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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 1875

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18820 Posts
November 04 2019 19:01 GMT
#37481
On November 05 2019 03:33 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 05 2019 03:13 farvacola wrote:
On November 05 2019 02:40 Mohdoo wrote:
Trump's taxes seem poised for the supreme court. Should be interesting. I wonder if they'll even consider it.

I’d guess they refuse to hear the appeal, which affirms the lower court’s decisions.


So you don't think this is the sort of thing Kav could be the deciding saving vote for Trump? You'd expect most conservatives on the court to reject this?

The state tax document request is a state police powers and self governance issue, which is a legal framework in which Trump’s, shall we say, exotic theories of absolute federal executive immunity hold very little water. Those theories, while still wholly unsupported by basically every piece of common law that has touched on the powers of the executive, are more tenable when matched up with other federal investigations, like those conducted by Congress.

I would guess the likes of Kavanaugh would rather take up the federal v federal case. But that all said, it’s hard to say one way or the other, this is major uncharted waters stuff.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15465 Posts
November 04 2019 20:26 GMT
#37482
On November 05 2019 04:01 farvacola wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 05 2019 03:33 Mohdoo wrote:
On November 05 2019 03:13 farvacola wrote:
On November 05 2019 02:40 Mohdoo wrote:
Trump's taxes seem poised for the supreme court. Should be interesting. I wonder if they'll even consider it.

I’d guess they refuse to hear the appeal, which affirms the lower court’s decisions.


So you don't think this is the sort of thing Kav could be the deciding saving vote for Trump? You'd expect most conservatives on the court to reject this?

The state tax document request is a state police powers and self governance issue, which is a legal framework in which Trump’s, shall we say, exotic theories of absolute federal executive immunity hold very little water. Those theories, while still wholly unsupported by basically every piece of common law that has touched on the powers of the executive, are more tenable when matched up with other federal investigations, like those conducted by Congress.

I would guess the likes of Kavanaugh would rather take up the federal v federal case. But that all said, it’s hard to say one way or the other, this is major uncharted waters stuff.


Sounds like I still have plenty of reason to keep my eyes squinted. I guess we'll see....how long until we hear what the supreme court thinks about taking the topic up for discussion or not?
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18820 Posts
November 04 2019 20:40 GMT
#37483
Probably sometime this week
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States22983 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-04 20:49:32
November 04 2019 20:48 GMT
#37484
I get the feeling the SC is going to just defer to voters like Congress will when it comes to any vague sense of accountability for Trump or his administration.

They all may go through some of the motions, but the calculation seems to be that Trump refusing to acknowledge an official action removing him is more dangerous (to the mythos of the US political system anyway) than leaving it up to voters to remove him.

As to the taxes thing I'd expect Trump to just refuse and fight in court until or unless they start arresting people for failing to comply.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15465 Posts
November 04 2019 22:52 GMT
#37485
Welcome back from exile GH
iamthedave
Profile Joined February 2011
England2814 Posts
November 05 2019 00:43 GMT
#37486
On November 05 2019 07:52 Mohdoo wrote:
Welcome back from exile GH


He was exiled?
I'm not bad at Starcraft; I just think winning's rude.
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9132 Posts
November 05 2019 00:54 GMT
#37487
Temp banned?
You're now breathing manually
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15465 Posts
November 05 2019 16:09 GMT
#37488
On November 05 2019 09:54 Sent. wrote:
Temp banned?

yeah
redlightdistrict
Profile Joined October 2018
382 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-05 17:27:13
November 05 2019 17:21 GMT
#37489
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz and Prince Andrew to suppress the story for years.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands21505 Posts
November 05 2019 17:25 GMT
#37490
On November 06 2019 02:21 redlightdistrict wrote:
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz to suppress the story for years.
Anything posted by Project Veritas is automatically useless and most likely fake.
Their stuff has been proven set up, fake and cut out of context so often that if they report the sky is blue I would question it and look out the window to be sure its not purple right now.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15465 Posts
November 05 2019 17:26 GMT
#37491
On November 06 2019 02:21 redlightdistrict wrote:
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz, Prince Andrew, and Epstien to suppress the story for years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lfwkTsJGYA&feature=youtu.be


No one is going to discuss anything made by project veritas. They are verifiably dog shit and we've been through this before. It is as fake news as fake news can be. It is actually fake.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42249 Posts
November 05 2019 18:09 GMT
#37492
On November 06 2019 02:26 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 06 2019 02:21 redlightdistrict wrote:
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz, Prince Andrew, and Epstien to suppress the story for years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lfwkTsJGYA&feature=youtu.be


No one is going to discuss anything made by project veritas. They are verifiably dog shit and we've been through this before. It is as fake news as fake news can be. It is actually fake.

I recall when a guy went to Planned Parenthood pretending to be a pimp and the employee there told him that PP could absolutely provide services to his hoes and that he should bring them in immediately. She then called the police the moment he left and reported the incident so they could arrest the pimp and help his hoes. Project Veritas went with the PP sex trafficking angle.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Lmui
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada6210 Posts
November 05 2019 20:25 GMT
#37493
Well the Sondland (ambassador to eu) and volker (ukraine negotiator) testimony is now fully available.


https://docs.house.gov/meetings/IG/IG00/CPRT-116-IG00-D005.pdf

Sondland walked back essentially everything, and is now saying there is a proquidpro with Ukraine. Theres also some stuff implicating both pence and Rick Perry in this as well.
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
November 05 2019 23:44 GMT
#37494
On November 06 2019 05:25 Lmui wrote:
Well the Sondland (ambassador to eu) and volker (ukraine negotiator) testimony is now fully available.


https://docs.house.gov/meetings/IG/IG00/CPRT-116-IG00-D005.pdf

Sondland walked back essentially everything, and is now saying there is a proquidpro with Ukraine. Theres also some stuff implicating both pence and Rick Perry in this as well.

The solution for GOP is now to just not read it. I guess it makes it easier on the conscience when defending Trump ad infinitum. I think some of them did the same with the Mueller report.



Neosteel Enthusiast
Ben...
Profile Joined January 2011
Canada3485 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-06 00:14:42
November 06 2019 00:14 GMT
#37495
I guess that quote kinda begs the question of what the hell has been going on with Lindsey Graham the last year or two? His behaviour with this impeachment stuff in particular has been outright bizarre. Important context for that tweet above is that Graham was previously demanding that the transcripts for Sondland and Volker be released since he believed not doing so was a sign that the hearing was rigged and wasn't transparent. Now that this testimony has been released he and several other high profile Republicans have essentially claimed that the hearing is rigged anyway and said that reading the testimony was pointless. It's abundantly clear that the Republicans are acting in extreme bad faith at this point. Nothing the Democrats running the inquiry will do will ever placate these people, and in acting as they are, these Republicans are giving an out to Fox News and other conservative outlets to report on what these people are doing rather than being forced to report on the increasingly damning content of these testimonies.

The reason Graham in particular sticks out is because his behaviour has done a complete 180 degree spin from 2 years ago. He used to be one of the few vocal Republican critics of Trump and would commonly voice his disagreements. Suddenly within a short period of time he became one of Trump's biggest supporters, and will lie as needed to keep consistent with Trump's narrative. It's become a meme at this point for Graham to say one thing, then people to immediately find a clip of him in the past saying the precise opposite. It's clear that he has abandoned any principles he previously had.

Something else to point out with regard to these testimonies being released is that behind closed doors it's quite obvious the Republicans act quite differently. Yes, it is typically each member's staff asking questions, but outside of a few specific circumstances, the Republicans tend to simply be following along with the hearing and asking their questions. The ridiculous Gowdy-like theatrics we see in the public hearings don't tend to be happening nearly as much. This definitely lends credence to the idea that they are acting as they are in public purely to distract from acts done by Trump that are looking increasingly indefensible.
"Cliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide" -Tastosis
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-06 00:30:09
November 06 2019 00:29 GMT
#37496
I think the most likely thing is that McCain was something of a moral compass for Graham. That and the fact that Graham has always backed down from actually doing anything, ever, despite his talk; the talk is just less common since he doesn't have anyone he feels like he needs to be honest to.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15465 Posts
November 06 2019 00:59 GMT
#37497
Lindsay Graham saying he won't even read testimony is a really weird turn. This is him saying he doesn't care. Man, what a sad state. This is way beyond partisanship

Other stuff has made me frustrated, but this is sad more than anything. Refusing to read something is a huge escalation. Oy.
Xxio
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada5565 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-06 03:26:01
November 06 2019 01:38 GMT
#37498
On November 06 2019 02:21 redlightdistrict wrote:
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz and Prince Andrew to suppress the story for years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lfwkTsJGYA&feature=youtu.be

I don't remember the host saying they were pressured by Prince Andrew and Dershowitz, but rather that network seniors thought airing negative material about Prince Andrew would compromise their coverage of the royal family, particularly of Kate and Will.

Edit: she did say the "Palace" threatened them in "a million different ways."
KTY
Introvert
Profile Joined April 2011
United States4682 Posts
November 06 2019 01:41 GMT
#37499
On November 06 2019 09:14 Ben... wrote:
I guess that quote kinda begs the question of what the hell has been going on with Lindsey Graham the last year or two? His behaviour with this impeachment stuff in particular has been outright bizarre. Important context for that tweet above is that Graham was previously demanding that the transcripts for Sondland and Volker be released since he believed not doing so was a sign that the hearing was rigged and wasn't transparent. Now that this testimony has been released he and several other high profile Republicans have essentially claimed that the hearing is rigged anyway and said that reading the testimony was pointless. It's abundantly clear that the Republicans are acting in extreme bad faith at this point. Nothing the Democrats running the inquiry will do will ever placate these people, and in acting as they are, these Republicans are giving an out to Fox News and other conservative outlets to report on what these people are doing rather than being forced to report on the increasingly damning content of these testimonies.

The reason Graham in particular sticks out is because his behaviour has done a complete 180 degree spin from 2 years ago. He used to be one of the few vocal Republican critics of Trump and would commonly voice his disagreements. Suddenly within a short period of time he became one of Trump's biggest supporters, and will lie as needed to keep consistent with Trump's narrative. It's become a meme at this point for Graham to say one thing, then people to immediately find a clip of him in the past saying the precise opposite. It's clear that he has abandoned any principles he previously had.

Something else to point out with regard to these testimonies being released is that behind closed doors it's quite obvious the Republicans act quite differently. Yes, it is typically each member's staff asking questions, but outside of a few specific circumstances, the Republicans tend to simply be following along with the hearing and asking their questions. The ridiculous Gowdy-like theatrics we see in the public hearings don't tend to be happening nearly as much. This definitely lends credence to the idea that they are acting as they are in public purely to distract from acts done by Trump that are looking increasingly indefensible.


Both parties do this, closed-door hearings are always more well-behaved by everyone.

It's not a sign of anything.
"It is therefore only at the birth of a society that one can be completely logical in the laws. When you see a people enjoying this advantage, do not hasten to conclude that it is wise; think rather that it is young." -Alexis de Tocqueville
Inrau
Profile Joined June 2019
35 Posts
November 06 2019 01:48 GMT
#37500
On November 06 2019 02:26 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 06 2019 02:21 redlightdistrict wrote:
Well now that the Epstien thing is coming back to life, ABC news is talking about how they were pressured by Alan Dersiowtz, Prince Andrew, and Epstien to suppress the story for years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lfwkTsJGYA&feature=youtu.be


No one is going to discuss anything made by project veritas. They are verifiably dog shit and we've been through this before. It is as fake news as fake news can be. It is actually fake.

The video itself is quite damning, despite the edits and authors politcal bias. ABC even responded to the claim in a dodgy way. Their abortion crap, was indeed crap, but this ... to my knowledge has some alarm bells.
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