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[T][M] Resistance V - Section 31 - Page 16

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:04 GMT
#301
Btw you said that HTS should name two townies other than Superbia? Are you implying that she shouldn't include herself on the team? At least in IRL Resistance, we usually thought that either the leader should be trusted (accepted with leader included) or not trusted (team refused). Did you usually make teams regardless of the leader?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
November 02 2015 13:06 GMT
#302
Well tbh i don't see how "nightmare" is "slightly town-sided" but yeah..
As i said earlier i didn't think what Superbia said about you made you scum and yes, i was arguing with Rels how Rels' interpretation of the situation was in my opinion incorrect.

I don't read the thread any more "improperly" (if that's what you wanna call it) as mafia, especially when there is ~2-3 pages of content. And if we assume you are town i would definitely not call Superbia town like that, regardless of his alignment.
table for two on a tv tray
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
November 02 2015 13:08 GMT
#303
On November 02 2015 22:04 Xatalos wrote:
Btw you said that HTS should name two townies other than Superbia? Are you implying that she shouldn't include herself on the team? At least in IRL Resistance, we usually thought that either the leader should be trusted (accepted with leader included) or not trusted (team refused). Did you usually make teams regardless of the leader?

No, i don't want her to get the easy way out of just giving two reads as if she is mafia she can just name two townies and then say "well i know i am town so i am going of course".

Basically it has nothing to do with if she is gonna go on the mission or not, i just don't like the "Palmar approach" to Resistance (or like -- at least how he used to start Resistance games), as you basically exclude yourself on giving reads (other than easy ones) as you "just have to have this much townreads".

If you get what i am saying?
table for two on a tv tray
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:09 GMT
#304
Hm....

With nightmare, I was referring more to the annoyance and risks introduced rather than the overall balance. I don't think it's ultimately super town-sided. Maybe it was before our discussion in the pre-game, but probably not now?

Still glad to be town

Didn't really get your last sentence?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:11 GMT
#305
On November 02 2015 22:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 22:04 Xatalos wrote:
Btw you said that HTS should name two townies other than Superbia? Are you implying that she shouldn't include herself on the team? At least in IRL Resistance, we usually thought that either the leader should be trusted (accepted with leader included) or not trusted (team refused). Did you usually make teams regardless of the leader?

No, i don't want her to get the easy way out of just giving two reads as if she is mafia she can just name two townies and then say "well i know i am town so i am going of course".

Basically it has nothing to do with if she is gonna go on the mission or not, i just don't like the "Palmar approach" to Resistance (or like -- at least how he used to start Resistance games), as you basically exclude yourself on giving reads (other than easy ones) as you "just have to have this much townreads".

If you get what i am saying?


Well I agree that I'd like reasoning on every player (why they were included or not). Seems pretty easy for scum to play if everyone just claims 2 townreads..
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:13 GMT
#306
On November 02 2015 20:11 Xatalos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 18:33 Rels wrote:
On November 02 2015 18:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On November 02 2015 18:29 Rels wrote:
But you forgot a question bro.
Do you know what I'm talking about with Xatalos' being obvious in a few days ?

I know what you are talking about. I don't see that being townie in any way though since "in a few days" this game might be on mission 2 or even 3. So it doesn't really work that way in Resistance.

Easy. Just have to not include him the first team, and if it doesn't go through, vote no when he's leader tomorrow.


:/

I guess you're referring to my town/scum activity? Well, it's not a bad point really. Just a bit sad if you exclude me until late for that.

Yes, and that's only today, since tomorrow you're leader and we'll be able to judge you then. I think it's a good idea to not include you to today's team.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
November 02 2015 13:14 GMT
#307
If i am scum here i am either giving a townread to my scumbuddy for no reason (which is stupid) or giving a townread on a townie for "no reason" (as would be the case at that point).

I don't do either, especially when the counter-part of the argument is you, who is usually shitty to argue with just based on the fact that you post that much. In either of the scenarios i do not even know how Superbia is gonna follow up, so it is basically a bad play for me to call him town as scum (andd i actually like playing as scum in Resistance -- and i don't play bad).
table for two on a tv tray
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:16 GMT
#308
On November 02 2015 20:41 Superbia wrote:
Xat&rest- Xat's initial post set me off. Saying something like "this is a nightmare for scum" has two results (from writer POV):
1. It distances you from "scum".
2. It downplays scum.

1. Is NAI. 2 is super weird from a town perspective, and leans me more towards mafia. I feel like if you were town and believed this you would've focused on the strength of town, rather than the weakness of mafia, and as a result, would've said something along the lines of "mafia gonna get #rekt #noqt" (or something less trolly). Regardless I feel like commenting on how "weak" mafia is is mafia indicative as it sets up for a lax game.

Now I already had a very real suspicion that you knew that this set up is not a "nightmare" for scum, as you have played resistance(/avalon) before (noted by you correctly associating my merlin comment with avalon). So that double begs the question why you felt the need to point out that mafia was "weak".

I also understand that there is no resolving this situation regardless of your alignment. We can't talk this shit out- since it my suspicion and your possibly-innocent post. I am going, however, going to be suspicious of you. Unfairly? Maybe. But we'll see how your day plays out. So far I don't really like how you've been soft-pushing my push on you. But that may be biased of me.


On the topic of rayn&rels:

I loved rayn's initial post of calling me town, this is exactly the type of opening I would expect out of town-rayn. I would love to hear some more depth behind his meta-read on Xat. But so far rayn is leaning town.


Rels I don't know about. Feels weird that he is literally postponing a read (and not evaluating him at all) on Xat until d3 or whatever (This is something I have done as scum before). The fact that he is also comfortable evaluating people (me, and partially rayn- although I understand rayn) based on interactions with xat feels scummy.

In fact, re-reading the order in which this happens makes me like him less and less. He starts off by going fairly aggressive against my side of the (now infamous) Xat/Super debacle, without giving an opinion on Xat. The fact that I'm nitpicking (your words) against Xat should be NAI, unless you have a town-read on Xat (which you don't). This is highlighted by the fact that if Xat were mafia in this instance, this type of pressure could make me look town, but since you shouldn't know Xat's alignment, you also shouldn't be able to voice a proper opinion on this. You then LATER say that Xat's alignment will become obvious later during the game (also scummy-esque).

So, Rels probably has TMI, and should never be included in any team.

Several things:
1 - "I loved rayn's initial post of calling me town, this is exactly the type of opening I would expect out of town-rayn. I would love to hear some more depth behind his meta-read on Xat. But so far rayn is leaning town." Agree
2 - What is your read now on Xatalos ?
3 - The problem I have is not just "nitpick" buzzword. It's:
On November 02 2015 17:45 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 08:32 Superbia wrote:
Do you really think this game is a nightmare for scum?

Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 08:35 Xatalos wrote:
Yeah, I think it should be somewhat anti-scum. In the way that IRL Resistance is pretty balanced, but here it's much easier for town to communicate properly than IRL, whereas the scumteam can't communicate at all like usual in forum Mafia.

Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 08:39 Superbia wrote:
So now that we've correctly concluded that you don't believe it is a "nightmare" for scum. Why did you open with that?

LOL
"Is it a nightmare ?"
"Kinda"
"OK now that you said it's not a nightmare ..."
You misread something there bro.

raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
November 02 2015 13:18 GMT
#309
On November 02 2015 17:52 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 17:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Well thank you captain obvious.
I bet alot of players would not realize that unless you said it.

You're welcome!
I don't understand why you're hard townreading Superbia, who nitpicked something to death and made it the basis for a "mild" scumread.

Is this your way of saying "i agree with the townread on rayn"?
table for two on a tv tray
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:19 GMT
#310
On November 02 2015 21:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I think you should try to find two townreads besides Superbia if you think that's possible when you have read everything closely.

Clever
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:20 GMT
#311
On November 02 2015 22:13 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 20:11 Xatalos wrote:
On November 02 2015 18:33 Rels wrote:
On November 02 2015 18:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On November 02 2015 18:29 Rels wrote:
But you forgot a question bro.
Do you know what I'm talking about with Xatalos' being obvious in a few days ?

I know what you are talking about. I don't see that being townie in any way though since "in a few days" this game might be on mission 2 or even 3. So it doesn't really work that way in Resistance.

Easy. Just have to not include him the first team, and if it doesn't go through, vote no when he's leader tomorrow.


:/

I guess you're referring to my town/scum activity? Well, it's not a bad point really. Just a bit sad if you exclude me until late for that.

Yes, and that's only today, since tomorrow you're leader and we'll be able to judge you then. I think it's a good idea to not include you to today's team.


You still think I'm unreadable right now...?
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:22 GMT
#312
On November 02 2015 22:14 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If i am scum here i am either giving a townread to my scumbuddy for no reason (which is stupid) or giving a townread on a townie for "no reason" (as would be the case at that point).

I don't do either, especially when the counter-part of the argument is you, who is usually shitty to argue with just based on the fact that you post that much. In either of the scenarios i do not even know how Superbia is gonna follow up, so it is basically a bad play for me to call him town as scum (andd i actually like playing as scum in Resistance -- and i don't play bad).


Well, I guess we have different styles then But I think you said something similar in Skype too.. And you didn't really make many townreads in the VS game... So maybe that's a town tell for you.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:23 GMT
#313
On November 02 2015 22:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 22:04 Xatalos wrote:
Btw you said that HTS should name two townies other than Superbia? Are you implying that she shouldn't include herself on the team? At least in IRL Resistance, we usually thought that either the leader should be trusted (accepted with leader included) or not trusted (team refused). Did you usually make teams regardless of the leader?

No, i don't want her to get the easy way out of just giving two reads as if she is mafia she can just name two townies and then say "well i know i am town so i am going of course".

Basically it has nothing to do with if she is gonna go on the mission or not, i just don't like the "Palmar approach" to Resistance (or like -- at least how he used to start Resistance games), as you basically exclude yourself on giving reads (other than easy ones) as you "just have to have this much townreads".

If you get what i am saying?

NOOOO )= )= )=
I was so sure that was a super trap )= I had accepted you as town
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:23 GMT
#314
On November 02 2015 22:16 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 20:41 Superbia wrote:
Xat&rest- Xat's initial post set me off. Saying something like "this is a nightmare for scum" has two results (from writer POV):
1. It distances you from "scum".
2. It downplays scum.

1. Is NAI. 2 is super weird from a town perspective, and leans me more towards mafia. I feel like if you were town and believed this you would've focused on the strength of town, rather than the weakness of mafia, and as a result, would've said something along the lines of "mafia gonna get #rekt #noqt" (or something less trolly). Regardless I feel like commenting on how "weak" mafia is is mafia indicative as it sets up for a lax game.

Now I already had a very real suspicion that you knew that this set up is not a "nightmare" for scum, as you have played resistance(/avalon) before (noted by you correctly associating my merlin comment with avalon). So that double begs the question why you felt the need to point out that mafia was "weak".

I also understand that there is no resolving this situation regardless of your alignment. We can't talk this shit out- since it my suspicion and your possibly-innocent post. I am going, however, going to be suspicious of you. Unfairly? Maybe. But we'll see how your day plays out. So far I don't really like how you've been soft-pushing my push on you. But that may be biased of me.


On the topic of rayn&rels:

I loved rayn's initial post of calling me town, this is exactly the type of opening I would expect out of town-rayn. I would love to hear some more depth behind his meta-read on Xat. But so far rayn is leaning town.


Rels I don't know about. Feels weird that he is literally postponing a read (and not evaluating him at all) on Xat until d3 or whatever (This is something I have done as scum before). The fact that he is also comfortable evaluating people (me, and partially rayn- although I understand rayn) based on interactions with xat feels scummy.

In fact, re-reading the order in which this happens makes me like him less and less. He starts off by going fairly aggressive against my side of the (now infamous) Xat/Super debacle, without giving an opinion on Xat. The fact that I'm nitpicking (your words) against Xat should be NAI, unless you have a town-read on Xat (which you don't). This is highlighted by the fact that if Xat were mafia in this instance, this type of pressure could make me look town, but since you shouldn't know Xat's alignment, you also shouldn't be able to voice a proper opinion on this. You then LATER say that Xat's alignment will become obvious later during the game (also scummy-esque).

So, Rels probably has TMI, and should never be included in any team.

Several things:
1 - "I loved rayn's initial post of calling me town, this is exactly the type of opening I would expect out of town-rayn. I would love to hear some more depth behind his meta-read on Xat. But so far rayn is leaning town." Agree
2 - What is your read now on Xatalos ?
3 - The problem I have is not just "nitpick" buzzword. It's:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 17:45 Rels wrote:
On November 02 2015 08:32 Superbia wrote:
Do you really think this game is a nightmare for scum?

On November 02 2015 08:35 Xatalos wrote:
Yeah, I think it should be somewhat anti-scum. In the way that IRL Resistance is pretty balanced, but here it's much easier for town to communicate properly than IRL, whereas the scumteam can't communicate at all like usual in forum Mafia.

On November 02 2015 08:39 Superbia wrote:
So now that we've correctly concluded that you don't believe it is a "nightmare" for scum. Why did you open with that?

LOL
"Is it a nightmare ?"
"Kinda"
"OK now that you said it's not a nightmare ..."
You misread something there bro.



Hah....
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:25 GMT
#315
On November 02 2015 22:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 17:52 Rels wrote:
On November 02 2015 17:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Well thank you captain obvious.
I bet alot of players would not realize that unless you said it.

You're welcome!
I don't understand why you're hard townreading Superbia, who nitpicked something to death and made it the basis for a "mild" scumread.

Is this your way of saying "i agree with the townread on rayn"?

I don't understand. Maybe you quoted the wrong post bro.
Xatalos
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland9675 Posts
November 02 2015 13:26 GMT
#316
Rels, you think I'm currently completely unreadable? Really? That's what your earlier post implied.
"The opportunity to secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself." - Sun Tzu
ShoCkeyy
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
7815 Posts
November 02 2015 13:27 GMT
#317
Just woke up, going to go over all the pages now.
Life?
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:28 GMT
#318
On November 02 2015 22:26 Xatalos wrote:
Rels, you think I'm currently completely unreadable? Really? That's what your earlier post implied.

Now I think you're town. You're being active and you meddle with everything in the thread, exactly like in the game I'm hosting.
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 02 2015 13:28 GMT
#319
On November 02 2015 22:27 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Just woke up, going to go over all the pages now.

\o/ \o/ \o/
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43270 Posts
November 02 2015 13:32 GMT
#320
On November 02 2015 22:25 Rels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2015 22:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
On November 02 2015 17:52 Rels wrote:
On November 02 2015 17:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Well thank you captain obvious.
I bet alot of players would not realize that unless you said it.

You're welcome!
I don't understand why you're hard townreading Superbia, who nitpicked something to death and made it the basis for a "mild" scumread.

Is this your way of saying "i agree with the townread on rayn"?

I don't understand. Maybe you quoted the wrong post bro.

Can you point out to a post of yours where you imply you read me as town for my Superbia read?
Because i really feel like your filter says the opposite.
table for two on a tv tray
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