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General Discussion - Page 4952

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
March 17 2014 20:27 GMT
#99021
But it IS an abbreviation man. Electric Light Orchestra, I used to listen to that all the time in the 90s and early 2000s.
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 17 2014 20:28 GMT
#99022
On March 18 2014 05:18 msl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 18 2014 05:12 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:07 idonthinksobro wrote:
this experiment proofs little because it is not about real scenarios. Just imagine a support player at 3k mmr, he trys to smoke gank mid, pings mid but his mid just does something stupid and the gank fails he falls behind. If the same game his mid was better and realized that there was a smoke gank incoming they would kill the other mid and get miles ahead.
I wonder if a 3k support player with good understanding but bad mechanics could stay at 4k if given the chance.

These test are always a top rated player smashing some super low scrubs untill he gets reasonable teammates and grinds back up again from there.

The games arnt real? The experiment is to prove there is no ELO hell. If his teammates don't hold him back, then ELO hell can't be real. That's the experiment.


I think the argument is that ELO hell is real, but only for supports.

That's pretty dumb. How is a carry supposed to farm without space to do so? ELO hell is a place created by people who want to not be held accountable for their losses.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
March 17 2014 20:31 GMT
#99023
elo hell?
more like what is a tank
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
cecek
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Czech Republic18921 Posts
March 17 2014 20:35 GMT
#99024
I propose disallowing elo hell discussions in GD and forwarding it to the qq thread. I haven't seen a single new argument in the discussion single the first two weeks of visible MMR. It's the same crap being repeated over and over again.
super gg
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 17 2014 20:41 GMT
#99025
On March 18 2014 05:35 cecek wrote:
I propose disallowing elo hell discussions in GD and forwarding it to the qq thread. I haven't seen a single new argument in the discussion single the first two weeks of visible MMR. It's the same crap being repeated over and over again.

I second the motion, as the discussion is dumb and has been ground up like baby food.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
March 17 2014 20:43 GMT
#99026
Well it's probably my fault, but in my defense somebody PM'd me for the info on Juice's MMR experiment so I was just trying to help them out.
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
Acritter
Profile Joined August 2010
Syria7637 Posts
March 17 2014 21:09 GMT
#99027
On March 18 2014 05:28 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 18 2014 05:18 msl wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:12 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:07 idonthinksobro wrote:
this experiment proofs little because it is not about real scenarios. Just imagine a support player at 3k mmr, he trys to smoke gank mid, pings mid but his mid just does something stupid and the gank fails he falls behind. If the same game his mid was better and realized that there was a smoke gank incoming they would kill the other mid and get miles ahead.
I wonder if a 3k support player with good understanding but bad mechanics could stay at 4k if given the chance.

These test are always a top rated player smashing some super low scrubs untill he gets reasonable teammates and grinds back up again from there.

The games arnt real? The experiment is to prove there is no ELO hell. If his teammates don't hold him back, then ELO hell can't be real. That's the experiment.


I think the argument is that ELO hell is real, but only for supports.

That's pretty dumb. How is a carry supposed to farm without space to do so? ELO hell is a place created by people who want to not be held accountable for their losses.

It's because at lower levels of play, the farming positions are more important, generally speaking. A Shadow Demon played perfectly can't carry the game in the face of feeding 1-3 positions. So, if you're at a lower level of play and are the best player on your team, you'd likely be best off playing a farming position instead of basically gambling that your team will be competent (which sometimes seems to be quite the thing to ask of them).

Where it falls apart is that there's nothing stopping anyone from spending 15 minutes learning how to last hit as [generic mid hero] and then instantly picking mid every game. Nobody at that level of play will know how to gank you.
dont let your memes be dreams - konydora, motivational speaker | not actually living in syria
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
March 17 2014 21:15 GMT
#99028
when is dota 2 gonna add in flavor famous player/fuzzy wuzzy hero names
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
TMG26
Profile Joined July 2012
Portugal2017 Posts
March 17 2014 21:17 GMT
#99029
On March 18 2014 06:09 Acritter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 18 2014 05:28 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:18 msl wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:12 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:07 idonthinksobro wrote:
this experiment proofs little because it is not about real scenarios. Just imagine a support player at 3k mmr, he trys to smoke gank mid, pings mid but his mid just does something stupid and the gank fails he falls behind. If the same game his mid was better and realized that there was a smoke gank incoming they would kill the other mid and get miles ahead.
I wonder if a 3k support player with good understanding but bad mechanics could stay at 4k if given the chance.

These test are always a top rated player smashing some super low scrubs untill he gets reasonable teammates and grinds back up again from there.

The games arnt real? The experiment is to prove there is no ELO hell. If his teammates don't hold him back, then ELO hell can't be real. That's the experiment.


I think the argument is that ELO hell is real, but only for supports.

That's pretty dumb. How is a carry supposed to farm without space to do so? ELO hell is a place created by people who want to not be held accountable for their losses.

It's because at lower levels of play, the farming positions are more important, generally speaking. A Shadow Demon played perfectly can't carry the game in the face of feeding 1-3 positions. So, if you're at a lower level of play and are the best player on your team, you'd likely be best off playing a farming position instead of basically gambling that your team will be competent (which sometimes seems to be quite the thing to ask of them).

Where it falls apart is that there's nothing stopping anyone from spending 15 minutes learning how to last hit as [generic mid hero] and then instantly picking mid every game. Nobody at that level of play will know how to gank you.


If he played well, the 1-3 positions should be ballin' out of control.
Supporter of the situational Blink Dagger on Storm.
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
March 17 2014 21:18 GMT
#99030
On March 18 2014 06:09 Acritter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 18 2014 05:28 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:18 msl wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:12 Plansix wrote:
On March 18 2014 05:07 idonthinksobro wrote:
this experiment proofs little because it is not about real scenarios. Just imagine a support player at 3k mmr, he trys to smoke gank mid, pings mid but his mid just does something stupid and the gank fails he falls behind. If the same game his mid was better and realized that there was a smoke gank incoming they would kill the other mid and get miles ahead.
I wonder if a 3k support player with good understanding but bad mechanics could stay at 4k if given the chance.

These test are always a top rated player smashing some super low scrubs untill he gets reasonable teammates and grinds back up again from there.

The games arnt real? The experiment is to prove there is no ELO hell. If his teammates don't hold him back, then ELO hell can't be real. That's the experiment.


I think the argument is that ELO hell is real, but only for supports.

That's pretty dumb. How is a carry supposed to farm without space to do so? ELO hell is a place created by people who want to not be held accountable for their losses.

It's because at lower levels of play, the farming positions are more important, generally speaking. A Shadow Demon played perfectly can't carry the game in the face of feeding 1-3 positions. So, if you're at a lower level of play and are the best player on your team, you'd likely be best off playing a farming position instead of basically gambling that your team will be competent (which sometimes seems to be quite the thing to ask of them).

Where it falls apart is that there's nothing stopping anyone from spending 15 minutes learning how to last hit as [generic mid hero] and then instantly picking mid every game. Nobody at that level of play will know how to gank you.


A Shadow Demon played perfectly will make the enemy lane feed for the first 10 minutes.

At an MMR where everyone's CSing is shoddy, getting kills is the easiest way to snowball. And support heroes usually have the best skill sets for early game killing.
Average means I'm better than half of you.
Zealos
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United Kingdom3576 Posts
March 17 2014 21:22 GMT
#99031
Let's start a pitchfork against Sigma for abandoning level one after FATA miskilled presence of the dark lord level one?

Rox.kis were level one roshing at the time.
On the internet if you disagree with or dislike something you're angry and taking it too seriously. == Join TLMafia !
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-17 21:25:59
March 17 2014 21:23 GMT
#99032
On March 18 2014 06:22 Zealos wrote:
Let's start a pitchfork against Sigma for abandoning level one after FATA miskilled presence of the dark lord level one?

Rox.kis were level one roshing at the time.

Lets not and say we didn't.
+ Show Spoiler +
yes i intentionally mis-quoted that


Sigma have never been big on sportsmanship (aka they whine a lot for whatever small advantage they can get and are generally pretty french entitled). If they had won, it would have been "a thing", but since they lost I feel like it's just water under the bridge right now. Apparently an Admin was following it up and I'm happy to leave it at that unless the organization wants to pursue further.
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
Sbrubbles
Profile Joined October 2010
Brazil5776 Posts
March 17 2014 21:25 GMT
#99033
Why? They lost anyway.
Bora Pain minha porra!
LuckoftheIrish
Profile Joined November 2011
United States4791 Posts
March 17 2014 21:27 GMT
#99034
Rabble rabble I don't actually care this shit happened in dota 1 all the time
On Twitter @GosuGamers_LotI | Grubby has a huge head!
-FmP-
Profile Joined October 2002
Canada85 Posts
March 17 2014 21:34 GMT
#99035
im 5600 where the hell is my leaderboard message guys
Sn0_Man
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
Tebellong44238 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-17 21:36:37
March 17 2014 21:36 GMT
#99036
On March 18 2014 06:34 -FmP- wrote:
im 5600 where the hell is my leaderboard message guys

I recommend writing GabeN an impassioned hate-letter
(or love-letter, but I bet he gets plenty of those)
LiquidDota StaffSCIENTISTS BAFFLED | 3275929302
LuckoftheIrish
Profile Joined November 2011
United States4791 Posts
March 17 2014 21:37 GMT
#99037
Offer him incentives. Money probably won't work, but try being creative. Maybe a shrine.
On Twitter @GosuGamers_LotI | Grubby has a huge head!
Shaella
Profile Blog Joined January 2013
United States14828 Posts
March 17 2014 21:57 GMT
#99038
Elo hell is a myth and its always been a myth guys.

Also I play core heros because I'm legit better at it than i am at supporting
don't tell me to provide a legend for those charts cause we already got shaella in this thread - eieio | Bulba is my waifu
Daozzt
Profile Joined July 2010
United States1263 Posts
March 17 2014 22:07 GMT
#99039
I am stuck in Elo hell.
cecek
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Czech Republic18921 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-03-17 22:08:58
March 17 2014 22:08 GMT
#99040
http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/20npxx/sigma_vs_qinsane_minute_1/

Omg more drama! Fata literally Hitler. Call the sponsors, boycott Sigma games! omg!

I fucking love reddit.
super gg
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