|
It has finally come down to this, a moment where a war can possibly break out.
N-Korea - "North Korea on Friday and Saturday issued several statements that said it would lash out at South Korea if it again tested artillery on Yeonpyeong."
Source: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704138604576029240348016046.html?mod=WSJASIA_hpp_LEADNewsCollection&200937
However, regardless of what North Korea has to say about S-Korean's action they are giving it a go. Starting from 1:00pm KST (11:00am EST) about 2000 artillery fires will hit in the region just below the border that seperates the two neighbouring countries."
S-Korea - "We won't take into consideration North Korean threats and diplomatic situations before holding the live-fire drill. If weather permits, it will be held as scheduled," a spokesman for South Korea's joint chiefs of staff said.
![[image loading]](http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/5486/woad764nkoreans20101219.gif)
Note: South Korea's biggest concern is the current position of North Korea's artillery weapons which are pointing directly towards bigger cities of Korea.
![[image loading]](http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/7943/20101220005540.jpg)
240㎜ artillery missile: distance of up to 60km
Hope nothing goes bad, the worst thing that could go wrong is one of thoes artillery fires from
South Korea landing on North Korea. And this is a possibility considering the last incident where South Korean soldier accidently fired in a practice drill...
Update:
[12:00am EST-] - Artillery firing heard on South Korea's Yeonpyeong island
http://twitter.com/Reuters#
[12:30am EST] Dow Jones: South Korea Joint Chiefs Of Staff Say Artillery Drill Hasn't Started Yet
http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#
[12:33am EST] Artillery fire drill begins, expected to last 2 hours
Reporters on Yeonpyeong Island confirm outgoing #ROK shelling into Yellow Sea.
http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#
[12:58am EST] Fighter Jets Launched.
http://twitter.com/search?q=#ROK
[1:30am EST] "South Korea Finishes Artillery Test On Yeonpyeong Island"
http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#
[2:00am EST] Defense ministry won't confirm drill has ended. Artillery firing still heard on Yeonpyeong by AP reporter.
http://twitter.com/W7VOA#
::Mod Edit:: Keep the starcraft jokes out of the thread, please. Derailing, flamebaiting and general stupidity in this thread is a fast track to Disneyland
|
|
|
I really hope they're good at what they do. Why can't they practice with blank ammunition exactly? Or, if they want to test the aim of their weapons, one direction's good as the other. Do they really have to wave guns in each other's faces?
|
On December 20 2010 13:53 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So in 7 minutes...?
I think so..
I imagine what people in S-Korea is going through right now.
Alot of prayers maybe.
|
On December 20 2010 13:53 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So in 7 minutes...?
isn't it odd to think that 7 mins from now there is a slight possibility of a full scale war o.O
|
Lets see how this turns out, hope NK is just talking big and does nothing.
|
I really don't think that this drill is a good idea. But we'll see.
|
Well, it's almost 2pm here, and nothing of note has happened. Again both countries are full of lip and it's business as usual.
|
wow ok ... AND IM JUST A COUPLE OF THOUSAND MILES AWAY FROM WAR! OMG
|
On December 20 2010 13:54 ddrddrddrddr wrote:
I really hope they're good at what they do. Why can't they practice with blank ammunition exactly? Or, if they want to test the aim of their weapons, one direction's good as the other. Do they really have to wave guns in each other's faces?
yeah, basically this. firing them at water between the two is just provoking a 'i have bigger balls' fight.
|
Canada55 Posts
the tension is killing me only i hope no one gets killed 
|
i don't get it, by doing this - i.e. firing artillery in an empty see - they are just trying to steam north koreans so they will also fire but this time towards real targets ?
I mean, if you really want them to fire at you, just shot them in the face no ?
Anyways i hope this doesn't happen at all of course, i'm feeling bad for all our nerdy idols and their family out there the situation is so explosive 
|
On December 20 2010 13:54 ddrddrddrddr wrote:
I really hope they're good at what they do. Why can't they practice with blank ammunition exactly? Or, if they want to test the aim of their weapons, one direction's good as the other. Do they really have to wave guns in each other's faces?
Thats all it really is, just a way for both sides to flaunt their junk at each other.
|
Pretty sure that guy^^ said this shit was already over with. He says its 2pm. WHAT SAY YOU SIRRR
|
any link to live news stream?
also 2 minute warning according to my comp.
|
On December 20 2010 13:55 kr_priest wrote:
Well, it's almost 2pm here, and nothing of note has happened. Again both countries are full of lip and it's business as usual.
sry
that^^
|
|
|
South Korea really isn't doing the right thing.... It doesn't matter if you are being bullied, DON'T start a fucking war, don't testing your damn artillery ! The last thing this world needs right now is another war.
|
|
|
war would be great. Speed along the inevitable.
shit.
war would suck!
everbody gotta be all "haters gonna hate" on everybody
|
|
|
Uhh, where in that article is the firing confirmed? I'm not doubting you--I just couldn't find it anywhere. Or was it implied somewhere in the article?
|
|
|
there's still no news about it...good thing!
|
I hope north korea doesnt overreact to this... if that diagram is to be believed, the shots are clearly fired over sk territory... no need to make a mountain of an ant hill :/
|
There won't be a war.
Can't make it any clearer than that, really.
|
|
|
United States24637 Posts
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:00 guyabs wrote:
there's still no news about it...good thing!
It hasn't been a minute.
|
|
|
It's scheduled to fire at 11 p.m. EST Sunday.
So it's already been an hour.
Nothing happened.
North Korea is doing this due to the entire succession thing and trying to capture some global attention.
Now if North Korea actually retaliates with full scale military operation...
|
The clouds are hatin'. Might be delayed until tuesday.
|
If S. Korea doesn't go through with this the North will just see them as an even bigger pushover and will bully them more.. its really a lose/lose situation
|
nothing happened as in .. did SK test fire?
|
Aw shit, it's about time.
Update the OP to include results ASAP please.
|
Has the test fire happened already or what.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:03 BROotogy wrote:
If S. Korea doesn't go through with this the North will just see them as an even bigger pushover and will bully them more.. its really a lose/lose situation
Yeah, I get the feeling North Korea will do something ballsy soon after South Korea backs down "officially". :< :<
|
This is horrible news. May by some grace of something the two nations find peace.
|
Osaka27139 Posts
|
On December 20 2010 14:01 Neos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:00 guyabs wrote:
there's still no news about it...good thing! It hasn't been a minute.
usually threats like that are on schedule
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:04 Elegy wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12033330The South Korean military says it will begin live-firing exercises on an island close to the border with North Korea in the coming hours, but so far heavy fog has delayed them.
Heh, I wish they would just get it over with if its going to happen.
Fog or not.
|
|
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:05 guyabs wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:01 Neos wrote:On December 20 2010 14:00 guyabs wrote:
there's still no news about it...good thing! It hasn't been a minute. usually threats like that are on schedule
I think he is trying to say that you won't get any good news coverage the exact second its going down >.>
|
Bad weather has delayed the military exercise. Seoul had earlier said it wanted to conduct the one-day artillery drills on Yeonpyeong sometime between Saturday and Tuesday.
North Korea is promising to strike back with even more force than it used on Yeonpyeong last month if the live-fire drills are carried out.
Residents on Yeonpyeong and four other islands were ordered to take shelter before the drills because of possible attacks by North Korea.
South Korea's military will "immediately and sternly" deal with any possible provocation by North Korea, said the officer at the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
ehhhhhhh
|
What exactly is happening? I'm so tired I can barely think coherently ;;
So SK wants to carry out more military exercises (which won't--directly, at least--hurt NK), but NK says they will fire at SK if they (SK) carry on with the exercises?
|
|
|
Hey North Korea. FUCK YOU!
User was warned for this post
|
HELL.....
wait for it...
IT'S ABOUT TIME.
Eyyyyyy
User was warned for this post
|
Artilery fireing heard, as per reuters witness
Uhoh
|
FLASH: Artillery firing heard on South Korea's Yeonpyeong island - Reuters witness
3 minutes ago via web
quoted from http://twitter.com/Reuters#
scary stuff 
edit: im too slow >_> nvm
|
|
|
yawn.
Nothing is going to happen.
Nobody in North Korea has full control of the military.
If NK is going to war, they are going to wait until:
A) They can fully weaponize their nuclear weapons
B) Have full control of the military else they are playing the game with one hand tied.
Before North Korea can truly retaliate with military actions, someone in the high command has to have full control of the military. That was the role Kim Jong-Il had, but with his ill health, the high-command is too messy to conduct any real military actions.
|
Does SK really want to provoke NK even more?
|
now this is getting scary!
|
If NK was going to do something they would have done it by now right?
|
On December 20 2010 14:11 synapse wrote:
Does SK really want to provoke NK even more?
No, but SK is trying to prove they're not pushovers either.
|
This is way out of hand. I hope no one gets hurt or killed. This is something can be way avoided.
|
On December 20 2010 14:13 Getz wrote:
If NK was going to do something they would have done it by now right?
Its 2pm in Korea, only 1 hour past their scheduled time of drill.
They have said this drill could last few hours. Assuming nothing has been fired yet. (according to the twitter source)
|
They delayed the drill, they just started shelling like 8 minutes ago.
FLASH: Artillery firing heard on South Korea's Yeonpyeong island - Reuters witness
11 minutes ago via web
|
I really hope shit doesn't hit the fan. It would be very unfortunate.
|
This is stupid, nothing's going to happen. North Korea isn't dumb enough to attack the South, and if they do, they will be utterly fucked.
|
|
|
The scary part is that this is chicken with millions of lives at stake =/.
|
Uh....Holy Shit. I should be worried...right?
|
i'm in SK. I've been telling all my kids, YOU READY FOR WAR???? haha.
|
Meh, not sure what to think of this, How big of an impact would it have on the rest of us? China has already shown their hand in the matter..
I suppose America might wade into someone else's war again fight for a few years before an inevitable retreat, i mean "tactical withdrawal" ;D.
But I do hope nobody innocent gets hurt here. There's enough pain in the world as is.
... then again.. we are overpopulated..
Per capita...
merka..
hmm
|
I think people should be more worried about Iran-Israel than NK-SK.
|
Osaka27139 Posts
On December 20 2010 14:20 ProtossGirl wrote:
I suppose America might wade into someone else's war again fight for a few years before an inevitable retreat, i mean "tactical withdrawal" ;D.
This thread is to talk about a current event. It is not to flame bait Americans. Don't derail the thread.
|
On December 20 2010 14:20 d_so wrote:
i'm in SK. I've been telling all my kids, YOU READY FOR WAR???? haha.
Funny thing is, all my students are really excited about this news. They're like bloodthirsty savages...moreso than usual! Maybe it's all the video games, or maybe it's because they don't understand the ramifications that war could bring.
|
On December 20 2010 14:14 HtC wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:11 synapse wrote:
Does SK really want to provoke NK even more? No, but SK is trying to prove they're not pushovers either.
theyre not trying to prove anything imo. They dont have a choice. If they dont follow thru, they'll lose face big time.
Having another country tell you what to do in your own territory (that you claim) is ridiculous. You are recognizing thru action, NK's territorial claim. Sovereignty is at stake here.
|
What? Is something really about to happen??
User was warned for this post
|
Sucks for South Korea. North Korea knows it can't win in the long run economically (just like the Soviet Union) and wanted a war. South Korea of course isn't going to budge but the internal pressure from the victims' relative really is really hurting South Korea from both the inside and outside.
|
On December 20 2010 14:20 d_so wrote:
i'm in SK. I've been telling all my kids, YOU READY FOR WAR???? haha.
this is so excellent lol
|
On December 20 2010 14:20 ProtossGirl wrote:
Meh, not sure what to think of this, How big of an impact would it have on the rest of us? China has already shown their hand in the matter..
I suppose America might wade into someone else's war again fight for a few years before an inevitable retreat, i mean "tactical withdrawal" ;D.
But I do hope nobody innocent gets hurt here. There's enough pain in the world as is.
... then again.. we are overpopulated..
Per capita...
merka..
hmm
Huh? I dont think a conventional war between North Korea and South Korea/the US would go very well for North Korea. Their weaponry is dated and poorly maintained. There would however be a horrible loss of human life on both sides.
|
high stakes poker where everyone loses
|
imo, If I was a south korean I would be calling for the resignation of whoever ok'd this artillery test. What good can come of this?
anyother news links??
|
I wish I knew exactly what is going on over there, where is the live coverage?
|
On December 20 2010 14:24 InvalidID wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:20 ProtossGirl wrote:
Meh, not sure what to think of this, How big of an impact would it have on the rest of us? China has already shown their hand in the matter..
I suppose America might wade into someone else's war again fight for a few years before an inevitable retreat, i mean "tactical withdrawal" ;D.
But I do hope nobody innocent gets hurt here. There's enough pain in the world as is.
... then again.. we are overpopulated..
Per capita...
merka..
hmm
Huh? I dont think a conventional war between North Korea and South Korea/the US would go very well for North Korea. Their weaponry is dated and poorly maintained. There would however be a horrible loss of human life on both sides.
Do you have first hand evidence of this? Or is it just heresay.
The whole Afghanistan situation is against "people in sandals and bermuda shorts with rusty AK's" But it still doesn't seem to be the great hit it was intended to be.
I think the theme to avoid here is any sense of arrogance or superiority. Don't count your chickens until the eggs have hatched.
Be modest, and hope for diplomatic solution.
User was temp banned for this post.
|
On December 20 2010 14:24 TheGiftedApe wrote:
imo, If I was a south korean I would be calling for the resignation of whoever ok'd this artillery test. What good can come of this?
They're in a dilemma. If they conduct the test, they risk NKorea firing on them. If they don't, they lose one of their only defenses against NKorea. It's shitty both ways.
|
On December 20 2010 14:26 Getz wrote:
I wish I knew exactly what is going on over there, where is the live coverage?
http://www.cnn.com/video/
|
|
|
yea its only a video not a livestream
|
This reporter's twitter is more "live"
http://twitter.com/#!/markmackinnon
markmackinnon Mark MacKinnon/马凯
Reuters report of artillery fire from Yeonpyeong Island repeated by China's Xinhua, but nothing yet on AP, AFP, or South Korea's Yonhap.
|
On December 20 2010 14:24 TheGiftedApe wrote:
imo, If I was a south korean I would be calling for the resignation of whoever ok'd this artillery test. What good can come of this?
anyother news links??
North Korea is telling the South what to do on South`s property. If the the South backs down then the North would of tasted fear and would would never stop making empty threats.
|
North Korea better have good micro since Boxer and some other SC people are in the South Korean military.
But seriously, thanks. Now I won't be able to go to sleep and instead will be refreshing Reuters' twitter.
User was warned for this post
|
CNN isn't the best coverage site
Either way North Korea going to war is suicide. They won't do it. This is purely showmanship / propaganda by North Korea. South Korea is test firing into it's own territory, nothing wrong with it and they've done it many many times before.
They've had a ton of these moments/threats since forever, best thing to do is just ignore it and carry on.
|
On December 20 2010 14:04 Elegy wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12033330The South Korean military says it will begin live-firing exercises on an island close to the border with North Korea in the coming hours, but so far heavy fog has delayed them.
Excellent.
Maybe I will wake up tomorrow to some rather "exciting news"
"Headline News:
North launches a full scale retaliation campaign against the South in response to South's military exercise. North Korean ground divisions, estimated half a million in infantry, have breached the 38th Parallel military demarcation line by 4:00 am EST. Major South Korean cities, including Seoul, Busan, Incheon and Gwangju, have sustained heavy civilian casualties after the first wave of long range artillery exchanges between the North and South.
North's only warning was a brief radio transmission on the international frequency: "you attacked my water."
All South military reserve personnel have been mobilized. The nation is on full alert. The combined United States and South Korean military force is prepared to counterattack.
One military reserve personnel, Mr. Lim Yo-Hwan, had this to say: "I have played war strategy games for all of my life. To be expected to actually bear arm and aim it at another person alters my idea of warfare into an entirely different perspective. Nonetheless, we South Korean men will not stand back while our beloved home is being torn apart. I will defend it with my life."
By 7:00 am EST, South Korea declares nationwide martial law. Civilians in major cities are ordered to evacuate."
User was warned for this post
|
So basically nothing has happened from either side yet.
|
I really hope this doesn't lead to all-out war.
At the same time, I also hope that the North Korean government will be destroyed from the face of the Earth. But the way to accomplish this is to convert the people to the truth about the world and their government, then remove their leaders from power and unite the two Koreas. If a war happens, the indoctrinated North Koreans will die in droves like sheep led to the slaughter by their "Dear Leader." And millions of South Koreans will die as well.
Praying now...
|
can anyone post the link to where they are getting their information from, the source? or if theres a live video of the news
User was warned for this post
|
North Korea forgot to research Siege Mode.
User was warned for this post
|
On December 20 2010 14:28 jacosajh wrote:
North Korea better have good micro since Boxer and some other SC people are in the South Korean military.
Stop fucking making starcraft jokes. People have families in South Korea.
|
On December 20 2010 14:29 Getz wrote:So basically nothing has happened from either side yet.
Seems to be the case.
|
On December 20 2010 14:30 HCmystic wrote:
can anyone post the link to where they are getting their information from, the source? or if theres a live video of the news
There isnt much going on right now it seems, check previous posts for other links.
http://twitter.com/markmackinnon
http://twitter.com/Reuters#
|
SK not doing drills currently, says will go ahead tomorrow. Check back in ~24 hours to see if WWIII is starting or not...
source: http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#
EDIT, specific wording
|
On December 20 2010 14:24 TheGiftedApe wrote:
imo, If I was a south korean I would be calling for the resignation of whoever ok'd this artillery test. What good can come of this?
anyother news links??
From what I've read, a lot of the populous openly criticized the government for not responding harsher last time. I'd imagine they're just sick of being pushed around and having their citizens killed. Hell, even hundreds of defected former NK soldiers offered to form a special task force to defend SK in the event that it goes to war.
The ROK Defense Ministry will not confirm or deny anything until the drills are over (or a war breaks out) so it looks like (for now) all news will come from what's "heard."
Reuters says its reporter inside an air raid bunker on the island heard artillery fire but no confirm from #ROK military.
|
United States13896 Posts
Same rules as the other thread guys, no StarCraft jokes please.
|
Ugh, I wish it would just happen if its going to happen.
I dont like all this tension build up sitting here waiting.
|
On December 20 2010 13:57 Marou wrote:i don't get it, by doing this - i.e. firing artillery in an empty see - they are just trying to steam north koreans so they will also fire but this time towards real targets ? I mean, if you really want them to fire at you, just shot them in the face no ? Anyways i hope this doesn't happen at all of course, i'm feeling bad for all our nerdy idols and their family out there the situation is so explosive
Whichever kid slaps the other one in the face first, that's the one the teacher's going to slap with a ruler. In this case, slapping = missiles and teacher = UN
|
On December 20 2010 14:24 TheGiftedApe wrote:
imo, If I was a south korean I would be calling for the resignation of whoever ok'd this artillery test. What good can come of this?
anyother news links??
http://news.nate.com/view/20101220n09147?mid=n0204
most people are for it.
자주적 국방을 실현하기 위해 사격훈련은 꼭 필요하다.
military fire training is necessary.
82% (8643명)
국민 안보에 위협을 미치기 때문에 軍은 사격 훈력을 중단해야한다
17% (1821명)
Threat to national security
잘 모르겠다
dont know
1% (73명)
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:31 CarlyZerg wrote:SK not doing drills currently, says will go ahead tomorrow. Check back in ~24 hours to see if WWIII is starting or not... source: http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#EDIT, specific wording
Time of post was 2:27pm MONDAY KST, its still live.
Hope nothing comes of this and we will be able to deal with NK in a more peaceful manner, so much blood would be shed if war broke loose.
|
Bad idea for north Korea....no one likes them..i dunno why they're trying this shit...they hit a couple major cities, the rest of the world destroys them for it....why do it?....
|
So many people saying different things.
|
I'm confused is it Monday at 2:30 in Korea right now, or Sunday at 2:30?
EDIT, got answered while I was posting
|
On December 20 2010 14:36 CarlyZerg wrote:
I'm confused is it Monday at 2:30 in Korea right now, or Sunday at 2:30?
It's monday right now
|
I'm listening to the news on the radio...artillery drills have begun.
|
On December 20 2010 14:37 kr_priest wrote:
I'm listening to the news on the radio...artillery drills have begun.
Keep us updated as best you can please.
|
On December 20 2010 14:33 Getz wrote:
Ugh, I wish it would just happen if its going to happen.
I dont like all this tension build up sitting here waiting.
I am not too worried. The number one concern for the North Korean regime seems to be survival. They need to incite conflict to maintain the status quo of tension, to ensure a smooth succession for Kim Jong Un. I don't think they are stupid enough to risk an actual war, and it wouldn't serve their interests at all.
|
On December 20 2010 14:38 InvalidID wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:33 Getz wrote:
Ugh, I wish it would just happen if its going to happen.
I dont like all this tension build up sitting here waiting. I am not too worried. The number one concern for the North Korean regime seems to be survival. They need to incite conflict to maintain the status quo of tension, to ensure a smooth succession for Kim Jong Un. I don't think they are stupid enough to risk an actual war, and it wouldn't serve their interests at all.
Dumber things have happened in the past...
|
On December 20 2010 14:37 kr_priest wrote:
I'm listening to the news on the radio...artillery drills have begun.
It's sometimes hard to get the proper perspective on news from within America, can I ask you how seriously Koreans are taking this? Does war seem more imminent than the other (countless) times NK has messed around, or is this sorta business-as-usual for you guys?
|
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it!
|
On December 20 2010 14:36 Werk wrote:
Bad idea for north Korea....no one likes them..i dunno why they're trying this shit...they hit a couple major cities, the rest of the world destroys them for it....why do it?....
It's SK doing the hwaiting this time
|
Really unfortunate that it has to come to this. It's basically military dick-waving at this point, except with lives at stake.
Here's to hoping I won't wake up tomorrow with some incredibly bad news.
|
MURICA15980 Posts
Well this is definitely more serious business than usual, but not hide in your basements scary yet.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:40 Liquid`HuK wrote:
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it!
HuK FIGHTING!
|
On December 20 2010 14:40 Liquid`HuK wrote:
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it!
Canada?
|
This is like the Cuban Missile crisis, expect we had at least 1 sensible person back then, Gorbachev.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:39 Getz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:38 InvalidID wrote:On December 20 2010 14:33 Getz wrote:
Ugh, I wish it would just happen if its going to happen.
I dont like all this tension build up sitting here waiting. I am not too worried. The number one concern for the North Korean regime seems to be survival. They need to incite conflict to maintain the status quo of tension, to ensure a smooth succession for Kim Jong Un. I don't think they are stupid enough to risk an actual war, and it wouldn't serve their interests at all. Dumber things have happened in the past...
Kinda like how when one guy was killed and bunch of nations didn't want to lose face, they started a world war?
|
On December 20 2010 14:42 CarlyZerg wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:40 Liquid`HuK wrote:
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it! Canada?
HOORAHH...or maybe ABOOT
|
On December 20 2010 14:43 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:39 Getz wrote:On December 20 2010 14:38 InvalidID wrote:On December 20 2010 14:33 Getz wrote:
Ugh, I wish it would just happen if its going to happen.
I dont like all this tension build up sitting here waiting. I am not too worried. The number one concern for the North Korean regime seems to be survival. They need to incite conflict to maintain the status quo of tension, to ensure a smooth succession for Kim Jong Un. I don't think they are stupid enough to risk an actual war, and it wouldn't serve their interests at all. Dumber things have happened in the past... Kinda like how when one guy was killed and bunch of nations didn't want to lose face, they started a world war?
Exactly...
|
Reporters on Yeonpyeong hearing booms from outgoing artillery. #DPRK has vowed a punishing response. #Koreas
http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA
Not sure if it's a new threat or reiteration of the old.
|
On December 20 2010 14:40 Liquid`HuK wrote:
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it!
haha Huk. Kimchi has really grown on you huh .
I hope the situation will not develop into actual war. Be safe and kick ass in SC2
|
On December 20 2010 14:40 Liquid`HuK wrote:
im rdy to throw down and defend my country if it comes down to it!
brave hero
|
fucking hell u dudes freak me out with this shit
noone in korea seems worried at all, but this thread makes me worry O_o
seems business as usual here, noone has even been mentioning it
|
Gah this makes me nervous :[. I don't want anything bad to happen to my brother :[
|
On December 20 2010 14:45 Subversion wrote:
fucking hell u dudes freak me out with this shit
noone in korea seems worried at all, but this thread makes me worry O_o
seems business as usual here, noone has even been mentioning it
You guys must be used to stuff like this, but from the outside looking in it seems like a really big issue.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:33 p4NDemik wrote:
Same rules as the other thread guys, no StarCraft jokes please.
But what if you are truly worried about the players? D: For instance my comment about Kang Min, I really dont want him to go to war!
|
The general public showing disinterest as usual. The Chinese asking both Koreas to show "extreme restraint" as usual. The US saying that they'll back SK whatever happens.
|
On December 20 2010 14:45 Day[9] wrote:
Gah this makes me nervous :[. I don't want anything bad to happen to my brother :[
I'm sure he'd be able to get a ticket out as soon as things get serious. Plus then he'd be home for Christmas!
|
On December 20 2010 14:45 Day[9] wrote:
Gah this makes me nervous :[. I don't want anything bad to happen to my brother :[
None of us do Day, I will pray for him.
|
On December 20 2010 14:46 Sl4ktarN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:33 p4NDemik wrote:
Same rules as the other thread guys, no StarCraft jokes please. But what if you are truly worried about the players? D: For instance my comment about Kang Min, I really dont want him to go to war!
I think it's obvious whether a comment is in bad taste or not.
|
This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it.
|
On December 20 2010 14:45 Day[9] wrote:
Gah this makes me nervous :[. I don't want anything bad to happen to my brother :[
Hey Day, I just spoke to my Korean co-teacher and he said noone is stressed about it. He said North Korea is always making threats and nothing comes of it, and that noone in Korea is particularly worried.
So don't worry man, I'm sure everything will be just fine
|
#ROK believed to be firing K-9 self-propelled howitzers, 105mm towed artillery guns, Vulcan guns and 81mm mortars. #Koreas
http://twitter.com/W7VOA
|
Was just chilling... Browsing tl... Making coffee. And then i see this thread
|
Native Koreans aren't worried? If they aren't worried, we probably shouldn't be worried.
|
On December 20 2010 14:46 Sl4ktarN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:33 p4NDemik wrote:
Same rules as the other thread guys, no StarCraft jokes please. But what if you are truly worried about the players? D: For instance my comment about Kang Min, I really dont want him to go to war!
I thought reserve forces aren't deployed to the front lines. Can anyone clarify this?
|
On December 20 2010 14:48 Mohdoo wrote:
Native Koreans aren't worried? If they aren't worried, we probably shouldn't be worried.
This just seems a bit more serious than what has happened from NK in the past, at least it does to everyone except SK.
|
Better get some sleep and see what's going to happen tomorow.
I suspect this to be pure provocation but if the South or the North respond too aggressively I don't know what could folow up...
Wishing for the best.
|
Koreans ARE worried. I don't know where people are getting the impression that they are not concerned. Of course, they have grown to become bit desensitized about things like this but this still is alarming to koreans.
|
On December 20 2010 14:48 11cc wrote:Was just chilling... Browsing tl... Making coffee. And then i see this thread
The thread title is misleading...It might be "accurate" but given the circumstances it is not substantial news to anyone familiar with the crisis. That is, the threat does not hold significant weight.
|
On December 20 2010 14:48 Mohdoo wrote:
Native Koreans aren't worried? If they aren't worried, we probably shouldn't be worried.
disagree, firing weapons is a pretty big deal, if you start to not care it allways seems like it happens...
|
MURICA15980 Posts
For Koreans, it's alarming but what the hell can you do except get on with your life? If they cowered everytime tensions rose, nothing would get done. So they get on with their lives. If it were us, we'd be doing the same thing.
|
Oh god, these things always put me on edge. War is just exactly the opposite of what anyone wants, yet North Korea still has to act so aggressively. The worst thing is if they did retaliate, I don't think South Korea would do anything.
|
Business as usual.
Moar starcraft pls.
User was temp banned for this post.
|
On December 20 2010 14:51 Werk wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:48 Mohdoo wrote:
Native Koreans aren't worried? If they aren't worried, we probably shouldn't be worried. disagree, firing weapons is a pretty big deal, if you start to not care it allways seems like it happens...
They're firing into the sea, in a military drill which they do ALL THE TIME, it was scheduled long before any of this stuff with DPRK happened.
The same military drill they did a little while ago, where DPRK promised huge retaliation, and then did nothing.
Why do people believe this should be any different?
|
Russians are concerned over today's exercises and asking SK to show restraint.
|
United States22883 Posts
Renamed, extremely misleading title. ;o
|
So does anyone know if this drill happened ? i mean the time passed when it was scheduled right ?
|
On December 20 2010 14:55 JMSLEX wrote:
So does anyone know if this drill happened ? i mean the time passed when it was scheduled right ?
The drill was reported to began at around 12:30amEST. 2:30pm KST
|
On December 20 2010 14:54 Jibba wrote:
Renamed, extremely misleading title. ;o
Aye, I was like WAHT THE F
ooh.
Anyhow, I'm really tired of all this NK bullshit, I mean seriously...You're like the 13 year old kid that nobody really likes and you go out of your way to make sure nobody likes you, cause you're 13 and the smartest kid in the world.
sooner or later someone is gonna snap and god only knows what will happen from there.
|
FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
Reading through this thread made me confused.
In any case, I hope everything turns out okay. I'll just check back later and hope for the best...
|
|
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:54 Jibba wrote:
Renamed, extremely misleading title. ;o
job well done.. we shouldn't over speculate things..
yes, war may or may not break out. but this is clearly a planned, scheduled artillery firing aimed to demonstrate the military power of the SK
|
United States22883 Posts
On December 20 2010 14:55 JMSLEX wrote:
So does anyone know if this drill happened ? i mean the time passed when it was scheduled right ?
Yes. For people who didn't read the article.
SEOUL—South Korea on Monday afternoon test-fired artillery from an island North Korea attacked last month, defying North Korean threats of another attack and asserting its rights in a maritime area it has controlled since the Korean War of the 1950s.
...
On Sunday, South Korean defense officials called the planned test "usual and justifiable." Aides to South Korean President Lee Myung-bak were quoted in several newspapers Monday as saying they needed to stage the test, which usually happens monthly, to prevent a precedent from being set by the North's attack.
...
There have been no signs of unusual troop movement or war preparations in North Korea, a person familiar with military surveillance of North Korea said.
Nonetheless, according to South Korea's Yonhap news agency on Sunday, North Korea had raised the military readiness of its artillery unit along the west coast.
|
whoever bumped the "North Korea Fires Artill…" thread given what is going on at the moment is a really silly person. -_-
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 14:52 Klogon wrote:
For Koreans, it's alarming but what the hell can you do except get on with your life? If they cowered everytime tensions rose, nothing would get done. So they get on with their lives. If it were us, we'd be doing the same thing.
yup, this is actually what we had to do in the cold war, it was constant fear. I hope for the best, NK needs to grow up!
|
Also for what it's worth, New Mexico Governor Bill Richardson is in N.Korea. He's been there multiple times before and seems to be on reasonable terms with Pyongyang and is experiencing some mild success in easing tensions.
|
This seems like the best of both worlds is happening: SK is staging the drill, which it basically has to do in order to maintain its claim to sovereignty in the contested region, but it's toning it down cause it doesn't want to piss NK off. Hopefully it works.
|
United States13896 Posts
On December 20 2010 14:46 Sl4ktarN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 14:33 p4NDemik wrote:
Same rules as the other thread guys, no StarCraft jokes please. But what if you are truly worried about the players? D: For instance my comment about Kang Min, I really dont want him to go to war!
Well then, you don't have to worry, he isn't actually serving active duty if I recall correctly. He was conscripted for civil service. Just use your head, its quite easy to ascertain what is and is not kosher.
|
The insane contrast between N and S Korea really has changed my opinion on the United States' policy of containment and the "domino theory" re: communism.
Just look at what South Korea has acheived. In less than fifty years, a highly competitve, progressive, developed nation has grown from the impoverished, struggling country that Korea was post-Japanese occupation.
When people talk about the misguided effort that was Vietnam, I think it's important to note just how successful the US making proactive efforts in Korea has been and how that has contributed to world prosperity.
Anyways, rambling aside, best wishes to all the South Korean Tl.netters (Northerners as well, but they won't be able to read this, unfortunately). Since there hasn't been any news bulletins I'm assuming things went according to plan and nothing insane happened.
|
Well, all signs point to giving NK a chill pill. Glad it happened peacefully...
|
On December 20 2010 14:59 Lachrymose wrote:
whoever bumped the "North Korea Fires Artill…" thread given what is going on at the moment is a really silly person. -_-
It was the official thread covering the issue, so they were probably just trying to continue the discussion.
This is probably gonna be it, someone else said in the other thread that NK can choose between 2 things.
Retaliation, probably at the cost of the regime, and who knows what else.
Losing face, if they don't retaliate forcefully, they can't expect to see a god damned dime of aide based on threats of aggression and their whole strategy for the past ~50 years becomes moot.
|
On December 20 2010 15:04 Werk wrote:
Well, all signs point to giving NK a chill pill. Glad it happened peacefully...
Honestly, what we have to really worry about is North Korea in 2012-2014 when the NK are able to weaponize their nuclear warhead. Its also going be around this time when Kim Jong-Un should have a control of the North Korean army.
Right now, nothing is going happen.
It's a lot of blah blah.
But I would be far more worried in 2-5 years.
|
On December 20 2010 15:07 ShcShc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:04 Werk wrote:
Well, all signs point to giving NK a chill pill. Glad it happened peacefully... Honestly, what we have to really worry about is North Korea in 2012-2014 when the NK are able to weaponize their nuclear warhead. Its also going be around this time when Kim Jong-Un should have a control of the North Korean army. Right now, nothing is going happen. It's a lot of blah blah. But I would be far more worried in 2-5 years.
Do you really believe that that the prospect of war depends on NK's ability to use nuclear weapons? Shit is going down, tension is high, and South Korean rhetoric is more aggressive than ever.
|
looking at it at nk perspective, what was the point of all this if u were gonna do nothing in the end.
maybe they felt like playing the asian market.
|
On December 20 2010 15:07 ShcShc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:04 Werk wrote:
Well, all signs point to giving NK a chill pill. Glad it happened peacefully... Honestly, what we have to really worry about is North Korea in 2012-2014 when the NK are able to weaponize their nuclear warhead. Its also going be around this time when Kim Jong-Un should have a control of the North Korean army. Right now, nothing is going happen. It's a lot of blah blah. But I would be far more worried in 2-5 years.
Even then I don't think North Korea would be stupid enough to risk nuclear war. Also the amount of damage they could inflict with conventional weapons is probably not much more then they could with a few Hiroshima level nuclear weapons. If you dont believe this, look at some historical examples from World War Two ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Hamburg_in_World_War_II (42,000 civilian deaths), http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Tokyo (~100,00 civilian deaths) ). North Korea, while lacking in strategic bombers, has a similar artillery position on Seoul .
|
On December 20 2010 14:59 Lachrymose wrote:
whoever bumped the "North Korea Fires Artill…" thread given what is going on at the moment is a really silly person. -_-
Didn't realize there was a new topic up until after i posted.
Sorry I'm not 100% on the ball like you. 
|
Well, seems like its going to be ok for now.
|
MURICA15980 Posts
Yeah... we're just awaiting a response now. None so far.
|
No news is good news? Maybe?
|
Yeah I guess so, if nothing has happened then nothing needs to be reported.
|
lots of tweets from some guys in SK, but no real news...200 shells to be fired...jets flying to deter NK...people in Yeonpyeongdo told to take cover...yadda yadda
|
|
|
(This isn't a Starcraft joke)
For god sake, get out of there, Artosis, IdrA, Liquid and Tasteless, etc.
|
|
|
|
|
Taepodong surprise incoming?
|
MURICA15980 Posts
Yup, it's over. I think we can feel fairly good about it right now.
|
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST?
edit: nvm OP is wrong?
|
On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST?
11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do.
|
On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do.
I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock.
|
MURICA15980 Posts
They said they would choose to respond whenever they pleased.
|
On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock.
If they do anything, it probably wont be as bad as what they claimed it would be.
On December 20 2010 15:43 Klogon wrote:
They said they would choose to respond whenever they pleased.
How convenient...
|
Based on statements leading up to today's #ROK dril, #DPRK signaled it would retaliate at time and place of its choosing and also blames US.
http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA
Can't forget to blame the US! It looks like nothing will happen today.
|
eek I hope this thread gets updated this is sketchy stuff.
|
On December 20 2010 15:33 Getz wrote:Now we wait...
I cant take the pressure
|
On December 20 2010 15:43 Klogon wrote:
They said they would choose to respond whenever they pleased.
*and blamed the US
They seem to parody themselves
|
On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock.
They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with.
|
Judging from North Korea's recent history, I would say that North Korea is not dumb enough to do any large scale attack, but they're too stubborn to walk away empty handed after delivering such a significant threat. They're probably going to do some sabotage, or minor bombing on YP island or something like that. I just hope that if they do, everyone will be protected in bomb shelters.
|
Sounds like North Korea will use this as an excuse for another one of their random attacks then be able to point back to this to say "See we told you we would retaliate." Without having to explain themselves another random shelling or sinking a ship etc etc. But this time it's the US' fault because of this drill etc.
|
On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with.
A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with.
They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response.
|
On December 20 2010 15:47 Chairman Ray wrote:
Judging from North Korea's recent history, I would say that North Korea is not dumb enough to do any large scale attack, but they're too stubborn to walk away empty handed after delivering such a significant threat. They're probably going to do some sabotage, or minor bombing on YP island or something like that. I just hope that if they do, everyone will be protected in bomb shelters.
I agree with most everything you say, but the big difference here that no matter what NK does - I think that SK will hit them back hard and all the "big talk" about full-scale war will become reality
|
On December 20 2010 15:51 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:47 Chairman Ray wrote:
Judging from North Korea's recent history, I would say that North Korea is not dumb enough to do any large scale attack, but they're too stubborn to walk away empty handed after delivering such a significant threat. They're probably going to do some sabotage, or minor bombing on YP island or something like that. I just hope that if they do, everyone will be protected in bomb shelters. I agree with most everything you say, but the big difference here that no matter what NK does - I think that SK will hit them back hard and all the "big talk" about full-scale war will become reality
Yeah, my biggest fear is a full scale war as well. One major factor that will prevent the war is China's lack of support. North Korea knows they have no chance unless they are backed by China, and seeing as how China refused to state their support/oppose on today's issue, it looks as if they don't support NKorea, but are afraid to lose them as an ally.
|
On December 20 2010 15:49 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with. A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with. They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response.
It is a whole lot more than just testing for a response. I think the biggest reason why South Korea choose to do what it does is to show that they are no pushover and to apiece its' citizen who is demanding blood. So this drill is another way for South Korea government to keep its' citizen moral high.
|
On December 20 2010 15:55 Yamoth wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:49 Shigy wrote:On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with. A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with. They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response. It is a whole lot more than just testing for a response. I think the biggest reason why South Korea choose to do what it does is to show that they are no pushover and to apiece its' citizen who is demanding blood. So this drill is another way for South Korea government to keep its' citizen moral high.
ACtually, the drill was scheduled and planned long before all this recent crap with NK. It's pretty much routine, and not intended to to provoke NK in any way.
SK have said as much. Please read news etc before posting inflammatory opinions =/
|
On December 20 2010 15:58 Subversion wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:55 Yamoth wrote:On December 20 2010 15:49 Shigy wrote:On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with. A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with. They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response. It is a whole lot more than just testing for a response. I think the biggest reason why South Korea choose to do what it does is to show that they are no pushover and to apiece its' citizen who is demanding blood. So this drill is another way for South Korea government to keep its' citizen moral high. ACtually, the drill was scheduled and planned long before all this recent crap with NK. It's pretty much routine, and not intended to to provoke NK in any way. SK have said as much. Please read news etc before posting inflammatory opinions =/
I don't think it has anything to do with anti-North sentiments across the SK population. I also don't think that this was routine, scheduled, and planned either. All this "previously planned" stuff you hear from the US/SK/Japan is a load of shit. While they may have technically been "previously planned" the scheduled date was either changed or established in light of Yeonpyeong attacks.
|
On December 20 2010 15:55 Chairman Ray wrote:
Yeah, my biggest fear is a full scale war as well. One major factor that will prevent the war is China's lack of support. North Korea knows they have no chance unless they are backed by China, and seeing as how China refused to state their support/oppose on today's issue, it looks as if they don't support NKorea, but are afraid to lose them as an ally.
You know the UNSC emergency meetings? Fucking China wouldn't denounce NK aggression, blocking a unified statement from the UNSC. I'm half Chinese (this is my i'mnotracist disclaimer), but China's unwavering support for NK is ridiculous. They're hardly a useful buffer state and a laughable trading partner (although there are some favorable deals that China has made regarding the rape and abuse of NK natural resources). China plzz!
|
On December 20 2010 16:01 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 15:58 Subversion wrote:On December 20 2010 15:55 Yamoth wrote:On December 20 2010 15:49 Shigy wrote:On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with. A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with. They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response. It is a whole lot more than just testing for a response. I think the biggest reason why South Korea choose to do what it does is to show that they are no pushover and to apiece its' citizen who is demanding blood. So this drill is another way for South Korea government to keep its' citizen moral high. ACtually, the drill was scheduled and planned long before all this recent crap with NK. It's pretty much routine, and not intended to to provoke NK in any way. SK have said as much. Please read news etc before posting inflammatory opinions =/ I don't think it has anything to do with anti-North sentiments across the SK population. I also don't think that this was routine, scheduled, and planned either. All this "previously planned" stuff you hear from the US/SK/Japan is a load of shit. While they may have technically been "previously planned" the scheduled date was either changed or established in light of Yeonpyeong attacks.
Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks.
(And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
|
#ROK defense ministry won't confirm drill has ended. Artillery firing still heard on Yeonpyeong by AP reporter. #Koreas
http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA
??? Thought it ended. I looked at Yonhap and I can't find a source saying it stopped.
|
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now.
edit: To something I read above, North Korea is a pretty vital buffer zone in my opinion. Yeah, I think South Korea would be a much better trading partner for China and thanks to WikiLeaks we've found out that China agrees with this logic too. However, not having tons of US military bases directly on China's border is a very advantageous thing for China.
|
On December 20 2010 16:01 Shigy wrote:
I also don't think that this was routine, scheduled, and planned either.
Are you intentionally trying to provoke people?
You know the drills the NK fired on were announced well in advance and done annually?
|
On December 20 2010 16:04 SoleSteeler wrote:
Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks.
(And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
They do live fire exercises regularly through the year on the disputed maritime border? I'd have to defer to you because you can observe the drills much more easily than me. However, the US joint military drills were also labeled as "previously planned" and it just sounds like bullshit rhetoric to avoid blame for provoking war.
|
|
|
+ Show Spoiler +On December 20 2010 16:04 SoleSteeler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:01 Shigy wrote:On December 20 2010 15:58 Subversion wrote:On December 20 2010 15:55 Yamoth wrote:On December 20 2010 15:49 Shigy wrote:On December 20 2010 15:45 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 15:43 Deadlyhazard wrote:On December 20 2010 15:40 Chairman Ray wrote:On December 20 2010 15:39 Deadlyhazard wrote:
I thought this was starting at 11:00 AM EST? 11pm EST. It's over now. Now we wait to see what North Korea will do. I'm going to laugh if NK does nothing because they 'promised' retaliation. But I'm really hoping they won't do anything so they can remain a laughing stock. They do this crap all the time. They are like little kids seeing what they can get away with. A bit unrelated, but what you said about NK just there at the end it almost sounds like SK is seeing what they can get away with. They're literally testing the waters with this drill. It is a military provocation (provoke, by definition fits). It was a very short drill, close to NK water, and I think they're trying to fish a response instead of drawing out tensions for so long. I'm not accusing them of warmongering, but it does seem like this drill is actually testing North Korea's response. It is a whole lot more than just testing for a response. I think the biggest reason why South Korea choose to do what it does is to show that they are no pushover and to apiece its' citizen who is demanding blood. So this drill is another way for South Korea government to keep its' citizen moral high. ACtually, the drill was scheduled and planned long before all this recent crap with NK. It's pretty much routine, and not intended to to provoke NK in any way. SK have said as much. Please read news etc before posting inflammatory opinions =/ I don't think it has anything to do with anti-North sentiments across the SK population. I also don't think that this was routine, scheduled, and planned either. All this "previously planned" stuff you hear from the US/SK/Japan is a load of shit. While they may have technically been "previously planned" the scheduled date was either changed or established in light of Yeonpyeong attacks. Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks. (And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
Even though it's a test, it's still pretty scary, because of how close it is, and the repercussions that could follow. Hopefully they can get everything figured out over there, but I find it unlikely.
|
On December 20 2010 16:08 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:04 SoleSteeler wrote:
Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks.
(And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
They do live fire exercises regularly through the year on the disputed maritime border? I'd have to defer to you because you can observe the drills much more easily than me. However, the US joint military drills were also labeled as "previously planned" and it just sounds like bullshit rhetoric to avoid blame for provoking war.
The US does drills with the South Korean navy all the time in those disputed waters. Partly to flex their muscles and also to be prepared for potential war.
|
On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now.
America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan.
If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything.
|
On December 20 2010 16:08 Craton wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:01 Shigy wrote:
I also don't think that this was routine, scheduled, and planned either. Are you intentionally trying to provoke people? You know the drills the NK fired on were announced well in advance and done annually?
Yep, but I don't think that any of the drills since the shelling were "previously planned" specifically to counter a North Korean attack. I think that the timing of the US exercises were absolutely unplanned and were a response to rising tensions.
|
On December 20 2010 16:07 xBillehx wrote:#ROK defense ministry won't confirm drill has ended. Artillery firing still heard on Yeonpyeong by AP reporter. #Koreas http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA??? Thought it ended. I looked at Yonhap and I can't find a source saying it stopped.
Weird, I'd like to hear more about this
|
On December 20 2010 16:08 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:04 SoleSteeler wrote:
Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks.
(And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
They do live fire exercises regularly through the year on the disputed maritime border? I'd have to defer to you because you can observe the drills much more easily than me. However, the US joint military drills were also labeled as "previously planned" and it just sounds like bullshit rhetoric to avoid blame for provoking war.
Wow... South Korea has more than enough cause to go to war with cheonan sinking and artillery strike at yeonpyung island. Just imagine if your own neighbourhood was subjected under artillery strike from another country with hostile intentions.
|
RT @W7VOA: #ROK Pres. spokesman says entire gov't, all public servants to stay on emergency alert anticipating #DPRK counterstrike.
http://twitter.com/markmackinnon#
its 4:00pm in Korea, the bussiest time of the day. hope nothing goes wrong.
|
On December 20 2010 16:07 xBillehx wrote:#ROK defense ministry won't confirm drill has ended. Artillery firing still heard on Yeonpyeong by AP reporter. #Koreas http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA??? Thought it ended. I looked at Yonhap and I can't find a source saying it stopped.
I thought it was over too, whats going on.
|
On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear. If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war. Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. edit: To something I read above, North Korea is a pretty vital buffer zone in my opinion. Yeah, I think South Korea would be a much better trading partner for China and thanks to WikiLeaks we've found out that China agrees with this logic too. However, not having tons of US military bases directly on China's border is a very advantageous thing for China.
Oh man I don't think they will ever be able to make the draft into law again, it would be political suicide to try and re-introduce that
well, 99% sure.....I hope!
|
On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything.
South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well.
South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war.
It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty.
edit:
On the draft, political suicide is a lot better than having North Korea kill US soldiers stationed in South Korea. Frankly, if a Korean war broke out it'd be the biggest war since WWII. So, yeah...
|
On December 20 2010 16:08 Shigy wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:04 SoleSteeler wrote:
Err no, these live firing exercises are held fairly often year round, and this is just another one of those. It has nothing to do with last month's attacks.
(And for the record, I am a Canadian living in South Korea.)
They do live fire exercises regularly through the year on the disputed maritime border? I'd have to defer to you because you can observe the drills much more easily than me. However, the US joint military drills were also labeled as "previously planned" and it just sounds like bullshit rhetoric to avoid blame for provoking war.
It was so planned and routine that NK gets notified in advance everytime they do it.
|
I doubt they would draft lol but yes this would mean a huge war not only involving koreans.
|
They do hold regular drills, and the US/ROK military drill was planned after the Cheonan sinking but delayed by international pressure (China bitching that it's too close to them) until the first bombing happened. These artillery drills also happen regularly for both Koreas, but only SK announces to everyone that they're holding them, NK just does them out of the blue.
Still looking for sources saying they stopped, other reporters are now saying it's still being heard. I guess there was some confusion somewhere.
|
On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty.
You have to remember every country is in this for their own benefits. I don't see America going as far as you claim but what they'll probably do is supply South korea with all the technology/intel with a few soldiers stationed here and there. As sick as this sounds, the American leadership will probably think to themselves, why waste American lives when we can let South Koreans waste their lives? America has no urgent need to bring its soldiers, but the South does since they are NK's neighbour.
Strategically speaking, A Korean war would actually benefit America which is why they keep egging the South to retaliate(military drills/sending nuclear ships included). However the war would be disastrous for both koreas, Japan, China and Russia which is why Russia is in panic mode with the UN.
|
You guys are right, this quick live fire drill was planned months ago so that they could make sure their equipment was still in order through the winter, gotta keep that shit warm, right?
To be real, I'm not saying that SK is being aggressive, but IMO this is more of a test than a long-awaited exercise.
edit: I know they do naval exercises and joint military exercises all the time. CONSIDER THE TIMING IN WEEKS, MAYBE DAYS and you'll wake the fuck up
|
On December 20 2010 16:17 Sworn wrote:
I doubt they would draft lol but yes this would mean a huge war not only involving koreans.
There will most likely be a draft if a NK/SK war broke out, count on it.
|
MURICA15980 Posts
On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty. edit: On the draft, political suicide is a lot better than having North Korea kill US soldiers stationed in South Korea. Frankly, if a Korean war broke out it'd be the biggest war since WWII. So, yeah...
Additionally, South Korea is one of the few countries in one of the world's hotspots that the US has repeatedly stated clearly that they will support it in times of war. Hell, they have 30,000 troops there. If after all that the US backs down to a small rogue nation like North Korea, US credibility in its extended deterrence over its allies will be severely damaged, perhaps forever. You can bet your marbles that if this turns into full out war, the US will be heavily involved from day 1.
|
On December 20 2010 16:20 sekritzzz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty. You have to remember every country is in this for their own benefits. I don't see America going as far as you claim but what they'll probably do is supply South korea with all the technology/intel with a few soldiers stationed here and there. As sick as this sounds, the American leadership will probably think to themselves, why waste American lives when we can let South Koreans waste their lives? America has no urgent need to bring its soldiers, but the South does since they are NK's neighbour.
Well, for certain, America would declare war and provide troops. It can be debated how many but obviously every soldier currently stationed in South Korea would be used in combat operations.
South Korea is pretty damn important. Of all the countries with US military bases in them South Korea is by far the most important strategically.
|
On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty. edit: On the draft, political suicide is a lot better than having North Korea kill US soldiers stationed in South Korea. Frankly, if a Korean war broke out it'd be the biggest war since WWII. So, yeah...
Lol. I think your mind is over exaggerating unfortunately (well fortunately).
A Korean war wouldn't last more than 2 weeks.
The 2003 Iraq war was short & simple (in terms of fighting Saddam's army).
There is a possibility of having guerrilla-like fighting that could last years, but definitely not nearly the scale you are thinking of.
|
On December 20 2010 16:22 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:20 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty. You have to remember every country is in this for their own benefits. I don't see America going as far as you claim but what they'll probably do is supply South korea with all the technology/intel with a few soldiers stationed here and there. As sick as this sounds, the American leadership will probably think to themselves, why waste American lives when we can let South Koreans waste their lives? America has no urgent need to bring its soldiers, but the South does since they are NK's neighbour. Well, for certain, America would declare war and provide troops. It can be debated how many but obviously every soldier currently stationed in South Korea would be used in combat operations. South Korea is pretty damn important. Of all the countries with US military bases in them South Korea is by far the most important strategically.
I agree with you there, especially with China's rise. Lets see how this plays how.
|
On December 20 2010 16:22 overt wrote:
Well, for certain, America would declare war and provide troops. It can be debated how many but obviously every soldier currently stationed in South Korea would be used in combat operations.
South Korea is pretty damn important. Of all the countries with US military bases in them South Korea is by far the most important strategically.
cosign. We would jump right into that shit. How much we would dedicate is a mystery to me with all the guys in the Middle East and our own little economic problems.
But yeah, South Korea is very economically and militarily strategic for us.
|
(URGENT) S. Korea concludes live-fire exercise near N. Korea: official
http://twitter.com/#!/YonhapNews
Okayy Yonhap just said it ended 2 minutes ago. (2 hour drill?)
@ the current discussion, the US would definitely be in it on day 1. At the very least all 30k troops would be actively involved and we'd probably send in a few carriers to assist in taking out artillery. SK is way more important than Iraq/Afgan
Edit: More confirmation now.
#ROK Defense Ministry confirms to VOA live-fire drill has ended & it lasted 94 minutes. #Koreas
http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA
The live-fire drill on Yeonpyeong has ended. Defense Ministry says it lasted 94 minutes.
http://twitter.com/#!/VOA_Seoul
|
On December 20 2010 16:23 ShcShc wrote:
The 2003 Iraq war didn't last very long (in terms of fighting Saddam's army).
There is a possibility of having guerrilla-like fighting that could last years, but definitely not nearly the scale you are thinking of.
i dont really think there will be a guerilla war as intense as in the middle east, if one of korean state fell. especially on the NK side.
|
On December 20 2010 16:22 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:20 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:15 overt wrote:On December 20 2010 16:11 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:07 overt wrote:
South Korea flexing it's muscles is perfectly acceptable. The North just last month shelled their land and killed civilians. That's an act of war. The only reason this isn't already a full scale war is because North Korea is nuclear.
If the North retaliates there will be war and it will be huge. The most interesting thing will be what China does. I don't know if they can risk going against America and the rest of the international community but at the same time they don't want to give up that North Korean buffer zone. It will also be terrifying to wonder if North Korea would actually use their nuclear arms in the event of a full scale war.
Either way, I feel very bad about this whole situation. On the light-hearted side of things, if we have to re-introduce the draft at least gays and lesbians can be drafted now. America would be insane to try and be active in another war. They already overextended themselves with Iraq/Afghanistan. If this does into a full out war, I honestly think most major powers(japan included) would just take a step aside and wait a while before engaging in anything. South Korea > Iraq/Afghanistan. A Korean war would mean an almost immediate withdrawal from Iraq/Afghanistan at least combat troops that is. And the US would likely institute a draft as well. South Korea is probably one of the most important countries in the world for the United States. Not only is it a very successful democracy in South East Asia but it has a huge economy. Also, there are US soldiers stationed there...meaning a Korean war would instantly plunge America into war. It's the same reason why if someone declared war on Germany or Japan they'd also be declaring war on America. You don't establish military bases in a country just because they look pretty. You have to remember every country is in this for their own benefits. I don't see America going as far as you claim but what they'll probably do is supply South korea with all the technology/intel with a few soldiers stationed here and there. As sick as this sounds, the American leadership will probably think to themselves, why waste American lives when we can let South Koreans waste their lives? America has no urgent need to bring its soldiers, but the South does since they are NK's neighbour. Well, for certain, America would declare war and provide troops. It can be debated how many but obviously every soldier currently stationed in South Korea would be used in combat operations. South Korea is pretty damn important. Of all the countries with US military bases in them South Korea is by far the most important strategically.
The U.S nor the South Korean would declare war.
Everything would be based on speed. Take over as many known artillery points in order to inflict the least damages on South Korean cities. That would be the whole point of a Korean war.
The only real advantage North Korea has is its complex tunnel system. Nobody in the Western world knows how deep or complex its tunnel systems are. Apart from that, a pretty good chunk of their military is figured out.
|
On December 20 2010 16:25 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:23 ShcShc wrote:
The 2003 Iraq war didn't last very long (in terms of fighting Saddam's army).
There is a possibility of having guerrilla-like fighting that could last years, but definitely not nearly the scale you are thinking of.
i dont really think there will be a guerilla war as intense as in the middle east, if one of korean state fell. especially on the NK side.
Never said there will be.
There is always a possibility depending on how much North Koreans are afraid of the Western ideologies. The North Koreans definitely has the training that could turn it into guerilla warfare, but I don't think many would want it.
And of course North Korea would fall...the military plans found by NK were based on "topping down the North Korean regime within a few days".
|
South Korean Businesses backed todays drills.
Yonhap
SEOUL, Dec. 20 (Yonhap) -- South Korea's major business organizations expressed strong support for the military's artillery firing exercise Monday that came on the heels of a recent shelling of a South Korean border island by North Korea.
The organizations said increasing tension with the communist North may significantly damage the country's economy, but insisted security comes before anything else.
"The country's businesses are deeply worried repeated provocations from North Korea will have a grave effect on the country's economy, but they also very clearly understand that there will be no business without security," said an official from the Federation of Korean Industries (FKI), the largest industrial lobby in South Korea.
North Korea bombed South Korea's Yeonpyeong Island near the border last month, killing four people, including two civilians. Seoul made it clear the latest artillery firing was part of its decades-long exercise and that it will decisively strike the North if the communist nation tries to attack any of South Korea's islands near the border.
"The artillery exercise on Yeonpyeong Island is a legitimate demonstration of the country's sovereignty that has been done for the past 37 years as part of efforts to check our defensive posture," the FKI official said.
The Korea Chamber of Commerce & Industry also called it a necessary demonstration of the country's sovereign rights in a released statement.
"Monday's exercise clearly demonstrated the country's firm resolution that it will defend its territory and waters despite repeated threats from North Korea," it said.
The Korea Employers Federation urged the government to sternly deal with any provocation from North Korea.
"We again urge the government to deal with any North Korean provocation with stern and decisive measures," it said.
|
I don't see what is giving people itt the idea that a draft could possibly come back
|
Im not sure i understand this... Is it North or South korea that is testing the missles?
User was warned for this post
|
On December 20 2010 16:39 Lil.Sassy wrote:
I don't see what is giving people itt the idea that a draft could possibly come back
war would probably end even before you get off the bus to ft benning/parris island. lol.
|
On December 20 2010 16:40 Akuemon wrote:
Im not sure i understand this... Is it North or South korea that is testing the missles?
South Korea
|
On December 20 2010 16:39 Lil.Sassy wrote:
I don't see what is giving people itt the idea that a draft could possibly come back
People are just being paranoid and believe that the U.S. military can't stretch its strength if there is another Korean War. We are only using a small fraction of forces in the Middle East while we have reserves back home and on other bases worldwide.
|
On December 20 2010 16:46 zoLo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:39 Lil.Sassy wrote:
I don't see what is giving people itt the idea that a draft could possibly come back People are just being paranoid and believe that the U.S. military can't stretch its strength if there is another Korean War. We are only using a small fraction of forces in the Middle East while we have reserves back home and on other bases worldwide.
Sure, but with what economic resources? Are we not buried enough yet with the trillions of debt at hand? Congress needed another $1.1 trillion just to get follow through with its programs to the end of the year.
|
I can't help but think America is pushing SK towards taking this action. This is an escalation of military tension no matter how you look at it, and the US could stand to gain by eliminating NK, while China, who has historically been NK's ally, would only lose.
I'm saying this as an American, not some paranoid foreigner who hates America.
I'm glad to see that today's drill ended without too much drama.. so far.
|
United States4053 Posts
Title should be changed. Not only is the drill done, it started at 1:00 PM, not AM
k
edit: it's not really relevant anymore, but I think 1:00 PM would be better in thread titles for things like this because 1)TL's server time is KST, 2)it actually happened in Korea
|
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will.
|
On December 20 2010 17:00 infinitestory wrote:
Title should be changed. Not only is the drill done, it started at 1:00 PM, not AM
1am est time i think
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 16:59 .Aar wrote:
I can't help but think America is pushing SK towards taking this action. This is an escalation of military tension no matter how you look at it, and the US could stand to gain by eliminating NK, while China, who has historically been NK's ally, would only lose.
I'm saying this as an American, not some paranoid foreigner who hates America.
I'm glad to see that today's drill ended without too much drama.. so far.
That is because its completely true. America would be the only person to benefit from a war scenario whilst both Koreas, Russia and China would all lose. Why do you think Russia went into panic mode and called an emergency U.N. summit? it knows that America wants it to happen.
|
as this situation in the korean pennisula goes further into instability which helps the value of the dollar to rise. i wonder why.
|
On December 20 2010 17:06 sekritzzz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:59 .Aar wrote:
I can't help but think America is pushing SK towards taking this action. This is an escalation of military tension no matter how you look at it, and the US could stand to gain by eliminating NK, while China, who has historically been NK's ally, would only lose.
I'm saying this as an American, not some paranoid foreigner who hates America.
I'm glad to see that today's drill ended without too much drama.. so far. That is because its completely true. America would be the only person to benefit from a war scenario whilst both Koreas, Russia and China would all lose. Why do you think Russia went into panic mode and called an emergency U.N. summit? it knows that America wants it to happen.
How does America benefit from South Korea and Japan's economy weakening, potential nuclear attacks on Japan and South Korea, and the potential for China to covertly or overtly fund a North Korean war all over again?
I can't think of a single country other than China that truly benefits from keeping North Korea around to begin with as the South is a much better trade partner to have. However, no country really benefits from a reunified Korea at this time.
|
On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will.
I agree. All the "wars" of the modern era that ended in a matter of days did so with the losers' rational surrenders. To actually decimate an entire nationalized military in total war is not a simple affair and really cannot be done without egregious damage to civilian populations. Demonstrating that the nation cannot win is different from completely castrating its ability to make war. With so many people militarized or potentially militarized by NK, non-atrocious means of killing them all will not get the job done quickly.
I just pray that NK can be restored to sanity without the severe loss of life that could very well happen.
|
On December 20 2010 17:11 overt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 17:06 sekritzzz wrote:On December 20 2010 16:59 .Aar wrote:
I can't help but think America is pushing SK towards taking this action. This is an escalation of military tension no matter how you look at it, and the US could stand to gain by eliminating NK, while China, who has historically been NK's ally, would only lose.
I'm saying this as an American, not some paranoid foreigner who hates America.
I'm glad to see that today's drill ended without too much drama.. so far. That is because its completely true. America would be the only person to benefit from a war scenario whilst both Koreas, Russia and China would all lose. Why do you think Russia went into panic mode and called an emergency U.N. summit? it knows that America wants it to happen. How does America benefit from South Korea and Japan's economy weakening, potential nuclear attacks on Japan and South Korea, and the potential for China to covertly or overtly fund a North Korean war all over again? I can't think of a single country other than China that truly benefits from keeping North Korea around to begin with as the South is a much better trade partner to have. However, no country really benefits from a reunified Korea at this time.
It was a tool comment, nuff said. "zomgeee America wants war cuz everyone else will go down and we'll be on top"
|
On December 20 2010 17:06 sekritzzz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 16:59 .Aar wrote:
I can't help but think America is pushing SK towards taking this action. This is an escalation of military tension no matter how you look at it, and the US could stand to gain by eliminating NK, while China, who has historically been NK's ally, would only lose.
I'm saying this as an American, not some paranoid foreigner who hates America.
I'm glad to see that today's drill ended without too much drama.. so far. That is because its completely true. America would be the only person to benefit from a war scenario whilst both Koreas, Russia and China would all lose. Why do you think Russia went into panic mode and called an emergency U.N. summit? it knows that America wants it to happen.
Major export markets (2009)--China (23.2%), U.S. (10.1%), Japan (5.8%), Hong Kong (5.3%), Singapore (3.6%).
Major importers to South Korea (2009)--China (16.8%), Japan (15.3%), U.S. (9.0%), Saudi Arabia (6.1%), Australia (4.6%).
Russia has the least to lose. In fact, war would drive up the cost of oil, which would benefit Russia. The US would be obligated to help Korea, as they are allies, and so a war would be quite costly. Russia (and China) could just sit on the sidelines.
|
Some people really underestimate NK.
Russia was supposed to kick ass and take names in Chechnya. Look what happened there.
|
It is true that the situation between SK and NK has been heated up alot lately. But I still think people on TL are too affected with SK. A war will not happen.
There are 4 countries involved in this and all 4 of them don't want war. We can all agree that the US doesn't want another war rightnow.
SK is too developed to be going to war with NK which basically has nothing. Its like you are driving a Ferrari and jump out of it to fight with a beggar on the side of the road...and result in you may be get killed.
NK sure as hell doesn't a war as well. Their leaders want to dictate NK as their own kingdom, then pass it down to their children. They want to be kings in their country.
China also doesn't want NK and SK to go to war cos they are on rise to be a economic power house. A war at their doorstep is the last thing they wanted.
From my point of view, why NK and SK keep provoke each other because for NK, the regime leader wants to show their people - the people of NK how awesome they are that they can scare SK and US to death whenever they want. It is a way to oppress the NK public not to go nuts because of their dictatorship.
After NK provoke SK, ofc SK will have to react just trying to avoid to be viewed by the SK public their goverment is weak and isn't capable of dealing with NK.
US and China...well, just hovering around, tell everybody to calm down, bring in carriers etc...
I think the SK and NK problem can only be resolved in 2 ways:
First, wait untill the current leader of NK dies and see what happens. His son may has some sense in him.
Second, the NK public will perform a coup on themselves.
|
On December 20 2010 17:55 Caphe wrote:
It is true that the situation between SK and NK has been heated up alot lately. But I still think people on TL are too affected with SK. A war will not happen.
There are 4 countries involved in this and all 4 of them don't want war. We can all agree that the US doesn't want another war rightnow.
SK is too developed to be going to war with NK which basically has nothing. Its like you are driving a Ferrari and jump out of it to fight with a beggar on the side of the road...and result in you may be get killed.
NK sure as hell doesn't a war as well. Their leaders want to dictate NK as their own kingdom, then pass it down to their children. They want to be kings in their country.
China also doesn't want NK and SK to go to war cos they are on rise to be a economic power house. A war at their doorstep is the last thing they wanted.
From my point of view, why NK and SK keep provoke each other because for NK, the regime leader wants to show their people - the people of NK how awesome they are that they can scare SK and US to death whenever they want. It is a way to oppress the NK public not to go nuts because of their dictatorship.
After NK provoke SK, ofc SK will have to react just trying to avoid to be viewed by the SK public their goverment is weak and isn't capable of dealing with NK.
US and China...well, just hovering around, tell everybody to calm down, bring in carriers etc...
I think the SK and NK problem can only be resolved in 2 ways:
First, wait untill the current leader of NK dies and see what happens. His son may has some sense in him.
Second, the NK public will perform a coup on themselves.
I agree with this dude
I'm really waiting to see a coup happening, There was a fairly significant coup in China after Mao died that was so so beneficial to our people.
|
To many people in this thread coming up with "what if's" that are so far above any of our echelons they sound absurd.
To the wikipedia warriors that say our military is "stretched to thin" I would like to direct you to USMC Forces Pacific: 2 MEF's locked and loaded ready to go gentleman.
Take a step back and relax, all these doomsday scenarios people are coming up with are almost laughable.
|
3579 Posts
China isnt going to be helping North Korea at all. read the war logs, they want Korea to be re-united under south korea
|
MURICA15980 Posts
Actually, many analysts are saying all these shows of power from the North and attacks on the South may be political maneuvering within North Korea's domestic politics in order to gain experience and obtain "victories" for the resume of the new heir and 4-star general, Kim Jung-un.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will.
First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight.
China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons.
The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish.
|
On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight. China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons. The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish.
i dont think russia or china would like the idea of nuclear radiation coming to their countries
|
On December 20 2010 18:25 ImFromPortugal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight. China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons. The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish. i dont think russia or china would like the idea of nuclear radiation coming to their countries
The US would prob just use tactical nukes to destroy militiary/strategic targets,not ICBMs.
|
On December 20 2010 18:25 ImFromPortugal wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight. China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons. The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish. i dont think russia or china would like the idea of nuclear radiation coming to their countries
True. Would South Korea/US let a nuclear bomb going off without a retaliation of their own?
|
North Korea have stated on many different occasions that if war was to erupt, then they will fire hundreds of missiles straight into Seoul.
|
On December 20 2010 18:38 us.insurgency wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 18:25 ImFromPortugal wrote:On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight. China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons. The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish. i dont think russia or china would like the idea of nuclear radiation coming to their countries True. Would South Korea/US let a nuclear bomb going off without a retaliation of their own?
Even if SK get nuked by NK, I wouldn't bet US uses nuke against NK.
After all, SK wouldn't want an unified penninsula in which half of it is a nuclear wasteland.
They don't need nuke to make NK regime collapse.
Just bomb military bases, stock piles of missiles and artilleries, and bomb Pyongyang and send the citizens into a chaotic frenzy and it's gg.
|
#DPRK (via KCNA) retreats from retaliation threat, now says #ROK drill not worth a reaction. #Korea
http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOA
FLASH: North Korea army says "it is not worth reacting to provocation" from South Korea's exercise - KCNA
http://twitter.com/#!/Reuters
Looks like they chose to lose face and backed down.
|
On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight.
Are you 12?
|
North korea is taking sensible decisions?
Looks like they got even more crazier now. Like when did that ever happen?
Good thing nothing came out of it though.
|
|
|
On December 20 2010 18:36 thoradycus wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 18:25 ImFromPortugal wrote:On December 20 2010 18:21 us.insurgency wrote:On December 20 2010 17:00 overt wrote:
It's more or less if China gets involved. If China gets involved a draft will occur. If North Korea holds on longer than people are acting in this thread, a draft could occur especially if we keep operations normal in Iraq/Afghanistan.
People seem to think we'd just steamroll through North Korea. Their infrastructure likely couldn't maintain a long drawn out war, but having nukes, the world's fourth largest army, and more tanks and naval vessels than South Korea means that a war wouldn't be over "in two weeks."
It'd be laughably one-sided, but if North Korea goes nuclear or just happens to surprise people, the war could go on much longer than people are acting like it will. First of all if the war goes nuclear then it would be over fast. The UN would step in and I bet there would be nuclear retaliation. The US could devastate North Korea in a nuclear fight. China already said they are not backing North Korea. They think they should disarm their nuclear weapons. The reason why war is so costly (especially for the US) is because they use technology to save lives. They do not need as much man power like they did in WWII A fear about a draft is very selfish. i dont think russia or china would like the idea of nuclear radiation coming to their countries The US would prob just use tactical nukes to destroy militiary/strategic targets,not ICBMs.
To be clear, the size of the explosion and resulting fallout depends on the number of warheads, not the delivery system. Tactical nukes are relatively short-ranged missiles fired from a carrier of some sort, such as a submarine. ICBM stands for intercontinental ballistic missile, which means it can be launched from one continent and strike in another.
In any case, a nuclear strike is highly unlikely from any organization that can be singled out and targeted for retaliation in any form (such as a nation). Using a nuke might help you defeat an enemy, but what it will do for sure is assure your own destruction either at your own hands or those around you. I won't be worried about it, personally.
|
This thread is hilarious
a bunch of people stating that there will be war. a bunch of people weighing in their opinions with absolutely 0 geo-political information about the area other than 'north korea bad'. And then fearmongering spreading like a disease.
Who here really thought that North Korea would decide that now would be a fantastic time to launch missiles into Seoul and enter a war they cannot win
|
On December 20 2010 19:12 ShloobeR wrote:
This thread is hilarious
a bunch of people stating that there will be war. a bunch of people weighing in their opinions with absolutely 0 geo-political information about the area other than 'north korea bad'. And then fearmongering spreading like a disease.
Who here really thought that North Korea would decide that now would be a fantastic time to launch missiles into Seoul and enter a war they cannot win
I thought there was about as good a chance of that happening as them launching missiles at an island and killing 4 people.
Not likely but possible.
|
Well, according to South Korean news, NK just said they didn't feel like responding to this drill or something of that sort.
More like they can't dare, but they're creative people so whatever.
|
On December 20 2010 19:12 ShloobeR wrote:
This thread is hilarious
a bunch of people stating that there will be war. a bunch of people weighing in their opinions with absolutely 0 geo-political information about the area other than 'north korea bad'. And then fearmongering spreading like a disease.
Who here really thought that North Korea would decide that now would be a fantastic time to launch missiles into Seoul and enter a war they cannot win
I get a feeling that you could say something like this for most news threads created in General.
|
On December 20 2010 19:12 ShloobeR wrote:
This thread is hilarious
a bunch of people stating that there will be war. a bunch of people weighing in their opinions with absolutely 0 geo-political information about the area other than 'north korea bad'. And then fearmongering spreading like a disease.
Who here really thought that North Korea would decide that now would be a fantastic time to launch missiles into Seoul and enter a war they cannot win
Pretty much this. North Korean leaders might be running a failed state, but they'd rather be running a failed state than be dead. None of them are actually crazy, but the appearance of being crazy is how they get what they need from the international community. Pretending to be a rabid dog that's ready to strike keeps people at the negotiating tables instead of laughing and walking away when they actually need something.
|
NK, a country run by cowards. Only problem is they've become like a cornered dog with rabies, just as insane to boot. Before the test it was all "yes if you do this we will retaliate 100%" now look how quickly they shut up when their bluff is called. Someone needs to dominate North Korea so the people can enjoy better lives, its fucking tragic
|
They probably never intended to retaliate. Instead, they'll just report this incident within North Korea as another example of North Korea's military superiority against the illegitimate fascist puppet of America government in the South. The True Korea was so successful in defending the rebels' illegal and unprovoked attack that no Koreans died or were even injured in the effort to defend the attack. All hail Kim Jong-un and his military genius!
|
On December 20 2010 20:23 domovoi wrote:
All hail Kim Jong-un and his military genius!
there is no such thing as a military genius because war is stupid.
there are tons of people that are affected by this that we, the starcraft community, care about. please take that into consideration before regurgitating twitter updates with your own geo-political commentary.
i hope this is just another "check out my big guns" display and that everyone in both NK and SK is safe.
|
Nothing is gonna happen in the long run.
The North Korean regime is heavily dependent on USA money to maintain their personal luxury and to keep enough people fed and happy to keep the system running. THat said, they need to provoke South Korea and the US from time to time to pursue two goals:
a) create and maintain the feeling of outside threat to ensure innerpolitical stability
b) remind the US that they better keep the money flowing because NK is potentially up for trouble otherwise
|
On December 20 2010 20:46 tmhjr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 20:23 domovoi wrote:
All hail Kim Jong-un and his military genius! there is no such thing as a military genius because war is stupid. there are tons of people that are affected by this that we, the starcraft community, care about. please take that into consideration before regurgitating twitter updates with your own geo-political commentary. i hope this is just another "check out my big guns" display and that everyone in both NK and SK is safe.
You realize that he is talking from the perspective of the NK media right? That is how this sort of thing works in totalitarian governments. Any action that is good or bad is spun so that it not only benefits the country but also enforces its leadership/government
|
On December 20 2010 18:59 xBillehx wrote:#DPRK (via KCNA) retreats from retaliation threat, now says #ROK drill not worth a reaction. #Korea http://twitter.com/#!/W7VOAFLASH: North Korea army says "it is not worth reacting to provocation" from South Korea's exercise - KCNA http://twitter.com/#!/ReutersLooks like they chose to lose face and backed down.
SEOUL, Dec. 20 (Yonhap) -- South Korea on Monday fired artillery into waters near the western sea border with North Korea, an official said, amid Pyongyang's threat to strike back if the drill goes ahead.
The drill began at around 2:30 p.m. from Yeonpyeong Island, with artillery rounds landing in a 40 kilometer-by-20 kilometer area south of the maritime border, an official at the South's Joint Chiefs of Staff said.
NORTH KOREA in its Army statement (KCNA) said...
"This was nothing but a childish play with fire of cowards without an equal as they made much fuss, firing shells left unused during the military provocation on November 23 after shifting by stealth the waters to be a scene of the projected shelling and its target for fear of the KPA′s second and third retaliatory blows for self-defence.
"North Korea called Monday's drills a "reckless military provocation" but said after they ended that it was holding its fire because Seoul had changed its firing zones."
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated
|
On December 20 2010 21:08 Electric.Jesus wrote:
Nothing is gonna happen in the long run.
The North Korean regime is heavily dependent on USA money to maintain their personal luxury and to keep enough people fed and happy to keep the system running. THat said, they need to provoke South Korea and the US from time to time to pursue two goals:
a) create and maintain the feeling of outside threat to ensure innerpolitical stability
b) remind the US that they better keep the money flowing because NK is potentially up for trouble otherwise
i thought China supplied 90% of their domestic needs
|
On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:SEOUL, Dec. 20 (Yonhap) -- South Korea on Monday fired artillery into waters near the western sea border with North Korea, an official said, amid Pyongyang's threat to strike back if the drill goes ahead. The drill began at around 2:30 p.m. from Yeonpyeong Island, with artillery rounds landing in a 40 kilometer-by-20 kilometer area south of the maritime border, an official at the South's Joint Chiefs of Staff said. NORTH KOREA in its Army statement (KCNA) said... "This was nothing but a childish play with fire of cowards without an equal as they made much fuss, firing shells left unused during the military provocation on November 23 after shifting by stealth the waters to be a scene of the projected shelling and its target for fear of the KPA′s second and third retaliatory blows for self-defence. "North Korea called Monday's drills a "reckless military provocation" but said after they ended that it was holding its fire because Seoul had changed its firing zones." Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated
Um, just so you're aware this is the exact same area they fired into the first time. North Korea had been threatening that if these drills went on they'd retaliate, and SK beefed up defenses big time. Turns out they didn't follow through with their threats, but it is the same area thats "disputed" by North Korea. Read the thread man. :\
|
On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated
No it didnt? At least Id want to hear from someone else than NK if it did. Cant get a much worse source than that.
|
On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/Jf5u6.jpg)
Southwest is still disputed.
edit:
red = NK claim
blue = SK claim
|
The US would prob just use tactical nukes to destroy militiary/strategic targets,not ICBMs.
I'm going to completely ignore the political issues and focus on the misinformed nature of people on nuclear weapons.
Tactical Nukes: Use a Plutonium or Uranium for fissile material. The blast is fairly small but releases large amounts of radioactive byproducts from undetonated Uranium/Plutonium, other radioactive isotopes are created from the bombardment, some of the shell is radiated along with the surrounding area.
Strategic Nuclear weapons: They start with the type of charge based in the tactical nuclear weapon, an atom bomb. This creates the temperatures required for the secondary, more powerful, Hydrogen reaction. The Dueterium fuses with Trinum, hydrogen with 1 nuetron and 2 nuetrons respectively, creating a significantly more powerful blast. This mainly releases stable hydrogen, hellium, and lithium as byproducts, and it boosts the efficiency of the fission device creating slightly less byproducts.
Some of the bomb's casing and area around the nuclear weapon becomes irradiated from being bombarded with nuetrons but overall the radioactive fallout from a thermonuclear device is only slightly higher than that of a tactical warhead for a blast that is several magnatudes more powerful. Tactical nuclear weapons would create a larger radioactive concern than strategic ones.
Edit: There's a bit more going on, but that's the general idea. Much more bang, equal fallout.
|
On December 21 2010 01:12 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated Southwest is still disputed. edit: red = NK claim blue = SK claim
So SK is claiming they have rights to the surrounding water while NK claims it is just a small water bridge tot he islands? Or am I not understanding that image correct?
|
On December 21 2010 01:12 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated Southwest is still disputed. edit: red = NK claim blue = SK claim
Is this seriously what NK claims to be theirs?
Thats is just ridiculous...
|
On December 20 2010 18:10 b_unnies wrote:
China isnt going to be helping North Korea at all. read the war logs, they want Korea to be re-united under south korea
That cable is... "an American diplomat quoting a Chinese diplomat quoting a North Korean diplomat." Shi Yinhong
|
On December 21 2010 02:20 rastaban wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2010 01:12 NIJ wrote:On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated Southwest is still disputed. edit: red = NK claim blue = SK claim So SK is claiming they have rights to the surrounding water while NK claims it is just a small water bridge tot he islands? Or am I not understanding that image correct?
you are understanding it correctly.
NK pretty much thinks border is way below where the island is, while conceeding that island itself is not theirs.
So no matter where you shoot, its violating their territory.
|
On December 21 2010 02:23 Getz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2010 01:12 NIJ wrote:On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated Southwest is still disputed. edit: red = NK claim blue = SK claim Is this seriously what NK claims to be theirs? Thats is just ridiculous...
It is absolutely ridiculous from a SK perspective. And thats why anyone who said SK is trying to provoke NK doesnt understand what the fuck is going on.
Its like NK coming to your house and saying "bedroom and the entrance to the door is your property. But the bathroom and the livingroom belongs to us. If you take a shit in our toilet Im gonna punch you in the face." Then China and Russia comes alongs begging you not to take a shit in your toilet because it will anger NK. If you do what they say, your actions accepts the fact that you dont have sovereignty in the house that you claim you own.
|
On December 20 2010 18:10 b_unnies wrote:
China isnt going to be helping North Korea at all. read the war logs, they want Korea to be re-united under south korea
No, I think it is likely China will help North Korea.
1. They do not want to see a unified Korea competing against it. They don't want a stronger ally of US
2. North Korea will not win without China's help. South Korea's army COMBINED with US army will devastate North Korean regime to the ground. They know this. If this happens, South Korea will be the unified Korea, not a equally divided government. They also know that South Korea is a puppet of the US. If South Korea's border touches China, it means the same thing as U.S. touching China in border. They do not want that. Basically they want a BUFFER ZONE between U.S. and themselves, and North Korea is a perfect buffer.
3. When North Korea is about to be defeated, it's likely they will use nukes. China does not want nuke going off near its region.
|
On December 21 2010 03:45 lastmotion wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 18:10 b_unnies wrote:
China isnt going to be helping North Korea at all. read the war logs, they want Korea to be re-united under south korea 2. North Korea will not win without China's help. South Korea's army COMBINED with US army will devastate North Korean regime to the ground. They know this. If this happens, South Korea will be the unified Korea, not a equally divided government. They also know that South Korea is a puppet of the US. If South Korea's border touches China, it means the same thing as U.S. touching China in border. They do not want that. Basically they want a BUFFER ZONE between U.S. and themselves, and North Korea is a perfect buffer. 3. When North Korea is about to be defeated, it's likely they will use nukes. China does not want nuke going off near its region.
2. I don't understand, you're arguing that China won't defend NK because they still want a buffer between the US/ROK and China? SK is not a puppet dude, you've been reading too much NK propaganda letters/news. So again, China wants a buffer, therefore won't help. What???
3. lol noooookz
|
puppet state is a strong word, but SK is defintely on US side. Like a henchman.
1. Is probably still true, but its changing rapidly. I think the rumors are right. China is probably beginning to feel comfortable with the fact SK will be the one reunifying the peninsula. They could always negotiate terms that could prohibit US involvement in exchange for supporting (by not supporting NK) SK's reunification effort.
NK is defintely afraid of US and SK combined. which is why they continuously attempt peace treaty with US. If they can achieve that, they can not worry about getting china aid and deal with SK 1v1.
|
On December 20 2010 18:10 b_unnies wrote:
China isnt going to be helping North Korea at all. read the war logs, they want Korea to be re-united under south korea
I don't think so. Just made me remember when the two Germany's reunited. The British and the Americans weren't really happy about it. Being half korean and half german, I would really like to witness my second reunification live(I can still feel the goosebumps when i think about the fall of the iron curtain). Would be the show of a life time. Anyways, a unified korea seems less likely now than ever.Although i get the feeling that NK is on it's last legs, hence the aggression.
Hope nothing bad happens. Praying to Hana-nim
|
On December 21 2010 01:12 NIJ wrote:Show nested quote +On December 20 2010 22:15 ImFromPortugal wrote:
Its clear that South Korea did not fire into the area that is disputed by North Korea, hence why they have not retaliated Southwest is still disputed. edit: red = NK claim blue = SK claim
The blue area is what the UN declared to be South Korean waters. Sorry, just that your wording made it sound like South Korea was making claims to those waters that were just as unsubstantiated as North Korea's claims. In reality, the UN and most of the international community (except China) recognizes the blue area as South Korean waters.
On December 20 2010 19:12 ShloobeR wrote:
This thread is hilarious
a bunch of people stating that there will be war. a bunch of people weighing in their opinions with absolutely 0 geo-political information about the area other than 'north korea bad'. And then fearmongering spreading like a disease.
Who here really thought that North Korea would decide that now would be a fantastic time to launch missiles into Seoul and enter a war they cannot win
It's unlikely that North Korea wants war. Had this just been a drill that happened last year before the sinking of Cheonan or the shelling of Yeonpyeong, I doubt anyone would have taken this threat from North Korea seriously. The fact of the matter is, North Korea's government is getting bolder and it could be because of Kim Jung-il's announcement of his son (as some have suggested) or it could simply be that they want to be taken more seriously in the international community or it could be for any number of reasons. Really, we've now gotten past the point where we can accurately predict what the North will do. Yes, it seems unlikely the North would engage in a full scale war but had you asked me three months ago if the North would shell a South Korean island I would have said, "not in this decade." With that in mind, I don't think it's naive to think that North Korea may have tried something last night. South Korea certainly prepared for it and I can guarantee you that the Pentagon was on high alert too.
|
youre right. I just couldnt remember on top of my head exactly who else recognized the blue line, so omitted that part out for accuracy. I didnt mean to imply it was only SK claiming that border nor it was unsubstantiated like NKs claim is.
|
Well I suppose we all knew this was coming:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12039477
North Korea 'will not hit back' over Yeonpyeong drills
North Korea says it will not retaliate despite "reckless provocations" from the South, which held live-fire drills on the flashpoint island of Yeonpyeong.
I think we can all settle down now?
|
On December 21 2010 04:40 number1gog wrote:Well I suppose we all knew this was coming: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12039477Show nested quote +North Korea 'will not hit back' over Yeonpyeong drills
North Korea says it will not retaliate despite "reckless provocations" from the South, which held live-fire drills on the flashpoint island of Yeonpyeong. I think we can all settle down now?
Figures, they get everyone all riled up and then do nothing.
|
On December 21 2010 04:41 Getz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2010 04:40 number1gog wrote:Well I suppose we all knew this was coming: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12039477North Korea 'will not hit back' over Yeonpyeong drills
North Korea says it will not retaliate despite "reckless provocations" from the South, which held live-fire drills on the flashpoint island of Yeonpyeong. I think we can all settle down now? Figures, they get everyone all riled up and then do nothing.
i think they would do something when sk isnt expecting... attacking now would be stupid, with Sk ready to counter attack
|
MURICA15980 Posts
It was a bluff and they got called on it. Now they'll do everything they can do make excuses, and probably several months from now blow something up and say it was retaliation for those live exercises.
|
I was kinda hoping NK would do something so we be rid of them once and for all. However, them backing down will only lead to the current situation lasting another 50 years or so while their country and people starve in poverty and the SKs have to keep on living with a thorn on their side.
|
On December 21 2010 04:59 Klogon wrote:
It was a bluff and they got called on it. Now they'll do everything they can do make excuses, and probably several months from now blow something up and say it was retaliation for those live exercises.
Just how they operate, they know if they are the ones to start a war they will get slaughtered but if they are the victim China will come to their aid.
NK is like a little kid, hiding behind an older brother and starting shit knowing they cant finish it alone.
I am glad there will be no war ... for now.
|
well this isn't a good addition to the climax of unfortunate events that will take place december 21st 2012 x_X
and if we assume NK will act as they have, Ordained is right.. maybe NK is trying to make SK shit their pants, waiting for another couple artillery rounds to hit, months down the road..
|
On December 21 2010 05:34 vnlegend wrote:
I was kinda hoping NK would do something so we be rid of them once and for all. However, them backing down will only lead to the current situation lasting another 50 years or so while their country and people starve in poverty and the SKs have to keep on living with a thorn on their side.
uh
starving in poverty sounds better than 'being rid of them once and for all' don't you think
|
On December 21 2010 06:46 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2010 05:34 vnlegend wrote:
I was kinda hoping NK would do something so we be rid of them once and for all. However, them backing down will only lead to the current situation lasting another 50 years or so while their country and people starve in poverty and the SKs have to keep on living with a thorn on their side. uh starving in poverty sounds better than 'being rid of them once and for all' don't you think
Most of the people starving in poverty
is worse than being rid of 'them'=rulers and most of army once and for all.
The problem is getting rid of the rulers+army would also involve a lot of the starving people dying.
And getting rid of the thorn in SK's side would involve a lot of SKoreans dying.
|
the best would be if the people wanted to tear down the goverment from inside :/
|
Or if Kim's successor turns out to be less of a xenophobe.
|
South don't seem happy enough that they conducted the last test, they are planning the "largest-ever live file drill" to be held tomorrow.
I hope South backs down on this one, or this really could be 'one bridge too far'
|
They really are taunting NK arent they lol
|
On December 22 2010 12:22 Biggo wrote:South don't seem happy enough that they conducted the last test, they are planning the "largest-ever live file drill" to be held tomorrow. I hope South backs down on this one, or this really could be 'one bridge too far'
About time they man-ed up.
|
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh snaaaaaaaaaaapppp.. seriously, SK js hit the fan lol
|
Big surprise! SK is indeed trying to test the waters and see if NK really means business. SHOCKER~!!
|
On December 22 2010 12:22 Biggo wrote:South don't seem happy enough that they conducted the last test, they are planning the "largest-ever live file drill" to be held tomorrow. I hope South backs down on this one, or this really could be 'one bridge too far'
this is stupid. they called their bluff, and now they want to stick it in their face?
north korea doesn't care that their bluff got called, they have done this before and will do it again. but such obviously deliberate provocation is just stupid for relations between the two countries.
|
Personally I support all future drills and tests they decide to do because it's about time they stepped up to NK's belligerent attitude rather than stepping back and taking it in the ass. I'm all for SK showing it's a powerful country that can defend itself quite well to remind NK that they very well could bite off more than they can chew should they start shit again. It's risky and very bold, but as I posted before a lot of SK citizens as well as major SK businesses support this stance. They can't act soft or they'll be taken advantage of.
I also have a similar opinion on NK's recent offers. I believe only when they make good on their words/promises should the world give them some slack. They've previously said a bunch of shit to appease the six party talks and never went through with it.
With that said I sincerely hope SK keeps their eyes open for any future attacks. They've been very careful and keep their jets in mid-air standby during the drills should any attack start. After all, the two Koreas really are still at war.
Now for an article on the drills this week:
(LEAD) S. Korean Army to stage massive firing drill to deter N.K. provocationsSEOUL, Dec. 22 (Yonhap) -- South Korea plans to conduct its largest-ever ground and air live-fire drill near the border with North Korea on Thursday, as the South's military remains on alert for the North's surprise provocations not only in the tense western border regions, but also in other unforeseen areas, officials said Wednesday. ![[image loading]](http://img.yonhapnews.co.kr/etc/inner/EN/2010/12/22/AEN20101222007100315_02_i.jpg) This file photo shows an Army live-fire drill held at a range in Pocheon in August. (Yonhap) The Army's combined live-fire exercises, set to occur at a range in Pocheon, north of Seoul, will feature K-9 self-propelled guns, multiple launch rocket systems, anti-aircraft guns, attack helicopters and six Air Force jets, including two F-15K jets, said the officials. "The firing drill for multiple launch rockets has so far been conducted individually. But this time they will be combined with other artillery," said an Army official. Multiple launch rocket launchers are capable of delivering almost 8,000 munitions in less than 60 seconds at ranges exceeding 32 kilometers. A one-star Army general involved in the drill said that the military will conduct a thorough counterstrike on North Korea's artillery positions in the case of any further provocations by the communist state. Separately, the Navy began maritime firing exercises in waters off the east coast on Wednesday that included six naval ships and Lynx anti-submarine helicopters. A Navy official said that the exercise will be held through Friday about 100 kilometers south of the eastern sea maritime border with the North. Nearby Army units will be on heightened vigilance during the drill, the official said. ![[image loading]](http://img.yonhapnews.co.kr/etc/inner/EN/2010/12/22/AEN20101222007100315_01_i.jpg) South Korean Marines remain in combat-ready posture on Yeonpyeong Island in this file photo taken on Dec. 21. (Yonhap) Tensions on the divided peninsula remain high after the North's deadly shelling of the South's Yeonpyeong Island in November, as well as the South's live-fire drill from the same island earlier this week that had been feared to lead to a fresh clash between the two sides. Though the North did not carry out its threat to strike back if the South pushes ahead with the exercise, there are still concerns that the communist nation could stage unforeseen attacks on the South. The defense ministry said that the military is maintaining readiness to strike immediately back at the North in case of provocations in the western land and sea border regions, including the front-line Aegibong hill where the South lit up a giant Christmas tree that Pyongyang sees as psychological warfare. The ministry also plans to keep military alertness at the highest level for the northernmost islands and other border regions for the time being, while continuing to put fighter jets on mid-air standby. Defense Minister Kim Kwan-jin told lawmakers Tuesday that the military will maintain such readiness until North Korean threats drop visibly. Kim also said that new provocations by the North would likely be surprise attacks, and the South is prepared for various scenarios. North Korea has also reportedly deployed more surface-to-ship and surface-to-air missiles along its west coast while keeping fighter jets ready to scramble. The two Koreas are still technically at war as the 1950-53 Korean War ended in a truce, not a peace treaty. The western sea border has been a constant source of military tension between the two sides as the North refuses to recognize the boundary.
Yonhap
|
On December 22 2010 20:08 xBillehx wrote:After all, the two Koreas really are still at war.
so cliche!
Though I agree that SK has the right to, and reason to conduct these military drills, I think the exercises close to the border the other day was ballsy and dangerous considering NK's promises to retaliate.
War is bad mmk
|
North Korea 'ready for sacred war' with the South![[image loading]](http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/50552000/jpg/_50552266_010895348-1.jpg)
North Korea is ready for a "sacred war of justice" using the nuclear deterrent, its armed forces minister has said.
Kim Yong-chun said exercises conducted by South Korea near the border were a preparation for war with the North.
The drill is one of the largest in South Korea's history, involving tanks, helicopters and fighter planes.
Tension has been high since North Korea shelled the South's Yeonpyeong island last month, killing four South Koreans.
South Korean President Lee Myung-bak has promised immediate retaliation to any further Northern attack.
The South Korean army acknowledged that the drill was aimed to display its firepower.
Although the South has conducted 47 military drills this year, this is the largest winter live-fire exercise ever conducted on land.
'Military provocation'
The North earlier branded Seoul's exercises "warmongering" but until now had not threatened the South with any retaliation.
During a meeting in the North Korean capital, Mr Kim, quoted by Pyongyang's Korean Central News Agency, accused the South of preparing for a new Korean War.
"The South Korean puppet forces perpetrated such grave military provocation as renewing their shelling against the DPRK [Democratic People's Republic of Korea] during their recent exercises for a war of aggression in the West Sea [Yellow Sea] of Korea," he said.
"This indicates that the enemy's scenario for aggression aimed at the start of another Korean War, has reached the phase of its implementation."
"The revolutionary armed forces of the DPRK are getting fully prepared to launch a sacred war of justice of Korean style based on the nuclear deterrent at anytime necessary to cope with the enemies' actions deliberately pushing the situation to the brink of a war," he added.
Both China and Russia have called on the South to defuse tensions and US officials too are privately expressing their concern about Seoul's new, more aggressive stance.
South Korea and the US had already been conducting large-scale military exercises, following the apparent torpedoing of a South Korean warship by the North on 26 March, which killed 46 south Korean sailors.
Efforts to redirect the Korean issue back to the negotiating table have been unsuccessful.
China and the North say it is time to return to the six-nation talks about North Korea's nuclear programmes.
But the US, South Korea and Japan have said they will not return to such talks, which have previously involved rewards for the North if it cuts back on nuclear development.
North Korea walked out of the six-party talks in April 2009 and expelled UN nuclear inspectors from the country.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12067735
This does not sound good...
|
Seriously, I'm getting tired of SK's dick-wagging.
Yeah, you got the bigger one, we got it. Tuck 'em away, boys.
On a serious note, I really just don't think that this is a good idea right now. We called their bluff, and that was the right thing to do, and I supported our president's actions until then - but this just seems like taking it a step too far.
I just don't think dick-wagging is appropriate when tens of millions of citizens' lives depend on your actions.
|
On December 23 2010 21:33 Sawajiri wrote:
Seriously, I'm getting tired of SK's dick-wagging.
Yeah, you got the bigger one, we got it. Tuck 'em away, boys.
On a serious note, I really just don't think that this is a good idea right now. We called their bluff, and that was the right thing to do, and I supported our president's actions until then - but this just seems like taking it a step too far.
I just don't think dick-wagging is appropriate when tens of millions of citizens' lives depend on your actions.
After what I've heard so far I think ure god damn right.
Well the nuklear thread is pretty scary... I think this has to be toned down by a huge amount to get things straighten up. I dont think there will ever be a diplomatic meeting between your president and the N-Korean leaders.
I hate to say it, but russia and china are doing the right thing in my eyes, they try to keep the waves low..
If a war is going to start I'm really concerned, because this would be the first time a war starts in a country Im really in some way related to. I think the North wouldnt win the war by any messures, but I'm afraid they could kill Alot of people =/
|
There will never be a full scale conflict.
Lots of strong words and warnings not to provoke.
Lots of military exercises and speculation about the strength and intentions of the North.
Lots of media sensationalism over playing minor issues because it sells.
But this will, never, ever turn into a full scale conflict.
We know this because we know that China wants no part of it, and without China's backing, NK can never take any action.
Everyone else knows this, and you can tell because the stock markets are stable.
If people truly thought that war was likely the markets would show it.
It won't stop the media from scaremongering though, because nobody wants to read that there is no real threat and that everything will be OK.
|
On December 23 2010 22:05 SQUATZ wrote:
There will never be a full scale conflict.
Lots of strong words and warnings not to provoke.
Lots of military exercises and speculation about the strength and intentions of the North.
Lots of media sensationalism over playing minor issues because it sells.
But this will, never, ever turn into a full scale conflict.
We know this because we know that China wants no part of it, and without China's backing, NK can never take any action.
Everyone else knows this, and you can tell because the stock markets are stable.
If people truly thought that war was likely the markets would show it.
It won't stop the media from scaremongering though, because nobody wants to read that there is no real threat and that everything will be OK.
except the millions living in s korea and the thousands that have friends/family there?
lol what a douchebag
|
The North shelled the freaking island, therefore they have no right to forbid the South to conduct military drill in the very same island to protect themselves.
Lol at the nuke threat "the sacred war of justice", let's see justice when you get your ass kicked by an alliance of 50 countries with advanced technologies. I really hope someone bring that Kim dictator to justice (i mean jail), he sucks too much.
|
We know this because we know that China wants no part of it, and without China's backing, NK can never take any action.
Lol, so yeah because Kim is such an intelligent logical thinking leader...and no lunatic fanatic?
except the millions living in s korea and the thousands that have friends/family there?
lol what a douchebag
+1 I couldnt agree more
|
North Korea is putting up a one heck of a show, and I'm surprised so many people are taking them seriously. Nuclear war? haha. If anyone believes that, they may just as well believe Kim Il sung and Kim Jung Il are gods and not human beings. Just another day of tough talks from North Korea. The ironic thing is, as crazy as Kim Jung Il may be, as long as he is alive, there will be no full scale war. Just my thoughts though.
|
Why is this even a discussion? Its obvious its all propaganda , keep people scared , make them fear for their life / homes and they will not even consider how bad they have it in north korea. Make the south look like the bad guys stops the temptation.
|
The ironic thing is, as crazy as Kim Jung Il may be, as long as he is alive, there will be no full scale war.
Where is your argument for that conclusion?
Why is this even a discussion? Its obvious its all propaganda , keep people scared , make them fear for their life / homes and they will not even consider how bad they have it in north korea. Make the south look like the bad guys stops the temptation.
Sure its propaganda, Cpt. Obvious.
But propaganda doesnt equal a bluff or passive mode...
|
On December 23 2010 22:49 ch4ppi wrote:Show nested quote +The ironic thing is, as crazy as Kim Jung Il may be, as long as he is alive, there will be no full scale war. Where is your argument for that conclusion?
I have no arguments, just thoughts. North Korea wants stability of their regime. War does exactly opposite of that. But a threat of war is just enough to achieve internal stability. At least in a totalitarian state like North Korea. If North Korea starts a war, they are saying we don't care if our regime falls. I don't see that happening as long as Kim Jong Il is in charge. Now if he dies, and his young and inexperience son takes over, thats when hell can be unleashed. Again, just my thoughts.
|
On December 23 2010 22:15 HeavOnEarth wrote:
except the millions living in s korea and the thousands that have friends/family there?
lol what a douchebag
What I mean is that stories that everything is OK do not capture the public's attention, the media will always spin things to make the situation look worse than it actually is.
And I like that the last line is all you took away from my post.
On December 23 2010 22:20 ch4ppi wrote:
Lol, so yeah because Kim is such an intelligent logical thinking leader...and no lunatic fanatic?
Yeah bro, that Team America documentary really showed his true colours.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
