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What Happened to free's PvZ?

Forum Index > BW General
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VGhost
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3621 Posts
June 10 2011 19:02 GMT
#1
There is one player who, for me, comes first. I cheer when he wins, rage (a little) when he loses, despair over the inconsistencies - and follow the Woongjin Stars for his sake. The object of this devotion is a Protoss, who perpetually looks stoned but plays some of the most entertaining games of all time. His name is Yoon Yong Tae. His name is free[gm], and he goes by pretty (which is funny because he's not but his teammates - Really and ZerO at least - kind of are).

An Introduction to Free-v-Z

My fandom was sparked by one game against Jaedong, which was one of the first games I watched getting back into BroodWar in 2008 after college. I want to talk briefly about this game, because it exemplifies several strategic necessities of winning in Starcraft.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSrljNirolw

+ Show Spoiler [Battle Report] +
free opens forge-Nexus-cannon before gateway and plays very safe into sair-DT. Jaedong opens with a pool-hatch build, and takes a third base (and eventually 4th), aiming for a 5 hatch attack. Both players are deterred from their plans by the others' preparedness: Jaedong makes mutalisks, while free goes HT-heavy (his first four HT are morphed to archons) and plays for pressure, with his forces out on the map (without actually attacking). Behind this screen, despite the mutas, free gets his third base up.

Both players continue to probe. free works up to five bases; Jaedong, with a little more effort, manages six. Jaedong raids free's nat with guardians; free adds a DA to his army.

Jaedong drops free's main but loses half his OLs before they can drop, to sairs. free cleans up the attack easily, and counters to Jaedongs natural, where he is met by lurker-ling, defilers, and ultralisks. He wrecks most of the defenses but Jaedong's reinforcements drive him off. Jaedong counters to free's 5th, but is driven off in turn by reavers, cannons, and the rest of free's army. Further skirmishing turns Jaedong's army to free's 4th, where he kills the Nexus, and pours in reinforcements seeking blood - but free's army defends and returns to its dominant position on the map.

Jaedong is slowly bleeding dry, while free slowly works on preparing to expand to his 6th and 7th bases, and runs several storm drops into Jaedong's mining bases. free gets his sixth up, but Jaedong's ultralisks take down the Nexus while free is pounding Jaedong's natural defenses again. But the Zerg army is cut off and mostly destroyed by a larger zealot-archon-reaver force. free stops Jaedong's 7th, and when Jaedong again runs in ultras to stop his own 6th from rebuilding, the previous scene is repeated, with most of the Zerg units dying to a superior army after destroying most of the Protoss buildings.

It's a little more complicated than this, but at this point free retakes his 6th, takes his 7th (with cannons) and smashes in Jaedong's nat, successfully this time. Jaedong ggs.


Analysis

While this game fascinates me, I admit it's not one of the absolute best ever played. free's micro was incredibly sloppy at times. Jaedong's decision-making was poor in many places and incredibly passive. But I do find it a classic example of the value of positional play (which of course in Starcraft is related mainly to control of bases, which is to say econ).

free essentially won this game by winning the early game strategic chicken. Athena 2 is an interesting map in that its central area can plausibly be controlled by a single "ball" army. There are side attack routes, but as Jaedong found (although he failed to utilize them as well as he could have) they are not the most practical way to move large armies around the map for a backstab. Therefore, when free's center-map army survived the mutalisks, and free had three gas (then four and five), he was free (heh) to make the high-gas units that would go toe-to-toe with Zerg Hive tech and win him the game.

To put it another way, Jaedong became a victim of his own early-game passiveness and what almost looks like indecision. Cannons or no, for instance, simply carrying through with 5 hatch hydra would have swept the Protoss units out of the middle and put the pressure on free. Later in the game, accompanying his drop on free's main - which pulled a lot of free's army to defend - with pushing lurkers out into the middle of the map would have gained him the map control he in fact never got. And finally, his counter-counter was a bad idea. He had the forces to push free's army out of the middle (and then expand, cementing an econ lead), but by committing them against the bases instead (to the final result of sniping *a* Nexus) he wasted his advantage to no positional gain, indicating at least a miscalculation.

Not to take away from free: many Protoss would have been overwhelmed by the flood of ultra-ling, would not have had the idea to stay in the Zerg's face the whole game, or messed up any other of countless decisions that won free the game.

Career Background

This game also is valuable because it demonstrates one thing free was (and occasionally still is) known for: unstoppable late-game play against Zerg. But investigating this further, I found something very curious about free's record. For the first fifteen months of his career, free was a Zerg-killing machine, racking up a 70% winrate. This brings us up to The Revolution - after which, in truly rock-like fashion, free's winrate dropped precipitously to a "mere" 58% over the next year. And that really does seem to be a turning point, for whatever weird reason: from beating Jaedong in series play, he went on in the next three months to lose to every good Zerg he faced (and FireFist). On the other hand, his PvT and PvP (previously mediocre and mediocre) became scary and also scary over that next year. In short, free became a complete player in 2007... but for some reason his stellar Zerg-smashing record became merely very good, and it coincides with Bisu's reinventing PvZ. You can see the changes on this handy chart:

[image loading]


The easy hypothesis is that free - possibly under coaching pressure - changed his style to match the new standard. I was going to write on this subject (leading into the question of, "How important is standard play vs. a player's own style), but I ran into a problem. I can't find any VODs of free playing PvZ before Bisu made forge FE standard. The only replay I can find is a game vs Calm on Peaks (and the replay is broken, meaning it's pretty old, and anyway forge FE looks kind of implausible on that map).

So... can some old-timer illumine me? What made free's early PvZ so good? Why did it change?

The other possibility is that Zerg invented something that countered free's style (more focus on early aggression?), but I don't even know where to begin trying to figure that out.
Can
#4427 || I am not going to scan a ferret.
Wala.Revolution
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
7584 Posts
June 10 2011 19:26 GMT
#2
I can't answer your question, but another video that demonstrates Free'z PvZ is his game vs yCH[z-zone (I think)] on a map test.
Stuck.
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
June 10 2011 20:03 GMT
#3
I still remember the Free vs Jaedong series that he won, I thought it was so cool and impressive with his huge balls of archons and stuff. He's so far from that level now.
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
June 10 2011 21:33 GMT
#4
Duh, he hasn't been sent out a lot lately so he probably don't have the chance to show it anymore.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
qzmpwxno
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Papua New Guinea152 Posts
June 10 2011 22:34 GMT
#5
Free used to be one of my fav players, he was one of the 6 dragons as well, but recently he had been kicked into the B team and has just not been playing at the level of his former ability. He got to the semifinal of an OSL or MSL last year but lost to Flash 3-1 after going on a "royal road" (demolishing every opponent in his path in the individual league), since then he hasn't been the same.
Stand on one block but own the whole street~
swanized
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Canada2480 Posts
June 10 2011 22:55 GMT
#6
On June 11 2011 07:34 qzmpwxno wrote:
Free used to be one of my fav players, he was one of the 6 dragons as well, but recently he had been kicked into the B team and has just not been playing at the level of his former ability. He got to the semifinal of an OSL or MSL last year but lost to Flash 3-1 after going on a "royal road" (demolishing every opponent in his path in the individual league), since then he hasn't been the same.

walking the royal road means winning the OSL on your first try not destroying everyone lol
Writer
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
June 10 2011 23:00 GMT
#7
Not having to deal with Muta stack? I dunno, I don't think playing 1base toss would work out for him in the current progaming environment.
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-10 23:05:32
June 10 2011 23:02 GMT
#8
Royal road is what Jaedong did afaik,

Either way, Although we haven't seen much of Free

What the hell happened to Jangbi might be a better question

Best is recovering somewhat of a slump

Kal is currently in a slump pretty much

Bisu is doing well and despite recent games Stork has been oke.(he was on fire during OSL run)

6 dragons not doing so well overall.
WriterXiao8~~
Lightwip
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5497 Posts
June 10 2011 23:11 GMT
#9
Alas, right now there is no Six Dragons, but only TaekBang. Stork isn't even too hot.
If you are not Bisu, chances are I hate you.
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
June 10 2011 23:17 GMT
#10
I am mildly disgruntled by free's performance in the last few months.

If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-10 23:27:09
June 10 2011 23:23 GMT
#11
Not an awful lot in my opinion. Look at his opponent list when he had the high winning percentage, then look at it after. He lost a lot of games to Savior in the second case, not to mention his opponent list in the high percentage winning situation was pretty weak. He upped his game for one series against Jaedong, but couldn't do the same against Savior. That's pretty much it.

Or if you want the snarky answer, DJEtterStyle predicting he would win a starleague by 2010 probably did him in... xD
kamikami
Profile Joined November 2010
France1057 Posts
June 10 2011 23:36 GMT
#12
Speaking of Protoss, right now we have an awesome Bisu, a recovering BeSt, an inconsistent Stork, and... JAEHOON !!!
Khassar de Templari
Mortality
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States4790 Posts
June 10 2011 23:38 GMT
#13
Right now there is no TaekBang. There is only Bisu. Stork is only #5 ranked Protoss by ELO in a season when Protoss is not doing good at all. The only top 10 ranked Protoss to make it even to Ro16 in MSL was Horang2, who got eliminated by rookie Grape (and Grape shows some potential, but don't even dare tell me that he's good because he's not). Bad time for Protoss.

Regarding Free's PvZ, it was very strong through most of last year:
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/details.php?section=korean&type=players&id=175&part=games&vs=Z&league=standard&map=any&from_year=2010&from_month=2&from_day=21&to_year=2010&to_month=11&to_day=18&action=Update

As for why it slipped, I don't know, but his game seems to have slipped as a whole. At one point he was #1 ranked PvT by ELO, but right now he's barely top 5. I guess his PvP hasn't changed much, but it seemed pretty strong in mid 2010, whereas in late 2010 he lost bo3's against Pure and Snow.
Even though this Proleague bullshit has been completely bogus, I really, really, really do not see how Khan can lose this. I swear I will kill myself if they do. - nesix before KHAN lost to eNature
Cheeseburgered
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States716 Posts
June 10 2011 23:38 GMT
#14
Kal was a PvZ wrecking machine until he faced jaedong in the MSL final as well
CJ Entusman #58 | Gogogo Stats
xarthaz
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
1704 Posts
June 11 2011 01:27 GMT
#15
I hate to say it but.. Free is getting old. You see, similarly to stork, they are at the point in their careers where the top plateu of age endowed capability has ended, and is firmly on its course down. No matter what the practice put in, the biological premises that limit people's capabilities run their course.
Aah thats the stuff..
qzmpwxno
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Papua New Guinea152 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-11 01:45:40
June 11 2011 01:44 GMT
#16
+ Show Spoiler +
On June 11 2011 10:27 xarthaz wrote:
I hate to say it but.. Free is getting old. You see, similarly to stork, they are at the point in their careers where the top plateu of age endowed capability has ended, and is firmly on its course down. No matter what the practice put in, the biological premises that limit people's capabilities run their course.


Old?!?!?

He's the same age as Stork, Firebathero, Ggaemo, Hyun, and Frozen. He's only a year older than Bisu. All those guys are still doing good, it's not about age at all, but rather motivation is key. The argument that mechanics or skill or whatever decreases as a player gets older is complete nonsense. Unless you're 30 years old like Nal_ra or Boxer, age isn't the issue. You either have it in you to be a good player or you don't. Simple.

Free is still good, no doubt, but most of his games seem to be 30-minute long macro fests, not exactly the most entertaining style, but it gets the job done. He's a dependable player for the most part with a respectable win ratio, just hasn't done well in individual leagues (with the exception of last year in the MSL/OSL).
Stand on one block but own the whole street~
Kenpachi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States9908 Posts
June 11 2011 02:14 GMT
#17
Horang2 Snow Movie Jaehoon (LOL) Grape Brave Afrotoss.
I think they all have potential to become some of the best.
Nada's body is South Korea's greatest weapon.
Antisocialmunky
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5912 Posts
June 11 2011 02:29 GMT
#18
As long as he doesn't throw away games with scout BM, he's still good in my book.
[゚n゚] SSSSssssssSSsss ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Marine/Raven Guide:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=163605
shucklesors
Profile Joined May 2010
Singapore1176 Posts
June 11 2011 02:35 GMT
#19
On June 11 2011 11:14 Kenpachi wrote:
Horang2 Snow Movie Jaehoon (LOL) Grape Brave Afrotoss.
I think they all have potential to become some of the best.

Hmm.. something's fishy about that..
+ Show Spoiler +
they're all protoss
mage36
Profile Joined May 2011
415 Posts
June 11 2011 04:37 GMT
#20
the real question is... what happened to free?
soudo
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
603 Posts
June 11 2011 04:41 GMT
#21
I love watching (P)free's late-game PvZ. It's not quite as refined and polished as Bisu's, but that's what I like about it. Bisu wins with surgical precision and capitalizes on small openings and the little mistakes his opponents make. Free just builds huge armies and tries to smash your face in with everything he's got.
Canadium
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada171 Posts
June 11 2011 05:11 GMT
#22
I completely agree with the free always looking stoned comment.... He always looks reluctant/annoyed. He's probably saying to himself " *sigh* I could totally own all these guys, but I just don't feel like it today."
You better run Charles....
Kenpachi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States9908 Posts
June 11 2011 23:22 GMT
#23
On June 11 2011 11:35 shucklesors wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2011 11:14 Kenpachi wrote:
Horang2 Snow Movie Jaehoon (LOL) Grape Brave Afrotoss.
I think they all have potential to become some of the best.

Hmm.. something's fishy about that..
+ Show Spoiler +
they're all protoss

.. thats the point
Nada's body is South Korea's greatest weapon.
Spica
Profile Joined December 2010
United States5582 Posts
June 11 2011 23:24 GMT
#24
On June 11 2011 13:37 mage36 wrote:
the real question is... what happened to free?

The Woongjin coaches said before that Free's skill is still intact, but his motivation isn't really anymore. Hopefully he'll find his spark again; I love watching his BM.
How to pronounce the name: "SPY-ka" | Proud to share the same birthday with Shin (神) Dong Won and the almighty BoxeR | 리쌍도 나무에서 떨어진다. | To YellOw: "2位じゃダメなんですか?" ㅋㅋㅋ | Rest in peace, Violet. 08/23/12
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