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General Discussion - Page 2912

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
igotmyown
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4291 Posts
May 24 2013 05:03 GMT
#58221
On May 24 2013 13:10 rabidch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2013 04:19 teapoted wrote:
On May 24 2013 03:31 Qbek wrote:
On May 24 2013 03:30 rabidch wrote:
castle fight was a really good map. i just hated it after 1.13 or whatever though after it split elves. also i really hate the high cooldown on rune of repair.

The game loses all it's charm once you reach the ultra lategame, 100 of each building stage once, it takes a lot of time to lose
I think almost all WC3 custom maps lose their charm once you get really good at them, because all of them were quite terribly balanced for variety.

But that's why our map folders had 1000 maps in them.

I think it's funny how 'mainstream' gaming started making tower defense games a couple of years ago. And all of them seem incredibly lazy compared to the WC3 tower defenses. But even then, all the tower defenses when you 'figured them out' wasn't that fun.

I'd love to see what some of those custom maps given the same care as Dota got from icefrog would be like. A tower wars that is actually strategic and interesting and had a variety of things you could do. Footmen Frenzy that doesn't have some heroes which are just plain ridiculous. Etc...

i had a lot of complaints about the balance of castle fight but the game was actually pretty well designed (maybe why i was so grievous)

of course nobody here talks about gota

What's wrong with castle fight balance?
Emnjay808
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
United States10666 Posts
May 24 2013 06:36 GMT
#58222
On May 24 2013 13:51 Spicy_Curry wrote:
Impossible Bosses was legit in Wc3

Quoted for truth.
Skol
Kishin2
Profile Joined May 2011
United States7534 Posts
May 24 2013 07:45 GMT
#58223
Should just recreate starcraft in dota 2.
zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6343 Posts
May 24 2013 08:23 GMT
#58224
On May 24 2013 16:45 Kishin2 wrote:
Should just recreate starcraft in dota 2.

Rebuilding Warcraft 3 in the dota2 editor is a fun yet ironic idea, the press would have a field day with that one... don't know how doable BW will be because of the game engine but we will see. Damn intellectual property issues.
“What the public criticizes in you, cultivate. It is you.” - Jean Cocteau
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-24 08:31:34
May 24 2013 08:30 GMT
#58225
On May 24 2013 14:03 igotmyown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2013 13:10 rabidch wrote:
On May 24 2013 04:19 teapoted wrote:
On May 24 2013 03:31 Qbek wrote:
On May 24 2013 03:30 rabidch wrote:
castle fight was a really good map. i just hated it after 1.13 or whatever though after it split elves. also i really hate the high cooldown on rune of repair.

The game loses all it's charm once you reach the ultra lategame, 100 of each building stage once, it takes a lot of time to lose
I think almost all WC3 custom maps lose their charm once you get really good at them, because all of them were quite terribly balanced for variety.

But that's why our map folders had 1000 maps in them.

I think it's funny how 'mainstream' gaming started making tower defense games a couple of years ago. And all of them seem incredibly lazy compared to the WC3 tower defenses. But even then, all the tower defenses when you 'figured them out' wasn't that fun.

I'd love to see what some of those custom maps given the same care as Dota got from icefrog would be like. A tower wars that is actually strategic and interesting and had a variety of things you could do. Footmen Frenzy that doesn't have some heroes which are just plain ridiculous. Etc...

i had a lot of complaints about the balance of castle fight but the game was actually pretty well designed (maybe why i was so grievous)

of course nobody here talks about gota

What's wrong with castle fight balance?

first of all, losing a building is not an option, i think its pretty retarded if you lose a building early/mid the game gets near impossible for the losing team if the winning team doesnt waste their money.
towers are slightly too expensive/useless in many cases, some towers are awesome while others are too situational (elf towers vs human and orc towers)
frozen mushrooms hard counter nearly every single beginning flying unit
rune of repairs cooldown is too long -- making some races too strong if they're ahead
some of the hard counters are way too strong in many situations making some buildings overpowered in some and useless in others (red/blue shield generators versus death pits, hex towers, mind control; frozen mushrooms as stated before)
some buildings are pretty garbage in general or are too expensive/situational for what they do (towers of ruin, world freezer, tower of destruction)


i think double damage and quad damage mechanics should be explored to encourage team pushes as well.
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
igotmyown
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4291 Posts
May 24 2013 09:47 GMT
#58226
I would use dd, quad (and there was one more, armor?) when I did all in pushes against greedy people.

I think it's good losing buildings kills you, castle fight should not devolve into late game all the time. You should lose if you get greedy and get hard countered your first 3 buildings.

There are individual hard counters, but racially I never felt there was an impossible matchup.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-24 10:23:35
May 24 2013 10:11 GMT
#58227
On May 24 2013 18:47 igotmyown wrote:
I would use dd, quad (and there was one more, armor?) when I did all in pushes against greedy people.

I think it's good losing buildings kills you, castle fight should not devolve into late game all the time. You should lose if you get greedy and get hard countered your first 3 buildings.

There are individual hard counters, but racially I never felt there was an impossible matchup.

the armor one was limited to aoe and only basically useful on legendaries or synched units, dd and quad were nice but i would like more pushing buffs in the game and one for defense

the problem with such hard counters is that those races become way too limited, why would you try building death pits or medusas shrines (whatever they're called) when for basically the same cost and less lumber they become absolutely useless to build? same with frozen mushrooms, its very hard to actually utilize any air composition against frozen mushrooms. thats when the game gets strategically frustrating since what you can build is becomes so limited at such an early stage.


for example, trolls are usually good against air units right? well the thing with frozen mushrooms is that you basically get a free net every 5 seconds that is global!!!


losing buildings should be bad but its way too much, when a building dies you already lose production and ability to fend off units, but then the bounty is ridiculously high when you lose a single building early on, basically what you get form that is like killing 10 or more of what hte building builds (non legendary) in one swing. its just too strong.
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
eieio
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States14512 Posts
May 24 2013 11:37 GMT
#58228
So this TD discussion inspired me to spend way too long getting Frozen Throne running(I don't have a windows machine anymore) and I just finished my first game of Sprout TD in years. I barely remember which towers build into each other/what my strategies were but it's still super fun. I highly recommend it, hopefully it'll be ported to Dota 2 someday :D
LiquidDota Staff
TL+ Member
yyfpulls
Profile Joined November 2012
United States2185 Posts
May 24 2013 14:19 GMT
#58229
Castle Fight was good fun. CivWars or Civilization something like that was fun too.
Don't Starve is definitely based off one of the survival maps (one with trolls) in war3.
Incze
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Romania2058 Posts
May 24 2013 15:17 GMT
#58230
Dendi streaming his amazing invoker
Yay!
Religion: Buckethead
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
May 24 2013 16:05 GMT
#58231
Not so sure what to think of it

http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1ey95p/select_is_streaming_sc2/ca4ytny

He said that he might switch back to SC2, also some stuff about Mini removing his Qpad tag and playing a lot less. Given their recent results(or lack thereof) it wouldn't suprise me.

WriterXiao8~~
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42416 Posts
May 24 2013 16:06 GMT
#58232
I'm sure they'll find replacements if needed
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
Comeh
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States18919 Posts
May 24 2013 16:07 GMT
#58233
On May 25 2013 01:05 Kipsate wrote:
Not so sure what to think of it

http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/1ey95p/select_is_streaming_sc2/ca4ytny

He said that he might switch back to SC2, also some stuff about Mini removing his Qpad tag and playing a lot less. Given their recent results(or lack thereof) it wouldn't suprise me.


Losing mini means losing their best player.

Would be a huge blow to them, and maybe a step up for mini (EG.MINI :D)
ヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノDELETE ICEFROGヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(
toemn
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany915 Posts
May 24 2013 16:08 GMT
#58234
On May 13 2013 03:35 toemn wrote:
anyone else thinking that the pandas will disband/change roster after losing the qualifiers? i doubt that singsing is sticking to them for months and months of poor results.. poor sing


called it.
http://en.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comments/1eym82/qpad_to_switch_players/

kappa
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
May 24 2013 16:10 GMT
#58235
Kappa indeed, well not that suprising I guess.
WriterXiao8~~
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42416 Posts
May 24 2013 16:11 GMT
#58236
James was also looking apartments in Sweden for the Dota players earlier this week. So obviously the bootcamp is over/players rather live somewhere else than in the studiohouse.
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
cilinder007
Profile Joined August 2010
Slovenia7251 Posts
May 24 2013 16:11 GMT
#58237
nouuva
Volskies
Profile Joined October 2012
Australia41 Posts
May 24 2013 16:12 GMT
#58238
Great for Mini to be leaving that sinking ship, sucks for singsing who has improved alot to be staying as he and waga owns the team, and isn't going until march next year.
SKC
Profile Joined October 2010
Brazil18828 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-24 16:14:23
May 24 2013 16:12 GMT
#58239
2GD said some time ago Select was visiting his family to decide his future, maybe even going back to SC2. Really not unexpected. The Mini thing is fairly new, but we don't know much about that besides the missing tag.
Gosi
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Sweden9072 Posts
May 24 2013 16:13 GMT
#58240
I guess Mini either quits comp dota or has a better offer going on? Can't see them kicking him, but maybe they did? Not so fond of Waga and jrx anyway and after TI3 with the standard team shuffling maybe Sing can cook up some decent lineup.
[13:40] <Qbek> gosi i dreanmt about you
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