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United States44353 Posts
On June 17 2017 02:36 Dazed. wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2017 01:16 KwarK wrote:On June 17 2017 01:13 BisuDagger wrote:On June 16 2017 12:55 KwarK wrote:On June 16 2017 08:45 Dazed. wrote:
This recap was kinda eh. 12 hatch 13 pool isnt revolutionary or even new, its the standard way to open in zvt going on at least two years now. You need to catch up on modern strategies Kwark. My bad. If there's not a Protoss in it then I'm out of the meta. But I feel like I've seen 12 11 quite a lot in recent vods too. My understanding is 12 11 > 8 rax at nat > 12 13 > 10 rax > 12 11. Shine got seriously punished for going 12 13 in the quarters. Recently on Jaedong's 'Escape from F' he was instructing everyone to go 13 pool so you can get that extra drone out earlier in order to keep up with Terran economy. 8 rax is a hard, hard counter to that though. When Shine went 12 13 and Mong went 8 rax Shine got reduced to like 7 drones. It's not as hard as you might think. I mean, how do you defend an 8 rax when you 11 pool? It all comes down to the drones. 13 pool makes it a bit harder, but your already in the thick of it if you've been 8 raxed...
A bit harder? It was game losing. 12 11 can hold a single 8 rax at natural pretty easily, creep colony morphing on the rear side of the hatchery, drones staying in the main where they're safe, lings spawn and you're good. When Shine 12 13'd vs Mong he lost so many drones it should have been unwinnable. Watch the Andromeda vod from the quarters.
If you're 110% sure your opponent is going standard 10 rax every game (as Shine was vs Flash in the finals) then sure, squeeze out some extra eco. But if there is any uncertainty it seems suicidal. Slightly stronger eco if they go 10 rax vs game lost if they go 8 rax.
(I know that the Andromeda game Shine won, Mong managed to throw the fuck out of that, it was a clownfest, he had a wallin, expo, marines behind the wall and like 2 scvs per drone of Shine and then couldn't fucking place a scv in the right spot)
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A bit harder is an exaggeration, but what I'm saying is you will find zerg players opening 13 pool on stream very frequently, and they defend 8 rax's frequently as well. Obviously your going to lose a bit more, but its still fundamentally holdable with just drone micro. The amount of games you will win by getting that drone advantage outpaces the vulnerability to 8 rax. Its pretty much replaced 11 pool as the standard. Not entirely of course, but its the 'in' opener.
Shine took way more damage than he should have against mong.
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United States44353 Posts
Welp, I guess I'm just getting old.
So does Shine just suck vs 8 rax at nat? Because he was seriously fucked in those games.
Edit:Shine took way more damage than he should have against mong. Got it, thanks.
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BW series need to be longer, finals being a bo5 is pretty unacceptable tbh, and so many bo1s early stages. it's annoying.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51549 Posts
On June 17 2017 12:27 ]343[ wrote:great read  really appreciate that our bw writers are no longer D level scrubs like me
hi!
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serious question, I'm not an expert on BW (followed SC2 for a few years), is BW Terran just inherently OP?
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United States44353 Posts
On June 27 2017 01:10 jtp118 wrote:
serious question, I'm not an expert on BW (followed SC2 for a few years), is BW Terran just inherently OP?
Not at all. All races have had times of dominance and some of the best players play different races. Flash is just Flash. Balance in BW comes more down to tweaking the map pool than anything else. Easily defensible 3rd gases help Zerg in ZvT and hurt Zerg in ZvP, chokes help P in PvZ but hurt P in PvT and so forth. The last balance patch, as far as I know, was 1.08 in 2001. Since then there have been stretches of domination by each race.
Flash happens to play Terran but Flash would dominate whichever race he'd chosen to learn.
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But he did not dominate sc2.
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United States44353 Posts
On June 27 2017 01:31 fx9 wrote:
But he did not dominate sc2.
It's a different game which requires different skills.
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EPT
