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General Discussion - Page 2795

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
SilverStar
Profile Joined January 2012
Sweden18511 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-10 10:01:27
May 10 2013 10:00 GMT
#55881
Anyone else getting connecting to dota 2 network thing?

Edit: Worked after 2 minutes
majava
Profile Joined May 2012
Finland248 Posts
May 10 2013 10:01 GMT
#55882
You can all have your arbitrary measures of tryharding, but in the end it doesn't mean anything. When I started Dota 1 many years ago, correct buildorders and reading guides were the stuff 1 % of players did. It was not uncommon to play with someone who viewed lasthitting unfair or tryhard if you will. One memory which really stuck to me is when I once ganged bot lane with venge at about lvl 5 or so. Apparently enemies viewed that as a "rat" tarctic. To them ganging was tryharding.

In the end it is all about your perspective. In the MM I am currently in dota 2, picking somewhat intelligently is almost required and lastpicking void when only offlane is available will get you flak. Level 1 wards are there in 95% of games. For someone else these are all tryharding, but to me and most of the people in my MM they are a normal thing which is to be expected.
Firebolt145
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Lalalaland34507 Posts
May 10 2013 10:02 GMT
#55883
On May 10 2013 19:00 SilverStar wrote:
Anyone else getting connecting to dota 2 network thing?

Every time I play with Nyovne I wish I got this instead.
Moderator
SilverStar
Profile Joined January 2012
Sweden18511 Posts
May 10 2013 10:06 GMT
#55884
Opened 2 new chests and got this:

[image loading]

Broodmother taunt and Disruptor Hammer.
NeonFlare
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
Finland1307 Posts
May 10 2013 10:08 GMT
#55885
On May 10 2013 18:43 Velr wrote:
Tryharding = 4/5 stack picking in AP as if it were CM whiteout bans and playing accordingly.

I have nothing against it, it just tends to lead to very onesided games and you wonder "why don't you go CM?".


This is pretty much why I play less AP these days, though I understand it's good way to increase your ratings to raise someone out from the lower levels so they can play more decent games when solo or smaller stack. It wouldn't be so bad if your team reacted to it and went with picks of same level, but usually it's 1-3 random rolls and rest of the picks either fill the lineup for decent lanes or in worse case pick whatever. It seems these unrestricted stacks get more common the higher your rating gets.

Another reason for some people to pick those heroes could be, that they are so often banned or not avaiable in other modes so they can practise them for those CM matches that let them actually slip through bans.

I'd really like them to implement a mode where every player had 1 Ban and they can do it simultaneously like picks in AP, something like 1 min time and it randoms if nothing is chosen, then same for picks. It could work at all skill levels as you could use your ban to pick off a hero you absolutely loathe and don't want to play against or consider imba.
cecek
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Czech Republic18921 Posts
May 10 2013 10:09 GMT
#55886
Don't equip the taunt. Apparently it crashes the game right now.
super gg
SilverStar
Profile Joined January 2012
Sweden18511 Posts
May 10 2013 10:10 GMT
#55887
On May 10 2013 19:09 cecek wrote:
Don't equip the taunt. Apparently it crashes the game right now.

Implying that I would play broodmother in a pub.
tauon
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Australia1278 Posts
May 10 2013 10:11 GMT
#55888
'Try-harding' doesn't bother me. The MMR system balances around the fact they tryhard. They are at the correct MMR for how they play.
Road to 6sange
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
May 10 2013 10:12 GMT
#55889
On reddit they said if you equip heroes with taunt and pick it, game might crash or something.
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
eieio
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States14512 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-10 10:38:33
May 10 2013 10:28 GMT
#55890
On May 10 2013 17:05 sandyph wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 10 2013 16:08 NB wrote:
On May 10 2013 15:49 eieio wrote:
On May 10 2013 15:31 sandyph wrote:
On May 10 2013 10:49 run.at.me wrote:
I'm sorry but there are definitely try hards in dota - while the game is competitive, it's also just a game - yet you see the nerds picking the ez nub heroes like nyx (seriously.. you don't pick nyx unless your a try hard noob)

They are labelled try hards because it is the equivalent of cheese in sc2.. Strategies that are much harder to counter than to execute.

While cheese in sc2 was generally accepted, nobody liked versing it and nobody respected it.

I don't cry when I see noob picks, but I definitely think you're bad



yeah will just put this here

http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win-part-1.html

ps. I dont even like the guy but he bring some valid points

In another one of his articles Sirlin actually talks about the idea of "soft bans". In Japan, some characters in fighting games are recognized as being OP against most other characters in the game, making the game a lot less fun because there are so few characters worth playing. So people just have kind of an unwritten rule against playing the character even though he isn't actually banned in competitive.

I have nothing against playing to win, especially in competitive play but in casual play as well. Additionally I definitely think that people like run.at.me are overreacting and are way off base. That being said, I definitely understand the frustration of playing against 5-stacks/the same op heroes over and over again.

Sirlin also has an article(I believe it's a followup to playing to win) that acknowledges the point that Yango makes about playing to improve vs playing to win. MM is different from competitive matches, and the "playing to win" attitude doesn't necessarily apply as much in MM as it does in competitive, where you should abuse the fuck out of anything you can in order to win.

we did have softban in dota... Many tournaments in dota1 considering Lonedruid and Lycan or even shadow demon invoker to be default ban. Mek, necro, guinsoo... are limited per team etc.. Right now our softban is Armlet on bear, if that was too game breaking, Valve would have hot fixed by now? However they spent time to fix Slark dark pact instead :-/


the soft ban in Dota and in the case of Super SF 2:CE Akuma (iirc) are different.
SSF2:CE Akuma is just broken and unlike Dota, there's no way to quickly fix it, that's way the soft ban was introduced.

while the case of Armlet on bear, it get soft banned due to Dota1 parity ken so it's not the same kind of thing.

a more apt analogy is Chen's controlling Roshan a few patch ago.

Akuma is soft banned in some places but hard banned in a lot of others. Akuma is just unbeatable. Old Sagat is soft banned in Japan because he makes the game less interesting even though he is beatable by a select group of characters. That's the soft ban that I think is more applicable here(and to me the more interesting soft ban in general).

Most competitive players would just stop you if you tried to pick Akuma, and you straight up wouldn't be allowed to in a competitive setting. Like Metaknight in Brawl or something. Nobody is gonna stop you from picking Old Sagat, but from what I understand a lot of Japanese players have created a culture where he isn't played because it improves the game.
LiquidDota Staff
TL+ Member
BlitzerSC
Profile Joined May 2011
Italy8800 Posts
May 10 2013 10:44 GMT
#55891
Is the EUW server exploding again ? :|
NB
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Netherlands12045 Posts
May 10 2013 10:46 GMT
#55892
On May 10 2013 19:44 BlitzerSC wrote:
Is the EUW server exploding again ? :|

wow thank god my game just end before people in chat said server down... about time to cook something and watch VG > LGD.cn :D
Im daed. Follow me @TL_NB
BlitzerSC
Profile Joined May 2011
Italy8800 Posts
May 10 2013 10:47 GMT
#55893
Welp, I was practicing last hitting in a private match so I don't really care either :D .
duoform
Profile Joined August 2012
Spain5180 Posts
May 10 2013 10:53 GMT
#55894


This is amazing...
"I really like Marauders and Marines." - Flash
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
May 10 2013 10:57 GMT
#55895
On May 10 2013 19:28 eieio wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 10 2013 17:05 sandyph wrote:
On May 10 2013 16:08 NB wrote:
On May 10 2013 15:49 eieio wrote:
On May 10 2013 15:31 sandyph wrote:
On May 10 2013 10:49 run.at.me wrote:
I'm sorry but there are definitely try hards in dota - while the game is competitive, it's also just a game - yet you see the nerds picking the ez nub heroes like nyx (seriously.. you don't pick nyx unless your a try hard noob)

They are labelled try hards because it is the equivalent of cheese in sc2.. Strategies that are much harder to counter than to execute.

While cheese in sc2 was generally accepted, nobody liked versing it and nobody respected it.

I don't cry when I see noob picks, but I definitely think you're bad



yeah will just put this here

http://www.sirlin.net/articles/playing-to-win-part-1.html

ps. I dont even like the guy but he bring some valid points

In another one of his articles Sirlin actually talks about the idea of "soft bans". In Japan, some characters in fighting games are recognized as being OP against most other characters in the game, making the game a lot less fun because there are so few characters worth playing. So people just have kind of an unwritten rule against playing the character even though he isn't actually banned in competitive.

I have nothing against playing to win, especially in competitive play but in casual play as well. Additionally I definitely think that people like run.at.me are overreacting and are way off base. That being said, I definitely understand the frustration of playing against 5-stacks/the same op heroes over and over again.

Sirlin also has an article(I believe it's a followup to playing to win) that acknowledges the point that Yango makes about playing to improve vs playing to win. MM is different from competitive matches, and the "playing to win" attitude doesn't necessarily apply as much in MM as it does in competitive, where you should abuse the fuck out of anything you can in order to win.

we did have softban in dota... Many tournaments in dota1 considering Lonedruid and Lycan or even shadow demon invoker to be default ban. Mek, necro, guinsoo... are limited per team etc.. Right now our softban is Armlet on bear, if that was too game breaking, Valve would have hot fixed by now? However they spent time to fix Slark dark pact instead :-/


the soft ban in Dota and in the case of Super SF 2:CE Akuma (iirc) are different.
SSF2:CE Akuma is just broken and unlike Dota, there's no way to quickly fix it, that's way the soft ban was introduced.

while the case of Armlet on bear, it get soft banned due to Dota1 parity ken so it's not the same kind of thing.

a more apt analogy is Chen's controlling Roshan a few patch ago.

Akuma is soft banned in some places but hard banned in a lot of others. Akuma is just unbeatable. Old Sagat is soft banned in Japan because he makes the game less interesting even though he is beatable by a select group of characters. That's the soft ban that I think is more applicable here(and to me the more interesting soft ban in general).

Most competitive players would just stop you if you tried to pick Akuma, and you straight up wouldn't be allowed to in a competitive setting. Like Metaknight in Brawl or something. Nobody is gonna stop you from picking Old Sagat, but from what I understand a lot of Japanese players have created a culture where he isn't played because it improves the game.

theres only one TIGER in dota2 though
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Zealos
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
United Kingdom3576 Posts
May 10 2013 11:41 GMT
#55896
So solo matchmaking basically does nothing? No visible rank or anything?
On the internet if you disagree with or dislike something you're angry and taking it too seriously. == Join TLMafia !
Firebolt145
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Lalalaland34507 Posts
May 10 2013 11:42 GMT
#55897
On May 10 2013 20:41 Zealos wrote:
So solo matchmaking basically does nothing? No visible rank or anything?

All it does is ensure you only play with people who are also solo. They haven't announced anything else regarding it so far.
Moderator
SilverStar
Profile Joined January 2012
Sweden18511 Posts
May 10 2013 11:43 GMT
#55898
On May 10 2013 20:41 Zealos wrote:
So solo matchmaking basically does nothing? No visible rank or anything?

No. It's just for queueing. You will never have a visible ranking. Get it out of your head.
unkkz
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Norway2196 Posts
May 10 2013 11:45 GMT
#55899
Since i am not in the know how, the guy main commentating for BTS - invited to TI3? So soothing to listen to and doesn't miss call players intentions as much as Tobi.
Firebolt145
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Lalalaland34507 Posts
May 10 2013 11:46 GMT
#55900
On May 10 2013 20:45 unkkz wrote:
Since i am not in the know how, the guy main commentating for BTS - invited to TI3? So soothing to listen to and doesn't miss call players intentions as much as Tobi.

That's LD, and yes he has been invited to TI3.
Moderator
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