lol predctions I don't reconize the first guy though. Rooting for stars, but they need a lot of things to go right to pull it out, considering that hydra leta and movie are all favorites against almost the entiere stars team.
WL is awesome but two rounds + a play off is more than enough of that format, so I'm kinda glad regular PL is back. 4-2 Woongjin Your predictions made me laugh too
On April 22 2011 23:46 hacklebeast wrote: lol predctions I don't reconize the first guy though. Rooting for stars, but they need a lot of things to go right to pull it out, considering that hydra leta and movie are all favorites against almost the entiere stars team.
I´m pumped for the matches even if I have to wake up at six o´clock for it. Gotta bring sacrifices for the daily dose of starcraft !! Anyways, I hope CJ will profit of the switch of format like it did in previous seasons...the line-up ist just so deep again, it´s amazing ! Unfortunately, I heard that EffOrt isn´t allowed into the rooster for some more month, is that correct ?
On April 23 2011 03:03 LichtgestaltSC wrote: I´m pumped for the matches even if I have to wake up at six o´clock for it. Gotta bring sacrifices for the daily dose of starcraft !! Anyways, I hope CJ will profit of the switch of format like it did in previous seasons...the line-up ist just so deep again, it´s amazing ! Unfortunately, I heard that EffOrt isn´t allowed into the rooster for some more month, is that correct ?
On April 23 2011 08:24 Taekwon wrote: ill watch this if t1 vs ace doesnt go live
how come there's a chance it won't go live ?
T1 Ace will most likely be on MBC, it is hard to get a good MBC stream save the one from cn.plu(which has chinese commentary, a feat that alot of people dislike).
mutas pick off one tank at leta's nat first vessel out, 1? tank remaining
Leta still only with 4 medics with his marines... another sunken morphing at soulkey's nat mutas aren't doing much damage vs mnm first defiler out, a sunken morphing at soulkey's 3rd 5 sunkens at soulkey's nat now
bunch of lurkerling with defiler support moving east, a few lings die in mines (and take some vultures with them)
3 vessels come and one defiler irradiated outside 2 but still enough swarms placed and lurkerling holds against leta for now 7th hatchery for soulkey, at 1.5
leta dropping more mines between his base and Soulkey's 2 lurkers (of 3) irradiated at 2 leta attacking into 2, not much there! but one lurker gets under swarm, and a few more appear form the nydus Leta backs off for now a 4th CC hovering over 9 but not landing yet, no scvs transferred yet
On April 23 2011 13:19 Elyvilon wrote: Not a huge fan of the mech transition against Soulkey, he's really good against it. If this is just mass vultures, that might be different I guess.
well, with no raxes landed...
Leta on double armory now pleague on some of leta's remaining mnm, and swarm around them lings clean most of them up
On April 23 2011 13:17 DropBear wrote: The Xel-Naga temple is falling to the swarm! Quick! Activate the Uraj and Khalis!
uhhhhh???????
KEEP ON SWARMING!!!!!!!
In single player campaigns lol, last Protoss mission, everyone defends the XelNaga Temple while the swarm attacks so they can activate the crystals. Soulkey was killing the temple with lings, it was my horrible attempt at a Starcraft joke haha
leta on 8 factories now, 2? shops 2 lurker+ling drop on leta's 4th, scvs run right away defiler also covers them ovie picks up again but irradiated, so it drops again a few vessels plagued still none have died this game so far?
Leta adding a 5th CC at the NW center plateau
Soulkey with a "secret" hatchery beyond the temple at the NW main
soulkey swinging the game his way, taking out 2 of leta's mining expos more scourge bing wasted though or perhasp to scout? SK has a new hatchery at 3, and is also taking the NE center expo Leta resumes mining at one of the plateaus
GTR SWITCHED OVER TO HERE Now I see gols taking down a hatchery at 11 ish Tons of queens with +2 Cara 1-2 for the vultures A CC getting picked apart by a lurker somewhere And 2-0 muta's
most queens still in reserve another 6 queens being brought forwards as hydraling elimnate a few remaining mnm
now running into vultures, no match but 2 tanks on top of the NW center expo dealing damage but now broodling'd still, leta has 2 of the center expos running soulkey has a massive amount of bases running too
and lots of queens are still hanging out/charging energy
Rax scouts SK expoing to 12? Or atleast sending a drone Queens just flying around mid map Tons of HydraQueen above Leta's midleft TONS OF BROODLINGS Leta...
Soulkey doing an all out attack on leta's medium sized mech army NW of the map, lots of queens, broodling it's the end? hydra taking out leta's new CC at 10
Holy shit, how is this possible? I thought the consensus was that queens could rape face but required inhuman usage. Only in BW do you get metagame shifts even after this much competitive play.
well, its pretty interesting to see queens but leta seriously gave him so much time to build up. while SK was saving all that gas leta could have taken out some of his expos.
Hahahaha. I don't think leta scouted those queens at all; I think to beat that he has to push before critical mass of queens (I can't believe I just used that phrase) is built up so he can force SK to be defensive and "waste" queens.
I really liked his arrangement system where recharging queens are at the bottom, while full energy queens are on top.. Very systematic way of dismantling mech... It hurts my heart seeing no more mech 'imba'
On April 23 2011 13:32 c3rberUs wrote: Is this like a zvt revolution or this ordinary? I've never seen this many queens in a pro game or any game before.
Not much. Mostly woongjin zergs (crazy hydra vs someone, Zero vs Ruby (MSL), Soulkey vs FANTASY)
other zergs have varing degrees of success (calm vs fantasy, uhhh)
On April 23 2011 13:32 c3rberUs wrote: Is this like a zvt revolution or this ordinary? I've never seen this many queens in a pro game or any game before.
Not much. Mostly woongjin zergs (crazy hydra vs someone, Zero vs Ruby (MSL), Soulkey vs FANTASY)
other zergs have varing degrees of success (calm vs fantasy, uhhh)
Now I want to see Jaedong using this hydra-queen combo. It would be awesome.
On April 23 2011 13:32 c3rberUs wrote: Is this like a zvt revolution or this ordinary? I've never seen this many queens in a pro game or any game before.
Not much. Mostly woongjin zergs (crazy hydra vs someone, Zero vs Ruby (MSL), Soulkey vs FANTASY)
other zergs have varing degrees of success (calm vs fantasy, uhhh)
Oh, ok, thanks. Either way this was one hell of a game.
SK has always been good against mech, especially lategame mech; watch his older games against Sea and fantasy. It's the other parts of the matchup that he has more trouble with.
On April 23 2011 13:32 c3rberUs wrote: Is this like a zvt revolution or this ordinary? I've never seen this many queens in a pro game or any game before.
Not much. Mostly woongjin zergs (crazy hydra vs someone, Zero vs Ruby (MSL), Soulkey vs FANTASY)
other zergs have varing degrees of success (calm vs fantasy, uhhh)
Now I want to see Jaedong using this hydra-queen combo. It would be awesome.
Exactly what I was typing. Specially after seeing him lose to whom shall not be named throwing wave after wave of ultraling into tanks.
What the hell. Leta had sizable advantage going into lategame but the queens just reversed it. Leta couldn't control the queen numbers. Soulkey's usage of sending out small numbers then retreating them back to gain energy is amazing. This needs to be in every zerg's arsenal.
Amazing queen usage. I was really worried for a while there when Leta was taking bases everywhere while SK was still on 4 bases but he obviously knew what he was doing. How is the Terran going to adapt to this? It's really hard to get off EMPs when the zerg has scourge+plague+hydras everywhere. Also, because the zerg already has dark swarm + cracklings + lurkers, mass goliaths probably won't be that effective either.
On April 23 2011 13:32 c3rberUs wrote: Is this like a zvt revolution or this ordinary? I've never seen this many queens in a pro game or any game before.
Not much. Mostly woongjin zergs (crazy hydra vs someone, Zero vs Ruby (MSL), Soulkey vs FANTASY)
other zergs have varing degrees of success (calm vs fantasy, uhhh)
Oh, ok, thanks. Either way this was one hell of a game.
You can see a lot more of this if you check out SoulKey's + Show Spoiler +
two games vs. Fantasy in the MSL Ro32 group stages
On April 23 2011 13:32 flagellum- wrote: seriously, I don't know why progamers have never used queens this much before
if leta had stayed bio instead of transitioning, soulkey just wouldn't have had to get as many queens and could mass ensnare the mm
I guess it only works on big maps where you can afford to invest that much resources for the 2 minutes they need to get energy/
Queens vs bio is an entire different ball game; it's very VERY micro intensive (I think only Jaedong's really used it effectively and that was in like 1 or 2 games) and you only make a couple. You can't afford to make alot because against bio they're only good for ensnare and they don't have consume like defilers so they're "useless" most of the time. IMO you need to make sure they bio ball isn't being that aggressive and/or you know you have enough time to get an ensnare up; other wise it's just better to use the gas on lurkers.
This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
On April 23 2011 13:32 flagellum- wrote: seriously, I don't know why progamers have never used queens this much before
if leta had stayed bio instead of transitioning, soulkey just wouldn't have had to get as many queens and could mass ensnare the mm
I guess it only works on big maps where you can afford to invest that much resources for the 2 minutes they need to get energy/
Queens vs bio is an entire different ball game; it's very VERY micro intensive (I think only Jaedong's really used it effectively and that was in like 1 or 2 games) and you only make a couple. You can't afford to make alot because against bio they're only good for ensnare and they don't have consume like defilers so they're "useless" most of the time. IMO you need to make sure they bio ball isn't being that aggressive and/or you know you have enough time to get an ensnare up; other wise it's just better to use the gas on lurkers.
exactly, queen vs bio was pulled off a few times and works on paper but it's too micro intensive for most progamers to use effectively.
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
I don't think the queens were clustered enough for valks to be better than wraiths, especially since they had +2 armour.
Also taking out the scourge never really seemed like an issue, they all melted to goliaths.
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
I don't think valks have the damage output to kill queens before they destroy the tanks and queens can regenerate their health while they build-up energy
edit: also SK got +2 air armor so the valks need to be upgraded and you can't exactly KNOW he's gonna go queens so your upgrades are gonna be delayed
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
Valkyries kinda suck. Queens are faster and Valkyries can be easily scourged
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
No point to use valkyries. All the queens needs to do is just shoot the broodling. Valks cant kill those queens in time b4 they broodling.. Aside from that, its a waste of gas in mech vZ
Jaedong used queens for a relatively short span (primarily ensnare tactics vs bio). He pulled it off, but lamented that queen usage was too difficult and he didn't want to do it anymore. Of course, that was way back, before the reign of the mech switch.
Basically, what someone said on the last page is true: SK's late game ZvT is easily among the best but what he needs to do is strengthen his mid-game, where he is typically very vulnerable. Much like Zero.
On April 23 2011 13:41 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Jaedong used queens for a relatively short span (primarily ensnare tactics vs bio). He pulled it off, but lamented that queen usage was too difficult and he didn't want to do it anymore. Of course, that was way back, before the reign of the mech switch.
Basically, what someone said on the last page is true: SK's late game ZvT is easily among the best but what he needs to do is strengthen his mid-game, where he is typically very vulnerable. Much like Zero.
If even the mechanical beast of Jaedong complains about its difficulty, then I wont get to see this build much on iccup! Yay!
On April 23 2011 03:03 LichtgestaltSC wrote: I´m pumped for the matches even if I have to wake up at six o´clock for it. Gotta bring sacrifices for the daily dose of starcraft !! Anyways, I hope CJ will profit of the switch of format like it did in previous seasons...the line-up ist just so deep again, it´s amazing ! Unfortunately, I heard that EffOrt isn´t allowed into the rooster for some more month, is that correct ?
Effort is returning in august i read.
I guessed the matchup, but can i guess the result?
On April 23 2011 13:36 J1.au wrote: You guys are overreacting so much.
No, other zergs should learn to do what Soulkey did if they know what's good for them. It could be a major shift in lategame ZvT where the power of mech is greatly blunted by spawn broodling.
Guys, Queens vs Mech has always been an option. Look in Strategy to see how many theorycrafts there are on the subject.
The problem is that it requires really good micro and come at the expense of Defilers.
What's impressive about Neo_G's play is not choosing to use Queens, but rather being able to balance their requirements.
That said, it's devastating VS a complacent turtle terran that lets Z accumulate said Queen count. If he scans it, there is a timing window that he can and should strike, before the Queens amass enough energy.
On April 23 2011 13:43 ShadeR wrote: Lategame valks glitch out.
Ya, because of the sprite limit on maps, I think only 6 valks can shoot at once too.
It's not a limit on valks, but rather limit on sprites. Valks shoot "8" at once, more than most other units (who shoot 1/0) so they are the first one to stop. I've only ever seen this one BGH games.
Meh, Jaedong has his own way of dealing with the mech transition (being super aggressive and doing lurkerling+defiler drops everywhere). Plus, that guardian tech switch just as the terran is starting to turtle up was pretty sweet.
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
I don't think the queens were clustered enough for valks to be better than wraiths, especially since they had +2 armour.
Also taking out the scourge never really seemed like an issue, they all melted to goliaths.
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
I don't think valks have the damage output to kill queens before they destroy the tanks and queens can regenerate their health while they build-up energy
edit: also SK got +2 air armor so the valks need to be upgraded and you can't exactly KNOW he's gonna go queens so your upgrades are gonna be delayed
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
Valkyries kinda suck. Queens are faster and Valkyries can be easily scourged
On April 23 2011 13:38 DropBear wrote: This is an idea coming from a noob, but would Valkyries have been good for Leta in this situation? Would take out the scourge coming for his vessels, and do some serious damage to the Queens.
No point to use valkyries. All the queens needs to do is just shoot the broodling. Valks cant kill those queens in time b4 they broodling.. Aside from that, its a waste of gas in mech vZ
Thanks for the responses guys. I guess they are a bad idea then
On April 23 2011 13:46 Musou wrote: Stars must have some serious confidence in Light's TvZ to send him out on such a terrible TvZ map. His TvZ is among the best, but still.
perhaps they rather have him play vZ rather than anyone else.
On April 23 2011 13:46 Musou wrote: Stars must have some serious confidence in Light's TvZ to send him out on such a terrible TvZ map. His TvZ is among the best, but still.
perhaps they rather have him play vZ rather than anyone else.
That and have you seen Hydra's ZvT? Extremely average.
On April 23 2011 13:36 J1.au wrote: You guys are overreacting so much.
No, other zergs should learn to do what Soulkey did if they know what's good for them. It could be a major shift in lategame ZvT where the power of mech is greatly blunted by spawn broodling.
especially when Soulkey pretty wins any late game TvZ and wins it so decisively nowadays. I guess zerg players with good mechanics should definitely pick it up, to take advantage of this shifting meta-game ^^
If this becomes a major trend in Modern TvZ, I wonder who should be credited for it? But really, I would love to see how big shot terran players react to this and attempt to counter it (flash probably already has an answer to this due to shit tons of practice with crazyhydra : O)
I think the real problem that Leta never made a "death push." He kinda macro'd up, took some expos, participated in random skirmishes, then BAM suddenly tanks are exploding and he's scrambling around defending his expos, being spread thin and right into SK's hands. There was that HUGE timing window when SK was massing queens and had virtually no ground army. Leta was not very assertive and seemed to be playing for a map split into starving the opponent.
Light sending out some marines? Or not Spire morphing and nat gas taken Lings coming outside of Light nat Hydra really wants that SCV brb time to get food OH WAIT LING RUNBY? Or not. -.- Hydra taking 5 expo Scv slips into the main of Hydra again Ebay up and acadamy flashing Back to ACE vs SKT and my food. ;D
1 creep added to hydra's nat light's scv scouts hydra's 3rd one ling finishes it off ebay done, a few turrets going up, mutas pop! light with a bunch of marines and 2 medics pretty forwards - no, they pull back and get a few shots off on the mutas
On April 23 2011 13:52 MountainDewJunkie wrote: I think the real problem that Leta never made a "death push." He kinda macro'd up, took some expos, participated in random skirmishes, then BAM suddenly tanks are exploding and he's scrambling around defending his expos, being spread thin and right into SK's hands. There was that HUGE timing window when SK was massing queens and had virtually no ground army. Leta was not very assertive and seemed to be playing for a map split into starving the opponent.
This.
I think overall, Leta lacks confidence. Does he even 2port anymore? He's turned boring - all he does nowadays is play standard, which he isn't great enough to win most games with. Especially since the opposition is now almost always expecting it.
On April 23 2011 13:52 MountainDewJunkie wrote: I think the real problem that Leta never made a "death push." He kinda macro'd up, took some expos, participated in random skirmishes, then BAM suddenly tanks are exploding and he's scrambling around defending his expos, being spread thin and right into SK's hands. There was that HUGE timing window when SK was massing queens and had virtually no ground army. Leta was not very assertive and seemed to be playing for a map split into starving the opponent.
This.
I think overall, Leta lacks confidence. Does he even 2port anymore? He's turned boring - all he does nowadays is play standard, which he isn't great enough to win most games with. Especially since the opposition is now almost always expecting it.
It's not recent; Leta has always had a problem actually killing people after gaining a large advantage. He just sits back and macros for too long before pushing out.
quite a few lurkers morphing for hydra, 7 in one place? yes, y at the nat, they're scanned 2 at the 3rd - here comes light's forces the lurker burrows just in time
7 lurkers moving out, 1 dies quickly muta/lurker pull back
mutas run into light's main, picking off a few scvs, and the first tank taking a LOT of damage though 2 more lurkes morphing at the nat another hatch in the main, so 5 hatches now by my count facility on the way
3 tanks siege near hydra's nat lurkerling sandwich from both sides light losing a lot of stuff but killing a lot of stuff too! but it's probably advantageous for hydra, light has to pull away and hydra has a good number of lurkers left
Flying's shuttle is takes too many hits, one hit from dying. Flying engages at the choke; bad idea as his reavers are behind his army and snow's army deals alot of damage. Flying's shuttle is sniped and he loses his goons and reaver. Snow loses one reaver. Flying's nat is down.
flying losing a lot of goons trying to pick off the reaver or shuttle new reaver out of the robo takes a scarab in the face robo destroyed by goons on the other side of the way
I doubt that queens can be completely "Figured out" in TvZ, as they're pretty efficient and timings can be changed. But queens in ZvP is just wtf... Protoss is not terran that needs to deploy and undeploy and slowly push, he just can go and kill you and if you havent enough units, you can't do shit about it.
I hope Movie reads my FB post... LOL Lets see whos up now.. Pan into the boothsnow.. SkyHigh -.- Xellos coming back gave him a confidence boost! VS Really!
On April 23 2011 15:01 tabula rasa wrote: zero and soulkey are becoming too reliant on queens. queens WILL get figured out, and when that happens they'll be in big trouble.
Thats not true imo.. Queen has been underused for a long time now, and only recently do the Woongjin Zergs start experimenting with them.. Of course it will take many failures until (and if) they manage to figure out a way to assimilate Queens into the Swarm's arsenal.. Im looking forward to them introducing a Queen revolution as well..
Only problem: dont do it vs the chobo Hites n give them free wins T_T.. Do their experiments in their games vs SKT imo =x
-.- scouting in the right direction Really's scout looks like its following -.-'s into his back again Now back to scouting -.- Only 1 on gas for Really Really denied his expo
On April 23 2011 15:01 tabula rasa wrote: zero and soulkey are becoming too reliant on queens. queens WILL get figured out, and when that happens they'll be in big trouble.
Thats not true imo.. Queen has been underused for a long time now, and only recently do the Woongjin Zergs start experimenting with them.. Of course it will take many failures until (and if) they manage to figure out a way to assimilate Queens into the Swarm's arsenal.. Im looking forward to them introducing a Queen revolution as well..
Only problem: dont do it vs the chobo Hites n give them free wins T_T.. Do their experiments in their games vs SKT imo =x
i said that they are becoming too reliant on them, which implies a recent development.
On April 23 2011 15:01 tabula rasa wrote: zero and soulkey are becoming too reliant on queens. queens WILL get figured out, and when that happens they'll be in big trouble.
Only problem: dont do it vs the chobo Hites n give them free wins T_T.. Do their experiments in their games vs SKT imo =x
Soulkey has already been nice enough to fulfill that request
On April 23 2011 15:01 tabula rasa wrote: zero and soulkey are becoming too reliant on queens. queens WILL get figured out, and when that happens they'll be in big trouble.
Thats not true imo.. Queen has been underused for a long time now, and only recently do the Woongjin Zergs start experimenting with them.. Of course it will take many failures until (and if) they manage to figure out a way to assimilate Queens into the Swarm's arsenal.. Im looking forward to them introducing a Queen revolution as well..
Only problem: dont do it vs the chobo Hites n give them free wins T_T.. Do their experiments in their games vs SKT imo =x
i said that they are becoming too reliant on them, which implies a recent development.
floating raxes checking each others' nats 2 vultures vs 2 vultures at really's nat skyhigh lands his rax at really's nat to manner the minerals skyhigh's shop done
really finishes his 2nd factory no idea about the starport? he adds an armory (no academy yet?)
Rax landed by the mineral line at Really's nat Really's rax is flaoting about the main, spots the starport First wraith out Last I saw Really's armory was almost complete
Armory gets dealyed by the wraith picking off the scv Two kills...Three kills Two wraiths now Acadamy building for both players Mass vultures for Really! GTR decides to switch back
On April 23 2011 15:12 MountainDewJunkie wrote: Using queens three games in a row ---> becoming too reliant on queens?
No, I'm afraid that's just a dumb thing to say.
how is it not? soulkey used queens against ruby, fantasy, fantasy, and leta. four games consecutively, and i can't remember any games before that. zero used queens against movie and in the msl against whats-his-name, and i can't remember any games before that. so zero and soulkey combined have used queens way more than three games in a row. both these guys are in the same team. people can expect to see queens used when they play against them. i'm not saying that they are reliant on queens, i'm saying that it will become a liability to them if they're not careful.
edit: hm, i checked the tlpd and apparently i made a mistake. zero played ruby, not soulkey. sorry about that.
On April 23 2011 15:15 d_so wrote: i wonder if soulkey will use queens against mnm terran too. maybe broodling the medics + ensnare. that'd be so sweet
broodlinging the medics takes too much energy to be worth it
ensnare maybe, but JD said back when he was experimenting with ensnare when Chupung-Ryeong was still in the mappool that it took too much apm/multitasking to use ensnare in lategame ZvT
On April 23 2011 15:17 gen.Sun wrote: Brood ing on medic would ne a total waste. But ensnare should be really good!
Ensnare on mnm was done by Jaedong vs Fantasy back near the end of 2008, and combined w/ dark swarm. Don't think he used it much since. He said at that time, it was pretty APM intensive.
I would like to see him use it now, though. It's been a while.
On April 23 2011 15:17 gen.Sun wrote: Brood ing on medic would ne a total waste. But ensnare should be really good!
Ensnare on mnm was done by Jaedong vs Fantasy back near the end of 2008, and combined w/ dark swarm. Don't think he used it much since. He said at that time, it was pretty APM intensive.
I would like to see him use it now, though. It's been a while.
IIRC it was used before hive with lurkers. I could be thinking of a different game though, as I distinctly recall a few christmas themed games.
On April 23 2011 15:17 gen.Sun wrote: Brood ing on medic would ne a total waste. But ensnare should be really good!
Ensnare on mnm was done by Jaedong vs Fantasy back near the end of 2008, and combined w/ dark swarm. Don't think he used it much since. He said at that time, it was pretty APM intensive.
I would like to see him use it now, though. It's been a while.
IIRC it was used before hive with lurkers. I could be thinking of a different game though, as I distinctly recall a few christmas themed games.
It was used during hive, but I think it was while consume was researching. Jaedong sandwiched the force while throwing down ensnare + DS. At least I think that's what it was.
On April 23 2011 15:17 gen.Sun wrote: Brood ing on medic would ne a total waste. But ensnare should be really good!
Ensnare on mnm was done by Jaedong vs Fantasy back near the end of 2008, and combined w/ dark swarm. Don't think he used it much since. He said at that time, it was pretty APM intensive.
I would like to see him use it now, though. It's been a while.
IIRC it was used before hive with lurkers. I could be thinking of a different game though, as I distinctly recall a few christmas themed games.
It was used during hive, but I think it was while consume was researching. Jaedong sandwiched the force while throwing down ensnare + DS. At least I think that's what it was.
Hm, could've sworn he used ensnare on Sin Chupung Ryeong during lair tech. Eh, details.
Oh, I have thee beaten. s2, Ssak, and Zero are on my main, and so is GGaemo, who went 1-1... Point wise I might be slightly ahead, but outside of that, my team went 1-4 today
On April 23 2011 13:30 BlackMagister wrote: Leta was too passive, nice play by soulkey though.
On April 23 2011 13:31 night terrors wrote: fuck. i have leta on fpl.
well, its pretty interesting to see queens but leta seriously gave him so much time to build up. while SK was saving all that gas leta could have taken out some of his expos.
Terran basically HAS to be passive with mech. The slowest army in the game against the fastest army in the game, they pretty much have no choice but to react to where the zerg is attacking
On April 23 2011 13:52 MountainDewJunkie wrote: I think the real problem that Leta never made a "death push." He kinda macro'd up, took some expos, participated in random skirmishes, then BAM suddenly tanks are exploding and he's scrambling around defending his expos, being spread thin and right into SK's hands. There was that HUGE timing window when SK was massing queens and had virtually no ground army. Leta was not very assertive and seemed to be playing for a map split into starving the opponent.
Leta did push. Look what happened already with the SMALL push of going to eliminate Soulkey's proxy at 10 o'clock. While he was there, soulkey already managed to drop the mid bases and destroy leta's mining there. This is why these TvP style mech pushes dont work in mech TvZ.
EPT![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Milkis/PLWriteup05/scandalousnew.jpg)
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Hite Entus vs Woongjin Stars![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/flamewheel/Team_Icons/WoongjinStars.png){kind=icon}
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Leta « Belt Way » 
Neo.G_Soulkey
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