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On October 10 2012 19:37 Prime`Rib wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 18:57 Kupon3ss wrote:On October 10 2012 18:47 PrinceXizor wrote:the heroes that typically get BKB is what i meant, and i explained later on, but i was saying a lot of pub strategy is just spam spells and hope for the best so a bkb makes you immune tot he most prominent strategy, and being unhindered lets you work on doing what you need to in fights. the bkb up time is your window. On October 10 2012 18:46 Itsmedudeman wrote:
But who cares about strategically raising your mmr when you'd have to play like that every game to maintain it? Unless we're starting that whole "ELO hell" shit in dota 2. Nah no ELO hell, though there is definitely a bad time to play to try to improve mmr. anytime there is an influx of new players or a new patch, bad time to be in anything below very high. >.< Games from normal to bottom of very high will often have a couple or more new players then. >.< pretty bad. ^ see that's the kind of personal experience of one part of the mmr ladder that I assume that blahz0r was having problems with The best way to advance mmr is by winning your games, as the best way to do so is by being a better player than others in your bracket. Its not "something you do to climb ladder", rather the things you do to improve as a player that naturally improves your ability to play the game and make decisions that makes you better and rise naturally. You can literally just play all -ap, hit the random button at the start of the game and just play that hero "properly" and it still doesn't take very long to get to "very high mmr" if that's where you belong (sure it might take marginally longer) the idea that you have to do anything besides just playing proper dota to climb elo is a bit absurd Impossible to get to VH just by random hero every game. When you get close to VH bracket, people starts to be tryhards and picks proper heroes to win the game.
Of course it's possible. Harder, yes, but definatelly not impossible. And not doing so would mean you would have to keep doing "tryhard" picks to keep yourself on that bracket, which is dumb if what you want is to random/etc. Saying it's impossible is the same as saying noone randoms or picks bad heroes in very high, which is just not true.
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it's probably easier to get to VH with random every game if you are in the top 25% of VH. extra gold gives you such an advantage. free quelling on every hero is pretty good for denying last hitting in lane.
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Qb shouldn't help with denying
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On October 10 2012 19:49 PrinceXizor wrote:
it's probably easier to get to VH with random every game if you are in the top 25% of VH. extra gold gives you such an advantage. free quelling on every hero is pretty good for denying last hitting in lane.
more like extra gold lets u open boots orb of venom on all melee heroes like a true man
edit: and veno for the synergies
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On October 10 2012 19:50 Yoshi- wrote:
Qb shouldn't help with denying
Gives bonus attack damage against non-hero units, depending on the type of hero you are.
Bonus Damage (melee): +32%
Bonus Damage (ranged): +12%
Umm... why? You do more damage to creeps so you can deny them earlier. Does it not work on allied creeps?
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On October 10 2012 19:52 Kupon3ss wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 19:49 PrinceXizor wrote:
it's probably easier to get to VH with random every game if you are in the top 25% of VH. extra gold gives you such an advantage. free quelling on every hero is pretty good for denying last hitting in lane. more like extra gold lets u open boots orb of venom on all melee heroes like a true man edit: and veno for the synergies
touche..
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On October 10 2012 18:35 Kipsate wrote:
The easy way is to que with your (competent) teammates
The middle way is to pick a pubstomp hero or a hero who can function well in a pub, this can range from Furion to Pudge(provided you are an excellent Pudge) to Night Stalker or even Bounty Hunter.
The hard way is to always pick whatever your team needs, in some cases a good support will have a large influence on the laning stage and thus the game, Rubick is possibly the best one for this.(in my personal experience when you hit the higher mmr brackets this becomes the best way together with pickig Furion, I could be wrong though)
This is very good advice to follow if you want to win more matchmaking games. I'm not sure I would say picking what your team needs is "the hard way" though, as that's typically what I end up doing, and that works WAY better than just picking X pubstomper hero and hoping the rest of your team are competent enough to pick a lineup that doesn't suck.
Also, I personally tend to stick to a fairly small pool of heroes when playing roles that I'm less comfortable with, ie if I'm playing support, I almost exclusively play venomancer and rubick, if I'm jungling, hardly anything but enigma or dark seer, while if we need a mid hero, I'm far more experienced in doing that, so I can play pretty much anything I feel like, and I think that this is something that helps quite a bit with trying to win games.
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On October 10 2012 19:55 valheru wrote:Gives bonus attack damage against non-hero units, depending on the type of hero you are. Bonus Damage (melee): +32% Bonus Damage (ranged): +12% Umm... why? You do more damage to creeps so you can deny them earlier. Does it not work on allied creeps?
Doesn't work on allied creeps.
http://www.playdota.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2183
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On October 10 2012 19:37 Prime`Rib wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 18:57 Kupon3ss wrote:On October 10 2012 18:47 PrinceXizor wrote:the heroes that typically get BKB is what i meant, and i explained later on, but i was saying a lot of pub strategy is just spam spells and hope for the best so a bkb makes you immune tot he most prominent strategy, and being unhindered lets you work on doing what you need to in fights. the bkb up time is your window. On October 10 2012 18:46 Itsmedudeman wrote:
But who cares about strategically raising your mmr when you'd have to play like that every game to maintain it? Unless we're starting that whole "ELO hell" shit in dota 2. Nah no ELO hell, though there is definitely a bad time to play to try to improve mmr. anytime there is an influx of new players or a new patch, bad time to be in anything below very high. >.< Games from normal to bottom of very high will often have a couple or more new players then. >.< pretty bad. ^ see that's the kind of personal experience of one part of the mmr ladder that I assume that blahz0r was having problems with The best way to advance mmr is by winning your games, as the best way to do so is by being a better player than others in your bracket. Its not "something you do to climb ladder", rather the things you do to improve as a player that naturally improves your ability to play the game and make decisions that makes you better and rise naturally. You can literally just play all -ap, hit the random button at the start of the game and just play that hero "properly" and it still doesn't take very long to get to "very high mmr" if that's where you belong (sure it might take marginally longer) the idea that you have to do anything besides just playing proper dota to climb elo is a bit absurd Impossible to get to VH just by random hero every game. When you get close to VH bracket, people starts to be tryhards and picks proper heroes to win the game.
Yeah this isn't true at all, last game I played like 7 players or something randomed, and there was only one repick, because he randomed meepo.
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glad to see singsing back :D
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On October 10 2012 19:57 Yoshi- wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 19:55 valheru wrote:On October 10 2012 19:50 Yoshi- wrote:
Qb shouldn't help with denying Gives bonus attack damage against non-hero units, depending on the type of hero you are. Bonus Damage (melee): +32% Bonus Damage (ranged): +12% Umm... why? You do more damage to creeps so you can deny them earlier. Does it not work on allied creeps? Doesn't work on allied creeps.
the idea was dealing much more damage to their creeps frees up time to deny since you are no longer competing with time when the enemy creeps break kill threshold much sooner than allied ones. Did i explain that well. the main reason people miss last hits or denies is timing, it's hard to get every last hit and every deny because you only have so much time, you "get more time" by having the window for one side increase.
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On October 10 2012 20:01 PrinceXizor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 19:57 Yoshi- wrote:On October 10 2012 19:55 valheru wrote:On October 10 2012 19:50 Yoshi- wrote:
Qb shouldn't help with denying Gives bonus attack damage against non-hero units, depending on the type of hero you are. Bonus Damage (melee): +32% Bonus Damage (ranged): +12% Umm... why? You do more damage to creeps so you can deny them earlier. Does it not work on allied creeps? Doesn't work on allied creeps. the idea was dealing much more damage to their creeps frees up time to deny since you are no longer competing with time when the enemy creeps break kill threshold much sooner than allied ones. Did i explain that well. the main reason people miss last hits or denies is timing, it's hard to get every last hit and every deny because you only have so much time, you "get more time" by having the window for one side increase.
If we go for that hardcore-useless-totally-does-not-apply-in-a-real-game-theory-crafting than you could also argue that by killing the enemy creeps while they are on higher HP, will result in you pushing the lane, which will in the end normally only result in you losing cs.
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it does apply in a real game. play a game with qblade play a game without qblade you get more denies and last hits with qblade than not. pushing a lane shouldn't matter at all in mid, shouldn't matter much in safe lane with good support pulling (especially on dire) and doesn't matter in the hard lane because you're either running an aggro tri or offlaning with a hero that doesn't get to spend much time farming anyway.
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Pushing the lane in the safe lane matters A LOT if you're vs a solo from the other team, as you ideally want your support to just spend all his time on zoning their solo out of xp range, and if the lane ends up pushing, he gets way less space to do that, and eventually you will give their solo some xp instead of keeping him at level 1 with no xp at all.
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You are saying pushing the lane doesn't matter at mid, doesn't matter at the safe lane and doesn't matter at the hard lane. Which means lane control is useless, which is obviously not true.
Apart from what Canas said, pushing the hard lane matters, because if the enemy team screws up and the lane is near your tower, you would love to keep it that way so you can get xp and maybe even last hits. Just because you go offlane and isn't able to spend that much time farming doesn't mean you don't want free xp and gold if you can have it. Even on an offensive trilane keeping the lane not pushed is good because you have more control of the lane and the opposing trilane has a harder time. If the wave is at their tower you will never get kills without diving. And on mid you can be safer from ganks and not have to worry about high ground misses if the lane is in a good position, but things like rune control obviously change it quite often anyway. There is still a correct time when you want to push your lane.
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I think we've got a shikyo over here
as expected of a member of the TL dota all-star team
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To add to this discussion, I found it much better to turn off the auto-attack option (I had previously turned it on because I was too used to it after all those years of dota) and not worry about moving around or using stop, because I would really screw me up sometimes on heroes with fast pre-swing animations, though it does take some time to get used to it.
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:/ the amount of pushing done from last hitting from a quelling blade vs not doesn't matter. at least get context right guys geez
i was saying a quelling blade doesn't = loss of lane control.
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geez you guys like to jump on to any comment you can take out of context
This was supposed to be an edit -.-
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still not worth getting over a stout shield that allows you to tank creeps when.. say... you are farming under your tower or want to get aggresive and attract creep aggro. Oh, but its an excelent item once you get your battlefury on your anti-mage as it's guaranteed to pay itself since you'll be eating those neutral creeps 32% faster.
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EPT
