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Topic: Religion/Philosophy
Settings: Very drunk and high after a house party.
Opponent(s): Friend of 12 years, Friend of 6 months.
Question at hand: Why do less mature people think its ok and good to be discussing religion/philosophy while hammered?
Basically this is a conundrum I've encountered just last night at a party. The christians started talking about how they were right and blah blah. When asked for input, I replied, "I don't discuss religion while I'm drunk." My friend of 6 months was one of these less-mature people who generally starts going down bad paths that a person of his age should know better.
Upon arriving home, he and my very intoxicated friend of 12 years were still talking about religion. Keep in mind this long-time friend is about the most gullible guy on the planet. Lovable as all hell, but he's about as bright as a brick. He thought his mind was being blown about this, that, and the other thing that my other friend was spouting off about how he sees the world and how God was responsible for everything and how he was invincible because God told him he was.
After listening to this sickeningly-skewed variation of my own philosophy for about 10 minutes, he finally says something I just can't help but utter a response to. He says "Manny Pacquiao ain't shit man. I've taken punches from guys like 240 lbs, back in my football days, I was the star player. I was the shit. Everyone relied on me. I could've had a full scholarship to University of Minnesota. Why didn't I take it? Because I'm the best actor in the world. I know that I would end Manny real quick." Now... I'm no pro... I haven't followed boxing for very long... but I know who Manny Pacquiao is, and I know his legacy. I uttered "Wooooooow... you're really that delusional?" To this, he went off on a rant about how I had so little faith and that God would grant him the will to knock Manny out.
Now... this whole "strategy" of being blindly aggressive, ignorant, and just plain refusing to listen and exist in your own bliss... is this just America that has an overwhelming population of really ignorant, aggressive retards? Is this just me? I understand the whole idea of "The world can only place limitations on you if you let it." but this is being interpreted in a bad manner. There's a certain point where this idea isn't meant to be literal. "I can do whatever I want because I deem it so" sounds like something crazy people say to themselves. Yes, its a nice little thing to tell yourself when you're down to give you hope, but taking this to a level where you just think reality will bend to your will and everyone is just a player in your world is incredibly stupid.
Am I missing something serious here? Is loud, stupid, and extremely bull-headed the way to go in America?
 
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Wouldn't really let one guy set your tone for a whole country. There will be no changing his mind unfortunately, so it's best to just ignore him when he gets going like that
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was he drunk? that could be an explanation
if he wasn't drunk then he's just retarded. americans are pretty cool, no less different then any other people. don't generalize around 1 retard
probably some freak with a religious upbringing and spoiled. doesn't mean you can't be friends just don't bring up any talk about religion
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To answer your question:
Yes, that is much more common in USA than it is in many other countries.
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That's like me saying: is it just Koreans who would be so ignorant as to assume one could possibly represent a nation of ~307 million? There are bull-headed, narrow-sighted people everywhere. I'd advise you not to be one of them. Just because it's in vogue to make sweeping generalizations about "Americans" and "America" doesn't somehow make said generalizations correct.
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If he believes in god then there's pretty much no limit to what he can believe apparently.
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You're looking at the extreme end of a spectrum. In general, you should focus on the middle. There are people like this who seem delusional, but there are also people who see themselves as completely worthless unable to accomplish anything. From personal experience, the latter does not feel very good. The sweeping generalization you make is a fallacy and it's only detrimental to you not everyone else. It may also depend on your location in the US.
On a side note, don't tell me this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Secret_(book) isn't real?! If I believe enough it'll come true!
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I always discuss philosophy when I'm drunk, and religion, and literature, and politics, and economics.
Mind you, your friend sounds like a bad person to base the "standard American" off of. But I see nothing wrong with these topics, especially if the people you're talking to are intelligent. Your friend just really does sound dumber than a brick and talking about such intelligent topics as religion and philosophy with a dumb person at ANY point, drunk or not, is just bound to end in frustration.
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Man, next time you guys start talking religion and whatnot when completely outta your minds, record it.
It'll be a blast to listen to once you're sober 
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I think speaking of anything relating to religion should be banned and the word should be made into taboo. No matter if people are sober or hammered they start arguing about shit that most times makes no sense and that is impossible to two people understand in the same way. It´s just infuriating, a good example of people talking only because they want to be heard when they have nothing to say.
I so wish people would shut up about spiritual themes, no one will ever understand your view so why bother.
Same should apply for drunken banter too. People sound stupid enough when they are sober I can´t stand anyone who can´t shut up when they are drunk.
And your friends way of thinking is as arrogant bullshit as it gets, funny how he justifies his narcism and bloated ego by God. Atleast the satanists are honest to themselves on that matter.
Jesus was a communist and a teamplayer to the heart, I wonder how well he has read his Bible..
Or then he is just super delusional. Of course I don´t mean you can´t be delusional after reading the Bible, most people seem to be.
But that´s just how I see it.
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Knock that fucker out and tell him his faith must have not been strong enough.
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How do the actions of one drunken friend you've known for six months represent American culture? Moreso it seems like he just got drunk and bragged idiotically, your interpretation is very strange.
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Koreans are fucking retarded.
Consider this.
KAIST is considered the single top school in Korea for science and engineering.
A KAIST student has told me, with a straight face, completely sober, that he believes that the Earth is literally 6,000 years old.
Is this level of intellectual blindness as smart as Koreans get?
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you can find stupid people everywhere in the world
especialy if there's alcohol near
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Wow that American spewing blind faith is so ignorant. Ignorance must be prevalent among Americans at large. Wait a minute...
To be honest, though, I'm not really happy with how big of a role Christianity plays in American society.
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We have plenty of Creationists in America... a lot of religious fundamentalists are as ignorant as your friend is, even when they're completely sober.
I believe the running statistics are that half of Americans don't accept evolution, and a quarter of us don't know that the Earth revolves around the sun (they get confused and think it's the other way around).
But I'd like to think that stupid people exist in other places of the world too, since religion isn't only prevalent in America. Faith-based ignorance will persist wherever religion is more important than logic, facts, and science.
The biggest problem is that most of them aren't open-minded enough to change their minds, no matter how rational your arguments are, and regardless of how perfectly you dismantle their positions. It's a pity, because a person's beliefs affect their actions... so if a person's beliefs are irrational, than their actions may become dangerous.
Fortunately, I think our society as a whole is headed in the right direction, because I think the newer generation isn't as closed-minded as the older one. I think we're making progress and becoming more liberal. We're still going to have nutjobs though.
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On November 15 2010 04:47 HwangjaeTerran wrote:
I think speaking of anything relating to religion should be banned and the word should be made into taboo.
It's one of the most essential components of our existence, for belief or not...and we shouldn't discuss it!? I completely disagree. It's one of the things that SHOULD be discussed. I think it should be encouraged. What we're missing is the composure, maturity and mental stretching required to have such conversations and that's only some of us.
on the speaking of religious beliefs
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There's no such thing as an extended conversation on the topic of religion that includes composure and maturity. You both agree that your premises are different and move on to another topic.
Oh. Mental stretching. I see.
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Next time he does that stuff just take your tshirt, or sweater and pull it up over your mouth and nose, while looking at him in a serious manner.
He will stop talking. I guarantee it.
as for talking and doing shit while hammered, its either because the booze lets him talk about his insecurities or smt. Anyone that talk like that while under influence of alcohol are supressing some side of them when they arent under the influence of alcohol.
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I pretty much avoid discussing politics and religion/philosophy altogether while drinking UNLESS I know the friend I'm with can keep a civil discussion even after a couple of beers.
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Religion is just bad. Seriously seriously bad. Poison if you will.
Free your mind from the poison and the world opens up to you in ways otherwise impossible.
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the only reason you see it so much more in USA than other countries is because there are actually Athiests here that the theists will argue with. in most other countries people are just the same only they are mostly all in agreement with each other so it doesnt show since there is no conflict.
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On November 15 2010 07:31 Keldrath wrote:
the only reason you see it so much more in USA than other countries is because there are actually Athiests here that the theists will argue with. in most other countries people are just the same only they are mostly all in agreement with each other so it doesnt show since there is no conflict.
Seriously, the USA does not have a monopoly on atheism -.- There are heaps of atheists in other countries and plenty of religious conflict going around. It's just the american ego + poor education + fundamentalist christianity creates for an obnoxious personality that any sane person would argue with. We have hardcore christians in Aus but they're generally just not as 'in your face' with their beliefs.
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On November 15 2010 07:41 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2010 07:31 Keldrath wrote:
the only reason you see it so much more in USA than other countries is because there are actually Athiests here that the theists will argue with. in most other countries people are just the same only they are mostly all in agreement with each other so it doesnt show since there is no conflict. Seriously, the USA does not have a monopoly on atheism -.- There are heaps of atheists in other countries and plenty of religious conflict going around. It's just the american ego + poor education + fundamentalist christianity creates for an obnoxious personality that any sane person would argue with. We have hardcore christians in Aus but they're generally just not as 'in your face' with their beliefs.
you only really see it in first world countries. which do not make up the majority of the worlds population.
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On November 15 2010 07:31 Keldrath wrote:
the only reason you see it so much more in USA than other countries is because there are actually Athiests here that the theists will argue with. in most other countries people are just the same only they are mostly all in agreement with each other so it doesnt show since there is no conflict.
That's probably true to some extent. There are hardly any theists what so ever in sweden, at least not around my age. Those that are tend to be very private about their faith.
The US on the other hand seems like it's split right down the middle with evangelists on one side and atheists on the other.
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Just like others said in the thread so far don't think that one person reflects on a whole nation, don't also think that one person reflects on a whole religion.
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On November 15 2010 07:31 Keldrath wrote:
the only reason you see it so much more in USA than other countries is because there are actually Athiests here that the theists will argue with. in most other countries people are just the same only they are mostly all in agreement with each other so it doesnt show since there is no conflict.
So answer the very broad generalization that is anti-american with another very broad generalization equally unfounded that is pro american.
Nice.
(reverse the anti/pro if you are not an atheist)
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Discussion while drunk? Sad! That just means he's not confident enough to present them sober, probably because he knows it's all bs.
And no, has nothing to do with him being American. I've seen this happen plenty during my travels. The insecure people get big mouths with alcohol, better than big fists i guess.
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discussions while inebriated dont usually go well. mix in sensitive topics like religion/politics/philosophy and you have a disaster.
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When my girlfriend wasn't able to tell it is the moon that revolves around the earth I kinda lost hope for a cultivated environment here in north america : /
Once she also asked me if Napoleon and Julius Cesar were around the same era -.-
And I mean she is far from being the dumbest girl around (she's doing fine at the university and shit), but I must admit being european but now living in canada I clearly find the average north american less cultivated.
Of course there are still more educated people.
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EPT
