I think, that it is stupid trying to compare the old school players to Bisu/Jaedong/Flash.

Back in the day of the old school players, StarCraft was a completely different game.(You don't see 3x bunker rush, 2gate openings, early lurker/ling)

Nowadays, starcraft is so advanced that NO MATTER WHAT STRATEGY YOU USE, the pure mechanics of the players Bisu/Jaedong/Flash will be too overwhelming.

Since starcraft back in the old school players day, and starcraft nowdays is so different, there cannot be a real decision.

Gryffindor_us

United States5606 Posts

June 30 2009 02:33 GMT

#142

On June 30 2009 10:11 lingallin wrote:

For you best means most accomplished, that's not what it means for everyone.

That's fine but the problem is that other than statistics or accomplishments then how do you quantify the greatness of a player. Because if you're arguing solely on style/influence then you're going to tread into the territory of nearly pure opinion. I do agree though that these topics are futile.

On June 30 2009 10:10 Jayme wrote:

Yea but you're talking about medals and not pure skill here.

That's why this poll fails.

If we're talking about just skill even Bonjwa Nada would have an extraordinarily hard time dealing with Jaedong. He'd probably get eaten alive really seeing as he lost constantly against Savior and Jaedong's mechanical skills far and away surpass that of Savior.

The problem is that trying to compare eras is impossible (especially with the ridiculous increase in the prominence of teamleague). Hell, I'm sure I've tried to justify it in the past but it's not possible. If we were to take the people in this poll and have them all start at the beginning at the same age then we might get a chance to see that played out but that's impossible. Also, as KP_Collector pointed out if we use the criteria that seems to be driving Jaedong's success in this poll then we're going to have a new best player every once in a while and that seems very shallow. What if Effort replaces Jaedong and starts winning everything left and right? Does Jaedong still hold up? It starts to get really tricky when you have to incorporate time into the evaluation. What is greater: wholly dominating for a short period of time or having bursts of dominance over a 7 year period? Oh well.

The primary reason I posted was to remind people who seem to forget easily or who weren't there for it that NaDa, iloveoov etc.. exhibited the same dominance you see in Bisu, Flash, and Jaedong and they have the medals. When BW finally ends maybe we can revisit this topic with much more clarity. Probably though people will still auto-vote BoxeR T_T.

Dice

Korea (South)926 Posts

June 30 2009 02:35 GMT

#143

On June 30 2009 09:49 Count9 wrote:
Can't compare eras /sigh

But since we're going to anyways... Bisu > JD > Flash > Other terrans > Bisu, they are the best of all time, no one from the past can beat them. I say Bisu is better than JD simply cause he got 3 MSLs, I dunno why that's more important than JD's SL wins, but I just think it is.

You're crazy if you think that 3 MSLs > 2 OSLs + 1 MSL. I'm sure alot of people can disagree with you on this one.

Ruff

Kazakhstan179 Posts

June 30 2009 02:36 GMT

#144

Every player knows this is NaDa!

3 MSL + 3 OSL = best sc player of all time

7mk

Germany10157 Posts

June 30 2009 02:36 GMT

#145

Ah wtf why is there another poll like this already?

iloveHieu

United States1919 Posts

June 30 2009 02:38 GMT

#146

Bisu should get more votes xD

Ruff

Kazakhstan179 Posts

June 30 2009 02:38 GMT

#147

NaDa 3rd? OMG crazy newcomers! NaDa must be 1st!

Deleted User 31060

3788 Posts

June 30 2009 02:39 GMT

#148

unless jaedong breaks his arm and quits starcraft forever tomorrow or goes into a horrible Frozean-like slump he's going to be hands down the greatest soon, maybe even after this Starleague season

s_side

United States700 Posts

June 30 2009 02:41 GMT

#149

1. Nada (this cannot be debated)

2. Jooooooooolie

3. TBD

Musoeun

United States4324 Posts

June 30 2009 02:42 GMT

#150

NaDa = most medals (so far).
Jaedong = most dominating ever when he's in form (Flash is a close second).
Boxer = granddaddy of them all.

Then you get people like oov, Yellow, or Bisu who revolutionized the game, or a race, or at least a matchup... I go with NaDa though. I fully expect Jaedong to equal his medal count at some point, but for now, for me, success = greatness.

Ancestral

United States3230 Posts

June 30 2009 02:46 GMT

#151

People are voting for different things because they're using different criteria. Jaedong, Bisu, or Flash should be the "most skilled." NaDa, ilovoov, or sAviOr should be "best." BoxeR should be "greatest."

And of course even what I wrote can easily be refuted because those words don't even have specific enough definitions.

Neptuneajax

Australia206 Posts

June 30 2009 02:47 GMT

#152

yes bisu/jaedong/flash probably have the best mechanics and the ability to beat anyone of Nada/Boxer/OOV in their prime. But how did they get those mechanics and skill? By having truely GREAT players precede them and flesh out the game into what it is today. Without Boxer/Nada/Savior/OOV, Bisu/jaedong/Flash would not be what they are today. Voted boxer

Avidkeystamper

United States8556 Posts

June 30 2009 02:52 GMT

#153

This is eerily similar to who is the Great Of All Time (GOAT) in tennis.

Spanxxx

United States408 Posts

June 30 2009 03:09 GMT

#154

so far JD is #1 statistically speaking. some of my favorites are savior, bisu and boxer though.

terr13

United States298 Posts

June 30 2009 03:13 GMT

#155

By who is the best to play ever regardless of the time period, it's probably Jaedong.
By who is the most successful, and most dominating during their era, probably NaDa. No one can match his wins and his 7 year streak of being in the top 30.

Count9

China10928 Posts

June 30 2009 03:13 GMT

#156

On June 30 2009 12:09 Spanxxx wrote:
so far JD is #1 statistically speaking. some of my favorites are savior, bisu and boxer though.

What stats?

Mortality

United States4790 Posts

June 30 2009 03:20 GMT

#157

How is JD ahead of Nada, Savior and Oov?

Or are people basing this on absolute skill (in which case, the best player of today -- probably either JD or Bisu -- is "best all time")?

LosingID8

CA10835 Posts

June 30 2009 03:32 GMT

#158

On June 30 2009 10:19 Try wrote:
Obviously Boxer, he was dominant for a longer period of time than anyone else, and mattered more to the foundation and continuation of esports. No-one on the list even comes close to what Boxer has done for the professional starcraft scene or the length of time for which he was dominant. From 2001 all the way until alittle past the time he joined ACE, Boxer was a beast. Six years he was near the top. You can say that for no one else.

nada?