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On January 17 2012 07:42 Protactinium wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2012 07:24 Toadesstern wrote:On January 17 2012 07:10 Protactinium wrote:
Lets stop discussing Sandroba/BC being mafia for now. There are bigger fish to fry (all the apathetic people).
That's something I've got problems with. Why to you want to lynch into apathetic people at all. Those people are the kind of people you lynch when you've got nothing going on and need to get at least something going. Just let our vigis shoot into lurkers and deal with them once we run out of obvious targets like sandroba. That's what our vigis are good for after all. Apathy is not inactivity. Apathy does not mean that a player is unreadable. On the contrary, look at how this game has unfolded as a whole. Day 1 is full of chaos. The thread explodes to 75 pages, and hardly anyone is looking for mafia. You have some hardline players like WBG and company who want to throw Palmar off a cliff, and a bunch of useless mason discussion. The mafia have no reason to be actively at the front of the stage because it inherently carries risk. The town is already in a natural state of chaos anyway. Thus, the mafia are the ones who are going to be slacking off. A sandroba lynch is absolutely ridiculous and the amount of support it is getting is shockingly disturbing. Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 04:26 sandroba wrote:
1) Proactinum post is the best one so far. Fuck yes I like it. Cyriandor is my top candidate for lynch if I get elected.
Show nested quote +On January 14 2012 16:34 sandroba wrote:On January 14 2012 16:31 bumatlarge wrote:On January 14 2012 16:26 sandroba wrote:
Alright people I want to get elected and no one is fucking voting for me. What do you want me to do so you would fucking vote? Tell me and I'll do it. I have plenty of time right now and I can post random useless shit if that's what get's you voting. Why ciryandor? I think I talked about this already. He's ugly and smells bad. Also protact's case was the best thing to land on this thread so far. Also I might lynch a bg instead. Who knows. No mafia digs up a case on a fellow mafia when it is dead and buried. Lets look at one of your posts about sandroba: Show nested quote +On January 16 2012 08:20 Toadesstern wrote:On January 16 2012 06:22 wherebugsgo wrote:
@ Toadesstern:
Please explain why you find bumatlarge to be scummy.
Also, summarize your thoughts on Protactinium and sandroba while you're at it. I want to know things from you.
as promised (sry took longer because I completly forgot it  ) about sandroba:I don't like the fact that BC lynched Palmar at all. Sandroba was the guy who made BC lynch Palmar instead of whoever he wanted to lynch first. I asked BC and Sandroba to show me their pm logs, neither one did it and I don't like the coincidence of bc masoning sandroba although I have to agree that that one point probably is circular reasoning because I think it's something that makes bc scummy Sandroba's budding with Palmar (without a reason) and with BC (without giving an explanation). Also he voted BC. If you now look at what I posted about bum and BC you realize that there's a lot of mentioning each other within this circle of BC-Bum-Sandroba. I've got the feeling sandroba is trying to trick me/ us his picks and his style obviously is not helping at all. My highest priority to lynch right now would be sandroba, followed by bum. I won't support a bc lynch although I think he's leaning scum for me right now because I'm not sure about my judgement of bc yet. I'd say he's got a 30-50% of flipping red instead of true 10 out of 50. Explain how you know Sandroba made BC lynch Palmar, when he never said such a thing.
]Did it ever occur to you that the chaos was mafia made and not town made? And did you also ask yourself who was pushing the discussion? BC and sandro. The masoning buddies. So you're right it, the day was horrible. No one seemed scum, everyone was discussion. Nice place for scum to be in. Don't be fooled that it was town play which got us that.
To who suggested the lynch: This is the log of the last minutes before BC decided to lynch Palmar, decide yourself.
[/spoiler]
[14/01/2012 3:51:45 PM] Sandro Maculan: you are lynching protact 100%?
[14/01/2012 3:52:13 PM] james: not 100% no
[14/01/2012 3:53:12 PM] james: i have foolishness, palmar, protact, brownbear and wiggles
[14/01/2012 3:53:16 PM] james: on a list of possible red vets
[14/01/2012 3:53:21 PM] Sandro Maculan: lol
[14/01/2012 3:53:28 PM] Sandro Maculan: i want to lynch none of those
[14/01/2012 3:53:35 PM] james: most wont
[14/01/2012 3:53:41 PM] james: brownbear hasn't posted that I remember
[14/01/2012 3:53:47 PM] james: if i had to choose former mayor candidates
[14/01/2012 3:53:50 PM] james: is shoot slardar
[14/01/2012 3:53:51 PM] Sandro Maculan: bb might even get mkéd
[14/01/2012 3:53:53 PM] james: but hes so obviously not red
[14/01/2012 3:54:12 PM] james: so many vets have done
[14/01/2012 3:54:13 PM] Sandro Maculan: tbh i don't even remember reading his posts
[14/01/2012 3:54:15 PM] james: dick fuck all
[14/01/2012 4:01:44 PM] Sandro Maculan: man I'll compromise don't lynch fool or incog then you get my vote
[14/01/2012 4:04:25 PM] james: fine, ill agree to that
[14/01/2012 4:05:49 PM] Sandro Maculan: k gotta roll
[14/01/2012 4:05:54 PM] Sandro Maculan: I'd totally support palmar
[14/01/2012 4:06:00 PM] Sandro Maculan: fuck him he is scum
[14/01/2012 4:07:01 PM] james: lol
[14/01/2012 4:17:56 PM] james: off to work be back later
[12:05:56 AM] Sandro Maculan: i'm back
[12:06:01 AM] Sandro Maculan: who got lynched
[12:11:43 AM] james: palmar flipped miller
[/spoiler]
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On January 17 2012 08:37 Liquid`Sheth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2012 08:25 rgTheSchworz wrote:On January 17 2012 08:20 Liquid`Sheth wrote:On January 17 2012 08:18 rgTheSchworz wrote:@Sheth, do not think I am uninformed or dumb in any way. I play IRL mafia if that helps and some friends have gotten me into forum mafia. (The only way Schworz would know he is bussing someone is if he was mafia too).
Feel free to speculate on my supposed stupidity.Logically before playing i have read some Mafiawiki. I know what the term means.Macpo is a clear case for reasons i have mentioned.I won't switch to someone else unless people fail to vote. ##Vote: Macpo Everyone makes mistakes, I wasn't calling you dumb. I in fact state I've made the same mistake. It is speculation, so we'll see. Did you accidentally type bussing then btw? I notice you never really deny it in your post. Learn to read. No, not at all accidental, i find it more helpful to use an agreed-upon term than a whole sentence to describe the same thing. I read that you know what the term means. I believe you've always known what the term means. I asked if you didn't mean to say that and you havn't responded to that in two posts. Its a small thing, but a definite thing. I agree that it is easy to use an agreed-upon term to describe things. Again here your saying that you believe he was bussing. You're really not convincing me you didn't scum slip. However for the sake of kieeping today about the small amount of lynch targets, lets get back on GGQ / Macpo. I'll look through Schwortz filter a bit more closesly later on. I'm sure it will be very interesting from what I remember of his posting 
Also, please look into Chaos. We'll hopefully have a double lynch coming up VOTE NOW and take of things.
In other news: I decided to reconsider the last pages and therefore ##unvote.
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On January 17 2012 08:45 Liquid`Sheth wrote:
Despite me going after Opz a bit here, today I still want us to lynch Macpo for all of the reasons before stated.
aren't you afraid that he actually IS a newbie town player? I mean stressing to be newb may be a newb mistake afterall.
Don't get me wrong, I'd lynch him, but IMO he might flip town.
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On January 17 2012 08:53 Liquid`Sheth wrote:
I'm not afraid of it, but there is a chance he is. I feel that from how he has changed his style so much and from the way he has posted he is very likely a newbie mafia though. And just because someone "might" flip town is never a reason not to lynch him. (I realize you say you'd lynch him).
I see what you're saying.
The difference is that if we mislynch a newb, we actually wasted a lynch. No information at all. No one really seems to support him, some guys call him out for being a newb. Some say "aaaw he's a cute noob, I wanna keep him!".
If we'd lynch someone more controversial a mislynch might at least give us information.
Another option would be a GGQ lynch which would propably correlate with a Chaos lynch. Basically, buy one get one free. IMO.
mac has no such benefits.
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On January 17 2012 08:55 Lanaia wrote:
Jay, I had some questions for you a while ago and I'm not sure you answered them. Looked in your filter, didn't see it.
You asked if I consider both BC and sandro a scum and I answered at some point. If they're both scum, the log would be fake. And a very well one. I don't think that this effort would be worth it. I might be wrong though.
Was there anything else?
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On January 17 2012 09:00 wherebugsgo wrote:Writing. Stumbled across this: Show nested quote +On January 17 2012 08:48 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 17 2012 08:45 Liquid`Sheth wrote:
Despite me going after Opz a bit here, today I still want us to lynch Macpo for all of the reasons before stated. aren't you afraid that he actually IS a newbie town player? I mean stressing to be newb may be a newb mistake afterall. Don't get me wrong, I'd lynch him, but IMO he might flip town. what is that supposed to mean? You would lynch him, but he might flip town? Are you saying you would lynch him despite the fact that there's a non-negligible chance he might flip town? AKA you're willing to lynch someone who you are not confident about? Either that, or you're just stating the obvious.
see post in response to sheth
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Would it even been possible to lower the KPs? I mean 3 goons had to be blocked and kills resolve at the same time, dont they?
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Where did VE claim a hit?
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Votes for Macpo (15)
Protactinium
Foolishness
Bill Murray
Scamp
Jitsu
Meapak_Ziphh
evantrees
Lanaia
bumatlarge
rgTheSchworz
Adam4167
Cyber_Cheese
Toadesstern
glurio
rtgICEMAN
Votes for sandroba (2)
hiro protagonist
Kenpachi
Votes for GGQ (1)
sandroba
Votes for Protactinium (3)
Nisani201
risk.nuke
~OpZ~
Votes for Bill Murray (1)
wherebugsgo
Votes for Kenpachi (1)
BrownBear
Votes for Jackal58 (2)
bumatlarge
BloodyC0bbler
Votes for L (2)
kitaman27
kingjames01
Hey good, we’re finally agreeing on something.
Is it though?
There has never been so much agreement in a mafia game ever. It is the best bandwagon ever. And so convenient. He made some newbie posts and everybody is pointing at him. Mafia is just leaning back and letting us lynch the noob. There is no interference whatsoever. Either mafia has chosen to let him just die or he’s freaking newb townie! This will simply be mislynch.
Even worse, we’ll get ZERO information from a possible mislynch. Nada. “Hey everybody was agreeing. Yay. Let’s lynch him”. We’ll be as smart as we were before.
I realize that, I won’t get my BC vote…and not even sandrobar. But if we take a “lesser” player, let’s pick GGQ or chaos. If we mislynch here, we get information regarding sandros and chaos alignment.
Wake the fuck up, tow!
##Vote: GGQ
For now….if there is someone else gathering more votes, I’ll reconsider, because I think that mac is the wrong choice. No gain, mislynch and no information at all.
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On January 17 2012 20:46 Bill Murray wrote:
I could easily have prevented Lanaia from using a scum ability
when I saw 3 KP, and L claimed Roleblocked, I thought it might have been the combination of the two
You do realize that 3 roles would have been needed to block a KP?
I choose to believe kita who is the only one claiming to be shot (someone said VE, but I think he misunderstood something).
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On January 18 2012 01:15 risk.nuke wrote:
##unvote: Protactinium
##vote: Bill Murray
why is that risky? what did convince you?
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On January 18 2012 01:31 Jitsu wrote:C_C, you said in you're post: Show nested quote +On January 17 2012 19:49 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Oh yeah, as scum I'd never had more fun in my life than that mislynch  poor guy But alright- ##Unvote##Vote Macpo I might have read it wrong. Can you elaborate?
They were discussing macpo and someone mentionted sephy from another game. that was the context. so yeah, you misread. go apologize
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fail on my part, sorry mr nuke
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On January 18 2012 01:44 risk.nuke wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 01:41 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 01:36 risk.nuke wrote:On January 18 2012 01:26 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 01:15 risk.nuke wrote:
##unvote: Protactinium
##vote: Bill Murray why is that risky? what did convince you? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=108#2141And please, call me nuke. risk is more similar to a clantag so it would be more correct and make it easier for me since people use the word "risk" quite alot in mafia. fail on my part, sorry mr nuke No harm done What do you think of Bill Murray?
I certainly think that at least one of the three mayor candidates is scum. The vote had so little interference. Furthermore, I think hydra is town.
=> BM and/or BC scum.
What I think of BC is common knowledge.
BMs latest action made no sense, you got a point there. The thing is, they make no sense from a scum perspective either. Even as a scum sheriff there's no reason to waste a jailtown without reason. He basically acted like a mad scientist and is probably gone insane or trolling. I don't know about scum though, because, like I said, those actions were neither town nor scum favoured.
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On January 18 2012 01:47 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 01:12 Jayjay54 wrote:Votes for Macpo (15)
Protactinium
Foolishness
Bill Murray
Scamp
Jitsu
Meapak_Ziphh
evantrees
Lanaia
bumatlarge
rgTheSchworz
Adam4167
Cyber_Cheese
Toadesstern
glurio
rtgICEMAN
Votes for sandroba (2)
hiro protagonist
Kenpachi
Votes for GGQ (1)
sandroba
Votes for Protactinium (3)
Nisani201
risk.nuke
~OpZ~
Votes for Bill Murray (1)
wherebugsgo
Votes for Kenpachi (1)
BrownBear
Votes for Jackal58 (2)
bumatlarge
BloodyC0bbler
Votes for L (2)
kitaman27
kingjames01
Hey good, we’re finally agreeing on something. Is it though? There has never been so much agreement in a mafia game ever. It is the best bandwagon ever. And so convenient. He made some newbie posts and everybody is pointing at him. Mafia is just leaning back and letting us lynch the noob. There is no interference whatsoever. Either mafia has chosen to let him just die or he’s freaking newb townie! This will simply be mislynch. Even worse, we’ll get ZERO information from a possible mislynch. Nada. “Hey everybody was agreeing. Yay. Let’s lynch him”. We’ll be as smart as we were before. I realize that, I won’t get my BC vote…and not even sandrobar. But if we take a “lesser” player, let’s pick GGQ or chaos. If we mislynch here, we get information regarding sandros and chaos alignment. Wake the fuck up, tow!
##Vote: GGQFor now….if there is someone else gathering more votes, I’ll reconsider, because I think that mac is the wrong choice. No gain, mislynch and no information at all. I have two problems with this. 1) Mafia could be bussing. 2) You pointing it out is a defence However, what you say could carry weight, and at any rate he hasn't posted since page 80 so he might be eligible for a modkill today, and that really would be a waste of a lynch. If people are up for Chaosquo lynch, I will swap back. I'd rather give GGQ longer and hope he comes back, or vig him.
1) yup that's possible. How sure are you though that macpo is scum and not newb? His play has been basically how to not play mafia. If you take newb out of the equation, his case is not stronger than GGQ or chaos.
2) So you're saying I am scum and try to get him out of there? Macpo is the one and only player so far who made a (very clumsy) case against me...if that's not enough, look at my filter and judge me based on my actions.
I'd be up for Chaos. If he flips red, chances are high that GGQ is scum too, since he both softdefended GGQ and cyri. We'd get a lot more benefit from his lynch than from macpo.
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On January 18 2012 02:01 jaj22 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 01:50 Jayjay54 wrote:
BMs latest action made no sense, you got a point there. The thing is, they make no sense from a scum perspective either. Even as a scum sheriff there's no reason to waste a jailtown without reason. He basically acted like a mad scientist and is probably gone insane or trolling. I don't know about scum though, because, like I said, those actions were neither town nor scum favoured. What would you expect a scum sheriff to do? No point keeping the jailings for an open roleclaim because you'd just get lynched for it, so the obvious choice is to go blue-hunting. The nightkills certainly look like blue hunting to me, so it fits.
Hmm. valid point. He also made his own setup by putting her on his scum list with little reason (I think he claimed meta or so).
also his weird, "I think I saved her".
In conclusion, town fucked up big time voting
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On January 18 2012 02:03 risk.nuke wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 01:50 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 01:44 risk.nuke wrote:On January 18 2012 01:41 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 01:36 risk.nuke wrote:On January 18 2012 01:26 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 01:15 risk.nuke wrote:
##unvote: Protactinium
##vote: Bill Murray why is that risky? what did convince you? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716¤tpage=108#2141And please, call me nuke. risk is more similar to a clantag so it would be more correct and make it easier for me since people use the word "risk" quite alot in mafia. fail on my part, sorry mr nuke No harm done What do you think of Bill Murray? I certainly think that at least one of the three mayor candidates is scum. The vote had so little interference. Furthermore, I think hydra is town. => BM and/or BC scum. What I think of BC is common knowledge. BMs latest action made no sense, you got a point there. The thing is, they make no sense from a scum perspective either. Even as a scum sheriff there's no reason to waste a jailtown without reason. He basically acted like a mad scientist and is probably gone insane or trolling. I don't know about scum though, because, like I said, those actions were neither town nor scum favoured. Wrong. while you could argue whether his motive makes sense for scum or town, they were in the end were scum favored. If he were scum: Using the power on a townie hoping to block a possible heal/check but also wasting one use which means we can not use it in a later situation. Possibly in a town controlled way. Say when we get confirmed townies we want to protect. If he were Town: Why would he use it on lanaia after arguing she is scum. Blocking potential dt checks or vig hits for the slim chance of actually preventing a mafia move. Consider it's probably just roleblocker and framer who would suffer from it. Godfather Goon and Mason nothing happens. And the jack is limited use anyway.
yea. Already posted above. Might support a lynch. Will think about it a little more.
Fact: A sheriff using his jailtimes that weird is not an effective role either way.
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On January 18 2012 02:20 jaj22 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 02:04 Jayjay54 wrote:In conclusion, town fucked up big time voting Given the low vote count on the three main candidates (32 votes, 10 scum), it looks implausible that a mafia didn't get elected unless they really weren't trying. It's quite possible that mafia even spread their votes between (scum) BM and (town) BC on the basis that BC was going to lynch Protactinium or Palmar.
yup that's how I feel. except that I don't think BC is town. BC/BM scum is possible and quite horrible as well.
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On January 18 2012 02:26 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 02:20 jaj22 wrote:On January 18 2012 02:04 Jayjay54 wrote:In conclusion, town fucked up big time voting Given the low vote count on the three main candidates (32 votes, 10 scum), it looks implausible that a mafia didn't get elected unless they really weren't trying. It's quite possible that mafia even spread their votes between (scum) BM and (town) BC on the basis that BC was going to lynch Protactinium or Palmar. I'm going to say if sandroba really flips green (which I don't believe will happen) we fucked up big time because we've got 2 mafias in office. If sandroba is red I'm willing to believe BM is green and BC is red.If sandroba is green I'm willing to believe BM is red. But that's not telling us shit about BC at all. Could be mafia or green,
so you actually consider the logs to be faked? that's a metric fuck ton of work, you don't just "chat", you actually have to put a lot of effort in faking it that well.
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On January 18 2012 02:36 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2012 02:30 Jayjay54 wrote:On January 18 2012 02:26 Toadesstern wrote:On January 18 2012 02:20 jaj22 wrote:On January 18 2012 02:04 Jayjay54 wrote:In conclusion, town fucked up big time voting Given the low vote count on the three main candidates (32 votes, 10 scum), it looks implausible that a mafia didn't get elected unless they really weren't trying. It's quite possible that mafia even spread their votes between (scum) BM and (town) BC on the basis that BC was going to lynch Protactinium or Palmar. I'm going to say if sandroba really flips green (which I don't believe will happen) we fucked up big time because we've got 2 mafias in office. If sandroba is red I'm willing to believe BM is green and BC is red.If sandroba is green I'm willing to believe BM is red. But that's not telling us shit about BC at all. Could be mafia or green, so you actually consider the logs to be faked? that's a metric fuck ton of work, you don't just "chat", you actually have to put a lot of effort in faking it that well. kind of. I don' think they're faked but the timestamp might be. Remember I asked him early on to show his logs and he refused to do so and only posted them once the night started. But yeah you're right that's pretty unlikely
To me, the other extreme BC and sandro being green is bullshit as well, because all those plays were not really townfavoured to be developed by two townies => one of them is scum.
BM is a different story. Jitsu masoned with him. Jitsu? You in here? what's your take on BM after talking to him for like 30 hours.
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EPT
