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Everyone has been complaining about bonus pool and how it inflates point totals leading to credentials from old posts becoming rather outdated. At a given time, a 1500 player might be "top tier" but after two weeks or so, plenty of people will have reached 1500 making it no longer "top tier" in the eyes of many. If you don't follow the forums every day, it's hard to get an idea of how high in the ladder these people actually are.
Easy way to "standardize" this rating involves removing the total number of bonus points awarded this season from the rating. Doing this will make your points relevant to the points that were around during the first week or two of release. If you still have bonus pool left, just add the amount of bonus pool you have left after subtracting the total bonus pool from your current rating. Many of you will remember that top players in the first week or two were sitting at around ~1000 points.
CURRENT TOTAL BONUS POOL: 905 (Updated 08:16KST 9/28/2010)
StandardizedRating = CurrentRating - CurrentTotalBonusPool + CurrentPersonalBonusPool
EXAMPLE
+ Show Spoiler +
If the CURRENT TOTAL BONUS POOL is 888
HuK - Currently at 2092 with 0 bonus pool
HuK (Standardized) - 1204
RandomExamplePlayer - Currently at 1400 with 300 bonus pool
RandomExamplePlayer (Standardized) - 812
Why is this useful?
For most people who have had their win ratio settle close to 50% and have played a significant number of games, points is a decent way to gauge their skill level. A standardized point total will allow credentials to be relevant for months instead of being outdated by inflation.
On a personal level, this really helps because it helps you track your ACTUAL improvement. A lot of people will watch their point total go up and feel satisfaction in "getting better". Even if you understand that your point total is being inflated, it's hard to tell exactly how much better (if at all) you're getting. If you just keep track of your standardized point total, you'll be able to have a pretty good idea of your progress and improvement.
How do I find the CURRENT TOTAL BONUS POOL?
If this idea catches on, I'll try to update this thread as much as possible with the current total bonus pool, but if you'd like to find it yourself, just get through 5 placement matches in whatever league you haven't played in. (Make a new team if you've already played placement matches in every format) The number of points in your bonus pool after you finish your placement matches is the value you want.
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Hello. 
I agree that bonus pool points are quite pointless and prehas even "unfair". When I first bought SC2 two weeks after the realese I was able to play my five placment matches. I lost my first two as Zerg and then Terran, winning my next three in a row with Toss. Du to life, I was unable to play for the following 5 days, when I finally was able to play I had over 150 bonus pool points. After winning my next two games I was placed in Diamond and started playing people that had the "slight advantage" curse. I won my next 6 games in a row winning 42 points a game and ended being number 2 in my divison after about 2 hours of playing from platinum.
So in the end I belive that the system really is not needed and it is just a comparision from the "rested experiance" you get from WoW. 
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The problem is that the system is inflated even without the bonuspool. So even with this system you wont be able to track your actual improvement  ..
But its still less inflated Id guess.
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On September 28 2010 00:01 xzidez wrote:The problem is that the system is inflated even without the bonuspool. So even with this system you wont be able to track your actual improvement .. But its still less inflated Id guess.
How is the system inflated without the bonuspool? :S
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On September 28 2010 00:07 Clearout wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2010 00:01 xzidez wrote:The problem is that the system is inflated even without the bonuspool. So even with this system you wont be able to track your actual improvement .. But its still less inflated Id guess. How is the system inflated without the bonuspool? :S
Probably because your points are still inflating just not as much with the addition of bonus pool points.
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the problem is that bonus pools are division and not league based.
noone will ever get into that "feld delta" division on europe anymore to see how much those pros got in bonuspoints.
Thus the idea is almost worthless im afraid
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On September 28 2010 00:10 shannn wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2010 00:07 Clearout wrote:On September 28 2010 00:01 xzidez wrote:The problem is that the system is inflated even without the bonuspool. So even with this system you wont be able to track your actual improvement .. But its still less inflated Id guess. How is the system inflated without the bonuspool? :S Probably because your points are still inflating just not as much with the addition of bonus pool points.
Was pretty sure it stayed the same. E.g. I win 12 points, someone loses 12 points. If you have a ridiculous win rate though, you will climb higher, but if you end at 50% W/L you shouldnt increase in points.
Edit: Sorry for derailing.
OT: Thanks for this! I'll make use of it to get a general idea of my "skill"
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I played against a friend that was about evenly matched with me. He won and got about 12 points and I only lost 9 points. The game after we faced each others again and this time I got 12 points..
So even tho we got 1-1 we both gained points.
If you ever play against someone twice and win one of the games, just check your history and his history... and you will see that you gained more than you lost.
Yes, you will get bonus points while you play. But not that many.
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You can't have less than 0 points I think. If you lose your first couple games after being placed in a new league, you don't lose any points but someone else gains points. That's the only inflation beside the bonus pool I can think of.
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The other inflation is if you play against a better opponent whole time and win you would get more points than an average game.
But if you lost you would lose less than you would gain.
So like xzidez pointed out above me and like my previous argument you will get some inflation but not as much.
But the same thing can be said vice versa. You could actually lose more points than that you could gain.
Therefore there are some cases where inflation isn't the case.
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BTW, do you get more bonus points after your placements if you win more of them? Just curious.
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On September 28 2010 00:13 Viruuus wrote:the problem is that bonus pools are division and not league based. noone will ever get into that "feld delta" division on europe anymore to see how much those pros got in bonuspoints. Thus the idea is almost worthless im afraid
Do you have a source that proves this? I'm pretty sure every division has the same amount of bonus pool. Getting through your placement matches and being placed in a brand new division still gives you tons of bonus points.
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Hmm as shannn says you can also lose more points than you get.
So its probably something like if you have less expected rating, you will get more. And more expected rating you will get much less...
Nevertheless I approve your idea! Its a pain trying to figure out if you are improving or not... the only "measurement" is the blizzards weekly top 200. And it's so much based on your daily form. People jump from 70 to 150, and back.
On September 28 2010 00:30 deverlight wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2010 00:13 Viruuus wrote:the problem is that bonus pools are division and not league based. noone will ever get into that "feld delta" division on europe anymore to see how much those pros got in bonuspoints. Thus the idea is almost worthless im afraid Do you have a source that proves this? I'm pretty sure every division has the same amount of bonus pool. Getting through your placement matches and being placed in a brand new division still gives you tons of bonus points.
well since you get xxx new points even if you end up in a completely new division... I will go ahead and say that everyone get the equal ammount of bonus points.
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I thought the Bonus pool was calculated every week since you activated your account, but I could be totally wrong on that.
If someone bought SC2 today and played his 5 placement matches, he wouldnt start with 888 Bonus pool, would he?
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On September 28 2010 01:06 lepape wrote:
I thought the Bonus pool was calculated every week since you activated your account, but I could be totally wrong on that.
If someone bought SC2 today and played his 5 placement matches, he wouldnt start with 888 Bonus pool, would he?
he would.
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Better way is go to sc2ranks.com, and look up your world percentile. Then say you're diamond 88th percentile or whatever. You'll still need to use all your own bonus points to be competitive though.
Subtracting out bonus pool isn't as good because there are other sources of inflation/deflation (rating floor of zero, amount of bonus your opponents had used etc).
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United States1078 Posts
This is a great idea.
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=118212
On May 11 2010 23:51 ZapRoffo wrote:
Some more information:
With a matchmaking rating system, the way points are assigned is as follows. There is a default point assignment (was +/-12 for wow, seems similar in sc2) for an "equal match result". The amount won or lost in any given match, though, is determined by comparing your displayed rating to your opponent's matchmaking rating. This is why many people are experiencing huge gains for wins and small losses. It's because they haven't played enough to raise their displayed rating to their matchmaking rating. They may be matched as an 1800 matchmaking rating, but are at 1300, so if they win against an equal opponent (1800 matchmaking), they get the points of a 1300 beating an 1800, which may be +20 or something. The opponent compares his displayed rating to your matchmaking rating to calculate his point change, if he's displayed 1600 and you are also 1800 matchmaking, he will lose -10 or so (slightly less than -12 default).
One huge misconception people I feel like people need to learn the truth about:
The bonus pool WILL NOT cause inflation of ratings in the long run as long as it only modifies your displayed rating and not your matchmaking rating, which appears to be the case. In the long run, displayed ratings converge to matchmaking rating, so if matchmaking rating is unaffected there is no long term effect.
An example:
I start with a big bonus pool and win up to 1600, and my matchmaking rating is 1700. Alice wins the same amount against similar quality opponents but with no bonus pool and goes to only 1350 or so, but also with 1700 matchmaking rating, because matchmaking is totally unaffected. Now in my games I will only be looking at winning +13 or so from my opponents who are 1700 matchmaking, while Alice is looking at something like +16 or +17 from her 1700 matchmaking opponents. I'm looking at -10 or -11 from losses, while she's looking at -8 or so from those same people. Eventually the result over a long enough period is we both end up at 1700 if no change in skill happens.
Even if I got enough of a bonus pool to get to 1900 or something, once that runs out I'm going to lose more for losses than I get for wins against people who are my skill level until I get to the appropriate level. The bonus pool just functions to get people's displayed rating jump started so if they took a break they can jump to their rating more quickly.
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United States12281 Posts
SC2ranks.com should have this feature added (where it shows the current max bonus pool and subtracts it from displayed ratings) in the coming days. Shadowed's ETA was last Friday but he had some server issues to work out.
One thing that he said will not be coming is a per-user "true rating" that shows rating minus consumed bonus pool (or rating sans inflation). The reason for this is because each user has to be individually queried for each team or bracket, and it creates too much work for the server.
Also to people in this thread: yes everyone gets the same amount of bonus pool, yes the accrual rate is constant.
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While bonus pool will not cause any inflation problems regarding matchmaking, the problems arise in discussion. Just about every thread on TL has someone qualify themselves as a 1000pt diamond player. Because of how bonus pool accrues, a 1000 diamond player now will not be a 1000pt diamond player in a few months - chances are he'll be closer to 1500 or 2000. Standardization of rating attempts to keep statements like "I'm currently a #### rated diamond player" more relevant for discussion even several months down the line.
A 500-S(Standardized) level diamond player that does not improve relative to his competition on the ladder will remain roughly a 500-S level diamond player many months from now even if his actual displayed rating has doubled.
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EPT
