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pvsnp
7676 Posts
IEM is in a couple days and if he makes a deep run or perhaps even wins it all, he will once again silence the doubters. Besides, remember that even if worst comes to worst and Inno just powers off for the next couple months, he is still virtually guaranteed a spot at Blizzcon. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On July 25 2017 09:31 pvsnp wrote: Besides, remember that even if worst comes to worst and Inno just powers off for the next couple months, he is still virtually guaranteed a spot at Blizzcon. Well personally i don't really care about blizzcon that much though. In my eyes his stats this year are insane, but he actually has to win some more for it to matter. If he doesn't win one of SSL/GSL/IEM then i am hugely disappointed tbh. He really should do well in all three, everything else is not up to par | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On July 25 2017 09:41 The_Red_Viper wrote: Well personally i don't really care about blizzcon that much though. In my eyes his stats this year are insane, but he actually has to win some more for it to matter. If he doesn't win one of SSL/GSL/IEM then i am hugely disappointed tbh. He really should do well in all three, everything else is not up to par Blizzcon, though it may not be the most difficult tournament, is most certainly the biggest stage. The publicity and recognition that the World Champion receives far outstrips that of any tournament. Even being at Blizzcon is a symbolic validation of being one of the best/most visible players in the world. Just look at how some (ignorant) people still think ByuN is one of the best Terrans, or even the best in the world. Also the prize money for everyone at Blizzcon is fed through a hefty multiplier, which cannot be discounted either. Inno being guaranteed a Blizzcon spot is no small thing. While of course Korean tournaments are extremely important as well (more important in terms of skill, even), Inno himself said that Blizzcon was his goal way back in December 2016. Regarding the upcoming tournaments, it would most certainly be awesome if Inno took one (or all) of the trophies, but the man is human like everyone else, for all that we call him a machine. He is fallible too, and merely because he has shown excellent form as of late is no guarantee of future excellence. I noted this phenomenon months before, which happens to just about every top-tier but seems to have undue influence on INnoVation. Once he starts slaughtering other top-tiers like sheep, fans rush to crown him as some utterly invincible killing machine, which can obviously only end in disappointment because nobody can win everything all the time. While I for one would be delighted to write a hypothetical panegyric about the First Bonjwa of Starcraft II after INnoVation has hypothetically won SSL, GSL, and Blizzcon, I don't anticipate such an event by any means. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
Being at blizzcon is nice and doing well there is important financially and publicity wise. But doing well in korean starleagues is superior and even this IEM now is basically on par with blizzcon. I want Inno to do well in these tournaments to actually show off some titles, get recognition that way. As i said, his stats are insane but only really mean something when he can get some big tournament results with it. It's also not about winning everything, but realistically Innovation only has won SSL and done decently in the other stuff with a winrate of 108–38 (73.97%) in games and 51–14 (78.46%) in matches (offline only) Just to compare it to the most insane year in starcraft history, flash had a winrate of 128 wins - 43 losses (74.85%) in 2010 and that made him win 4 korean starleagues, get 2nd in two more and a 1st place in WCG. Oh and a proleague title. I don't expect Inno to have similar results. But he should do better than ro16 / ro8 in pretty much anything tbh. So yes if he doesn't at least win one of these three tournaments and do well in the other ones i am kinda thinking he underachieves massively. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On July 25 2017 10:08 The_Red_Viper wrote: Well don't get me wrong, everything you said is true but personally i care more about the historical context of the results. Being at blizzcon is nice and doing well there is important financially and publicity wise. But doing well in korean starleagues is superior and even this IEM now is basically on par with blizzcon. I want Inno to do well in these tournaments to actually show off some titles, get recognition that way. As i said, his stats are insane but only really mean something when he can get some big tournament results with it. It's also not about winning everything, but realistically Innovation only has won SSL and done decently in the other stuff with a winrate of 108–38 (73.97%) in games and 51–14 (78.46%) in matches (offline only) Just to compare it to the most insane year in starcraft history, flash had a winrate of 128 wins - 43 losses (74.85%) in 2010 and that made him win 4 korean starleagues, get 2nd in two more and a 1st place in WCG. Oh and a proleague title. I don't expect Inno to have similar results. But he should do better than ro16 / ro8 in pretty much anything tbh. So yes if he doesn't at least win one of these three tournaments and do well in the other ones i am kinda thinking he underachieves massively. I mean, Flash is called God for a reason....and there is only one Flash for a reason too. Bracket luck plays an enormous role in any player's success as well, just as much as any amount of skill. Inno has the potential to be the GOAT of SC2, no doubt, and even if he retired this instant he would still be among the best of the best (#2 or #3 imo). Expecting him to become Flash is kinda....well it's not impossible and maybe not even that improbable, but it seems kind of....churlish? | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
Ofc bracket luck is a thing and even the format of these OSLs and MSLs was different (seeding, etc). I get all of that. I am simply saying that Inno really should do well in everything atm considering his form (stats). Let's imagine a world in which Inno loses in the ro16 in GSL, gets 5th in SSL and maybe a ro8 or ro4 in IEM. That would be incredibly disappointing in my eyes even if he will be at blizzcon  | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On July 25 2017 10:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: Nobody expects him to be Flash, but the win% is similar and comparing his tournament results so far with Flash's there is a huge gap. Ofc bracket luck is a thing and even the format of these OSLs and MSLs was different (seeding, etc). I get all of that. I am simply saying that Inno really should do well in everything atm considering his form (stats). Let's imagine a world in which Inno loses in the ro16 in GSL, gets 5th in SSL and maybe a ro8 or ro4 in IEM. That would be incredibly disappointing in my eyes even if he will be at blizzcon Given his current form, I would expect him to win at least one of the tournaments between now and Blizzcon, sure. But I won't be shocked if he doesn't. Shit happens. Remember also that he is the only player to have won two Korean tournaments this WCS year (plus VSL). He is already doing better than everyone else, even though guys like Stats, soO, and TY have also had incredible form. | ||
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ParksonVN
Australia370 Posts
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matolv
China33 Posts
Importance/Influence:Blizzcon>GSL>SSL>>GSL vs the World>GSL super cup>IEM Difficulty:GSL>=SSL>GSL super cup>IEM>Blizzcon=GSL vs the world 6 straight titles: G.O.A.T in esports 5 titles : G.O.A.T beyond Flash 4 titles: Unique Bonjaw in SC2 3 titles: Most dominating player in SC2 2 titles: Best SC2 player in 2017 1 titles: Not so bad. No title: Big slump He needs more titles rather than the win% at current level. | ||
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Sakat
Croatia1599 Posts
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ParksonVN
Australia370 Posts
On July 25 2017 15:01 matolv wrote: Following 6 Premier Events: Importance/Influence:Blizzcon>GSL>SSL>>GSL vs the World>GSL super cup>IEM Difficulty:GSL>=SSL>GSL super cup>IEM>Blizzcon=GSL vs the world 6 straight titles: G.O.A.T in esports 5 titles : G.O.A.T beyond Flash 4 titles: Unique Bonjaw in SC2 3 titles: Most dominating player in SC2 2 titles: Best SC2 player in 2017 1 titles: Not so bad. No title: Big slump He needs more titles rather than the win% at current level. Actually, if Inno wins 1 more GSL or Blizzcon, he will be considered GOAT unarguably. | ||
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
On July 25 2017 15:01 matolv wrote: Following 6 Premier Events: Importance/Influence:Blizzcon>GSL>SSL>>GSL vs the World>GSL super cup>IEM Difficulty:GSL>=SSL>GSL super cup>IEM>Blizzcon=GSL vs the world 6 straight titles: G.O.A.T in esports 5 titles : G.O.A.T beyond Flash 4 titles: Unique Bonjaw in SC2 3 titles: Most dominating player in SC2 2 titles: Best SC2 player in 2017 1 titles: Not so bad. No title: Big slump He needs more titles rather than the win% at current level. Your message would have been perfect if you went crescendo from no title to 6 ^^ let's hope at least on title like GSL/IEM/etc and the Blizzcon for 2017, it will be GOAT stranding. | ||
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Ej_
47656 Posts
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
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GumBa
United Kingdom31935 Posts
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Ryu3600
Canada469 Posts
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ParksonVN
Australia370 Posts
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gdarky
Latvia78 Posts
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
On July 27 2017 15:17 gdarky wrote: It's looks like INno is playing TvT only, because of IEM and World vs Korea. Main games on the 2 big tournaments will be tvt. So may be it's root of the SSL problems. so you think he prepared a lot TvT ? I really hope it's that, but if he become TvT god to lose 2 times against Trust I'll be mad ^^ | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
He stomped Trust 2-0 (wasn't broadcast but they showed a few clips), then beat Maru to advance in first. | ||
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