PM] Jesse Huard: maybe someone's a creepy SC2 fan-stalker
[14/03/2012 4:13:15 PM] Oisín De Condúin: lol
[14/03/2012 4:13:24 PM] Jesse Huard: and they wanted to kill him, so they could say they killed sheth in mafia
[14/03/2012 4:14:09 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so anyway
[14/03/2012 4:14:14 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm a PM detective
[14/03/2012 4:14:21 PM] Jesse Huard: PM detective?
[14/03/2012 4:14:24 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yah
[14/03/2012 4:14:32 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I can pick a person each night
[14/03/2012 4:14:33 PM] Oisín De Condúin: and see who is PMing them
[14/03/2012 4:14:41 PM] Oisín De Condúin: as proof
[14/03/2012 4:14:48 PM] Jesse Huard: cool
[14/03/2012 4:14:49 PM] Oisín De Condúin: echelon, palmar, layabout and me
[14/03/2012 4:14:50 PM] Oisín De Condúin: picked you
[14/03/2012 4:14:55 PM] Oisín De Condúin: and you haven't picked anyone yet
[14/03/2012 4:14:59 PM] Jesse Huard: yep
[14/03/2012 4:15:02 PM] Oisín De Condúin: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Am6awLPYDPGcdFM5VHEwYm5PaEJ4MVl3bWl0Vk9WbXc
[14/03/2012 4:15:02 PM] Jesse Huard: ok, cool
[14/03/2012 4:15:22 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I've also being plotting people's PM map
[14/03/2012 4:15:32 PM] Jesse Huard: Yeah, I'm pretty popular, lol
[14/03/2012 4:15:38 PM] Oisín De Condúin: you and palmar
[14/03/2012 4:15:45 PM] Jesse Huard: palmar hasn't talked to me though
[14/03/2012 4:15:58 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so he picked you but hasn't been talking?
[14/03/2012 4:15:59 PM] Oisín De Condúin: interesting
[14/03/2012 4:16:03 PM] Jesse Huard: Pandain Pmed me because he said he has fun talking to me, and wanted to send me love notes
[14/03/2012 4:16:07 PM] Oisín De Condúin: oh
[14/03/2012 4:16:15 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yeah I forgot he subbed out
[14/03/2012 4:16:16 PM] Jesse Huard: and then palmar hasn't talked to me since he's replaced in
[14/03/2012 4:16:28 PM] Jesse Huard: Pandain claimed scum to me, too

[14/03/2012 4:16:30 PM] Oisín De Condúin: lol
[14/03/2012 4:17:05 PM] Oisín De Condúin: anyway, once one scum flips
[14/03/2012 4:17:07 PM] Oisín De Condúin: it helps a lot
[14/03/2012 4:17:11 PM] Jesse Huard: Yeah, and I bet you thought you were going to get away with it too. At first, I was puzzled, maybe even a little lost. I wasn't sure what to make of you, but as soon as you claimed scum to me, things started to become clearer. It all made sense! You said you were scum, so in no time at all, I was able to deduce once and for all... that you were scum. CASE CLOSED. No scum escape, when Mr. Wiggles is on the case!

Original Message From Pandain:
fuck

Hide nested quote -
Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
=O Well I guess I'll have to lynch you!

Original Message From Pandain:
yes

Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
Ok, cool. You scum?

Original Message From Pandain:
I want to pm people who I like/have fun conversations with.

Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
Well, I hope you feel better soon, then. Why'd you decide to PM me, if you haven't really read through the thread?

Original Message From Pandain:
havne't read everything yet(feel sick).

Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
Hi! What do you think of the game, so far?

Original Message From Pandain:
hihi
[14/03/2012 4:17:13 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[14/03/2012 4:17:15 PM] Oisín De Condúin: because scum aren't going to choose each other
[14/03/2012 4:17:34 PM] Jesse Huard: no, and they're probably going to spread out their picks
[14/03/2012 4:17:40 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yah
[14/03/2012 4:17:42 PM] Jesse Huard: it's how I know that between you 4, you can't all be scum
[14/03/2012 4:17:51 PM] Jesse Huard: because thay would be a waste
[14/03/2012 4:18:11 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm going to assume caller is town
[14/03/2012 4:18:18 PM] Oisín De Condúin: because mafia never get day vigs right?
[14/03/2012 4:18:25 PM] Jesse Huard: I think a couple times
[14/03/2012 4:18:27 PM] Oisín De Condúin: hmm
[14/03/2012 4:18:36 PM] Jesse Huard: I'll consider him town, but not 'confirmed
[14/03/2012 4:19:46 PM] Oisín De Condúin: Mattchew, Caller, Kurumi
[14/03/2012 4:19:50 PM] Oisín De Condúin: probably 2 are town
[14/03/2012 4:19:55 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[14/03/2012 4:20:04 PM] Oisín De Condúin: but I'd guess one might be scum as well
[14/03/2012 4:20:07 PM] Oisín De Condúin: for the same reason
[14/03/2012 4:20:08 PM] Jesse Huard: I don't think this game is as 'normal
[14/03/2012 4:20:13 PM] Jesse Huard: as it's supposed to be
[14/03/2012 4:20:22 PM] Oisín De Condúin: well I am a PM detective
[14/03/2012 4:20:28 PM] Oisín De Condúin: and you have Kurmi + Jackal's roles
[14/03/2012 4:20:36 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, exactly
[14/03/2012 4:20:40 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so not standard medic detective vig
[14/03/2012 4:20:41 PM] Oisín De Condúin:

[14/03/2012 4:21:04 PM] Jesse Huard: If you think about it, they're all just weaker versions of the normal roles
[14/03/2012 4:21:32 PM] Jesse Huard: You get people's PMs, Jackal is a weaker vig, and kurumi is like a role cop who only gets random roles, and not who has them
[14/03/2012 4:21:57 PM] Jesse Huard: Looking at the amount of KP, and the number of scum, it makes sense that town is a little weaker, or mafia has some kind of extra roles
[14/03/2012 4:22:17 PM] Oisín De Condúin: well scum might have traded in KP
[14/03/2012 4:22:52 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, but none of the powers in the OP are KP
[14/03/2012 4:23:26 PM] Oisín De Condúin: as in, scum might have more KP than they showed last night
[14/03/2012 4:23:44 PM] Oisín De Condúin: because they traded it in for framing/covering/rolechecking
[14/03/2012 4:23:58 PM] Oisín De Condúin: oh nvm
[14/03/2012 4:23:59 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm an idiot
[14/03/2012 4:24:05 PM] Oisín De Condúin: scum numbers are in the OP
[14/03/2012 4:24:05 PM] Jesse Huard: well, it says that scum start at 4, all all contribute .5
[14/03/2012 4:24:07 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[14/03/2012 4:24:14 PM] Oisín De Condúin: that makes a lot more sense
[14/03/2012 4:24:32 PM] Jesse Huard: Counting the traitor as part of the scum number, we get 5 mislynches without blue interference, and lynching no scum
[14/03/2012 4:24:32 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so they only have 4, that does seem underpowered
[14/03/2012 4:24:40 PM] Jesse Huard: 4 mislynches*
[14/03/2012 4:24:50 PM] Jesse Huard: and mafia at 2 K{
[14/03/2012 4:24:51 PM] Jesse Huard: KP*
[14/03/2012 4:25:22 PM] Oisín De Condúin: do you think kurumi is the traitor?
[14/03/2012 4:25:29 PM] Jesse Huard: I'm not sure
[14/03/2012 4:25:49 PM] Jesse Huard: If he is, he shouldn't know the roles
[14/03/2012 4:26:04 PM] Jesse Huard: I'm interested in when he claimed to know the dreamflower role was in the game
[14/03/2012 4:26:38 PM] Jesse Huard: As traitor, the only reason to cliam that, would be because you think that jackal is scum, and want to make sure he lives
[14/03/2012 4:27:08 PM] Jesse Huard: he seemed like he was acting more seriously, in the PM jackal linked, than he is in the thread
[14/03/2012 4:27:57 PM] Jesse Huard: I think mattchew might be scum
[14/03/2012 4:28:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yeah I think so too
[14/03/2012 4:28:42 PM] Jesse Huard: he's posting stuff, but it doesn't really seem like it's coming from a town place. More like it's commentary or calling someone out without any actual substance
[14/03/2012 4:28:50 PM] Oisín De Condúin: In fact I even said it in the thread
[14/03/2012 4:28:56 PM] Oisín De Condúin: he's one of my strongest scumreads
[14/03/2012 4:29:00 PM] Jesse Huard: did you?
[14/03/2012 4:29:05 PM] Jesse Huard: I know couple people mentioned it
[14/03/2012 4:29:43 PM] Jesse Huard: ok, I see it
[14/03/2012 4:45:00 PM] Oisín De Condúin: There is no way that Ver or Incog wrote this:
[14/03/2012 4:45:00 PM] Oisín De Condúin: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574&currentpage=44#861
[14/03/2012 4:52:43 PM] Jesse Huard: Oh my
[14/03/2012 4:52:53 PM] Jesse Huard: lol
[15/03/2012 8:01:16 AM] Oisín De Condúin: You should mason caller
[16/03/2012 7:12:55 AM] Jesse Huard: So who are you thinking of checking tonight?
[16/03/2012 7:13:20 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Not too sure
[16/03/2012 7:13:34 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Once everyone massclaims I'll have a better idea
[16/03/2012 7:13:43 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm most suspicious of Mattchew right now
[16/03/2012 7:13:54 AM] Oisín De Condúin: so probably him
[16/03/2012 7:13:56 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[16/03/2012 7:14:02 AM] Jesse Huard: I keep oscillating on him
[16/03/2012 7:14:02 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but again, it depends on what people came
[16/03/2012 7:14:12 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm fairly sure he hammered on Kurumi
[16/03/2012 7:14:22 AM] Oisín De Condúin: just to bus him
[16/03/2012 7:14:36 AM] Jesse Huard: Do you know how Palmar is 'confirmed'
[16/03/2012 7:14:49 AM] Oisín De Condúin: he isn't
[16/03/2012 7:14:50 AM] Oisín De Condúin: not even close
[16/03/2012 7:14:56 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[16/03/2012 7:14:59 AM] Oisín De Condúin: he's lynched two townies
[16/03/2012 7:15:14 AM] Oisín De Condúin: and claimed to VE that he's a DT
[16/03/2012 7:15:38 AM] Jesse Huard: Cause, people keep saying he made the case on Kurumi, when the post he made is super wishy-washy, and he ends it with "I'm not sure", doesn't even call kurumi scum in it
[16/03/2012 7:15:50 AM] Jesse Huard: Kurumi killed himself with the obviously fake PMs
[16/03/2012 7:16:00 AM] Oisín De Condúin: yah
[16/03/2012 7:16:06 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Kurumi was an idiot
[16/03/2012 7:16:20 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I wouldn't be surprised
[16/03/2012 7:16:20 AM] Jesse Huard: Then, I want to see if Palmar uses Kurumi as his excuse to shoot jackal
[16/03/2012 7:16:25 AM] Oisín De Condúin: if Curu Palmar Mattchew
[16/03/2012 7:16:27 AM] Oisín De Condúin: is scumteam
[16/03/2012 7:16:29 AM] Jesse Huard: because he didn't say why he shot him
[16/03/2012 7:16:44 AM] Jesse Huard: town is gonna sheep them hardcore
[16/03/2012 7:17:09 AM] Oisín De Condúin: and all three are pushing Katina
[16/03/2012 7:17:16 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[16/03/2012 7:17:36 AM] Jesse Huard: I think the kills tonight will be some combination of me/caller/drh, and some lurkers
[16/03/2012 7:17:45 AM] Oisín De Condúin: yup
[16/03/2012 7:17:54 AM] Jesse Huard: that also explains why the lynch wasn't concealed
[16/03/2012 7:18:09 AM] Jesse Huard: they want the towncred for kurumi
[16/03/2012 7:18:20 AM] Jesse Huard: concealing that lynch, would have completely screwed town
[16/03/2012 7:18:42 AM] Jesse Huard: because we have no idea if two people were scum or town who people were pretty split on
[16/03/2012 7:20:17 AM] Oisín De Condúin: yep
[16/03/2012 7:20:23 AM] Oisín De Condúin: all three are pushing the same sort of case
[16/03/2012 7:20:27 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Palmar is confirmed town
[16/03/2012 7:20:33 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Katina is scum
[16/03/2012 7:20:39 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Only look at the people that didn't vote for Kurumi
[16/03/2012 7:20:49 AM] Jesse Huard: mattchew is confirmed town
[16/03/2012 7:21:12 AM] Jesse Huard: I always really hated that argument
[16/03/2012 7:21:24 AM] Jesse Huard: "If I was scum, would I really do something like that?"
[16/03/2012 7:21:58 AM] Oisín De Condúin: complete WIFOM
[16/03/2012 7:22:20 AM] Oisín De Condúin: the other thing is
[16/03/2012 7:22:31 AM] Oisín De Condúin: that both Mattchew and Curu claim to have masoned Palmar
[16/03/2012 7:22:39 AM] Oisín De Condúin: so its possible that Palmar is town
[16/03/2012 7:22:44 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but is being led by those two
[16/03/2012 7:22:49 AM] Jesse Huard: hmmm
[16/03/2012 7:22:53 AM | Edited 7:23:05 AM] Oisín De Condúin: and doesn't realise his town circle is scum
[16/03/2012 7:23:03 AM] Jesse Huard: lol
[16/03/2012 7:23:13 AM] Jesse Huard: Palmar just asked me to claim to him because he's confirmed town
[16/03/2012 7:23:21 AM] Jesse Huard: already told him I'm VT
[16/03/2012 7:23:29 AM] Oisín De Condúin: hey
[16/03/2012 7:23:34 AM] Oisín De Condúin: what was your PM like actually
[16/03/2012 7:23:43 AM] Oisín De Condúin: cos mine didn't actually say I was town
[16/03/2012 7:23:45 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I just assumed it
[16/03/2012 7:24:14 AM] Jesse Huard: well, it's green and says Townie
[16/03/2012 7:24:15 AM] Oisín De Condúin: hmm
[16/03/2012 7:24:22 AM] Jesse Huard: and my win-con is in it
[16/03/2012 7:24:30 AM] Oisín De Condúin: mine has no coloured text
[16/03/2012 7:24:33 AM] Oisín De Condúin: no win con
[16/03/2012 7:24:39 AM] Oisín De Condúin: just
[16/03/2012 7:24:44 AM] Jesse Huard: probably the hosts
[16/03/2012 7:24:56 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Role
Role description
[16/03/2012 7:25:12 AM] Jesse Huard: could be the hosts, doing it to screw with the jubjubs
[16/03/2012 7:25:17 AM] Oisín De Condúin: maybe
[16/03/2012 7:25:24 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I'd laugh if I was traitor
[16/03/2012 7:25:25 AM] Jesse Huard: Same thing happened in Sleeper Cell and Responsibility
[16/03/2012 7:25:26 AM] Oisín De Condúin: lol
[16/03/2012 7:25:36 AM] Jesse Huard: lol
[16/03/2012 7:25:43 AM] Oisín De Condúin: though I don't think traitor has a PR
[16/03/2012 7:26:42 AM] Oisín De Condúin: have you used your mason picks yet?
[16/03/2012 7:26:47 AM] Jesse Huard: responsibility had two roles named differently that did the same thing, and sleeper cell had everyone's role PMs formatted the exact same except for the bullet-proof townies, whose PM was completely different
[16/03/2012 7:26:53 AM] Jesse Huard: no, I'm going to wait for the next day
[16/03/2012 7:27:05 AM] Jesse Huard: maybe do DrH/Caller, depending on who's alive
[16/03/2012 7:27:16 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Caller I'm fairly sure is town
[16/03/2012 7:27:20 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but will be dead
[16/03/2012 7:27:23 AM] Jesse Huard: mhmm
[16/03/2012 7:27:27 AM] Oisín De Condúin: Dr. H I'm less certain
[16/03/2012 7:27:33 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but he's definitely leaning town
[16/03/2012 7:27:56 AM] Jesse Huard: do you think scum would have killed a kingmaker or try to influence him?
[16/03/2012 7:28:08 AM] Oisín De Condúin: hell yeah
[16/03/2012 7:28:10 AM] Oisín De Condúin: well
[16/03/2012 7:28:28 AM] Oisín De Condúin: assume Palmar is telling the truth
[16/03/2012 7:28:33 AM] Oisín De Condúin: and VE made him kingmaker
[16/03/2012 7:28:51 AM] Oisín De Condúin: then if Palmar is town and there's scum in his circle
[16/03/2012 7:28:56 AM] Oisín De Condúin: they would definitely take out VE
[16/03/2012 7:29:00 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[16/03/2012 7:29:14 AM] Oisín De Condúin: if Palmar is scum, but VE trusted him enough to make him king
[16/03/2012 7:29:26 AM] Oisín De Condúin: taking him out that early seems a bit premature
[16/03/2012 7:29:40 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but still plausible
[16/03/2012 7:29:49 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah, so that's probably a point in Palmar's favour, but nothing confirming
[16/03/2012 7:29:52 AM] Oisín De Condúin: especially if Palmar lynched a town, he could lose trust
[16/03/2012 7:29:56 AM] Jesse Huard: mhmm
[16/03/2012 7:30:04 AM] Jesse Huard: but he could get VE to sheep his picks
[16/03/2012 7:30:11 AM] Jesse Huard: "Pick mattchew, he's confirmed"
[16/03/2012 7:30:17 AM] Oisín De Condúin: yah
[16/03/2012 7:30:34 AM] Oisín De Condúin: but don't forget this was night one
[16/03/2012 7:30:52 AM] Oisín De Condúin: if I was scum I'd probably want to take out VE quickly
[16/03/2012 7:31:00 AM] Oisín De Condúin: as kingmaker is such a powerful role
[16/03/2012 7:31:11 AM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[16/03/2012 7:31:26 AM] Jesse Huard: if he figured out you were scum, he could king someone else and it's basically an unblockable vig shot
[16/03/2012 7:31:41 AM] Oisín De Condúin: yep
[16/03/2012 7:31:42 AM] Oisín De Condúin: also I'm pretty sure Palmar lied at one point
[16/03/2012 7:31:47 AM] Oisín De Condúin: when he said he HAD to lynch someone
[16/03/2012 7:32:01 AM] Oisín De Condúin: that's generally not part of the kingmaker role AFAIK
[16/03/2012 7:32:18 AM] Oisín De Condúin: being forced to lynch seems a bit off
[16/03/2012 7:32:36 AM] Jesse Huard: well
[16/03/2012 7:32:39 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I think he just wanted an excuse to take out Jackal before Jackal shot scum
[16/03/2012 7:32:44 AM] Jesse Huard: You are the Kingmaker, the power behind the throne. Every night you must send me a Private Message with a list of names to be made king. The highest person on the list not to be killed will be made king. The King will not be informed of who you are. You also can not choose any player you already made King unless you cannot fulfill your role otherwise (i,e only a few people are left whom you've all made king). You can't nominate yourself to be King either under any circumstances. The King is essentially a day vigilante who must type ##lynch player at some point during the day to kill someone. If the king's vote is bought by the politician, the politician also controls the king's lynch. Power behind the throne, neh?
[16/03/2012 7:32:47 AM] Jesse Huard: from PYP
[16/03/2012 7:32:54 AM] Jesse Huard: is you have to
[16/03/2012 7:32:58 AM] Oisín De Condúin: oh fair enough
[16/03/2012 7:33:02 AM] Oisín De Condúin: nevermind then
[16/03/2012 7:33:38 AM] Oisín De Condúin: I;ve got to go
[16/03/2012 7:33:41 AM] Oisín De Condúin: back in an hour or so
[16/03/2012 7:33:42 AM] Jesse Huard: ok, see ya
[16/03/2012 7:33:46 AM] Jesse Huard: I'll be at school
[16/03/2012 8:26:34 AM | Edited 8:26:40 AM] Oisín De Condúin: h
[16/03/2012 3:06:32 PM] Jesse Huard: h?
[16/03/2012 3:09:09 PM] Jesse Huard: I would say checking someone from the mattchew/curu/palmar circlejerk could be good, as it could find 2-3 scum, or prove that they are at least not lying about PMing each other, which makes them a lot less likely to all be scum
[16/03/2012 3:09:49 PM] Jesse Huard: I don't think most people would think there'd be a PM dt unless that was one of the roles they were told, and then they'd have to be smart enough to actually use their PMs on eachother
[16/03/2012 3:30:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yeah
[16/03/2012 3:30:44 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I noticed Mattchew has changed his tune though
[16/03/2012 3:30:55 PM] Jesse Huard: in what way?
[16/03/2012 3:30:58 PM] Jesse Huard: about katina?
[16/03/2012 3:31:12 PM] Oisín De Condúin: about a lot of things
[16/03/2012 3:31:12 PM] Oisín De Condúin: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=316574&currentpage=60#1196
[16/03/2012 3:31:24 PM] Oisín De Condúin:
No you don't get credit for the kurumi lynch

No you cant just call everyone not voting kurumi scum

No Katina is probably not scum cause she is genuine

Yes Katina is a super easy target for scum to go after
[16/03/2012 3:31:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so now I dunno wtf to think about him
[16/03/2012 3:35:25 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, he's been like that for me the whole game, almost
[16/03/2012 3:35:32 PM] Jesse Huard: I keep swinging between scum and not scum
[16/03/2012 3:35:36 PM] Jesse Huard: same with prplhz
[20/03/2012 4:31:18 PM] Jesse Huard: So who did you check?
[20/03/2012 4:31:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: katina
[20/03/2012 4:31:41 PM] Jesse Huard: oh yeah
[20/03/2012 4:31:45 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I posted it back a bit
[20/03/2012 4:31:50 PM] Oisín De Condúin: so who are the last scum
[20/03/2012 4:33:21 PM] Jesse Huard: I think BM is prolly scum, but people are saying that because a DT checked him, he's confirmed town
[20/03/2012 4:33:32 PM] Jesse Huard: I think he prolly just got covered
[20/03/2012 4:33:52 PM] Jesse Huard: I could be wrong, but he's acting really scummy
[20/03/2012 4:34:04 PM] Jesse Huard: just lurks, pops in calling someone town or scum, and leaving
[20/03/2012 4:34:18 PM] Jesse Huard: he doesn't actually push anything, though
[20/03/2012 4:34:32 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm in PMs with him, I think he's town
[20/03/2012 4:34:44 PM] Jesse Huard: Is he actually active in PMs?
[20/03/2012 4:34:53 PM] Oisín De Condúin: he's playing exactly the same way he did in Orgah
[20/03/2012 4:34:53 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yeah
[20/03/2012 4:35:15 PM] Jesse Huard: ok, because that was the other argument, but it only looked like he sent two PMs to layabout
[20/03/2012 4:35:52 PM] Jesse Huard: what do you think of Curu?
[20/03/2012 4:35:59 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm still iffy on curu
[20/03/2012 4:36:05 PM] Oisín De Condúin: he thinks he's confirmed
[20/03/2012 4:36:10 PM] Oisín De Condúin: a long with a lot of others
[20/03/2012 4:36:13 PM] Oisín De Condúin: but I'm not so sure
[20/03/2012 4:36:19 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[20/03/2012 4:36:31 PM] Jesse Huard: I hate people who call themselves confirmed, like it's an actual argument
[20/03/2012 4:36:39 PM] Oisín De Condúin: and I really hate when anyone declares themselves triple confirmed town in a closed setup
[20/03/2012 4:36:40 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yes
[20/03/2012 4:36:48 PM] Jesse Huard: it just makes them look arrogant, or scum pleading for cred
[20/03/2012 4:37:08 PM] Jesse Huard: What do you think of EchelonTee?
[20/03/2012 4:37:20 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I think he could definitely be scum
[20/03/2012 4:37:28 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I gotta go tho
[20/03/2012 4:37:32 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, I thought he was town
[20/03/2012 4:37:32 PM] Oisín De Condúin: in a raid right now

[20/03/2012 4:37:36 PM] Oisín De Condúin: back in 15min tho
[20/03/2012 4:37:52 PM] Jesse Huard: but then he sent me a PM saying that he wanted me to step up and lead the town because he thought Curu was iffy
[20/03/2012 4:37:58 PM] Jesse Huard: I was inactive for around 24 hours
[20/03/2012 4:38:11 PM] Jesse Huard: and when I come back, he's made a case against me, and Curu is the second one on it
[20/03/2012 4:38:17 PM] Jesse Huard: ok, cya
[20/03/2012 6:04:40 PM] Oisín De Condúin: sorry
[20/03/2012 6:04:46 PM] Oisín De Condúin: that took a bit longer than I expected

[20/03/2012 6:30:28 PM] Jesse Huard: no problem
[20/03/2012 6:30:55 PM] Oisín De Condúin: I'm doing 20 things at once right now

[20/03/2012 6:31:26 PM] Oisín De Condúin: mafia game, admin on a minecraft server, leader of a wow guild, final exams in 4 weeks
[20/03/2012 6:31:32 PM] Oisín De Condúin: kind of a bit hectic lol
[20/03/2012 6:31:40 PM] Jesse Huard: haha
[20/03/2012 6:32:01 PM] Oisín De Condúin: hmm
[20/03/2012 6:32:09 PM] Oisín De Condúin: also I think Dr. H might be scum
[20/03/2012 6:34:04 PM] Oisín De Condúin: If Kurumi was the traitor, someone from the scumteam must have masoned him
[20/03/2012 6:34:17 PM] Oisín De Condúin: we know kurumi didn't mason a scum because both of his picks flipped green
[20/03/2012 6:34:27 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah
[20/03/2012 6:34:44 PM] Jesse Huard: Is your spreadsheet up to date?
[20/03/2012 6:34:53 PM] Oisín De Condúin: of all the people who have claimed, only Dr. H masoned kurumi
[20/03/2012 6:35:00 PM] Oisín De Condúin: as far as I know yeah
[20/03/2012 6:35:06 PM] Oisín De Condúin: BM hasn;t claimed his second mason
[20/03/2012 6:35:18 PM] Oisín De Condúin: curu refuses to claim
[20/03/2012 6:35:29 PM] Oisín De Condúin: abenson is just terrible
[20/03/2012 6:35:48 PM] Jesse Huard: can you see him being scum?
[20/03/2012 6:36:05 PM] Oisín De Condúin: yes
[20/03/2012 6:36:10 PM] Oisín De Condúin: but I can also see him being bad
[20/03/2012 6:36:17 PM] Oisín De Condúin: but right now, he's the best lynch option
[20/03/2012 6:36:17 PM] Jesse Huard: yeah, that's the trouble
[20/03/2012 6:36:26 PM] Jesse Huard: His recent post about my PM is really weird

+ Show Spoiler [Me and ET] +

To: EchelonTee [ Profile | Buddy | Report ]
Subject: Re: TL jubjub
Date: 3/14/12 12:31
He's said a lot of stuff that's blatantly anti-town, like that role-fishing for PMs shouldn't set you off, or on your guard, calling himself confirmed town, and pushing the idea that if Jackal flips red, Curu and Caller are as well, and then some other things. It just sets me off, and makes him look scummy. What I have to do, is decide whether that actually means he's scum, or he's just pushing bad ideas, and actually believes them.

Original Message From EchelonTee:
mm atm he's just coasted in thread with his asshole townie persona. i assume he's doing a lot of PMs so he should have plenty of info soon. i'm assuming you've been around long enough for when PM games were common; is palmar experienced with them?

also i wouldn't be so quick to divide palmar into gosu town and chobo mafia; he just won as scum in Werewolves Invade TL II. I didn't rly follow that game too closely, but I think he was allowed to coast in that game; if Palmar doesn't start doing after a while I'm going to prod him. i guess mattchew is on that already.

what do you think of prplhz? super sheepy but i dont know why everyone thinks hes scum

Hide nested quote -
Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
Right now, I think Palmar is town, but I'm going to wait for the day to come and see how he posts then. If he actually scum-hunts, he's town. If he sits around and doesn't act normal, and instead all meek, he's scum, simple as that. One of Palmar's greatest strengths, is that he easily establishes himself as town in the games he's in, but it also works against him when he's scum, because he's incapable of doing the same thing, and it shows. He might try to change his meta, though, like he did in L, but even then, I didn't read him as scum, just as something being off in his play, which ended up being him playing like scum on purpose to prove a point, or something like that. He's pretty easy to read, and barely a threat as scum, so I'm not that worried, except for people sheeping him like crazy. If he's scum, and no one calls him out on it, people will sheep him for a couple of lynches off reputation, and it might cost us the game.

Original Message From EchelonTee:
eh it reminds me of TL Mafia L where all the big names have the fun roles/are Mafia, and the newbies are lurking/don't have a clue what's going on. ur play currently reminds me of how you were in there; obviously I don't know your alignment and vice versa, but you're not crazy like some of the people in there, so let's talk if you want to bounce any thoughts.

this palmar development is either the best thing that's ever happened, or most terrible. everyone sheeping to him is lol but if he's town, i guess god decided to have mercy.

Original Message From Mr. Wiggles:
Yeah, I dunno what's up with that. It doesn't really make sense everyone's in PM land, though, when everyone can only contact 2 people themselves, and some players don't like PMs. Maybe Ver/Incog's games are just cursed, look at Responsibility

What do you think of the game, so far?

Original Message From EchelonTee:
hey, picking you for PM. is everyone floating in pm land or something, because otherwise this game looks and feels like a ghost town =/

Twas inactivity and complacency, that killed the town. Also of note, is after people revealed PMs, no one continued to PM. I wasn't getting anything useful out of layabout or EchelonTee and was using them to dump thoughts, so I didn't care that much, but I don't know why you would stop as town. I also sent a PM to layabout asking why he didn't vote Kurumi and he never answered. The rest of my PMs are me talking at Layabout/ET