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On April 10 2013 16:18 fight_or_flight wrote:
Good points made above. I won't pretend to know the history of the region in detail because I don't.
However, I do see the country not being treated equally as other countries. It's fine if we get sanctions against them because they are developing ballistic missiles, but to do so when they aren't is simply not treating them fairly.
We say "don't do that" when what they are doing is within their rights, then we don't even talk to them because "they're evil".
Then we put 60,000 troops across their border and do these war games for months off their coast until finally they make threats.
How about we actually wait until they do something threatening?
How many countries has north korea invaded in the last 50 years?
How many countries has iran invaded in the last 50 years?
How many countries has libya invaded in the last 50 years?
Maybe we should wait until, I don't know, one of these countries rolls tanks across their border before invading them? I'm just getting tired of all this....sorry.
Countries that routinely advocate the destruction and subjugation of another country by military means, that openly advocates using nuclear weapons in pre-emptive attacks, which regularly shoots anyone attempting to leave the country, ignores the needs of its own people to build up a military force to repel an attack that will never come unless they act first, refuses to change its behavior in light of multiple United Nations sanctions, and that is ruled by dictatorships of, let us say, less than stable mental faculties, and whose stated goal is to develop a method of launching intercontinental ballistic missiles... generally are not treated equally.
Also, please check the history. Really, really read the history. Those 60,000 troops are commonly known, even amongst themselves, as "speed bumps" if North Korea decides to invade.
Hell, read a North Korean newspaper. They are not innocents being provoked, they are continuing and escalating behavior that they started in 1950. The North invaded the South. Recent events are not the result of a bubble. They are not the actions of some great conspiracy of United States foreign policy. (Unless you believe the current president is continuing a plan that would have to have been hatched by Truman.)
Also, please note - Libya invaded Egypt in 1977. Iran "invaded" Iraq in the course of the Iran-Iraq war. The only reason North Korea hasn't invaded (again) yet is because the leadership of China and North Korea realizes it would end badly for all concerned. China still believes it would be a bad move. Not sure about Kim Jong Un.
How about we not wait until someone decides to cause drastic loss of civilian lives? (I mean, appeasement worked great before, right?)
On April 10 2013 16:45 fight_or_flight wrote:+ Show Spoiler +"Tell Obama to call me"Maybe we should talk to them instead of sanctioning them for putting up a peaceful satellite.
How about we have been trying to talk to them for the past 30 years and they have steadily ignored, refused, or outright said no? If you believe that their aim is to put up a peaceful satellite (on a rocket that can barely get it into an unstable orbit) I have some land I think you might be interested in.
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+ Show Spoiler +On April 10 2013 16:45 fight_or_flight wrote:![[image loading]](https://image.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/3/1/1362133411120/Kim-Jong-un-and-Dennis-Ro-010.jpg) "Tell Obama to call me"Maybe we should talk to them instead of sanctioning them for putting up a peaceful satellite.
For a long long long time the U.S and Korea have been giving in to the threats of war by North Korea and compensating them with money, food, aid etc... for the promises to not start war on the peninsula.
Now they are threatening 'a rain of fire' and 'thermonuclear war' and he wants to talk to Obama, of course he wants to get direct negotiations, that means their threats worked and they forced other countries to back down.
It clearly does not solve anything in the long run, history has told us this many many times.
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Going to Korea for a holiday next month, many people are telling me to cancel the trip but IMO NK have been threatening this and that for too long now without anything substantial.
Advice?
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On April 10 2013 21:11 Shortizz wrote:
Going to Korea for a holiday next month, many people are telling me to cancel the trip but IMO NK have been threatening this and that for too long now without anything substantial.
Advice?
Pretty sure you can cancel your trip even day before your flight if shit hits the fan. Don't cancel and enjoy your vacation. If people already in Korea aren't that worried, neither should you. If something would happen, i'm sure it would happen this month.
I just read an interesting interview of a N-Korean defector who was telling how many of the army soldiers does mostly farming work. In May, it's planting time in the fields. So without that, there wouldn't be much food for the Army. Wish i knew English source for this.
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On April 10 2013 21:11 Shortizz wrote:
Going to Korea for a holiday next month, many people are telling me to cancel the trip but IMO NK have been threatening this and that for too long now without anything substantial.
Advice?
No reason to cancel, the people who tell you to do so do not understand what is going on.
I understand the reasoning behind not wanting to fly into a country seemingly 'on the brink of war' but nothing will happen and your trip will go ahead without a hitch.
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A resource poor country going into war today generally has to increase oil import several months ahead of time. No change in NK's oil import, I heard. So, I seriously doubt they would actually go into war. All they do would be to launch some missiles (Scud, Nodong and Musudan) into international waters, and possibly 4th nuclear test at most.
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On April 10 2013 16:46 felisconcolori wrote:Show nested quote +On April 10 2013 16:18 fight_or_flight wrote:
Good points made above. I won't pretend to know the history of the region in detail because I don't.
However, I do see the country not being treated equally as other countries. It's fine if we get sanctions against them because they are developing ballistic missiles, but to do so when they aren't is simply not treating them fairly.
We say "don't do that" when what they are doing is within their rights, then we don't even talk to them because "they're evil".
Then we put 60,000 troops across their border and do these war games for months off their coast until finally they make threats.
How about we actually wait until they do something threatening?
How many countries has north korea invaded in the last 50 years?
How many countries has iran invaded in the last 50 years?
How many countries has libya invaded in the last 50 years?
Maybe we should wait until, I don't know, one of these countries rolls tanks across their border before invading them? I'm just getting tired of all this....sorry. Also, please note - Libya invaded Egypt in 1977. Iran "invaded" Iraq in the course of the Iran-Iraq war. The only reason North Korea hasn't invaded (again) yet is because the leadership of China and North Korea realizes it would end badly for all concerned. China still believes it would be a bad move. Not sure about Kim Jong Un.
Iraq invaded Iran.....
And the Libya-Egypt conflict was a short border war not an invasion.
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Well, they still got 2 more hours on their April 10th deadline.
I just read an interesting interview of a N-Korean defector who was telling how many of the army soldiers does mostly farming work. In May, it's planting time in the fields. So without that, there wouldn't be much food for the Army. Wish i knew English source for this.
Well, that kind of depends. You won't eat anything that you plant in May for a few months. Which would be kind of irrelevant to whoever makes that decision in NK. Because they plan on either winning the war and getting food from there, or losing the war in which cases the whole thing becomes someone elses problem. So far they don't appear to have a large problem with letting people starve, either.
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On April 10 2013 21:50 Simberto wrote:
Well, they still got 2 more hours on their April 10th deadline.
"South Korean intelligence says that North Korea's mid-range Musudan type missile is fuelled and ready for launch 'anytime now'."
Countdown? 
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just read the so called armed farmers are put back to work in farmland according to some chinese sites
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On April 10 2013 22:12 ETisME wrote:
just read the so called armed farmers are put back to work in farmland according to some chinese sites
This reminds me of workers in WarCraft 3 where they are armed farmers too. ^^
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I don't know if this has been brought up already, but thinking about it makes it seem a problem SK have to take hold of.
If US and SK would be to invade NK, free them of their dictatorship, and open NK up for the public and vice versa SK would be in quite deep ****. Thinking about all these "lost" North Koreans who have been living under all these terrible conditions and lies would, most likely, not go well into "western" culture, it would take decades for them to adapt into our culture, rules and conditions. (This is only my opinion / guesses). I believe the best for SK, US and rest of the world would let North Korea be North Korea (Bygones be Bygones). This is not humanitarian, but probably the cheapest and easiest way to do it. So if this calms down, and the North Korean dictatorship continue it would probably go in SK and US's favor.
But I feel these threats are just baloney, and I highly doubt NK will be doing anything stupid, they know it's suicide.
#Edit
This would just be a short term plan, North Korea can't be like this forever, and I think things will quickly change.
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How many hours left till it's next day in Korea now?
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On April 10 2013 23:49 Arnstein wrote:
How many hours left till it's next day in Korea now?
9 minutes.
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United States24807 Posts
So the deadline has come and nothing happened... you know what that means!
Go to 1:30
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On April 10 2013 21:11 Shortizz wrote:
Going to Korea for a holiday next month, many people are telling me to cancel the trip but IMO NK have been threatening this and that for too long now without anything substantial.
Advice?
Definitely don't cancel. NK has no balls. They've let me down again and again aaand again. At this point any news about NK I hear I instantly dismiss. They will never act. It's really quite sad.
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How is it sad that they do nothing? You would prefer that they nuke the shit out of SK and Japan?
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They didn't exactly say that anything would happen today, did they ? Afaik, they just said that they wouldn't be able to ensure safety blah blah blah starting today.
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I haven't been following the thread too closely but I would like to know what do the south koreans that post/posted here think about the Korea tensions? What do they think south koreans think in general in regards to the same subject?
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EPT
