On April 10 2017 19:06 KingofdaHipHop wrote: First time watching this season, goddamn that is a green studio
All I can think about is the wheel spinning hypnotically behind Valdez. I keep hoping one of the Korean casters will go up to it and spin it and then scream some konglish slogan.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
It was terrible.
Do people still play HotS?
Well I found 5 games after midnight so some people do.
Skill level is essentially non-existent though. Diamond league player massing hydralisks on one base against Terran.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
It was terrible.
Do people still play HotS?
Well I found 5 games after midnight so some people do.
Skill level is essentially non-existent though. Diamond league player massing hydralisks on one base against Terran.
Maybe I should go get my GM tag then. Just to say I got it.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
It was terrible.
Do people still play HotS?
Well I found 5 games after midnight so some people do.
Skill level is essentially non-existent though. Diamond league player massing hydralisks on one base against Terran.
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
It was terrible.
Do people still play HotS?
I played some placement matches a couple of days ago and got placed in diamond after not playing for like 1.5 years
On April 10 2017 19:14 Heartland wrote: I've started getting bored with how long LotV takes to pick up as well. I can't even imagine watching a HotS or WoL game anymore.
I played 5 HotS games last night to see how it feels.
It was terrible.
Do people still play HotS?
Well I found 5 games after midnight so some people do.
Skill level is essentially non-existent though. Diamond league player massing hydralisks on one base against Terran.
Maybe I should go get my GM tag then. Just to say I got it.
The biggest issue I faced in terms of playing is that because I'm so used to LotV, all my timings are skewed. I could barely remember a HotS build and I got supply blocked 3 minutes every game because CCs give less supply than they do in LotV.
The 6 worker start just really isn't for me though I have to say. The start is so slow.
Is this where Inno finally is forced to learn that you have to transition in late game TvZ and can't win all your games with just marauders and liberators?
On April 10 2017 19:31 Elentos wrote: Is this where Inno finally is forced to learn that you have to transition in late game TvZ and can't win all your games with just marauders and liberators?
On April 10 2017 19:31 Elentos wrote: Is this where Inno finally is forced to learn that you have to transition in late game TvZ and can't win all your games with just marauders and liberators?
What do you transition into though?
Ghosts + liberator range for starters, as aLive did yesterday.
If you wanna get really fancy you could also add ravens or BCs later on but that shit's expensive.
Not sure about Lurkers against Terran tbh. It was a cool idea and he had some success at the Super Tournament, but I doubt it will supplant LBM or Roach/Rav/Infestor.
I don't understand why they don't allow twitch to stream it,there are around 2k viewers and it could be at least doubled...do you know how many viewers are in the KR stream?
On April 10 2017 20:39 raff100 wrote: I don't understand why they don't allow twitch to stream it,there are around 2k viewers and it could be at least doubled...do you know how many viewers are in the KR stream?
On April 10 2017 20:39 raff100 wrote: I don't understand why they don't allow twitch to stream it,there are around 2k viewers and it could be at least doubled...do you know how many viewers are in the KR stream?
On April 10 2017 20:52 Elentos wrote: So Wolf recommends Zest to still attack after Patience has already started warping in units in his main base?
I don't believe that Patience knew what Zest's plan was at all. Double robo disruptor + immortal drop + continued upgrades is way too greedy against someone who's looking to attack you with a larger army. If the drop gets defended somehow, Patience simply dies. But he caught Zest in that horribly awkward spot that every Protoss who's ever played PvT knows is the worst feeling in the world. You've got to attack, you're confident that your attack can do well, you get dropped at the worst possible time in the worst possible place without a MSC around, and you immediately die.
On April 10 2017 20:57 Olli wrote: But he caught Zest in that horribly awkward spot that every Protoss who's ever played PvT knows is the worst feeling in the world. You've got to attack, you're confident that your attack can do well, you get dropped at the worst possible time in the worst possible place
Oh don't think this is a Protoss exclusive feeling. That happens way more in TvT than anyone would like.
Regardless, the point stands - how is his attack going to succeed when there are already units killing his main? If it becomes a base trade, Patience got there first.
On April 10 2017 20:57 Olli wrote: But he caught Zest in that horribly awkward spot that every Protoss who's ever played PvT knows is the worst feeling in the world. You've got to attack, you're confident that your attack can do well, you get dropped at the worst possible time in the worst possible place
Oh don't think this is a Protoss exclusive feeling. That happens way more in TvT than anyone would like.
Regardless, the point stands - how is his attack going to succeed when there are already units killing his main? If it becomes a base trade, Patience got there first.
I think he has to attack anyway. Patience can't basetrade him with two immortals and a few adepts. Sack the main if necessary, the third's more important. Get as many probes out as possible, secure the natural with a few pylons, warp in aggressively and all in Patience's third. If he kills Patience's army and the third, he can kill the natural too. Then he's got the stronger standing army, better economy and might be able to go home and clean up Patience's aggressive force, then win a basetrade. But that's all best case scenario. Going home was auto-loss though.
On April 10 2017 20:57 Olli wrote: But he caught Zest in that horribly awkward spot that every Protoss who's ever played PvT knows is the worst feeling in the world. You've got to attack, you're confident that your attack can do well, you get dropped at the worst possible time in the worst possible place
Oh don't think this is a Protoss exclusive feeling. That happens way more in TvT than anyone would like.
Regardless, the point stands - how is his attack going to succeed when there are already units killing his main? If it becomes a base trade, Patience got there first.
I think he has to attack anyway. Patience can't basetrade him with two immortals and a few adepts. Sack the main if necessary, the third's more important. Get as many probes out as possible, secure the natural with a few pylons, warp in aggressively and all in Patience's third. If he kills Patience's army and the third, he can kill the natural too. Then he's got the stronger standing army, better economy and might be able to go home and clean up Patience's aggressive force, then win a basetrade. But that's all best case scenario. Going home was auto-loss though.
Since Zest's main and 3rd were basically empty Patience could have sacked his own 3rd and waited to have the better army, he wouldn't have been forced to fight. Also 2 immortals could unpower all the gates in his main.
On April 10 2017 20:57 Olli wrote: But he caught Zest in that horribly awkward spot that every Protoss who's ever played PvT knows is the worst feeling in the world. You've got to attack, you're confident that your attack can do well, you get dropped at the worst possible time in the worst possible place
Oh don't think this is a Protoss exclusive feeling. That happens way more in TvT than anyone would like.
Regardless, the point stands - how is his attack going to succeed when there are already units killing his main? If it becomes a base trade, Patience got there first.
I think he has to attack anyway. Patience can't basetrade him with two immortals and a few adepts. Sack the main if necessary, the third's more important. Get as many probes out as possible, secure the natural with a few pylons, warp in aggressively and all in Patience's third. If he kills Patience's army and the third, he can kill the natural too. Then he's got the stronger standing army, better economy and might be able to go home and clean up Patience's aggressive force, then win a basetrade. But that's all best case scenario. Going home was auto-loss though.
Since Zest's main and 3rd were basically empty Patience could have sacked his own 3rd and waited to have the better army, he wouldn't have been forced to fight. Also 2 immortals could unpower all the gates in his main.
Patience was preparing to hold the third though, as I think he should. Unpowering gates is the worst part of this, but that's why Zest has to warp in aggressively from the start. Even if Patience backs off and loses "only" the third, he loses a robo and robo bay for it as well, since those were at the third. Once the third is down, Zest can start warping in at home, go back and clean up that part of Patience's army. Main/natural with single robo and one upgrade ahead vs natural/third with single robo and disruptor tech, but unpowered gates for a while is still hard, but more doable than what happened.
On April 10 2017 21:30 Fango wrote: Maru pulled that back
I was thinking it was gonna be a 10 minute 2-0 after the proxy at the start
It should have been. aLive was so far ahead but he just didn't know what to do with it. He didn't properly attack, he didn't go greedy. He went middle of the road after taking no damage from a 2-rax proxy.
By the way, I think Maru is changing his play slowly, and we're seeing him have some struggles with it right now, but I think he'd be THE player to watch out for in the second half of the year.
Long macro games and never transitioning were always his weakness, but we're seeing him get more and more comfortable in those games.
Maru is long overdue a title. Always a top 3 terran, never really got the recognition.
On April 10 2017 21:35 SC2Toastie wrote: By the way, I think Maru is changing his play slowly, and we're seeing him have some struggles with it right now, but I think he'd be THE player to watch out for in the second half of the year.
Long macro games and never transitioning were always his weakness, but we're seeing him get more and more comfortable in those games.
Maru is long overdue a title. Always a top 3 terran, never really got the recognition.
On April 10 2017 21:57 neutralrobot wrote: That was a really fun game too. Wish Maru had somehow managed to take it, but he at least made a plausible looking game out of it.
aLives too aggressive for him. In TvT right now thats the best way to do it. Id still say maru looks like the better technical player, in games 2 and 3 aLive had massive advantages that he kept throwing.
Really wish we didn't have those proxies though, shame they didn't play in GSL Super
On April 10 2017 21:54 SC2Toastie wrote: Wow wolf needs to tone it down with the only focussing on one player man, he's wrong mor eoften than hes right
Seriously! Its super annoying. Casters should just stop trying to sound all-knowledgeable and to predict everything. More play by play, less analyzing.
On April 10 2017 21:53 Elentos wrote: aLive almost threw this game reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally hard
Maru kept his Vikings next to his main for so long but if he moved them once the GG doomdrop was always gonna happen
What does that have to do with what I said though?
You said that aLive almost through it. I'm saying Maru did
Well he wasn't really ahead so I wouldn't consider it a throw. And even then, aLive almost threw the game back at him.
Its more the fact he was watching for doomdrops for so long. Then he moves his Vikings and bam. He wasn't ahead but its the move that lost him the game.
On April 10 2017 21:53 Elentos wrote: aLive almost threw this game reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally hard
Maru kept his Vikings next to his main for so long but if he moved them once the GG doomdrop was always gonna happen
What does that have to do with what I said though?
You said that aLive almost through it. I'm saying Maru did
Well he wasn't really ahead so I wouldn't consider it a throw. And even then, aLive almost threw the game back at him.
Its more the fact he was watching for doomdrops for so long. Then he moves his Vikings and bam. He wasn't ahead but its the move that lost him the game.
And and leaving all his tanks unsieged. Again
I mean he could have placed his sensor towers properly to avoid that whole disaster. And he still almost won because aLive didn't feel like making stuff.
On April 10 2017 21:54 SC2Toastie wrote: Wow wolf needs to tone it down with the only focussing on one player man, he's wrong mor eoften than hes right
Seriously! Its super annoying. Casters should just stop trying to sound all-knowledgeable and to predict everything. More play by play, less analyzing.
I enjoy analysis when it's well done. I enjoyed Apollo's casts the most, especially around 2013/14. He was knowledgeable about every race to the point where he could point out pros' mistakes and they would agree. That's extremely rare, and it was great to listen to. Even at high masters playing against GMs I still learned something from his casts.
I think the most underrated aspect of analytical casting is the building of ingame storylines. When someone chooses a strategy, you can point out their decision and clearly draw an image of what either player has to work with and what their goals are. Then it becomes more exciting to follow the game and see how they go about it.
On April 10 2017 21:53 Elentos wrote: aLive almost threw this game reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally hard
Maru kept his Vikings next to his main for so long but if he moved them once the GG doomdrop was always gonna happen
What does that have to do with what I said though?
You said that aLive almost through it. I'm saying Maru did
Well he wasn't really ahead so I wouldn't consider it a throw. And even then, aLive almost threw the game back at him.
Its more the fact he was watching for doomdrops for so long. Then he moves his Vikings and bam. He wasn't ahead but its the move that lost him the game.
And and leaving all his tanks unsieged. Again
I mean he could have placed his sensor towers properly to avoid that whole disaster. And he still almost won because aLive didn't feel like making stuff.
Same point though. He was so careful about doomdrops in both games and then loses to a doomdrop because that one time he moved his army
Carriers are actually excellent defensive units. They got crazy range and do a lot of damage. Plus they're hard to kill or even reach because they're flying.
On April 10 2017 22:44 Heartland wrote: Carriers are actually excellent defensive units. They got crazy range and do a lot of damage. Plus they're hard to kill or even reach because they're flying.
On April 10 2017 22:44 Heartland wrote: Carriers are actually excellent defensive units. They got crazy range and do a lot of damage. Plus they're hard to kill or even reach because they're flying.
"Give me all your cannons and templars. I know what you're thinking. You're thinking give me a lot of cannons and templars. That's not what I mean. I mean give me all you got."
EPT
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