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United States24675 Posts
I'm not going to write a guide for good trolling techniques. I don't think it would be very good and there are many others already on tl. I'm just going to talk about a recent phenomenon (not that recent honestly) that is apparent both on and off of tl.
As many of you are already aware (but not all unfortunately), the word trolling has ascended to a new meaning. It used to mean approximately:
Trolling is trying to get a rise out of someone. Forcing them to respond to you, either through wise-crackery, posting incorrect information, asking blatantly stupid questions, or other foolishness.
But it's been expanded to mean:
Any time anyone says anything that isn't 100% serious.
What the hell? Where did this come from? I guess a lot of people just didn't understand what trolling was, tried to pick it up from context, failed miserably, and then started disseminating their own crappy interpretation. Just to clarify a couple of examples:
Example 1
+ Show Spoiler +Person 1: Why is Bisu such a failure at protoss? Person 2: What the fuck!? Bisu has so many accomplishments and dominated for a long time. You have no right to say bad things about him after all he's done for bw. Analysis+ Show Spoiler +Trolling! Person 1 doesn't necessarily have anything against Bisu. Person 1 just knew that Person 2 would flip out and defend Bisu. Person 1 was amused by Person 2's heartfelt and long-ish response. If Person 1 is feeling extra trolly he'll continue the charade further.
Example 2
+ Show Spoiler +Person 1: Here's a terran fpvod I made to help the community learn how to play terran better. + Show Spoiler +http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=58459 Not trolling! It is painfully obvious that person 1 isn't serious, and he doesn't actually intend for people to think that this was a serious attempt at creating a demonstration fpvod. Still, people have told me it's an exellent troll. No, it's not! The fact that a few people actually fell for it is a testament to their obliviousness rather than trolly nature of the thread.
Conclusion: Over half of the accusations I see of trolling on TL are wrong. This isn't a phenomenon limited to TL so I don't blame its members, but if you are someone who often makes this mistake please take a moment to think about this.
Bonus: Provide the analysis for this sample yourself:
Example 3
+ Show Spoiler +[15:08] <micronesia> what do you do if you go 2 gate zealots and your opponent goes 2 fact vultures
[15:08] <Zavior> find a hard object
[15:08] <Zavior> bash random thigns with it
[15:09] <Jathin> um
[15:09] <Jathin> you shouldn't be going 2gate zealots if your opponent goes 2fact vultures
[15:09] <micronesia> I always go 2 gate zealots vs terran it's the best strategy
[15:09] <Jathin> but if, for god knows what reason, you're in that position
[15:10] <Jathin> hold your ramp with zeals and stall until you get goons
[15:10] <micronesia> I don't get goons; I rush straight from zealots to scouts
[15:10] <micronesia> so I can kill the vultures more easily
[15:10] <Jathin> word
[15:10] <suxN> i guess you could go for a cannon then, since youre lacking gas not minerals rite?
[15:11] <micronesia> lol
[15:11] <Jathin> cannon and rush to reaver
[15:11] <Jathin> that's your only hope
[15:11] <micronesia> but what if he goes 12 battlecruisers
[15:11] <micronesia> that's what always kills me
[15:11] <Jathin> scourges
[15:11] <Zavior> you retaliate with proxy fleet beacon
[15:11] <Zavior> how could you not see that
[15:11] <suxN> wtf, battlecruisers shouldnt be the problem if youre doing scouts
[15:11] <intrigue_> if u block ur ramp with pylons
[15:11] <intrigue_> battlecruisers cant do shit
[15:12] <micronesia> intrigue_ good point let me practice that in 1 player mode
[15:12] <Jathin> MC his scv
[15:12] <suxN> pylons are for noobs, 4x shield battery
[15:12] <Jathin> and make turrets
edit: your own examples can be offered if you like
  
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
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I think it's just something someone says when they say something wrong and try to play it off so that they can pretend that they got you by trolling rather than them just owning themselves by being a moron.
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Example 1 isn't really trolling either imo. It doesn't seem like it was trying to get a rise out of anyone.
Real trolling happens in political threads. People who believe the holocaust is real, but just for fun start saying that it's not and acting like a racist retard so that someone will spend a hour telling them how wrong they are and playing hero to everything that is decent about humanity.
Which is separate from pranks and people who just don't get sarcasm or satire.
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Trolsl 5/5 would read again.
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Yeah, I'd say trolling is more extreme/has more effort put into it than Example 1.
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United States24675 Posts
On January 03 2010 05:41 ghostWriter wrote:
I think it's just something someone says when they say something wrong and try to play it off so that they can pretend that they got you by trolling rather than them just owning themselves by being a moron.
I agree; this is something I didn't address but comes up a lot also.
On January 03 2010 05:43 Chef wrote:
Example 1 isn't really trolling either imo. It doesn't seem like it was trying to get a rise out of anyone.
Real trolling happens in political threads. People who believe the holocaust is real, but just for fun start saying that it's not and acting like a racist retard so that someone will spend a hour telling them how wrong they are and playing hero to everything that is decent about humanity.
It's not a severe example but I'm not that good of a troll so it would take some effort to come up with a good example. Hopefully it illustrates the basic principle.
edit: feel free to provide other examples that demonstrate this better.
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On June 25 2009 11:07 Grobyc wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2009 10:59 infinity21 wrote:On June 25 2009 10:42 Jibba wrote:
Remember, P - Park, N - Normal (as in normal gear), D - Down, R - Reverse. wat o.o What the fuck do you drive Jibba? Ever heard of 'D for drive' or 'N for neutral'?
On June 25 2009 11:07 Jibba wrote:
You guys are fucking idiots.
lol
that one one of the ones i can remember actually putting some effort into
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Trolling is picking Troll Warlord in a -apem "proz only" dota game and going beyond godlike.
^ Above sentence is an example of trolling
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On January 03 2010 05:41 ghostWriter wrote:
I think it's just something someone says when they say something wrong and try to play it off so that they can pretend that they got you by trolling rather than them just owning themselves by being a moron.
ex:
On May 30 2009 05:00 Hot_Bid wrote:hehe the classic present an idea, argue it, realize its ridiculously stupid, try to pass off as troll IM ONTO YOU JUMPERER YOUR PYLON BLOCK SHALL NOT SAVE YOU THIS TIME
from: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=94269¤tpage=5
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wrinten thins badass troLZ
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Trolling is anytime someone says something stupid/not funny, gets called out on it and is completely wrong, then says they were trolling to cover their ass.
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^^Yes
I hate the 'lol i wuz trollin u guyz' defense.
Edit: Admission of trolling is something a true troll would never do, ever.
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Korea (South)17174 Posts
if you're a true troll no one realizes you're a troll
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and for reference if you're looking for a good time, bodybuilding.com is quite possibly the easiest forum to elicit massive reactions over the simplest most obviously sarcastic statements
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Troll blog is obvious troll blog.
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Stay simple.
On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ?
On April 29 2009 01:34 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:how dare you
On April 29 2009 01:54 randomKo_Orean wrote::O
On April 29 2009 02:00 Zurles wrote:/slap with white glove
On April 29 2009 02:05 LaLuSh wrote:Blasphemy!
On April 29 2009 02:05 wiesel wrote:Your even from france and dont know elky? 
On April 29 2009 02:48 Machine[USA] wrote:...... .......... ............. i dont even know what to say, you should be ashamed.
On April 29 2009 03:06 Twisted wrote:
So is everyone re-leveling here or doesn't anyone know that boblion was kidding..?
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If someone responds serious to a troll, and the troll thinks he is serious but actually his is not, is he then doubletrolling?
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On January 03 2010 06:09 decafchicken wrote:
Trolling is anytime someone says something stupid/not funny, gets called out on it and is completely wrong, then says they were trolling to cover their ass.
Sometimes someone will say something obviously mockingly, satirical... Not intending to trick anyone, just trying to be funny, and then someone won't get it, and just for the hell of it, THEN they'll act like they're serious (under the impression eventually the person will realise they're just being absurd). I think that happens more often than not on TL because TLers have complete inability to give other posters the benefit of a doubt, especially if they have some dumb grudge against them
Other times you get people playing devil's advocate just because although they agree with the conclusion of the argument, the premises are absolute crap.
Other times a poster misunderstands another poster, and carries on an argument for several pages when essentially both posters agree. Again, this happens mostly because TLers refuse to give each other the benefit of a doubt.
This is why it's best just not to reply to replies. You can't reply like a normal person of forums... everything just turns to ridiculous crap.
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Micronesia shouldn't be allowed to blog.
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On January 03 2010 06:26 Navane wrote:
If someone responds serious to a troll, and the troll thinks he is serious but actually his is not, is he then doubletrolling?
Mind = blown
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On January 03 2010 06:25 Boblion wrote:Stay simple. Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 01:34 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? how dare you Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 01:54 randomKo_Orean wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? :O Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 02:00 Zurles wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? /slap with white glove Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 02:05 LaLuSh wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? Blasphemy! Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 02:05 wiesel wrote:Your even from france and dont know elky? Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 02:48 Machine[USA] wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? ...... .......... ............. i dont even know what to say, you should be ashamed. Show nested quote +On April 29 2009 03:06 Twisted wrote:
So is everyone re-leveling here or doesn't anyone know that boblion was kidding..?
hahaaha that was good my friend
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Can you please make more of these guides?
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On January 03 2010 06:11 Rekrul wrote:
if you're a true troll no one realizes you're a troll
At some point the troll has to show his true colors doesn't he? If not for ego reasons, atleast to secure his own safety.
Another interesting thing: If the best trolls really aren't unmasked, there must be several trolls and trollish posts that haven't been called out - and are still looked upon as "true".
What I'm getting at is: Have you been feeding us lies?! >
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hmm words naturally evolve and change over time
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Im not sure how example 2 was a troll.
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On January 03 2010 06:26 Navane wrote:
If someone responds serious to a troll, and the troll thinks he is serious but actually his is not, is he then doubletrolling?
I think he is meta-trolling.
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micronesia is a fat virgin
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This is stupid,;. what kind of pompous ***tard would try and analyze trolling?
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On January 03 2010 06:42 Avidkeystamper wrote:
This is stupid,;. what kind of pompous ***tard would try and analyze trolling?
loltroll
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Joking aside, I find that Jews make the best trolls.
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On January 03 2010 06:44 Aim Here wrote:
Joking aside, I find that Jews make the best trolls.
are u a jew?
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On January 03 2010 05:37 micronesia wrote:Trolling is trying to get a rise out of someone. Forcing them to respond to you, either through wise-crackery, posting incorrect information, asking blatantly stupid questions, or other foolishness.
That isn`t really the right definition either. I think Wikipedia puts it well:
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.
I think the bolded part is important, since a lot of people seem to ignore it. In order for a troll to succeed, it is not enough that people merely respond to him. They have to actually respond in an emotional manner for the attempt to be considered successful. Here is an example to illustrate my point:
+ Show Spoiler +Person 1: Bisu sucks! He deserves to die, die and burn in hell!
Person 2: I disagree, I think Bisu is an excellent Protoss player.
Person 3: Successful troll is successful.
If we look at the definition from Wikipedia, we see that Person 3 makes absolutely zero sense, since Person 2 did not respond emotionally at all. Yet, a lot of people think the same way Person 3 does, that a mere response makes the trolling attempt successful. I call it the SC2GDF line of thinking, since one witnesses this a lot on the Battle.net forums.
Simply put, merely responding to a troll cannot be considered a successful trolling attempt.
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This is quite an interesting read and analysis you have here. 5/5
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On January 03 2010 06:59 Caller wrote:
This is quite an interesting read and analysis you have here. 5/5
Why yous trollin', troll?
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On January 03 2010 06:42 Avidkeystamper wrote:
This is stupid,;. what kind of pompous ***tard would try and analyze trolling?
micronesia
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On January 03 2010 06:33 SanguineToss wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2010 06:25 Boblion wrote:Stay simple. On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? On April 29 2009 01:34 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? how dare you On April 29 2009 01:54 randomKo_Orean wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? :O On April 29 2009 02:00 Zurles wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? /slap with white glove On April 29 2009 02:05 LaLuSh wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? Blasphemy! On April 29 2009 02:05 wiesel wrote:Your even from france and dont know elky? On April 29 2009 02:48 Machine[USA] wrote:On April 29 2009 01:17 Boblion wrote:
Who is Elky ? ...... .......... ............. i dont even know what to say, you should be ashamed. On April 29 2009 03:06 Twisted wrote:
So is everyone re-leveling here or doesn't anyone know that boblion was kidding..? hahaaha that was good my friend
The best part about this is the meta trolling...twisted is the one that actually got trolled.
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On January 03 2010 06:26 Navane wrote:
If someone responds serious to a troll, and the troll thinks he is serious but actually his is not, is he then doubletrolling?
Countertrolling!
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I don't believe trolling exists, other people are idiots and it's my god given duty to correct them
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Are there any trolls from Romania?
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It's interesting; becuase it was used as a noun, I always thought that when people were called trolls this actually referred to the noun troll, those big ugly guys with clubs. Upon seeing this topic, I felt curious and looked it up on Wikipedia, and apparantly the word is drived from "trolling", which would be when a boat, a troller, lays out it's net, catching whatever might swim into it. The metaphor makes sense, in some sense, I guess, I had just always had the image of trolls hiding under a brigde, the dark and scare reality behind something seemingly innocent, and have made this fit with my image of an "internet troll".
As with any word that is overused, micronesia probably has a point that it has now lost some of its original (well, popular original) meaning. It's not a surprise it has been used so much. Trolling has been detrimental to many online communities, ruining their integrity. I remember back on the forums of wcreplays.com when people were starting to become more aware of the problem and were calling "troll" more and more. One reason being, of course, that they wanted to expose and expel the insencere posters, but more so it was due to them feeling insecure, no longer wanting to trust others and just let go. I'm sure that today people have become more desensitized to it, but the word has become popularised and is just more and more just as a way of adding to humourous meta-conversation.
It's true that trolls would not normally give themselves away. If trolling is to be useful as a word, you must distinguish clearly between between it and other similar things. Regardless of the actual intention of the poster, example 1 wouldn't be elaborate enough to be counted as a troll. As said earlier in this thread, trolling would be someone putting great effort into eleciting a deep emotional response (hence political topics), normally through provocation. The joy would often comes from the fun of making other people expose themselves completely. Acting stupid would normally not be enough for this, you have to push some more buttons to get to that point. If people were just being stupid, the "victims" would just have wasted some of their time, and I guess this isn't any great fear of forum-goers, and therefore this wouldn't see any need for calling out a "troll". If they had become emotionally involved, however, they will have wasted this energy and involvement, for, essentially, nothing, leaving a void, withdrawal or dissapointment. This is where it becomes necessary to call out the troll. However, as said, more people have become densensitized to this, and for many communities similar banter has become a part of the normal conversation. Maybe for that reason, trolls don't get as much of a kick out of the serious topics anymore, and we generally see more people devoted to a milder form of "trolling", hence why the perception of the word will have changed.
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United States24675 Posts
On January 03 2010 07:01 H wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2010 06:42 Avidkeystamper wrote:
This is stupid,;. what kind of pompous ***tard would try and analyze trolling? micronesia
You do realize he was trolling, right?
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Lotta retards on the internet, tl included. (Not a troll)
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I don't give a shit about this particular issue, and fail to see how anyone could.
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On January 03 2010 07:49 niteReloaded wrote:
I don't give a shit about this particular issue, and fail to see how anyone could.
lol nub troll
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after reading this thread i think every post is a troll rofl !
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can reality be trolled?
edit
I mean real life
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On January 03 2010 08:44 freelander wrote:
can reality be trolled?
edit
I mean real life
You seem confused about things. Us posting here on these forums is a part of reality
Edit: Damn, sneaky edit, even got in the quote. And it's a part of real life as well.
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![[image loading]](http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png)
Trolls are my sworn enemy.
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Word. Just because you don't agree with someone does not mean that they are a troll. -_-
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United States4796 Posts
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It's already been done on TL.
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Trolls are easy to spot. But there are some posters that are just completely hopeless in terms of intelligence that are often mistook as trolls. This is not the case.
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Kau
Canada3500 Posts
Saw this article today and was reminded of this blog.
The debate over so-called internet trolls - people who use social media accounts to abuse others - has been attracting headlines for several years now.
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was ugottask8 a troll??? i don't even know =[
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EPT
