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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
I think Trump is on a mission to show how many bullshit powers without any checks the president of the US actually has.
Also, i think this pardon is a test run to see what happens when he just pardons people in an absolutely corrupt way. The next move is to pardon everyone investigated by Mueller, and thus ending the whole russia investigation for good.
I find it interesting how the US simply has no safeguards against a totally corrupt president. If you manage to get elected, you can apparently basically do whatever you like with the office for 4 years, and there is nothing anybody can do about it.
I hope you will see Trump as a catalyzer for a complete rework of your political system, or at least realize that it does matter who you elect, and not elect someone as obviously unfit as Trump against for the next few presidents. Your nation is now an international laughing stock, and it becomes worse every day. And that is ignoring the actual real damage that Trump does to your nation, daily.
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On August 26 2017 15:48 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 15:41 Tachion wrote:On August 26 2017 15:34 LegalLord wrote:
Trump wasn't the one who divided the country; he simply came to prominence when the country was already deeply divided and fed the flames. He can't be blamed for it all and framing it as "this is what happens when you don't elect Hillary Clinton as a compromise" is laughably reductionist.
GH did put it nicely though: it's a good thing that a president this bad is more concerned with his own ego and with vanity praise than with power. Because the latter would be far more dangerous. Hold on a sec, I gotta open reeaalll wide to fit in all those words you just tried to shove into my mouth. Who said that was a direct response to your post?
Doesn't really seem relevant who it was supposedly a direct response to. Tachion's response seems appropriate in all cases.
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Trump does stuff that will make people who praise him happy so they praise him more, and piss off people who don't like him so he feels he winz against them. That's again all there is to it. He doesn't try to figure out if it makes sense, if it's fair, if it's a good idea or if it's good political strategy. He has the savinness and the world view of a whiny, insecure, angsty teenage girl.
And we knew it since his campaign.
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On August 26 2017 12:47 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 12:44 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Trump, probably: "Well in the past two weeks, I've hated on blacks and Jews and the transgender community, so who else can I- oh yeah, fuck you, Latinos." Trump should now appoint Arpaio to chair his council on building the wall. Gotta double down on this shit!
These are the types of posts that leave little doubt that you don't actually care about PoC's constitutional rights, fundamentally undermining all of the "it's about their rights" nonsense you spout when sticking up for Nazis.
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On August 26 2017 18:16 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 12:47 xDaunt wrote:On August 26 2017 12:44 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Trump, probably: "Well in the past two weeks, I've hated on blacks and Jews and the transgender community, so who else can I- oh yeah, fuck you, Latinos." Trump should now appoint Arpaio to chair his council on building the wall. Gotta double down on this shit! These are the types of posts that leave little doubt that you don't actually care about PoC's constitutional rights, fundamentally undermining all of the "it's about their rights" nonsense you spout when sticking up for Nazis.
I would give xDaunt the benefit of the doubt and assume he was being sarcastic.
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On August 26 2017 20:23 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 18:16 GreenHorizons wrote:On August 26 2017 12:47 xDaunt wrote:On August 26 2017 12:44 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Trump, probably: "Well in the past two weeks, I've hated on blacks and Jews and the transgender community, so who else can I- oh yeah, fuck you, Latinos." Trump should now appoint Arpaio to chair his council on building the wall. Gotta double down on this shit! These are the types of posts that leave little doubt that you don't actually care about PoC's constitutional rights, fundamentally undermining all of the "it's about their rights" nonsense you spout when sticking up for Nazis. I would give xDaunt the benefit of the doubt and assume he was being sarcastic.
I assume so aswell but it becomes harder and harder to differentiate between sarcasm and actual opinion when people defend neo-nazi propaganda and advocate for apartheid.
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On August 26 2017 14:32 KwarK wrote:
I mean there's few things that could be as expensive and destructive as Iraq. Complete domestic mismanagement is probably still a good job compared to starting wars. Iraq has cost more than a hundred walls. It's cost more than pulling out of NAFTA overnight would. I liked Bush more than Trump but Trump could really do far more damage than he has. Trump does petty damage like pardoning one super racist, stack that against imprisoning a million African Americans and you'll see Trump lacks the vision to deliberately destroy America. When he causes the end it'll be by accident.
While certainly true that Iraq was the dumbest idea in the last few decades, that was different. Of course he could've done "far more damage", he could (lets wait that out though) attack north korea in some form.
That doesn't mean he hasn't done more damage to the US than other presidents before (already). You lost any good reputation in the world, and the divide in your country was never more glaring. Of course you had Nazis before, they didn't come with Trump: but fact of the matter is, no president before emboldened them. Not to mention that he's just 217 days in office so far, so lets see where this is going first.
Calling complete domestic (and foreign) mismanagement is not "probably a good job compared to" anything though. If anything, it's just not as bad as starting a war. But as we know, Twitter still exist, so if i were you, i'd wait that one out before i argue with it.
Oh and i do agree that he doesn't do it deliberately, in fact i never said that. I don't believe that. I also don't believe that it'd be an accident in case it happens, but ignorance and stupidity.
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On August 26 2017 20:23 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 18:16 GreenHorizons wrote:On August 26 2017 12:47 xDaunt wrote:On August 26 2017 12:44 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Trump, probably: "Well in the past two weeks, I've hated on blacks and Jews and the transgender community, so who else can I- oh yeah, fuck you, Latinos." Trump should now appoint Arpaio to chair his council on building the wall. Gotta double down on this shit! These are the types of posts that leave little doubt that you don't actually care about PoC's constitutional rights, fundamentally undermining all of the "it's about their rights" nonsense you spout when sticking up for Nazis. I would give xDaunt the benefit of the doubt and assume he was being sarcastic.
I'm accounting for the potential sarcasm.
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I don't see the pardon (horrible and improper as it is) as an impeachable offense; as there's no direct conspiracy between them.
but it does establish trump as being more racist, and as being more against the rule of law (stuff we kinda knew already of course).
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On August 26 2017 21:03 zlefin wrote:
I don't see the pardon (horrible and improper as it is) as an impeachable offense; as there's no direct conspiracy between them.
but it does establish trump as being more racist, and as being more against the rule of law (stuff we kinda knew already of course).
Ofc hes not going to get impeached over it. Its 'just' utterly improper.
The more scary thing is that if Trump is willing to do this, how willing is he to do the same when someone gets criminally charged following Meullers investigation, and is there any way to stop him from just pardoning everyone.
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Probably there would be nothing to stop him from pardoning everybody, but then I would guess that would unite the republicans and he would get impeached over it. Hopefully.
Seriously though, I don't see how certain TL posters can even defend such a blatant disregard for the rule of law. It's really just one step away from bugging your opponents in terms of eroding democracy.
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On August 26 2017 21:31 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Probably there would be nothing to stop him from pardoning everybody, but then I would guess that would unite the republicans and he would get impeached over it. Hopefully.
Seriously though, I don't see how certain TL posters can even defend such a blatant disregard for the rule of law. It's really just one step away from bugging your opponents in terms of eroding democracy.
the support i've seen from them on here is pretty weak; mostly they're objecting to certain characterizations of it, quibbling on details, or doing whataboutism. elsewhere i've seen far worse, many people outright supporting it directly, asserting it was good and proper ot do so.
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On August 26 2017 22:07 zlefin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 21:31 Dangermousecatdog wrote:
Probably there would be nothing to stop him from pardoning everybody, but then I would guess that would unite the republicans and he would get impeached over it. Hopefully.
Seriously though, I don't see how certain TL posters can even defend such a blatant disregard for the rule of law. It's really just one step away from bugging your opponents in terms of eroding democracy. the support i've seen from them on here is pretty weak; mostly they're objecting to certain characterizations of it, quibbling on details, or doing whataboutism. elsewhere i've seen far worse, many people outright supporting it directly, asserting it was good and proper ot do so.
TLUSPMT. The last and dying bastion of rational discourse.
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On August 26 2017 15:19 Aquanim wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 14:58 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 11:33 Wulfey_LA wrote:
Anti-anti-Trumpers: when you spin for Trump, this is what you spin for:
EDIT: next time you spin for Trump and put up some feeble 'b-b-b-b-but Antifa/Lynch/Lewinski" nonsense, ask yourself what you think about state violence in violation of the constitution. Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. "This is what you spin for." Maybe you need to wake up to what it means to rarely support Trump and then sometimes find his attackers are just as idiotic and blind as he is. + Show Spoiler [pardon power] +
Like people who want a re-do on the constitution over this.
I'm old school I prefer my Nazi's in full retreat, dead on the streets, hanging from lamp posts like the old days. Anyways... Then we just apply your grasp of civil rights to the blacks, and StealthBlue's clones argue they're all druggies and gangbangers. Are you saying that it's unreasonable to do morally questionable things to people like the Nazis with the justification that their views and actions work against modern Western values?
Don't try to weasel around with "morally questionable things." Show me you afford citizens their civil rights no matter who they are and how disgusted you are, or show me the criminal act justifying their removal. Otherwise you're regressing the civil rights movement and totally forgetful of American history.
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On August 26 2017 23:06 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 15:19 Aquanim wrote:On August 26 2017 14:58 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 11:33 Wulfey_LA wrote:Anti-anti-Trumpers: when you spin for Trump, this is what you spin for: https://twitter.com/phoenixnewtimes/status/901263384087334914EDIT: next time you spin for Trump and put up some feeble 'b-b-b-b-but Antifa/Lynch/Lewinski" nonsense, ask yourself what you think about state violence in violation of the constitution. Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. "This is what you spin for." Maybe you need to wake up to what it means to rarely support Trump and then sometimes find his attackers are just as idiotic and blind as he is. + Show Spoiler [pardon power] + I'm old school I prefer my Nazi's in full retreat, dead on the streets, hanging from lamp posts like the old days. Anyways... https://twitter.com/AP/status/901279153625993216 Then we just apply your grasp of civil rights to the blacks, and StealthBlue's clones argue they're all druggies and gangbangers. Are you saying that it's unreasonable to do morally questionable things to people like the Nazis with the justification that their views and actions work against modern Western values? Don't try to weasel around with "morally questionable things." Show me you afford citizens their civil rights no matter who they are and how disgusted you are, or show me the criminal act justifying their removal. Otherwise you're regressing the civil rights movement and totally forgetful of American history.
Did you just piggy back nazis on the back of the civil rights movement?
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On August 26 2017 13:11 Nebuchad wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:
Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. I'm unconvinced, I think I look quite dapper. Of course, given that you never actually engage in arguments and instead do whiny sentence into evasion every time you are engaged, it was always going to be hard for you to convince me, or anyone.
For that, you might have to read and quote who I responded to. You can engage with me as you like and get a response in kind. Otherwise, if you have a complaint about my posting, PM or website feedback. Whining to accuse of whining helps nobody.
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On August 26 2017 23:11 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 23:06 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 15:19 Aquanim wrote:On August 26 2017 14:58 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 11:33 Wulfey_LA wrote:Anti-anti-Trumpers: when you spin for Trump, this is what you spin for: https://twitter.com/phoenixnewtimes/status/901263384087334914EDIT: next time you spin for Trump and put up some feeble 'b-b-b-b-but Antifa/Lynch/Lewinski" nonsense, ask yourself what you think about state violence in violation of the constitution. Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. "This is what you spin for." Maybe you need to wake up to what it means to rarely support Trump and then sometimes find his attackers are just as idiotic and blind as he is. + Show Spoiler [pardon power] + I'm old school I prefer my Nazi's in full retreat, dead on the streets, hanging from lamp posts like the old days. Anyways... https://twitter.com/AP/status/901279153625993216 Then we just apply your grasp of civil rights to the blacks, and StealthBlue's clones argue they're all druggies and gangbangers. Are you saying that it's unreasonable to do morally questionable things to people like the Nazis with the justification that their views and actions work against modern Western values? Don't try to weasel around with "morally questionable things." Show me you afford citizens their civil rights no matter who they are and how disgusted you are, or show me the criminal act justifying their removal. Otherwise you're regressing the civil rights movement and totally forgetful of American history. Did you just piggy back nazis on the back of the civil rights movement?
StealthBlue talked about old school lynchings. Tell me, did the movement argue to just include blacks in the privileged classes that get civil rights, or was it pretty sweeping? I absolutely consider the disgusting attitude that your hate justifies your violence to be in kind with the attitudes civil rights leaders came against.
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On August 26 2017 23:23 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 23:11 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On August 26 2017 23:06 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 15:19 Aquanim wrote:On August 26 2017 14:58 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 11:33 Wulfey_LA wrote:Anti-anti-Trumpers: when you spin for Trump, this is what you spin for: https://twitter.com/phoenixnewtimes/status/901263384087334914EDIT: next time you spin for Trump and put up some feeble 'b-b-b-b-but Antifa/Lynch/Lewinski" nonsense, ask yourself what you think about state violence in violation of the constitution. Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. "This is what you spin for." Maybe you need to wake up to what it means to rarely support Trump and then sometimes find his attackers are just as idiotic and blind as he is. + Show Spoiler [pardon power] + I'm old school I prefer my Nazi's in full retreat, dead on the streets, hanging from lamp posts like the old days. Anyways... https://twitter.com/AP/status/901279153625993216 Then we just apply your grasp of civil rights to the blacks, and StealthBlue's clones argue they're all druggies and gangbangers. Are you saying that it's unreasonable to do morally questionable things to people like the Nazis with the justification that their views and actions work against modern Western values? Don't try to weasel around with "morally questionable things." Show me you afford citizens their civil rights no matter who they are and how disgusted you are, or show me the criminal act justifying their removal. Otherwise you're regressing the civil rights movement and totally forgetful of American history. Did you just piggy back nazis on the back of the civil rights movement? StealthBlue talked about old school lynchings. Tell me, did the movement argue to just include blacks in the privileged classes that get civil rights, or was it pretty sweeping? I absolutely consider the disgusting attitude that your hate justifies your violence to be in kind with the attitudes civil rights leaders came against.
My hate? This isn't about me. This is about what you posted. Don't turn it around and play innocent. Answer the question I asked. Did you just propose that nazi's were part of the civil rights movement to give disenfranchised minorities equal standing in the law?
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On August 26 2017 23:06 Danglars wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2017 15:19 Aquanim wrote:On August 26 2017 14:58 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 12:13 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On August 26 2017 12:09 Danglars wrote:On August 26 2017 11:33 Wulfey_LA wrote:Anti-anti-Trumpers: when you spin for Trump, this is what you spin for: https://twitter.com/phoenixnewtimes/status/901263384087334914EDIT: next time you spin for Trump and put up some feeble 'b-b-b-b-but Antifa/Lynch/Lewinski" nonsense, ask yourself what you think about state violence in violation of the constitution. Clueless left wingers: Stop circling back to arguments like it's okay to punch a nazi or nazis don't get free speech. It makes you look bad. "This is what you spin for." Maybe you need to wake up to what it means to rarely support Trump and then sometimes find his attackers are just as idiotic and blind as he is. + Show Spoiler [pardon power] + I'm old school I prefer my Nazi's in full retreat, dead on the streets, hanging from lamp posts like the old days. Anyways... https://twitter.com/AP/status/901279153625993216 Then we just apply your grasp of civil rights to the blacks, and StealthBlue's clones argue they're all druggies and gangbangers. Are you saying that it's unreasonable to do morally questionable things to people like the Nazis with the justification that their views and actions work against modern Western values? Don't try to weasel around with "morally questionable things." Show me you afford citizens their civil rights no matter who they are and how disgusted you are, or show me the criminal act justifying their removal. Otherwise you're regressing the civil rights movement and totally forgetful of American history.
I did not and do not claim to endorse StealthBlue's opinion. EDIT: If you want to debate how his opinion reflects on American history and the civil rights movement, I suggest you do that with him.
However, you didn't answer my question.
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EPT
