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In any social gathering that takes place over long periods of time, certain social norms and taboos unique to that group begin to form. Battle.net acts as a typical host to a certain kind of subculture: the gamer. As hobbyists and competitors meet on this plane and converse with one another via forums, emails, instant messengers, live streams and so forth, online games, being no exception to the evolution of social interactions, form their own subculture.
The social paradigm in Starcraft 2 parallels that of most other online games, but most of these cultural attributes present themselves before and after a game, as well as between games. One such attribute is the “GG.” While literally, “GG” simply translates as “Good Game,” a simple acronym, the act of typing “GG” to one’s opponent means significantly more.
Think of “GG”s as “please” and “thank you” in American Culture. You’re in a restaurant. You order food, and the server brings it to you. You let the server place it on the table. Typically, etiquette would dictate that you say “thank you” (or some variation thereof), rather than simply ignoring the server’s act of bringing you food. But imagine you didn’t say anything. It’s not the WORST thing in the world, and while generally considered to be poor manners, your lack of verbalized thanks would typically be overlooked quickly. However, now imagine you didn’t say “thank you,” and the server says “you’re welcome” before you get a chance to (or perhaps you didn’t intend to say “thanks” at all). That pre-emptive “you’re welcome” will always come off as sarcastic or otherwise poorly mannered. The offensive “GG” functions, in terms of social etiquette, the same as a “you’re welcome” before a “thank you” functions in typical American social situations.
I know it’s not that big of a deal, but I just find something incredibly annoying about doing my best to fend off a heavy attack only to be met with the “GG” from the attacker. It doesn’t conform with the relevant social etiquette (in other words, it’s bad manners), and hell, maybe I have an expansion he hasn’t scouted. Maybe I am about to warp in 6 High Templar and storm all his shit. He doesn’t know. He should just play until I’m ready to leave (also a loser’s prerogative), at which point I should say “GG” (after which, he’s cleared to say “GG” back) and promptly leave. I should be allowed to exhaust all options that I feel I have left before leaving the game.
Of course, the defender (or possibly game’s loser) isn’t completely impervious to bad-manners. There are obviously plenty of things that you can do if you’re about to lose that are as annoying to do as offensive “GG”s, but that’s another issue.
The point here is just to explain why I feel offensive “GG” are poor manners, since sometimes people who do it don’t realize it’s considered rude.
So don’t call any offensive “GG”s!
Being nice and being on the internet don’t have to be mutually exclusive. Be nice!
 
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thats why they do it yo;;; pisses opponent off 
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I agree that is is a very impolite move--I would say even worse than something like a manner CC.
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you get offended way to easily.
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Offensive GGs are offensive? I thought that's why they got the name!
But yeah, good luck trying to tell people to be mannered online lol. Mannered people will stayed mannered most of the time, but
+ Show Spoiler +
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It's just something that you have to deal with.... If they do an offensive GG, don't get too riled up about it. Focus on your aspect of the game
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Offensive GG is usually my cue to build pylons everywhere.
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Canada8031 Posts
I'm fairly certain that the vast majority of people who do offensive gg's know what it implies. Being on the internet doesn’t mean you can't be nice, but at the same time, anonymity means that being a dick has few real repercussions.
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I do it all the time when i know the opponent can't win and is just stalling for time (IE building supply depots everywhere or flying buildings all over the map etc).
I think you're taking it a little too seriously.
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every time, without fail, that i get offensive gg'd i float my buildings or build pylons on the map. i take it as super offensive and i do every possible thing to annoy the opponent, i have time to waste, i hope it irritates him when i cost him 5 extra min trying to kill me when i alt tab and watch huk livestream.
fuck those offensive gg players. i hate them without fail.
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I can deal with any sort of bad manner besides offensive gg's. I'd rather be flamed after the game or something than be offensive gg'ed - and it always seems to be by someone doing some form of cheese and a BO win. I throw out all forms of courtesy when i'm offensive gged. Be forewarned.
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On December 17 2010 16:01 Comeh wrote:
I can deal with any sort of bad manner besides offensive gg's. I'd rather be flamed after the game or something than be offensive gg'ed - and it always seems to be by someone doing some form of cheese and a BO win. I throw out all forms of courtesy when i'm offensive gged. Be forewarned.
basically sums up my opinion on the matter, better articulated than myself, though. lol 
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I either say nothing, or tell them they're saying gg at the wrong time. I figure it's less satisfying for the offensive gg'er if they believe the recipent to their rudeness considers them misinformed, rather than insulting.
I don't do that if I can win though. There is nothing greater than being gg'd ... then crushing your opponents army and winning the game. Nothing.
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Come on OP. It's just a game. Wrap your head around it and just enjoy the game.
Winners GG is part of gamesmanship, No need to go through the labors of elaborating of social norms and etiquette to complain about your pwnage. xd
Better yet, practice harder so you can get some winners gg of your own
GG xd
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I don't bother replying people who gg's me when they are winning the game.
Either that, or when i gg, the opponent doesn't reply me with a gg, which seems to irritate me more than the one above. Am i kind of weird?
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Clearly the best way to counter this is to win the game after they gg you.
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I tell all my lower friends that i play with to NEVER EVER offensive GG. Top leagues already has enough BM guys, they don't need one more. This is just going to make the game less enjoyable for a new player.
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On December 17 2010 15:39 Zim23 wrote:
Offensive GG is usually my cue to build pylons everywhere.
hahaha so true! make the game as long as possible
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whenever someone offensive gg's me i go around the map building stuff if i have money to purposefully prolong the game. they will pay in some way for their bm
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I think its important to try to teach people and tell them when they're being rude, rather than being rude back. It's worth the effort when it does work if you can change someone from being an ignorant asshole into someone with manners.
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Every time someone offensive gg's me I'll just gg them back like they're the ones who quit and continue playing. Out of all the times I've come back to win, not one of them gg'ed again when they realized they lost and left. It makes me smile and feel satisfied.
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Offensive gg's are warranted at times. Usually they require a scout fleet accompanying the letters.
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On December 17 2010 17:06 Soulforged wrote:
Offensive gg's are warranted at times. Usually they require a scout fleet accompanying the letters.
I disagree;
reread the "please" and "thank you" analogy. It's not about whether or not they really are about to win. My example in that regard is actually somewhat irrelevant and I rather regret putting it in. The idea is that the "GG" is the always the loser's prerogative, regardless of his state in regards to the game.
I see where you're coming from, but you're interpreting it in a way that I would say is somewhat superficial. "GG" of course literally means "Good Game," but that's not actually its use; "GG" (in terms of the social paradigm in question) is actually a concession of defeat unless it's used as a response to said concession. Thus an offensive "GG" is almost like conceding defeat for your opponent, which is why it's a bad-mannered act.
Obviously in the situation that you mentioned, the lack of a "GG" from the losing player is also bad-mannered; however, it remains the losers "GG" to give.
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I usually call GG first... then i leave the game.
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Sometimes I'll be a dick and chirp people in team games when we have to fend off some stupid rush. Yesterday I got some double early pool/drone rush, which killed my hatch, but I kept my drones and helped my friend take out the units, and then droned their bases. Said something along the lines of "there's a game past the 5 minute mark" with expletives littered throughout.
I don't offensive gg, but if it happens to me, the new game is delay as long as possible. Take every vespene, nydus to the islands, whatever it takes to win, haha. Then i go get food while the other guy techs to some stupid overkill unit to try and rub it in.
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In one of my longest and favourite games I ended it with an 'offensive' gg. Actually it was a "vgg" because it was a very good game, but it was absolutely clear i had won at that point . It was a epic game with 9000+ base trades, which ended with me having 1 mining base while he was long distance mining and pushing with me barely fending over about 5 minutes till he had no option but to finally all-in with his workers, after which defending i 'offensive' gg'd.
I kinda typed it out of relief more than anything, as i could finally breath for the first time in 80 minutes, but i actually regretted it straight away as i didn't want to offend after such a good game. I don't think he would have taken offence though, but i don't think he would.
Are offensive gg's ok after really good games? What if you want to get the sentiment in before they leave in case they cbf gg-ing first?
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I like bad manners. Good manners are boring and conformist.
It's the internet version of having a stiff upper lip -_-
Besides, he just gives you the best reason ever to rally up your stuff and beat him for maximum satisfaction ^_^
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I offensively zz or hh or ???? then give them advice. I just do this to speed up my session but also to help the guy i just beat.
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On December 17 2010 18:32 THE_oldy wrote:
Are offensive gg's ok after really good games? What if you want to get the sentiment in before they leave in case they cbf gg-ing first?
That's kind of an interesting question. I think what you're getting at is that your "vgg" was intended as good manners, and thus doesn't conform to the pseudo-rule I've defined. In fact, I think your "vgg" would NOT be considered bad mannered, but not because it was a long game, but rather because you clearly stepped outside of the social paradigm by using "vgg" versus "gg."
To relate back to the "thank you" and "you're welcome" example, imagine the server brings you food and you don't say "thank you." The server then says something like "enjoy," or "happy to serve you," or some other statement that is essentially a statement whose actual intent is very similar to "you're welcome." However, since "you're welcome" is a statement used exclusively proceeding "thank you," by using a variation of the statement, the server's polite intent is made clear.
I know it's kind of a semantic argument, but in social situations, precise wording is incredibly important in conveying a particular message. I think by saying "vgg" instead of "gg" you did the same thing that our hypothetical server does by saying "enjoy" instead of "you're welcome." By setting a precedent outside of the most commonplace social paradigm, you imply your good intent.
I still think you probably should have waited until he said "gg," then you could have responded with "vgg," and that would have been even more clear. While it's possible that he interpreted as bad manners, it's certainly a lot more likely for him to interpret it the way you intended it than if you had simply used "gg."
In response to your second question, I'd say it's time to revert to the advice a lot of people are posting; just let the BM folks be BM and let that be that.
I feel like leaving a game without a "gg" is a lot less BM than the offensive "gg" anyway. It's more like the absence of good manners than the presence of bad manners. But I don't have any actual sort of analysis for that one; it's just straight up subjective opinion.
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I think that if you had a very good game and you're winning it , offensive gg can still be offensive. I feel like it's better to type something like "wow dude it was a crazy game " rather than a simple gg ,it shows that it was not some "average" game.
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In response to the "'gg'ing lategame to show appreciation for a good game " thing - it doesn't matter how long the game's gone on, if you type 'gg' when you're about to win before your enemy does, I consider it BM.
Just type "good game." If someone said 'good game' to me before they won, I wouldn't consider it BM at all. Same with the aforementioned 'vgg'.
Also, I agree completely with your points, Seltsam. That's the way I always looked at it myself.
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i think it's hilarious. i get offensive GG'ed all the time.
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They obviously aren't good players if they think the game is over before it is, therefore it is infact not even a good game as they clearly suck. Offensive GG's go in the category of games when I don't gg as it would be lying. By not saying GG they might understand that they infact are not good and should learn more about the game, I'm doing these bad mannered idiots a favor!
+ Show Spoiler +
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On December 17 2010 20:10 HwangjaeTerran wrote:They obviously aren't good players if they think the game is over before it is, therefore it is infact not even a good game as they clearly suck. Offensive GG's go in the category of games when I don't gg as it would be lying. By not saying GG they might understand that they infact are not good and should learn more about the game, I'm doing these bad mannered idiots a favor! + Show Spoiler +
I was gonna respond that the point is that "gg," in effect, doesn't actually mean "good game," but I can't tell if you're being facetious or not :/
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Offensive GGers cue the "Float buildings everywhere and scatter SCVs to build almost-complete supply depots everywhere and cancel them once they're found until I run out of minerals" procedure from me.
I've offensive GG'd a couple times, but it was because I felt the opponent was being rude about not leaving. (e.g. making me chase them around as they keep putting down new hatcheries while I have 3 working bases)
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The correct response is: "I refuse to accept your surrender."
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On December 17 2010 15:22 Seltsam wrote:
However, now imagine you didn’t say “thank you,” and the server says “you’re welcome” before you get a chance to (or perhaps you didn’t intend to say “thanks” at all). That pre-emptive “you’re welcome” will always come off as sarcastic or otherwise poorly mannered. The offensive “GG” functions, in terms of social etiquette, the same as a “you’re welcome” before a “thank you” functions in typical American social situations.
It's worse manner to be a little dipshit and not acknowledge the person that is working to serve your ungrateful ass. Likewise, it is poor manner to sit in the game and make me smash every last bit of your puny base because you think you still have a chance when you're sitting at half my supply and behind by three bases.
In both instances, you learnin people the hard way! There's no shame in showing rude, dumb people the error of there ways!
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What ticks me off most is when you explain how offensive GG is bad manner to someone who doesn't know but instead of learning they just say they don't care and follow it up with another BM jab.
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I too am against the offensive GG.
The only time I will do it is when I am about to kill their last structure and they still haven;t conceded, in which case they are already BM'ing me, so eff em.
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On December 17 2010 15:39 Zim23 wrote:
Offensive GG is usually my cue to build pylons everywhere.
And to hide nexuses to counteract being revealed, of course.
On December 18 2010 04:14 blamous wrote:
I too am against the offensive GG.
The only time I will do it is when I am about to kill their last structure and they still haven;t conceded, in which case they are already BM'ing me, so eff em.
They're probably afk or alt-tabbed, anyway.
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EPT
