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On April 03 2015 06:19 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 06:02 Numy wrote:On April 03 2015 05:57 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 05:52 jcarlsoniv wrote:On April 03 2015 05:42 Alaric wrote:On April 03 2015 05:14 Lord Tolkien wrote:
also, I think I breezed through 2 council missions, 1 terror mission, and like 8 abductions/crashed landings in one night.
Pity no one was watching, except for afklaric. (you say "an" when it starts with h?) Yes because the "h" is silent. In the opposite way, if the word starts with a long "u" like "unicorn", it's phrased "a unicorn". English is a fucking stupid language. It makes perfect sense in that writing and language, at least in the western world, was traditionally treated as a derivative of spoken word and meaning. Therefore, writing merely reflects how we verbally say things. But of course you could disagree with the positioning of writing as secondary if you want to go down the path of deconstruction and Derridean grammatology do ho ho~ You specify the Western world so does that mean the East's languages are constructed differently? I know local languages here are such a fking mess in the written form which is largely because they had no written form until European settlers came. I'm not a linguist so forgive errors and generalizations. Western writing systems (by which I mean Western Europe as descended from ancient Greece and Rome, which is the only important culture in the world obviously) are based on phonemes, or basic sounds, that are strung together to make words. The Latin alphabet, which we use to this day, is an example of this - each letter corresponds to a phoneme, or basic unit of sound, and by putting them together you get an indication of how a word is said. Eastern writing systems (by which I mean China cause that's the only important Eastern country) like Chinese is variously said to be logographic or ideographic, which means every single character represents not a sound but a meaning. It's a morpheme as opposed to a phoneme. The representation of meaning in writing is divorced from how to pronounce the word. Now it's actually a bit more complex since some Chinese characters, depending on origin, could be composed of both a semantic (meaning) and a phonetic (sound) element, which gives guidance on how the character sounds as well as a hint to the meaning. However, it is still not an exact representation of sound, which makes it different from an alphabetic system. One of the points Derrida made in Of Grammatology was that in Western language, writing is subservient to speech since writing is merely a transcription/representation of what is said, and is (unfairly) robbed of an independent existence.
Isn't korean much more phonetically purist then any western language?
And japanese (if you ignore kanji and focus on hiragana/katakana)
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
Yeah, but that's because emperor Sejong just told everyone that chinese-like characters are retarded and that the western system is much better
and since it was made by like 1 person at one particular moment instead of being a history-ridden whore like the english grammar is it actually makes sense
iirc
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On April 03 2015 06:27 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 06:19 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 06:02 Numy wrote:On April 03 2015 05:57 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 05:52 jcarlsoniv wrote:On April 03 2015 05:42 Alaric wrote:On April 03 2015 05:14 Lord Tolkien wrote:
also, I think I breezed through 2 council missions, 1 terror mission, and like 8 abductions/crashed landings in one night.
Pity no one was watching, except for afklaric. (you say "an" when it starts with h?) Yes because the "h" is silent. In the opposite way, if the word starts with a long "u" like "unicorn", it's phrased "a unicorn". English is a fucking stupid language. It makes perfect sense in that writing and language, at least in the western world, was traditionally treated as a derivative of spoken word and meaning. Therefore, writing merely reflects how we verbally say things. But of course you could disagree with the positioning of writing as secondary if you want to go down the path of deconstruction and Derridean grammatology do ho ho~ You specify the Western world so does that mean the East's languages are constructed differently? I know local languages here are such a fking mess in the written form which is largely because they had no written form until European settlers came. I'm not a linguist so forgive errors and generalizations. Western writing systems (by which I mean Western Europe as descended from ancient Greece and Rome, which is the only important culture in the world obviously) are based on phonemes, or basic sounds, that are strung together to make words. The Latin alphabet, which we use to this day, is an example of this - each letter corresponds to a phoneme, or basic unit of sound, and by putting them together you get an indication of how a word is said. Eastern writing systems (by which I mean China cause that's the only important Eastern country) like Chinese is variously said to be logographic or ideographic, which means every single character represents not a sound but a meaning. It's a morpheme as opposed to a phoneme. The representation of meaning in writing is divorced from how to pronounce the word. Now it's actually a bit more complex since some Chinese characters, depending on origin, could be composed of both a semantic (meaning) and a phonetic (sound) element, which gives guidance on how the character sounds as well as a hint to the meaning. However, it is still not an exact representation of sound, which makes it different from an alphabetic system. One of the points Derrida made in Of Grammatology was that in Western language, writing is subservient to speech since writing is merely a transcription/representation of what is said, and is (unfairly) robbed of an independent existence. Isn't korean much more phonetically purist then any western language? And japanese (if you ignore kanji and focus on hiragana/katakana)
Eastern writing systems (by which I mean China cause that's the only important Eastern country)
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On April 03 2015 06:19 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 06:02 Numy wrote:On April 03 2015 05:57 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 05:52 jcarlsoniv wrote:On April 03 2015 05:42 Alaric wrote:On April 03 2015 05:14 Lord Tolkien wrote:
also, I think I breezed through 2 council missions, 1 terror mission, and like 8 abductions/crashed landings in one night.
Pity no one was watching, except for afklaric. (you say "an" when it starts with h?) Yes because the "h" is silent. In the opposite way, if the word starts with a long "u" like "unicorn", it's phrased "a unicorn". English is a fucking stupid language. It makes perfect sense in that writing and language, at least in the western world, was traditionally treated as a derivative of spoken word and meaning. Therefore, writing merely reflects how we verbally say things. But of course you could disagree with the positioning of writing as secondary if you want to go down the path of deconstruction and Derridean grammatology do ho ho~ You specify the Western world so does that mean the East's languages are constructed differently? I know local languages here are such a fking mess in the written form which is largely because they had no written form until European settlers came. I'm not a linguist so forgive errors and generalizations. Western writing systems (by which I mean Western Europe as descended from ancient Greece and Rome, which is the only important culture in the world obviously) are based on phonemes, or basic sounds, that are strung together to make words. The Latin alphabet, which we use to this day, is an example of this - each letter corresponds to a phoneme, or basic unit of sound, and by putting them together you get an indication of how a word is said. Eastern writing systems (by which I mean China cause that's the only important Eastern country) like Chinese is variously said to be logographic or ideographic, which means every single character represents not a sound but a meaning. It's a morpheme as opposed to a phoneme. The representation of meaning in writing is divorced from how to pronounce the word. Now it's actually a bit more complex since some Chinese characters, depending on origin, could be composed of both a semantic (meaning) and a phonetic (sound) element, which gives guidance on how the character sounds as well as a hint to the meaning. However, it is still not an exact representation of sound, which makes it different from an alphabetic system. One of the points Derrida made in Of Grammatology was that in Western language, writing is subservient to speech since writing is merely a transcription/representation of what is said, and is (unfairly) robbed of an independent existence.
That's rather fascinating thanks. I'm so terrible at languages I tend to ignore information about them but man there seems to be interesting things in almost every sphere of life.
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Where does lomo stand in all of that, then, Cheep?
Of course it's written using the Latin alphabet and derives from western languages, on the other hand it's a deformation of another word, itself an acronym (eg. based on how other words are written, although it can sometimes be adapted for speech too (see RADAR), these are accomodations and not the common case), and according to you is the expression of an idea.
The word can be pronounced, which happened naturally (could argue that it'd have been adapted otherwise, but I've seen people say "lol" or "xd" out loud x_x), but it originates from written media and is more widespread there. In that case, doesn't the pronounciation take a backseat to the meaning it lets you convey to others?
Linguistics is awesome Numy. And then you stat delving into etymology and how languages evolved over time, especially tied to population migration (and the mixing of cultures in general) and there's so much to find about all that stuff.
Or you can start looking at stuff like speech acts and pick apart how language is constructed, litteral and figurative meaning, and the whole knot of what people mean/say and how recipients interpret.
Linguistics is (are?) a wonderful field.
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On April 03 2015 06:33 Numy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 06:19 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 06:02 Numy wrote:On April 03 2015 05:57 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:On April 03 2015 05:52 jcarlsoniv wrote:On April 03 2015 05:42 Alaric wrote:On April 03 2015 05:14 Lord Tolkien wrote:
also, I think I breezed through 2 council missions, 1 terror mission, and like 8 abductions/crashed landings in one night.
Pity no one was watching, except for afklaric. (you say "an" when it starts with h?) Yes because the "h" is silent. In the opposite way, if the word starts with a long "u" like "unicorn", it's phrased "a unicorn". English is a fucking stupid language. It makes perfect sense in that writing and language, at least in the western world, was traditionally treated as a derivative of spoken word and meaning. Therefore, writing merely reflects how we verbally say things. But of course you could disagree with the positioning of writing as secondary if you want to go down the path of deconstruction and Derridean grammatology do ho ho~ You specify the Western world so does that mean the East's languages are constructed differently? I know local languages here are such a fking mess in the written form which is largely because they had no written form until European settlers came. I'm not a linguist so forgive errors and generalizations. Western writing systems (by which I mean Western Europe as descended from ancient Greece and Rome, which is the only important culture in the world obviously) are based on phonemes, or basic sounds, that are strung together to make words. The Latin alphabet, which we use to this day, is an example of this - each letter corresponds to a phoneme, or basic unit of sound, and by putting them together you get an indication of how a word is said. Eastern writing systems (by which I mean China cause that's the only important Eastern country) like Chinese is variously said to be logographic or ideographic, which means every single character represents not a sound but a meaning. It's a morpheme as opposed to a phoneme. The representation of meaning in writing is divorced from how to pronounce the word. Now it's actually a bit more complex since some Chinese characters, depending on origin, could be composed of both a semantic (meaning) and a phonetic (sound) element, which gives guidance on how the character sounds as well as a hint to the meaning. However, it is still not an exact representation of sound, which makes it different from an alphabetic system. One of the points Derrida made in Of Grammatology was that in Western language, writing is subservient to speech since writing is merely a transcription/representation of what is said, and is (unfairly) robbed of an independent existence. That's rather fascinating thanks. I'm so terrible at languages I tend to ignore information about them but man there seems to be interesting things in almost every sphere of life.
From exploring several languages, one of the most interesting is the alphabet used in korea and the simpler japanese alphabets. They're completely sound based, with symbol being a pronounced syllable, it's amazingly simple and efficient and makes you hate english all the more :p
Worth looking at too if you find these kind ofthings interesting
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Linguistics was my favorite elective by far. I wish I still had the book so that I could pull out the chart of all possible human speech sounds, look at it, and try to make them all.
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was watching Huk stream last night
he seems pretty jazzed about LotV
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On April 03 2015 07:39 jcarlsoniv wrote:
was watching Huk stream last night
he seems pretty jazzed about LotV
Just about everyone is. HotS was already in a good position, and Blizzard's economy reworks were really lauded at the last Blizzcon.
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what exactly did they rework?
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Goddammit, I need to watch GoT this weekend...I forgot it returns in 10 days >.<
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On April 03 2015 07:55 Crusnik wrote:
Goddammit, I need to watch GoT this weekend...I forgot it returns in 10 days >.<
I almost don't want it to start cuz I think there are going to be story spoilers towards the end of the season...
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Despite the fact that were getting book spoilers from winds of winter this season I'm actually pretty hype for s5. This part of the series has some of my favorite scenes in it so it should be super awesome.
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I still haven't watched S4, so I'd have to marathon the entire series to get caught up I think...
And I can't start Friday night because it's Passover, so ~2 hour dinner zzzzzzzz
I hate being part of a Jewish family some times...
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On April 03 2015 08:08 Crusnik wrote:
And I can't start Friday night because it's Passover, so ~2 hour dinner zzzzzzzz
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jesus christ..
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On April 03 2015 08:12 Slayer91 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 08:08 Crusnik wrote:
And I can't start Friday night because it's Passover, so ~2 hour dinner zzzzzzzz
. jesus christ..
yes, that's the fellow
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On April 03 2015 08:14 jcarlsoniv wrote:Show nested quote +On April 03 2015 08:12 Slayer91 wrote:On April 03 2015 08:08 Crusnik wrote:
And I can't start Friday night because it's Passover, so ~2 hour dinner zzzzzzzz
. jesus christ.. yes, that's the fellow
Worst part? Guests, so I can't be slob and show up in a t-shirt and sleep pants. Need at least a decent shirt and jeans I guess.
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Lurkers are back? hnnnnnnnnnnng
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On April 03 2015 09:19 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Lurkers are back? hnnnnnnnnnnng
Yeah Lurkers are gonna be great.
For marauders to shit on.
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EPT
