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Yeah, I realize this is a kind of a strategy question, but it's too whiny and no where near strat. forum quality, so it's going in blogs.
So... following are 3 replays, with the question- how on earth do I win ZvP? It seems that there's three builds that I can't do anything about, namely:
1. Cannon rush that starts by the ramp.
2. VR openers
3. 4-gate
#1- the cannon rush: Replay:
http://www.mediafire.com/?bc6lhbcbuchpvvb
Even if my drones' AI would actually attack the cannons instead of glitching out and sitting there looking dumb, I don't see how I could possibly beat this- I can't mine because I'm having to attack cannons, and my opponent gets a free expansion whenever he wants it, turning it to 2-base Protoss vs. 1/2 base Zerg.
#2 VRs:
http://www.mediafire.com/?314xtazh57511k3
Can't leave my base, no way to trade armies to prevent the deathball from forming.
#3 4-gate
http://www.mediafire.com/?3d76j95m9ch9eq0
Even an incorrectly done 4-gate rapes me easily. I'm behind in econ (since I have to build units), have a smaller army, and then just get forcefielded to death.
What am I doing wrong? Why am I 100% unable to beat Protoss (my record against toss in the last month is literally 1 win, 14 losses). I'm in Gold (although I'm probably going to drop to Silver as soon as the lock is lifted), so it's not even an imbalance thing, but I seriously cannot win this matchup, and given that it's what I get most of on ladder, it's starting to get ridiculously frustrating.
 
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I've only watched the cannon rush replay so far, so I'll start with that. Your response wasn't very good here. Your early scout saw that he was going forge first, so you should have known what was coming. If you want to block the pylon wall-off, get a drone down to patrol the bottom of the ramp.
If you do get walled off, don't panic and send all your drones. Instead, get a spine crawler to stop him building up above your ramp, build up a little, spread the creep towards the ramp, and use your forces and spine crawler to bust the contain. Then just go and kill him.
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Have you tried playing terran? joke jokes jokes jokes
If you're having trouble with early openers, try getting a pool first before even thinking about expanding. Like get 2 lings out and then say "time for an expansion". If you combine this with avoiding lingspeed for a while and going for roaches, you can get a seriously strong opening.
Experiment with ling/baneling builds against those early gate rushes. The most important thing is to not be static. You lose 14/15 games with what you're doing now, so you really have nothing to lose by trying new strats.
Good luck!
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United States3939 Posts
I can't watch the games but I can give a few pointers
If you're being cannoned you must kill the probe. This is your #1 goal then just put like 5 drones on the pylon that's warping in. If you can kill the probe you're set, if you can't kill the probe but you kill the pylon it gives you enough time to keep making drones and delay for lings to deal with the probe. If he can't get a pylon up he can't build cannons.
vs voidrays TSL3 SPOILER
+ Show Spoiler +watch mondragon vs zeerax and then come tell me you can't leave you base when he goes voidrays. If he's going mass void just stick on your 2/3 base (depends on map) and get lair/hydras while defending with queens (ideally not spores, but if you have to make them, do it.). Then just go kill him. Voildrays feel a lot stronger than they actually are.
to be honest I'm really only posting this to get more people to watch mondi vs zeerax because this is how zerg is supposed to be played.
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I didn't watch the replays, so I may completely miss the point  Also, I'm not too hot a player myself.
Vs cannon rush:
If you can't prevent the cannon from going up, don't panic! Calmly get a spine crawler and expand creep towards your ramp. The spine crawler can nicely get rid of the wall-in without any losses. Since this takes a while, you may want to build a macro hatchery in your main.
Vs 4Gate:
It is critical that you scout the additional gateways being built in time. If you see them, get 2-4 spine crawlers and pump nothing but roaches. If you get your stuff out in time, you can hold quite easily. If you react too late, you're dead.
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On March 29 2011 00:17 Hurricane wrote:vs voidrays TSL3 SPOILER+ Show Spoiler +watch mondragon vs zeerax and then come tell me you can't leave you base when he goes voidrays. If he's going mass void just stick on your 2/3 base (depends on map) and get lair/hydras while defending with queens (ideally not spores, but if you have to make them, do it.). Then just go kill him. Voildrays feel a lot stronger than they actually are.
to be honest I'm really only posting this to get more people to watch mondi vs zeerax because this is how zerg is supposed to be played.
+ Show Spoiler +
those games were very specific situations with insanely greedy P play. usually Ps have more then 1 cannon and a sentry out and dont double expand with nothing but 2 voidrays 5 phoenix and 3 collosus.
yeah its def a possibility and style people should keep in mind and use when the opportunity is there. but as much as i loved those games (huge mondi fan since like forever) its in no way a reliable "go to" strat and is quite risky since if he holds youre doomed.
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Can't watch replays but I'll give general advice on what i found to work when I do roll Zerg (random player)
Contains
ZvZ, put the second overlord at your natural. Gives vision for cannon/bunker rushes. Always kill the worker first, if you go building first then can just cancel then start another one. If for whatever reason I get contained
-- If contain is next to my ramp, a spine crawler will take it out. Cannons have the same range but no vision of high ground.
-- If It's only a cannon. Use roaches and micro them back when they get 25% HP -- should be able to take the cannon out without losing a unit and later burrow. Beware if they have sentries a FF will ruin your day.
-- If they invested a lot in the contain; I will go 1 base all in with nydus. If they have good vision of their base, place it outside. Your just hoping your army is exponentially bigger as they generally contain, expand. Lots of money went in the contain and expansion thus you should have a timing where their army is small. If you place it outside of the protoss base, you may want to place one inside while they are force fielding their ramp (if they do).
Void Rays
Extra queens work wonders. Get 1-2 tumors spread around your base so your queens have running room. Save extra for transfuse, the extra creep will help the roaches speed so they can easily kite the zealots that are bound to come.
Four Gate
I find it only scary if they get the forward pylon down. I always get 4-6 lings when my pool finishes.
-- 2 lings at their ramp back far enough where they don't see but close enough where a probe won't sneak past.
-- 1-2 lings at watch towers (depending on map)
-- 1-2 lings checking around your base for a quick forward pylon from scout
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my response to voidrays is queens and spores until ic an put out a good number of roach and hydra with upgrades. and then like what july did in game 2 of the march GSLs, simply overlord drop them into your opponents base.
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I'm not that great, but I'll give you what tips I have.
If you scout a 4-gate, pump a bunch of roaches and if you really feel like you need them, get a few spine crawlers. You'll feel really bad about your economy, but if you survive the 4gate, you're in a good position. It's pretty awkward to transition out of a 4gate, so it's sort of all-in for the protoss even if it's not technically an all-in.
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EPT
