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General Discussion - Page 1187
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Emnjay808
United States10666 Posts
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
Anyways, I know some people in this thread probably played way back then. I only hazily know a few details about the first few versions of all-stars. It's not really a usual situation for someone learning... anyone have any advice for helping him learn? (As in key differences ... he claims 5v5 fights were rarer) | ||
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teapoted
United Kingdom24425 Posts
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pap0t
Philippines279 Posts
On October 07 2012 07:47 Nevuk wrote: I've got a friend who used to play RoC era dota (he recognized Eul's name but apparently hated the first/earlier versions of all-stars and went to play other games). Trying to introduce him to the game got him randoming pretty much all the time and he plays vs bot games on his own. He still hasn't played every hero, 81 matches so far so he's not giving up on it. He claimed he was pretty high level at it and I didn't believe him at first (apparently jungling was waaaay different as dk was a jungler and had the same skill set. He was talking about siegers and defenders and etc.) but he is improving faster than any other player I've seen try to start playing the game. Anyways, I know some people in this thread probably played way back then. I only hazily know a few details about the first few versions of all-stars cs. It's not really a usual situation for someone learning... anyone have any advice for helping him learn? (As in key differences ... he claims 5v5 fights were rarer) Plenty of ways to play Dota. Best way to learn is to get at least decent on every hero there is. That way you will be able to fully utilized not just your hero but your team heroes as well. Counter-picking is also very important, and it will come naturally as one progress thru playing the game over and over. @duckii It is a news coverage about how fascinating is dota is to the younger kids and how it is destroying their lives. Talking about how the kid plays around 7+ hours in a net cafe even if a storm brewing outside. He will never be absent from dota, he says. 50cents an hour + 15 to 16usd for bets a week. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On October 07 2012 07:52 teapoted wrote: You don't have to go back very far for 5v5 fights to be rarer. Mainly because people were worse at the game, they were more concerned with what they were doing and building their hero. The laning phase was thus much longer, and you really only grouped as 5 to finish the game. This is pre-frozen throne, so it's not back a little while, it's back in like 2005 to Eul's final RoC dota version. (I've played it exactly once and it was years ago). I have realized that him being a high skill level could be entirely true but that the skill ceiling has been raised immensely in that time period and it's also been seven or eight years since he played. It is nice not to have to teach someone how to lasthit, the importance of towers, mana management, etc. but it's relative. He has some just strange weaknesses in his play like randomly buying a magic stick as a starting item or neglecting to buy wards/chicken as a support (in fairness he doesn't know the ward spots). I get the feeling he wasn't really a support player. He said he was primarily a jungler when I asked him and RoC era jungler apparently translates very differently. His laning phase is good for a player of his experience (ie he might die or give up first blood but I've never seen him just feed and typically he wins his lane). His teamfighting has also surprised me as it's always quite good unless he's on a new hero. It's knowing when to TP (not in the sense of TPing out of danger, despite not buying wards his map awareness is decent, but just if he should TP to defend that tower or help out in that fight. Not really something you can teach, I know), where to go to get farm as a carry, mid-game stuff that's the issue. He tends to fall further and further behind unless it's sort of a "win teamfight -> push throne" scenario at 30 minutes. A large weakness was that his understanding of a blink dagger is um... poor to say the least. Explaining how to use blink on a hero like ES might seem simple but saying just "you blink into the middle of their team and ult them" isn't accurate as then he saved his blink for teamfights and didn't know the range on it, didn't use it to chase or initiate with long range fissures, etc. He also seems to think we're really far behind a lot whenever he himself is doing poorly (or in one case as earthshaker actually doing well but not realizing he was). That's nothing to do with someone being a new player to me though, plenty of players seem to feel that way and at least he asks me if we're losing. | ||
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
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Gandalf
Pakistan1905 Posts
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
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LAN-f34r
New Zealand2099 Posts
Who would have thought? | ||
blahz0r
3030 Posts
On October 07 2012 11:11 LAN-f34r wrote: Turns out that jungle sylla into ignoring your bear completely and going pure DPS (next to no survivability) on your hero then divine without aegis is actually a bad idea. Who would have thought? Just had a sniper do that and guess what, we won =x https://dotabuff.com/matches/47143452 | ||
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On October 07 2012 11:11 LAN-f34r wrote: Turns out that jungle sylla into ignoring your bear completely and going pure DPS (next to no survivability) on your hero then divine without aegis is actually a bad idea. Who would have thought? try laning sylla ignoring bear and going for the steroid first and becoming a ranged right clicker | ||
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Mataza
Germany5364 Posts
On October 07 2012 11:43 kdgns wrote: try laning sylla ignoring bear and going for the steroid first and becoming a ranged right clicker I hate those. Any thoughts on Magnus jungle? I´ve seen someone do it, was able to later gank him a couple of times, but noticed it very late. Tried it a bit myself, doublestacked medium camp at 0:51, clear at with wavepull at 1:16, instant level 2 is a good start. It´s a bit awkward and bumpy, but so is Bloodseeker in woods. You can stack a hard camp multiple times and clear it with chockwave, but that just opens another can of worms, skillprogression and mana(You want at least Shockwave 3 for that and need at least 3-4 casts). You could go+ Show Spoiler [skillbuild] + empower/ shockwave/ emp/ wave/ emp/ wave/ wave Itemwise the closest thing I know is Naix, so begin shield+axe and progress to armlet+treads. The helm is a huge performance boost, but I think for farmspeed 1 gloves of haste should still be gotten first. If someone has bright ideas, please share. Especially a way to get a cheap jungle core to get dagger faster. | ||
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hunts
United States2113 Posts
So doom is probably my favorite hero, has been for a while. Don't think he's played in tournaments anymore though, and I don't really know how others play him. I've been mainly playing him as a hard carry, though I have some friends yelling at me about how he's not a carry. I've been always going midas first on him, do most people do that or skip midas to get some items up earlier for the mid game? I've mostly been going either midas, phase, orchid, lothars, AC,, satanic/abyssal, or midas, phase, vanguard, radiance, AC, satanic/abyssal. What do you people think of those builds, good/bad? Are there better? I'm really not a fan of playing doom as more of a caster like some people like to, doesn't feel like he fits that role. | ||
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Dead9
United States4725 Posts
probably open shield+hatchet+pot > bottle or roh or soulring morbid mark > mom might work as well but it's kind of cheesy shockwave > empower > skewer edit: also if you stack a camp you can ulti it at 6 for easy money/exp | ||
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Talesavo
Canada59 Posts
On October 07 2012 07:47 Nevuk wrote: I've got a friend who used to play RoC era dota (he recognized Eul's name but apparently hated the first/earlier versions of all-stars and went to play other games). Trying to introduce him to the game got him randoming pretty much all the time and he plays vs bot games on his own. He still hasn't played every hero, 81 matches so far so he's not giving up on it. He claimed he was pretty high level at it and I didn't believe him at first (apparently jungling was waaaay different as dk was a jungler and had the same skill set. He was talking about siegers and defenders and etc.) but he is improving faster than any other player I've seen try to start playing the game. Anyways, I know some people in this thread probably played way back then. I only hazily know a few details about the first few versions of all-stars. It's not really a usual situation for someone learning... anyone have any advice for helping him learn? (As in key differences ... he claims 5v5 fights were rarer) The idea of "jungling" didn't really kick off until Merlini pioneered it with beastmaster almost 6 years ago. The only thing you really need to know about jungling now is that stacking and pulling is so much easier now than it's ever been and he should exploit it to its fullest. | ||
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eqez
Sweden837 Posts
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paper
13196 Posts
On October 07 2012 12:36 eqez wrote: I just played Sniper mid with my friends in the Normal pool instead of Very High. I went very well with using shrapnel to harass and control the lane to get runes. Will it work in higher games? no | ||
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Mataza
Germany5364 Posts
Opening lifeleech might actually be much better than opening armlet. If really trying hard, one could use dominator creeps to stack ancients later. I don´t like the idea of going mom as that´s 2k gold that lead nowhere and mom isn´t that good. Never doublepulled as of yet. Always thought that was a ranged supporter thing, not a thing for actual jungle heroes. Doesn´t that lead to missing at least 2 lasthits while pulling the other camp? | ||
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valheru
Australia966 Posts
On October 07 2012 12:36 eqez wrote: I just played Sniper mid with my friends in the Normal pool instead of Very High. I went very well with using shrapnel to harass and control the lane to get runes. Will it work in higher games? Highly unlikely sniper's base strength is 16 and the gain is 1.7 he's very very squishy. Base damage is also poor with 36-42. If he's against say a QoP with he should be slaughtered (lvl 2 blink is equal to his max attack range). Also he doesn't serve as a capable roamer. You should just be slaughtered in higher skilled games with your health pool and damage. | ||
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frucisky
Singapore2170 Posts
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