She's been off work for a while. Someone told me 'hospital stuff'. She was still calling me and sounded ok. She wouldn't tell me what it was, just that she needed a couple months off and the doctor had told her to avoid stress as much as possible. I took her word for it, content that she'd tell me in her own time. When others at work gossiped and sneered, I stood up for her, sometimes angrily; I got in trouble for swearing at one of my bosses who implied that she was faking to get time off work.
Yesterday she told me she had tried to kill herself.
My immediate reaction was anger. I called her a selfish twat. She just nodded like she understood. Quickly though that faded and my mind just went blank. I couldn't relate, I didn't understand how anyone could do that. Since it was beyond my comprehension it seemed meaningless. She assured me she was ok now and I told her that we would talk about it later when I could wrap my head around it.
Now I think I can't be angry with her. Yes it is selfish and I would never ever do it, I'd consider it cowardice, but I hold myself to a higher standard than I do most others. And I forget sometimes that she's actually quite young, and even at such a young age has been dealt a really shitty hand in life. Some of the things she's been through are awful, and although I swore never to repeat them to anybody, ever, it didn't make for happy listening. Everyone goes through bad times, but not like she has.
Before, when she told me about that, I felt completely and horribly impotent. I wanted to make her happier, but I didn't feel like I could do anything. I hated it. But I wasn't in the best place back then. Now I feel much more like myself, and I realise now with horror that I've been very selfish as well. When she talked about leaving work I told her to stay, even though she said how it was getting her down, when she wanted to go to her dads I told her to stay, just because I'd miss her. If I'd been more of a man I could've helped her sort her life out. But I did what was best for me instead of her.
I'm afraid, and full of regret and pity. But now I think I can help, just by having the balls to push her into changing the things she doesn't like, even if at some point I get cut out of the equation.
If it seems like bad taste to post this on TL, it might be. But I can't for the life of me think of anyone to talk to about this, and no one I know IRL comes here. I needed to write it down just to sort my head out, and it helped.
I don't think it's bad taste. Sometimes you just need to vent about something.
Funny (not really funny, but I think you understand what I mean)...are you dating my ex? Very similar case here. If you want to vent or talk to someone who is, rather has been, in a similar situation, shoot me a PM and we can chat. Out of respect for her, I won't put my version of the story up here, as without the details it won't mean a lot. However, in my case, talking to other people about it - even if it was something that is really not pleasant to talk about, will help you relieve a lot of personal stress.
Just keep your head on your shoulders. It'll help her just as much it will help you. Don't change yourself entirely because you are worried about what she will or will not do - because it will potentially make her feel like she's done some sort of irreversible damage. At least in my experience, anyways. Everyone is different, so it's hard to give advice in each scenario.
don't take responsibility for someone else, and don't try to influence others. as you've already recognized, trying to help someone else is you projecting your own desires and opinions. the best you can do for others is to achieve realization for yourself and in doing so you will benefit this girl
On July 11 2011 23:54 The KY wrote: I'm afraid, and full of regret and pity. But now I think I can help, just by having the balls to push her into changing the things she doesn't like, even if at some point I get cut out of the equation.
If you haven't already, you really need to apologize for being selfish with her. Sorting out life's crap is a nasty process and it helps when you have one less thing to worry about.
You can try and push her to change herself, but remember that you can't change people. The only person that can change the way she thinks about things is herself and she will do it when she's ready. It's certainly hard being on the sidelines, especially when you're confident a few simple actions will clear up a lot of issues, but she needs to find the strength to do it herself.
This doesn't mean you're completely helpless. If she's comfortable enough telling you so much about herself that you don't feel comfortable typing it then you may be one of her lifelines. All you can really do is listen. You'd be amazed how much this means to someone going through a really hard time. Oftentimes one thinks their (mostly destructive) way of thinking is normal, or maybe they recognize that it's terrible but don't have the strength to do something about it. They may find that strength just by ranting to a third party for an hour! If she wants to talk, make sure you're there to listen!
I've been where you are a couple times. The second time was terrifying and I wound up being the person who called in the ambulance lest she do something to herself. In each case I listen and let them know they're not alone. There are two things critical you NEED to remember: ALWAYS pursue a "threat" seriously and ALWAYS encourage them to seek professional help (go with them, if need be). While it may be nice to be a lifeline, that alone will not help them in the long run.
Stop calling him selfish He realizes it himself, and nobody is perfect
Do you expect to be 100% without fault? I certainly don't
On July 12 2011 01:29 Failsafe wrote: don't take responsibility for someone else, and don't try to influence others. as you've already recognized, trying to help someone else is you projecting your own desires and opinions. the best you can do for others is to achieve realization for yourself and in doing so you will benefit this girl
While I do agree to an extent that sometimes (or perhaps most of the time) you are projecting your own desires for that person you are trying to help, you can't always generalize that you shouldn't try to help others. Inadvertently hurting in trying to help others is part of relationships. Trying to avoid that by not helping is not the best solution.
Do you really want to live a life where nobody helps or interacts with you, especially in your times of need? What a lonely life would that be
On July 12 2011 02:29 HornyHerring wrote: Calling names someone who tried to kill herself is always a good idea. And the selfish one is you actually.
Have you ever been really close friends with someone who attempted suicide, or had bouts of major depression? Helping them is selfless, but ignoring them is not selfish. It's an incredibly emotionally taxing stressor to be someone whom a depressed/suicidal person is close friends with or relies on.
It's okay KY. I have a suicidal (Or maybe used to, I haven't talked to her in a few months) ex girlfriend. There are a lot of wrong ways to deal with the situation but there are no perfect or really right ways. Just a lot of okay ways to deal with it. You did okay.
On July 12 2011 02:29 HornyHerring wrote: Calling names someone who tried to kill herself is always a good idea. And the selfish one is you actually.
Have you ever been really close friends with someone who attempted suicide, or had bouts of major depression? Helping them is selfless, but ignoring them is not selfish. It's an incredibly emotionally taxing stressor to be someone whom a depressed/suicidal person is close friends with or relies on.
You know that's the exact voice in my head that kept me from telling anyone how depressed I would be at any given time. I'd just pop a vicodin and grin then laugh at their bad jokes, oblige my social obligations then leave and live my actual life. I'm not making a point here, I'm just saying that ignoring them may not be selfish but if someone has the guts to open up to you then you shouldn't throw in the towel until you're under extreme duress.
Edit: I think that's the most information I've ever or will ever give on team liquid O_O
I don't think it's bad taste. Sometimes you just need to vent about something.
Funny (not really funny, but I think you understand what I mean)...are you dating my ex? Very similar case here. If you want to vent or talk to someone who is, rather has been, in a similar situation, shoot me a PM and we can chat. Out of respect for her, I won't put my version of the story up here, as without the details it won't mean a lot. However, in my case, talking to other people about it - even if it was something that is really not pleasant to talk about, will help you relieve a lot of personal stress.
Just keep your head on your shoulders. It'll help her just as much it will help you. Don't change yourself entirely because you are worried about what she will or will not do - because it will potentially make her feel like she's done some sort of irreversible damage. At least in my experience, anyways. Everyone is different, so it's hard to give advice in each scenario.
Thanks dude I might just do that when there are further developments.
On July 11 2011 23:54 The KY wrote: I'm afraid, and full of regret and pity. But now I think I can help, just by having the balls to push her into changing the things she doesn't like, even if at some point I get cut out of the equation.
If you haven't already, you really need to apologize for being selfish with her. Sorting out life's crap is a nasty process and it helps when you have one less thing to worry about.
You can try and push her to change herself, but remember that you can't change people. The only person that can change the way she thinks about things is herself and she will do it when she's ready. It's certainly hard being on the sidelines, especially when you're confident a few simple actions will clear up a lot of issues, but she needs to find the strength to do it herself.
This doesn't mean you're completely helpless. If she's comfortable enough telling you so much about herself that you don't feel comfortable typing it then you may be one of her lifelines. All you can really do is listen. You'd be amazed how much this means to someone going through a really hard time. Oftentimes one thinks their (mostly destructive) way of thinking is normal, or maybe they recognize that it's terrible but don't have the strength to do something about it. They may find that strength just by ranting to a third party for an hour! If she wants to talk, make sure you're there to listen!
I've been where you are a couple times. The second time was terrifying and I wound up being the person who called in the ambulance lest she do something to herself. In each case I listen and let them know they're not alone. There are two things critical you NEED to remember: ALWAYS pursue a "threat" seriously and ALWAYS encourage them to seek professional help (go with them, if need be). While it may be nice to be a lifeline, that alone will not help them in the long run.
Bolded - Yeah I thought I should, and have done so.
Will try to do all that you say.
On July 12 2011 02:29 HornyHerring wrote: Calling names someone who tried to kill herself is always a good idea. And the selfish one is you actually.
It was an impulse reaction and I apologised immediately, and yes I realise that.
On July 12 2011 02:56 DivinO wrote: Panda Bear is good.
^_^ Panda Bear is real good. Saw Animal Collective live recently, were amazing.
It's okay KY. I have a suicidal (Or maybe used to, I haven't talked to her in a few months) ex girlfriend. There are a lot of wrong ways to deal with the situation but there are no perfect or really right ways. Just a lot of okay ways to deal with it. You did okay.
On July 12 2011 02:29 HornyHerring wrote: Calling names someone who tried to kill herself is always a good idea. And the selfish one is you actually.
Have you ever been really close friends with someone who attempted suicide, or had bouts of major depression? Helping them is selfless, but ignoring them is not selfish. It's an incredibly emotionally taxing stressor to be someone whom a depressed/suicidal person is close friends with or relies on.
You know that's the exact voice in my head that kept me from telling anyone how depressed I would be at any given time. I'd just pop a vicodin and grin then laugh at their bad jokes, oblige my social obligations then leave and live my actual life. I'm not making a point here, I'm just saying that ignoring them may not be selfish but if someone has the guts to open up to you then you shouldn't throw in the towel until you're under extreme duress.
Edit: I think that's the most information I've ever or will ever give on team liquid O_O
Bolded - Thank you
And thanks for sharing that. And sincere thanks to all repliers.
EPT
