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Depression is when you refuse to get out of bed for an entire semester and fail all of your classes.
Depression is when you get fired from your job because you don't care enough to go to work.
Depression is when you lose relationships and all your friends when you keep blowing off dates because you just don't "feel like it," and keep making up excuses to stay home.
Depression is when you sleep for 16 hours a day because of the overwhelming apathy and don't care enough to do otherwise.
That was me for three years till the beginning of this year. Only reason I never got fired is because I couldn't damn well get a job at that point. This year I finally managed to finish my degree but this is only the beginning.
I never really noticed or got annoyed at people using the word "depression" in whatever ways they wished. I mean if I can't even bring myself to give a shit about things that matter, why spend energy on complete trifles? I guess also not interacting with people at all helps in not getting annoyed at them.
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On July 30 2012 19:36 Morfildur wrote:
If it wouldn't happen so often, i could really get angry at all those people that went through a short down phase and think they know everything about depression because of it. Feeling down or "depressed" for a few days happens to everyone, as long as you have friends that care about you it's not as bad as it sometimes might feel.
The "tips" that most people that suffered through those phases give to really depressed people are usually somewhere between useless to ridiculous.
I agree with you, but I wasn't under the impression that was what the OP was talking about. Perhaps it was.
Someone made this blog awhile ago:
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=356524
and it really pissed me off. And I'm sure it pissed a lot of other people off too. Everyone who felt that way had the decency not to piss on his parade, but it was so arrogant and so ignorant that I had ended up writing a response and only deleting it after I had wrote what I wanted to say. If this blog was in response to that, then sure, it's a real complaint. Most people don't understand what it means to suffer from depression and consequently say dumb things like this because they're too pea brained to know that you have to offer some kind of reasoning to communicate with a depressed person, because the obvious reply to every blanket statement about happiness is 'I don't feel that way about it.'
If that's what we're discussing then it's something totally different, but I think people who are going thru a short period of depression or whatever you wanna call it are trying to advise other people with similarly short period of depression. What they don't really get is that no one needs advice for it, because no one is too dumb not to do the really obvious things and if they just wait a week or two they were gonna feel better about their ugly girlfriend breaking up with them anyway.
Still, labels tend to make things worse and accepting one's doom isn't exactly the best way to deal with depression. Labels can exacerbate conditions. I often ask 'what exactly is depression?' not in a strict definition of its symptoms, but in what exactly is happening in the brain and why it is happening and if it is really so impossible to cope with by changes in behaviour. Which is part of why I don't mind advice like try to eat better and force yourself to sleep at normal hours, and do new things. You might not feel that good about them, you might not enjoy doing them, but usually you feel way worse when you just wallow in your sadess on your bed for 20 hours a day. I don't like to think of depression as an impossible mountain the way some people do, which is why I hate the pissing contest as much as I hate the trivilizing of the issue. You might go out with friends and feel like shit about it afterward and wonder why you bother at all, and I think it's reasonable to call that depression, but an intelligent mind knows that either you are going to waste your time lying on your bed all day with nothing ever changing, you are going to kill yourself, or you are going to force yourself to do things and hope that eventually something clicks (accepting that it may be a long time or may never happen, but just for the possibility and chance of it).
Depression doesn't necessarily mean that you are a parasite who can't do anything for him or herself. That is something else entirely. A personality that gives up incredibly easily is not necessarly the same as one that is disappointed and sad most of the time. I think most people with chronic depression go thru a phase where they have incredibly trouble pulling themselves to do anything, make tonnes of excuses, don't recognize their situation, but then after feeling that way for so many years eventually develop habits that enable them to function in society even if their mood has not improved, because they eventually face a decision with whether they are capable of commiting suicide or whether they want to find as much comfort in their misery as possible.
tl;dr: that was an incredibly long post and probably didn't need to be, but essentially I think some people are very eager to classify depression on one end of the spectrum or the other, where like almost all issues in life it is more complex than that, and the less you simplify it the more able you are to deal with the reality of it instead of inventing its reality.
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I get what the OP is saying. The worst is when people compare their small down states to others' full-blown depression. It leads them to thinking when they are down it's the same as the depression of others when it isn't at all. And it leads to the pathetically uninformed statements like "Just go out and be active, you'll get over it", "Don't worry, It'll pass" etc.
But what I disagree with is the claim that there is only one kind of legitimate depression: The one that affects you in such a way that you can't be functional at all. But this simply isn't the case. There are people who maintain a bright facade around friends and family with depression. And there are certainly people with major depressive disorder who manage to continue going to class and work. If you've ever seen a suicide that comes out of nowhere for seemingly no reason ('he seemed so happy!'), I think you'd be less certain of your claims.
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why make a pissing contest out of word that has multiple meanings
you do realize that there are lots of people who have killed themselves due to clinical depression that showed few if any outward signs to family and friends?
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I agree that the word is overused. I'm always very careful about using it because I experienced depression firsthand for about 4 years. I know what it actually is, and I don't use it lightly. But you can't expect everyone to take such care in distinguishing feeling "depressed" or "discouraged" from full blown depression. It is just one of those terms that people toss around because they hear it so often that they can't think of any other term to better describe how they feel.
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I understand the need to claim the word depression, but honestly, it's more important to find out if your friend legitimately has a problem. Not everyone has major depressive disorder (the symptoms of which you described in your post). Some people (like me) have more minor, but still serious and chronic, disorders such as Dysthymia. Many of these disorders are hard to detect, as sufferers will think it's simply a part of their personality.
You can talk to your friend about the abuse of the word when they're in a better place in their life. For now, try to help, and if they seem to be worsening, encourage them to get help.
(Edit: No reason for me to quote the whole OP).
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There's a lot of stuff going on in this thread so I'll try to respond and explain my reasoning as clearly as I can.
Firstly yes there are a lot of different meanings of depression. The issue is that the popular use of the word has shifted recently to mean, more often than not, serious clinical depression and not temporary downturns of sadness. This is fueled partly by culture, specifically ads for anti depression medicines. They encourage people who are suffering from depression to seek help and or get medication. These commercials almost exclusively refer to it as "depression" not clinical depression, so therefore the usage of the word has shifted. So while I understand your points about depression having many different uses, I rarely see it used in any other way than implying serious clinical depression.
This leads to other problems, as was discussed in other posts. Labels, when you label yourself as seriously depressed even when you're not it can lead to you believing it and a more serious downturn. Or as others have discussed when they suddenly get better, they can start spewing out bad advice on how to recover from depression. Depression is different for everyone, and how to recover from depression is different as well. The one consistent thing is, advice that generally tells you to suck it up because you'll feel better soon is a sack of crap and comes from the misuse of the term depression.
It also wasn't my intention to start a pissing contest over depression, and I apologize if that's the way it came off. I merely intended (and apparently failed) to provide perspective for the worst end of the spectrum. So that those who are misusing the word can get some comparison.
Yes you can be seriously depressed without being that bad, and sometimes people can be outwardly happy and be seriously depressed. But that often comes from someone who has partially recovered but is still struggling, or is just hiding their feelings because they're scared. Depression isn't something that just goes away, you don't stop feeling depressed because you found some magical thought process that makes everything better. This is another reason why all these false claims on how to get better are bad, for someone who is struggling through real clinical depression it is a constant fight that never really goes away. Someone can be on medication and be "recovered," find themselves in a good enough spot that they go off medication for five years and be fine, but they can still get hit by a relapse at any time.
Depression is a constant struggle, and something to be taken seriously. So, keeping in mind that the usage of the term has shifted to imply serious clinical depression, that is why I say it isn't a word that should be thrown around so easily.
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Agreed. People should get penalized for misusing words like that because, clearly, it causes other people like you to write pointless blogs about it, resulting in me wasting my time.
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i think the kind of depression you are talking about is called chronic depression
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On July 30 2012 11:43 Raelcun wrote:
The point is everyone goes through down periods in their life where they're sad and it seems bleak and dark. At every point in someone's life it seems like things can't possibly get any better, but this is not depression. Being sad for a few days and finding yourself lacking in motivation is not depression, because this generally fades away given time. If you randomly wake up and everything is better for no apparent reason, you probably weren't depressed.
This seems pretty elitist and arrogant to me. More importantly, it asserts a few claims that just are not true. Depression is defined by the DSM IV, not OP's personal opinions on what does and does not constitute depression. It's true that being sad for a few days/finding yourself lacking in motivation is not enough to be called depression, but the fact that depression symptoms can fade away over time for no apparent reason does not suddenly mean you weren't depressed at all. I've gone through episodes of depression that have lasted anywhere from 2 years at the longest, to 3-4 months at the shortest, and with each major episode, there was no general reason why my symptoms faded; they just did. I don't think it would be correct to say that I wasn't depressed simply on the basis that I woke up one morning and started to feel better.
Depression is when the sadness completely overtakes everything in your life. When you cannot function as a normal human being because of the apathy and overwhelming sense of helplessness. Depression is a dark pit in which it can seem impossible to escape from, and it actively fucks with your life. Generally if you're still getting to work on time, and functioning as a normal human being from day to day you are not seriously depressed. Not to say there might not be other issues in your life, but depression is serious business.
Depression is when you refuse to get out of bed for an entire semester and fail all of your classes.
Depression is when you get fired from your job because you don't care enough to go to work.
Depression is when you lose relationships and all your friends when you keep blowing off dates because you just don't "feel like it," and keep making up excuses to stay home.
Depression is when you sleep for 16 hours a day because of the overwhelming apathy and don't care enough to do otherwise.
These are huge sweeping generalizations that establish what Depression can be, not what Depression always is. Depression can be a refusal to get out of bed for an entire semester. Depression can also rear its ugly head when you are getting up on time for class every day, getting a 4.0 for the semester. Depression can be when you get fired because you just stop caring about going to work. It can also take form when you get recognized by your boss for being the most conscientious worker in the company.
Depression isn't general. It's not easy to label or be certain of. The term covers a wide variety of symptoms, thoughts and feelings, some of which are easy to notice, like the major lifestyle changes described above, some of which are completely impossible to detect, and the latter symptoms do not always come packaged neatly with the former symptoms. Depression isn't always so obvious and it doesn't always prevent the sufferer from performing day-to-day life tasks. It can prevent you from living your life normally, but it does not have to.
I lost my father in June of last year and took a break from Starcraft because of it. I had to seriously stop and evaluate my life and where it was going. There were points where I didn't know what to do, and I was overwhelmed with crushing sadness, but it wasn't depression. This was just extreme despair, and while they seem similar, they're very different.
In short, still seek help from your friends, their attention and caring can be a good thing. But for the love of Kerrigan stop saying you're depressed because you were sad for a few days.
This part I can agree with, and this-I'd assume-is OP's actual point. Unfortunately it was hidden at the end of a rant which continuously (maybe accidentally) asserted that what many people experience through their Depression is not really Depression.
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On July 30 2012 11:43 Raelcun wrote:
In short, still seek help from your friends, their attention and caring can be a good thing. But for the love of Kerrigan stop saying you're depressed because you were sad for a few days.
What if you're sad for your entire life? Do you qualify as depressed, or do we go into super depressed? Or mega depressed? What if every doctor you've ever been to just jumps ship at the slightest provocation after declaring you totally immune to stimulants? What if you're additionally depressed because your suicide attempts failed? Do we become neo-depressed or ssj-depressed?
What if you have no friends? What then? Shall I seek my solace in steel and fire?
Things are not always so simple as the words of men make them to be. Words of men are but blankets of conception without value nor weight. Like morals and faith, they are hollow, and think not of them as absolute.
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On July 31 2012 21:44 IskatuMesk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 30 2012 11:43 Raelcun wrote:
In short, still seek help from your friends, their attention and caring can be a good thing. But for the love of Kerrigan stop saying you're depressed because you were sad for a few days. What if you're sad for your entire life? Do you qualify as depressed, or do we go into super depressed? Or mega depressed? What if every doctor you've ever been to just jumps ship at the slightest provocation after declaring you totally immune to stimulants? What if you're additionally depressed because your suicide attempts failed? Do we become neo-depressed or ssj-depressed? What if you have no friends? What then? Shall I seek my solace in steel and fire? Things are not always so simple as the words of men make them to be. Words of men are but blankets of conception without value nor weight. Like morals and faith, they are hollow, and think not of them as absolute.
You just described my life.
I don't like dragonball or dragonball referenced but I think i'll still start calling myself SSJ-depressed now, that term sounds a lot better than "chronic depression".
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For a lot of (most?) people being "a bit sad" is perfectly equal to saying "feeling depressed", because well they are extremely similar.
The difference is when someone says they ARE depressed, as in they HAVE depression and differentiating between the two is where mix ups can occur.
When someone says they're feeling depressed they're (generally) not implying they have depression (unless they say it's prevalent in their life or affected them for a long time etc).
I'm not saying you're getting confused and infact the people you talk about may very well all claim to be depressed, just saying that some use the word without actually equating it to being *clinically* depressed.
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You sound like you have no idea what you are talking about. It's just an imperfect word (like all words) to describe one's state. It's meaning can also change.
It just sounds like you had it rough and anyone else who is having problems didn't have It as badas you. Or only people who can't live anymore have depression. It is ignorant, foolish, and preachy. Especially if you don't have the facts straight.
I'm offended.
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I just found out I might be depressed
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I agree with all of this, i suffered from severe depession for 3 years and it isnt something that can be taken lightly, you dont lose a couple ladder games and say your depressed, its like a hand of sadness and lives in your head and grabs everything you do, care for, or think about, and strangles every last bit of you out of them.
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My parent had diagnosed for depression.
The one would be paranoid at all time having irational prescient thought about future occurrences. Like one time, a thought about a relative getting kidnapped by the mafia because she wouldn't respond to a text message. Others like "there is not point in living anymore." and actually attempt to terminate one's own life w/ the most bland expression of no contrite or sorrow.
Now that's depression. If anyone's reaction to a specific type of event that took place in their place to be "Go away!" or "Leave me alone!". That's not the scientifc symptoms for depression. It is more like isolation and want to recuperate their emotions. Depressions goes far beyond that point with multiple melodramatic incident hitting the subject in ways that he or she are too mentally unprepared to handle. In the end, their self-esteems is utterly shattered and thus can't find any other items to get a hold of to resume their livelihood.
Now that's the clinical definition for the term.
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Have you attempted suicide? No? Then you're not depressed. Depression and other psychological disorders can come in varying degrees. No point arguing about a word that has a clinical definition as well as a casual definition.
It's almost as if you have a prerogative with the word. As if someone using it somehow diminishes what you went through and what you experienced.
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Depression is a word that has been stretched and tortured, especially over the last twenty years, due to our increasingly blameless society and power of pharmaceutical companies. Throw in with the mix anxiety, too.
But it really is a shame because there are many people who are legitimately depressed, and no, I don't mean just clinically. If anything, those who are in true need of help are marginalized and lumped together with those that are merely situationally "blue" but seek quick solutions and absolving of responsibility through medication and labels.
Isn't there a lot to be "depressed" and "anxious" about? Real wages continue to fall as the prices of all things rise. Benefits are being slashed. Healthcare is barely affordable. Globalization (particularly, the exploitation) is especially depressing. Many families are broken. Many people are unhappy. People will die in debt (both the fault of themselves and the corrupt institutions). Loved ones will die. So we had better sedate ourselves with pills and accept the ways of the world.
P.S. your reference to a progamer claiming to be depressed? Is this blog inspired by+ Show Spoiler +
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It hasn´t really been stretched, nor tortured.
It´s just that there is a lot of steps in depression.
For example when I was in depression I told my symptoms and was graded by my psychiatrist to be around 30-40 in a 1-100 model (1 is most depressed.) But I am quite an outgoing guy so I really doubted it as I was very active, it was all really inside that I was depressed. And I had enormous amount of stress building up. I time from time reached out to good/close friends and talked about how I was depressed and that is why I am skipping a year in school etc etc.
At the time I still doubted my depression and wondered why I talked about it. I realize now later that it was me just venting trying to brake trough the depression and getting help.
So if someone who was in even deeper depression, I can understand that they feel - because I am still outgoing and seemingly happy - that I am just ''lying'' and not as ''hardcore'' as they are. When I desperately needed help to not slip down in even deeper depression.
Never judge people who say they are depressed, they might just reaching out
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EPT
