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Pinnacle voids ByuL vs MarineKing Match - Page 61

Forum Index > SC2 General
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mrRoflpwn
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States2618 Posts
April 02 2015 14:00 GMT
#1201
I am just so disappointed.
Long live the Boss Toss!
Grizvok
Profile Joined August 2014
United States711 Posts
April 02 2015 14:03 GMT
#1202
On April 02 2015 22:39 damoonwolf wrote:
It's not cheating, MarineKing is just very really bad.


I think you are just bad.
Deleted User 26513
Profile Joined February 2007
2376 Posts
April 02 2015 14:03 GMT
#1203
On April 02 2015 08:35 _SpiRaL_ wrote:
I posted basically the same thing in another thread like this.

To those of you who think betting lines that suspicious are NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER.

Please I pray to god you are never on a jury because you have no ability to assess evidence. Sure its not a smoking gun, but it is STRONG evidence. Lines moving that much, the most reasonable explanation is that someone knows the fix is in.

Then we have the game itself. Well when you have one piece of strong evidence, then THAT game, which itself would imo, be almost a smoking gun, in fact close to DNA evidence on the murder weapon, then we have a cast iron certainty. This game was fixed. The probability of that? Honestly its 99.9999% or something. But the way people act they seem to think its like a 50/50 or something. Because they jump through insane mental loops to try to convince themselves that each piece of evidence is not that strong in itself.

But its no surprise really a lot of people on this site are:

1. Very young
2. Not versed in mathematics
3. No idea about betting, how it works anything like that

Lol, that was funny. Go tell that to a lawyer... and watch how he laughs at your face. A betting line movement and a replay of the game. Strong evidence... Better send the guy to the jail.
Grizvok
Profile Joined August 2014
United States711 Posts
April 02 2015 14:06 GMT
#1204
On April 02 2015 23:03 Pr0wler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2015 08:35 _SpiRaL_ wrote:
I posted basically the same thing in another thread like this.

To those of you who think betting lines that suspicious are NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER.

Please I pray to god you are never on a jury because you have no ability to assess evidence. Sure its not a smoking gun, but it is STRONG evidence. Lines moving that much, the most reasonable explanation is that someone knows the fix is in.

Then we have the game itself. Well when you have one piece of strong evidence, then THAT game, which itself would imo, be almost a smoking gun, in fact close to DNA evidence on the murder weapon, then we have a cast iron certainty. This game was fixed. The probability of that? Honestly its 99.9999% or something. But the way people act they seem to think its like a 50/50 or something. Because they jump through insane mental loops to try to convince themselves that each piece of evidence is not that strong in itself.

But its no surprise really a lot of people on this site are:

1. Very young
2. Not versed in mathematics
3. No idea about betting, how it works anything like that

Lol, that was funny. Go tell that to a lawyer... and watch how he laughs at your face. A betting line movement and a replay of the game. Strong evidence... Better send the guy to the jail.


Not evidence to send him to jail but definitely enough for someone with half a brain to be incredibly suspicious.
mechengineer123
Profile Joined March 2013
Ukraine711 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-02 14:07:52
April 02 2015 14:07 GMT
#1205
Honestly, most of MarineKings TvZ losses look incredibly stupid. Remember he had that amazing streak of losing ~8 TvZ maps in a row due to not closing his depot wall at his natural. Nobody called him a match fixer then, even though that's like the most platinum league mistake you can make.
Entropy137
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada215 Posts
April 02 2015 14:08 GMT
#1206
No evidence to send him to jail lol. Plenty of evidence to ban him from playing in any more sc2 tourneys in korea.
Saya666
Profile Joined March 2015
United States13 Posts
April 02 2015 14:19 GMT
#1207
It's really been awhile since the last update... trying to let it blow over?
capu
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Finland224 Posts
April 02 2015 14:23 GMT
#1208
the betting line is suspicious when scrutinizing out of context but the context is that MKP hasn't really been himself after the comeback so the bettors knew mkp is weak and favored heavily the other side. The replay is proof of MKPs weak play.
affliction
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany198 Posts
April 02 2015 14:33 GMT
#1209
Capu read the whole thread and then try again to justify all of this shit. Seriously. I was always a big fan but for me the absurd betting lines (explained in this thread) are proof enough that something is wrong.
Penev
Profile Joined October 2012
28469 Posts
April 02 2015 14:39 GMT
#1210
On April 02 2015 23:19 Saya666 wrote:
It's really been awhile since the last update... trying to let it blow over?

We're waiting for this

Also for people who just started posting: Please read the thread.
I Protoss winner, could it be?
Swoopae
Profile Joined January 2015
Australia339 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-02 17:35:46
April 02 2015 17:34 GMT
#1211
I think the mods (if they are so inclined) could maybe put together the key posts from this thread and put them in the OP; lichter's post from the other thread re: kespa are aware of this, DJhelium's tweets to MVP and their replies, the posts where I explained the manner in which the money was bet on Byul and why the betting action was suspicious and unusual and explained dynamic line movement, a list of the 4 cancelled matches and additional matches identified as having suspicious line movement that were not cancelled, Pinnacle's original statement on the San vs Dark match and brief statement on this match , the replay itself which is already in OP, Marineking's facebook rant response, the videos where kane/huk/richard etc all discuss the issue, Welmu and Huk's posts ITT, Rekrul's post in the thread, etc
Wuster
Profile Joined May 2011
1974 Posts
April 02 2015 18:10 GMT
#1212
On April 03 2015 02:34 Swoopae wrote:
I think the mods (if they are so inclined) could maybe put together the key posts from this thread and put them in the OP; lichter's post from the other thread re: kespa are aware of this, DJhelium's tweets to MVP and their replies, the posts where I explained the manner in which the money was bet on Byul and why the betting action was suspicious and unusual and explained dynamic line movement, a list of the 4 cancelled matches and additional matches identified as having suspicious line movement that were not cancelled, Pinnacle's original statement on the San vs Dark match and brief statement on this match , the replay itself which is already in OP, Marineking's facebook rant response, the videos where kane/huk/richard etc all discuss the issue, Welmu and Huk's posts ITT, Rekrul's post in the thread, etc


At that point it probably warrants a new thread since the scope is much more than just MKP.

Of course we would need someone to volunteer making a new thread, like Bisu's Dagger volunteered for this one to keep the LR thread from exploding.
boxerfred
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
Germany8360 Posts
April 02 2015 18:42 GMT
#1213
Well, no Proleague for me until this is solved. The more I lurk this thread, the sicker I get. StarCraft used to cheer me up, especially high quality competition that is Proleague.
JoeCool
Profile Joined January 2012
Germany2517 Posts
April 02 2015 18:55 GMT
#1214
On April 03 2015 03:42 boxerfred wrote:
Well, no Proleague for me until this is solved. The more I lurk this thread, the sicker I get. StarCraft used to cheer me up, especially high quality competition that is Proleague.


Yeah same for me... but I feel like there are lots of people that lost part of their passion because of the recent events. How has viewership been this week?
Maybe it was naive, believing that Sc2 is a "clean" sport, but it is a huge disappointment.
geokilla
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada8230 Posts
April 02 2015 19:24 GMT
#1215
On April 02 2015 23:39 Penev wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2015 23:19 Saya666 wrote:
It's really been awhile since the last update... trying to let it blow over?

We're waiting for this
https://twitter.com/SC2MVP/status/582525929135738880
Also for people who just started posting: Please read the thread.

Ok what about San vs Dark?
Swoopae
Profile Joined January 2015
Australia339 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-02 22:59:17
April 02 2015 22:58 GMT
#1216
For the record not all of the cancelled matches were in Proleague; Innovation vs Super map 1 and Super vs Dream map 1 were in individual leagues, although a majority of the suspicious matches did occur in Proleague as well as two of the four cancelled bets on matches.

San vs Dark, no statements of significance were made other than San issuing a denial and claiming he played badly and claimed had a shoulder injury I think it was.

Because a thread was never made for the individual league series where there was suspicious line movement on Map 1 only, no statements were made about any of those.
Popkiller
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
3415 Posts
April 02 2015 23:18 GMT
#1217
On April 03 2015 07:58 Swoopae wrote:
For the record not all of the cancelled matches were in Proleague; Innovation vs Super map 1 and Super vs Dream map 1 were in individual leagues, although a majority of the suspicious matches did occur in Proleague as well as two of the four cancelled bets on matches.

San vs Dark, no statements of significance were made other than San issuing a denial and claiming he played badly and claimed had a shoulder injury I think it was.

Because a thread was never made for the individual league series where there was suspicious line movement on Map 1 only, no statements were made about any of those.


On the subject of Inno vs Super or Dream vs Super, did anyone look into this?

On March 26 2015 09:50 Davichi wrote:
Hello there.

I am posting this on my alternative account as I don't want my main account to be associated with any of the investigations in regards to the current match-fixing crisis we have right now. If moderators want to know who I am, they are free to check my user profile to see the IP matched to the user I am. All I ask is anonymity and to refrain from leaking my actual identity to the public.

Anyway, there's a very popular prop bet that shows up on Korean toto (betting sites) for 'game ending in (X) minutes', where there are several betting odds for a different time (so for example, 15 will have a lower line than say, 10). Word on the street in Korea is that many 'good' players will take advantage of this prop bet in a best-of-series against a weak opponent in order to make a bit of money by throwing one of the sets taking advantage of the prop bet, and then convincingly win the rest of the series.

One game which was highlighted by SwoopAE in terms of being suspicious that may have fit the bill was Innovation vs Super Game 1 from the GSL. This was a part of a best-of-series and had a 2-1 result.

If possible, could anyone check on the times the game ended at and the manner in which the game ended?

EDIT: There was also Super vs Dream Game 1 that was apparently compromised, but Dream swept the series 3-0 so I'm guessing for the bet to be nulled was that Super decided to do something in Game 1 that would have fulfilled a prop bet but he still lost.


Not sure if this poster is really as close to all of this as he says, but he could be right.
Goibon
Profile Joined May 2010
New Zealand8185 Posts
April 03 2015 06:16 GMT
#1218
On April 03 2015 03:55 JoeCool wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 03 2015 03:42 boxerfred wrote:
Well, no Proleague for me until this is solved. The more I lurk this thread, the sicker I get. StarCraft used to cheer me up, especially high quality competition that is Proleague.


Yeah same for me... but I feel like there are lots of people that lost part of their passion because of the recent events. How has viewership been this week?
Maybe it was naive, believing that Sc2 is a "clean" sport, but it is a huge disappointment.

Sums it up for me too

You know even though i'm still firmly an innocent until proven guilty, and correlation =/= causation kinda guy, i don't think i've watched a single game of sc2 since this story broke. I'm just lacking faith in the integrity as a whole because regardless of what the facts of this instance are - who told who what, etc - it's clear that somebody told someone something, and it's clear this is anything but an isolated instance.

I just can't do it.

But i still wanna watch SC2, so i've actually watched more SC2 streams since LOTV beta hit than i have since pre-HotS.
Leenock =^_^= Ryung =^_^= Parting =^_^= herO =^_^= Guilty
Shortizz
Profile Joined July 2011
Singapore129 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-04-03 06:44:43
April 03 2015 06:41 GMT
#1219
Ppl are still in denial? The line movement suggests that something is going on. This is SC2, not some division 1 sports team vs division 12345 that has 0 chance of winning. Even then, heavy bets are still being placed when the odds are ridiculously low(1.09?). In a game where a tiny mistake costs you the game who in their right mind would take those odds? Byul vs MarineKing isnt even that big of an advantage for Byul. Why not put your money on Innovation, Maru or herO vs random B teamer? Even those offered better odds than Byul vs MarineKing.

And then we have the actual match itself. Really? You are saying he is bad or having a bad day? That spine is there ON the minimap, nobody misses that. Ive played at GM level before and if my opponent made a mistake like that, i would suspect he got his account boosted or is on a phone call. No natural expansion, nothing on the gold bases, a freaking red dot on your mini map for a whole minute, too freaking obvious. This guy used to be MarineKingPrime, GSL finalist, not GoldLeaguePrime.

What really convinced me was his reactions via the player cam, you could see he was frustrated and troubled. He kept looking at his mini map on the bottom left screen and IMO when he saw that spine, he panicked. He didnt know what to do and was probably cursing himself for moving that reaper close enough to see it.
showstealer1829
Profile Blog Joined May 2014
Australia3123 Posts
April 03 2015 07:31 GMT
#1220
I think denial confuses things with saying the evidence is circumstantial at best. We don't know for sure what he was looking at. We can't, we weren't in the booth. It LOOKS bad, especially when combined with the betting lines. I will grant that, but I can understand why people won't convict MK on circumstantial evidence and will say "Let's wait for KeSPA before we condemn him"
There is no understanding. There is only Choya. Choya is the way. Choya is Love. Choya is Life. Has is the Light in the Protoss Dark and Nightmare is his chosen Acolyte
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