|
Most of the time the first storm drop won't kill much if you dodge at least a little because SCVs are fat and healthy. But they might get damaged significantly enough for the next storm drop to hurt you a lot more.
Storm drops will usually occur in late midgame when the cost of a medic is pretty much nothing relative to your income.
Having 1 medic will probably mean all of your SCVs are healed back to 60hp by the time the next drop happens. I'd keep the medic slightly away from the mineral line so she doesn't die to the actual storm.
That's all, I thought this might be a useful 'niche idea' and fun to read. I hope someone finds it interesting enough to try out.
I plan to share some other ideas about niche tactics in the coming time. 
|
I think you instead need to fix drops from happening. Shuttles die quite fast and some turrets make nice work of it with a floating building or vessel as hill vision. Can also get one wraith to help with shuttle killing.
A few vults to kill the single HT that actually survives the shuttle attack.
If you let shuttle drop, it will in most cases be 2 HTs so your SCVs are dead anyway if you let it happen.
A single mine also works unless its too close to SCVs.
Fun fact: If you use Patrol with Medic it will always go back after healing instead of staying where it was last healing. This way you could get one Medic for many expansions by using queue-patrolling (many patrols in a circle(3 or more spots)) which means you only need one.
|
I'll try to get the numbers for fastest game speed.
Without any upgrades, a medic starts with 50 initial energy, which regenerates until it caps out at 200.
One medic heals 18.601 HP/second.
It spends 1 energy to heal 2 HP. That means it spends 9.3005 energy/second.
With 0 energy, a medic heals ~1.5 HP/second (1.488 to be precise). That's 8% of the healing speed (or one could say it's 12.5x faster with full energy).
Energy regeneration is 0.744 energy/second. This is active at all times until the medic has full energy.
One fresh medic can heal 100 HP before it runs out of its initial energy. With that it can fully heal a minimum of (rounded up):
~1.7 nearly dead SCVs (~5.4 seconds)
or
~3.4 half dead SCVs (~10.8 seconds)
We can add a little more healing due to energy regeneration, but I don't know a good estimate. If I had to take a guess, I'd say that, realistically speaking (considering walking distance, obstacles, suboptimal pathing, etc.), a fresh medic would fully heal anywhere between 2-5 SCVs with its initial energy, depending on their exact health status. I'd put the mean at around 3-4 SCVs (with variance mostly coming from the amount of damage dealt to the worker line). The realistic mean could be higher or lower.
When all energy is spent, the healing rate goes down to 8%. At that rate, when given a whole minute, a medic can fully heal:
~1.5 nearly dead SCVs
or
~3 half dead SCVs
So in my rough estimate, about 1 minute and 5-10 seconds after the medic starts to go to work, it has probably healed around 6-8 SCVs.
After that it would require 67 idle seconds for the medic to have another 50 energy ready, or 268 seconds (~4.5 minutes) for the full 200 energy.
If instead the medic keeps healing, it'll do so at the aforementioned rate (per minute) of ~1.5 nearly dead SCVs or ~3 half dead SCVs.
Fingers crossed that I didn't get any numbers wrong.
|
Seems like a decent idea if you weren't floating your barracks by then
|
On August 04 2021 08:40 MeSaber wrote:
I think you instead need to fix drops from happening.
If storm drops happen even on ASL level, then obviously preventing them isn't doable.
Shuttles die quite fast and some turrets make nice work of it with a floating building or vessel as hill vision. Can also get one wraith to help with shuttle killing.
They don't mind if the shuttle dies, as long as they get to unload a few HTs.
And a few minutes later, a new shuttle with new HTs comes. Watch some pro games.
A few vults to kill the single HT that actually survives the shuttle attack.
Doesn't work. Especially if they unload 1 zealot before unloading 2-3 HTs.
If you let shuttle drop, it will in most cases be 2 HTs so your SCVs are dead anyway if you let it happen.
Wrong, if you notice it in time, you won't take the whole duration of the storm but will be able to dodge part of it.
A single mine also works unless its too close to SCVs.
Yes. But as you said, doesn't help if it's dropped in the mineral line. No terran will place mines in (or very near) the mineral line, because it's suicide.
Fun fact: If you use Patrol with Medic it will always go back after healing instead of staying where it was last healing. This way you could get one Medic for many expansions by using queue-patrolling (many patrols in a circle(3 or more spots)) which means you only need one.
I think I'd still personally prefer to have 1 per base because it takes time for her to walk from one base to the other, but this is still interesting to know.
|
I would say
ONE MARINE (or Ling or Zealot) in the mineral line can do wonders...
Especially if the opponent is not microing....
|
On August 05 2021 08:48 niteReloaded wrote:Show nested quote +On August 04 2021 08:40 MeSaber wrote:
I think you instead need to fix drops from happening.
If storm drops happen even on ASL level, then obviously preventing them isn't doable. Show nested quote +
Shuttles die quite fast and some turrets make nice work of it with a floating building or vessel as hill vision. Can also get one wraith to help with shuttle killing.
They don't mind if the shuttle dies, as long as they get to unload a few HTs. And a few minutes later, a new shuttle with new HTs comes. Watch some pro games. Show nested quote +
A few vults to kill the single HT that actually survives the shuttle attack.
Doesn't work. Especially if they unload 1 zealot before unloading 2-3 HTs. Show nested quote +
If you let shuttle drop, it will in most cases be 2 HTs so your SCVs are dead anyway if you let it happen.
Wrong, if you notice it in time, you won't take the whole duration of the storm but will be able to dodge part of it. Yes. But as you said, doesn't help if it's dropped in the mineral line. No terran will place mines in (or very near) the mineral line, because it's suicide. Show nested quote +Fun fact: If you use Patrol with Medic it will always go back after healing instead of staying where it was last healing. This way you could get one Medic for many expansions by using queue-patrolling (many patrols in a circle(3 or more spots)) which means you only need one. I think I'd still personally prefer to have 1 per base because it takes time for her to walk from one base to the other, but this is still interesting to know.
Nitpicking on what i said there. Everything i said is in context of just one drop happening. If you have a wraith it will shoot 2-3 shots on shuttle before passing, two turrets making short work of rest of shuttle, you will then get to drop one unit, it will not be a zealot but a HT, you then kill it with 4 vults shooting once each, or mine.
If you now dont defend at all there will be 2 HTs and they will storm at the same time and you wont be able to dodge when you have nowhere to go that isnt stormed. Usually this will kill a lot of SCVs, many more than just having one HT storming twice which is dodgeable.
If enemy comes with 2 shuttles you will more or less lose a lot of SCVs no matter what because you cant deny the drop from happening. Most Pro's leave tanks and vults for this and a bunker with rines.
Best solution is in most cases to just mass turret the edges to prevent many units dropping per shuttle but just one per shuttle making it out.
All this is situational depending on what really happens in a game and the best way to prevent SCVs from dying is just scans or map awareness (spread mines allover map to see shuttle coming).
I want to say wraiths however is really key, having a few of em over the hill and prob a bit away for chase-ability will at least kill one shuttle or maybe two if you chase em all the way.
|
On August 06 2021 00:08 MeSaber wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2021 08:48 niteReloaded wrote:On August 04 2021 08:40 MeSaber wrote:
I think you instead need to fix drops from happening.
If storm drops happen even on ASL level, then obviously preventing them isn't doable.
Shuttles die quite fast and some turrets make nice work of it with a floating building or vessel as hill vision. Can also get one wraith to help with shuttle killing.
They don't mind if the shuttle dies, as long as they get to unload a few HTs. And a few minutes later, a new shuttle with new HTs comes. Watch some pro games.
A few vults to kill the single HT that actually survives the shuttle attack.
Doesn't work. Especially if they unload 1 zealot before unloading 2-3 HTs.
If you let shuttle drop, it will in most cases be 2 HTs so your SCVs are dead anyway if you let it happen.
Wrong, if you notice it in time, you won't take the whole duration of the storm but will be able to dodge part of it. A single mine also works unless its too close to SCVs. Yes. But as you said, doesn't help if it's dropped in the mineral line. No terran will place mines in (or very near) the mineral line, because it's suicide. Fun fact: If you use Patrol with Medic it will always go back after healing instead of staying where it was last healing. This way you could get one Medic for many expansions by using queue-patrolling (many patrols in a circle(3 or more spots)) which means you only need one. I think I'd still personally prefer to have 1 per base because it takes time for her to walk from one base to the other, but this is still interesting to know. Nitpicking on what i said there. Everything i said is in context of just one drop happening. If you have a wraith it will shoot 2-3 shots on shuttle before passing, two turrets making short work of rest of shuttle, you will then get to drop one unit, it will not be a zealot but a HT, you then kill it with 4 vults shooting once each, or mine. If you now dont defend at all there will be 2 HTs and they will storm at the same time and you wont be able to dodge when you have nowhere to go that isnt stormed. Usually this will kill a lot of SCVs, many more than just having one HT storming twice which is dodgeable. If enemy comes with 2 shuttles you will more or less lose a lot of SCVs no matter what because you cant deny the drop from happening. Most Pro's leave tanks and vults for this and a bunker with rines. Best solution is in most cases to just mass turret the edges to prevent many units dropping per shuttle but just one per shuttle making it out. All this is situational depending on what really happens in a game and the best way to prevent SCVs from dying is just scans or map awareness (spread mines allover map to see shuttle coming). I want to say wraiths however is really key, having a few of em over the hill and prob a bit away for chase-ability will at least kill one shuttle or maybe two if you chase em all the way.
You don't know what nitpicking means. You made a lot of claims, I dissected them one by one and showed how you were wrong. Now you say that everything you said is in the context of just one drop happening, when the whole idea of the thread is recovery between multiple drops.
And the way you write seems like haven't watched pro level games that include storm drops.
Please don't reply anymore.
|
If it was worthwhile the pros would have done it by now.
|
What about using optical flare on HT, confusing your opponent long enough to evacuate your SCVs?
|
On August 08 2021 07:53 niteReloaded wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2021 00:08 MeSaber wrote:On August 05 2021 08:48 niteReloaded wrote:On August 04 2021 08:40 MeSaber wrote:
I think you instead need to fix drops from happening.
If storm drops happen even on ASL level, then obviously preventing them isn't doable.
Shuttles die quite fast and some turrets make nice work of it with a floating building or vessel as hill vision. Can also get one wraith to help with shuttle killing.
They don't mind if the shuttle dies, as long as they get to unload a few HTs. And a few minutes later, a new shuttle with new HTs comes. Watch some pro games.
A few vults to kill the single HT that actually survives the shuttle attack.
Doesn't work. Especially if they unload 1 zealot before unloading 2-3 HTs.
If you let shuttle drop, it will in most cases be 2 HTs so your SCVs are dead anyway if you let it happen.
Wrong, if you notice it in time, you won't take the whole duration of the storm but will be able to dodge part of it. A single mine also works unless its too close to SCVs. Yes. But as you said, doesn't help if it's dropped in the mineral line. No terran will place mines in (or very near) the mineral line, because it's suicide. Fun fact: If you use Patrol with Medic it will always go back after healing instead of staying where it was last healing. This way you could get one Medic for many expansions by using queue-patrolling (many patrols in a circle(3 or more spots)) which means you only need one. I think I'd still personally prefer to have 1 per base because it takes time for her to walk from one base to the other, but this is still interesting to know. Nitpicking on what i said there. Everything i said is in context of just one drop happening. If you have a wraith it will shoot 2-3 shots on shuttle before passing, two turrets making short work of rest of shuttle, you will then get to drop one unit, it will not be a zealot but a HT, you then kill it with 4 vults shooting once each, or mine. If you now dont defend at all there will be 2 HTs and they will storm at the same time and you wont be able to dodge when you have nowhere to go that isnt stormed. Usually this will kill a lot of SCVs, many more than just having one HT storming twice which is dodgeable. If enemy comes with 2 shuttles you will more or less lose a lot of SCVs no matter what because you cant deny the drop from happening. Most Pro's leave tanks and vults for this and a bunker with rines. Best solution is in most cases to just mass turret the edges to prevent many units dropping per shuttle but just one per shuttle making it out. All this is situational depending on what really happens in a game and the best way to prevent SCVs from dying is just scans or map awareness (spread mines allover map to see shuttle coming). I want to say wraiths however is really key, having a few of em over the hill and prob a bit away for chase-ability will at least kill one shuttle or maybe two if you chase em all the way. You don't know what nitpicking means. You made a lot of claims, I dissected them one by one and showed how you were wrong. Now you say that everything you said is in the context of just one drop happening, when the whole idea of the thread is recovery between multiple drops. And the way you write seems like haven't watched pro level games that include storm drops. Please don't reply anymore.
I reply how much i want thank you. Yes you dissected it until it had no context making each phrase look like a noob talking.
Be a man and stand up for you being wrong. Anyone can see what you did as its in text.
You just want to defend your stupid medic shit and you know it.
|
On August 08 2021 08:27 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:
If it was worthwhile the pros would have done it by now.
This. But yes i agree medic could heal scvs but i doubt its game changing by any means. There is a reason you mass produce workers.
|
Well, the idea wasn't to change the meta or anything.
On August 04 2021 07:23 niteReloaded wrote:
That's all, I thought this might be a useful 'niche idea' and fun to read. I hope someone finds it interesting enough to try out.
I think this idea is great from a roleplaying point of view. If I were a dude in an SCV, I sure would like to have some BW medics around to heal my wounds or to dab my sweat. Or to chit-chat with while I'm idling like most of my SCVs.
|
Your SCVs are idling? What game are you playing?
|
Noone works too hard in my bases, mate. They even have free beverages and worker unions.
If you work your guys to the bone then you're no better than the Zerg.
|
If you put a hot female medic in the middle of 24 sweaty strong miners you never know what’s gonna happen good thing they don’t get to use the stimpack ammarite??
|
Well I don't know about your bases but obviously there should always be a supervisor on site. The depots pose a bigger problem in this regard. The anti-discrimination officer has to be informed of any grievances.
But good job for pointing out the bigger problem: Terrans really didn't go with the times and don't do enough for a better gender distribution across the different jobs.
+ Show Spoiler +
|
On August 08 2021 23:08 Highgamer wrote:
Noone works too hard in my bases, mate. They even have free beverages and worker unions.
If you work your guys to the bone then you're no better than the Zerg.
Rofl this is just awesome. Reminds me of Rimworld or Oxygen not included where you set work schedule.
Just imagine if SCVs had stamina bar and needed to sleep xD
|
Nearly everything can be grouped into a lazy solution, an ideal solution, or a cute solutions. In the context of HT drops:
Ideal: scout the shuttle, place goliaths/early game wraith on its path
Lazy: Put an excessive amount of turrets/mines everywhere to deter him from doing drops against you
Cute (in no particular order): Ghost with lockdown vs shuttle, medics in mineral lines, late-game cloak wraiths, EMP the HTs when they drop, Yamato cannon shuttles,
Everyone should strive for the ideal solution, but we all end up taking the lazy solution at some point. Cute solutions only work if there's a huge gap (skill or resources) between the two players, or if both players are screwing around.
|
On August 11 2021 12:31 imBLIND wrote:
Cute (in no particular order): Ghost with lockdown vs shuttle, medics in mineral lines, late-game cloak wraiths, EMP the HTs when they drop, Yamato cannon shuttles,
lmao that got me laughing for a good minute. Yamato gun is brilliant. You can also scout the shuttle leaving, calculate time to reach your base, launch the nuke behind your mineral line just in time for it to arrive and remove workers a second prior to the blast. Is that cute or what?!
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/vw2Gidw.png)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/3t2d4CZ.jpg)
