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[WCS] Global Finals Day 1 - Page 326

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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Havik_
Profile Joined November 2011
United States5585 Posts
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6501
On November 17 2012 18:18 Resilient wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:17 Corrosive wrote:
if idra wins: omg stephano threw for 20 pages in a row


this will probably happen



Looking at how the brackets have lined up, they'd both want to LOSE this series. Who'd you rather play? Rain or BK? CMON MAN! :p
"An opinion is only as good as the evidence that backs it up."- William O'Malley, S.J.
Enchanted
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1609 Posts
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6502
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.

Rain got out micro'd pretty hard in that second game. First game was him botching it but the second he just got out micro'd.
thepuppyassassin
Profile Joined April 2011
900 Posts
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6503
On November 17 2012 18:17 eviltomahawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.

The Koreans go full-foreigner against the foreigners?



It's called "losing". Let's call it for what it is and stop making stupid excuses.
silent_owl
Profile Joined March 2011
Philippines3098 Posts
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6504
On November 17 2012 18:18 FakeDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:17 eviltomahawk wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.

The Koreans go full-foreigner against the foreigners?


Sadly yes this is one of the few time i have seen Koreans botching their lead.


Well, let's see the top Koreans play. Of course, Rain has no excuse.
"If you know your enemy and yourself, you need not fear the results of a hundred battles." - Sun Tzu
StarVe
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany13591 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-17 09:19:58
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6505
On November 17 2012 18:18 Chicane wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 silent_owl wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


EG would clearly suspend them.


Lol... how would they prove it? Stephano would just play worse and no one could say a thing other than speculate.

Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 Lysanias wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


Absolutly nothing, wich makes this bracket system flawed.


Yeah it's so stupid that they know who they will played. That is VERY FLAWED. Even if they do follow the same format, they shouldn't reveal it ahead of time! What were they thinking?!

There are no seeds whatsoever. It's completely useless to have predetermined brackets anyway, because everything in the group draws has been random draw already. Why not make it even more random? In that case, it'd even have actually been a good thing.
eviltomahawk
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States11135 Posts
November 17 2012 09:19 GMT
#6506
On November 17 2012 18:18 FakeDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:17 eviltomahawk wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.

The Koreans go full-foreigner against the foreigners?


Sadly yes this is one of the few time i have seen Koreans botching their lead.

I want to see foreigners going full-foreigner against Koreans who themselves are going full-foreigner, and the Koreans go even more full-foreigner against that full-foreignerness of the foreigners, and the foreigners responding by going even more full-foreigner in an endless loop of full-foreignerness.
ㅇㅅㅌㅅ
covetousrat
Profile Joined October 2010
2109 Posts
November 17 2012 09:20 GMT
#6507
On November 17 2012 18:13 Astro-Penguin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:09 X3GoldDot wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:07 Astro-Penguin wrote:
On November 17 2012 17:55 X3GoldDot wrote:
On November 17 2012 17:54 Astro-Penguin wrote:
On November 17 2012 17:53 MangoMountain wrote:
On November 17 2012 17:52 shabby wrote:
On November 17 2012 17:48 Astro-Penguin wrote:
That looks like 50% of my PvP losses....


You should stop fast expanding in PvP then.

Or remember to FF


Yeah its kind of amazing how blind sided people are, I don't mean to be elitist or anything but fast expand is the most solid build you can do in PvP. Missing a FF has nothing to do with how good a build is.


fast expanding most solid build my ass lol, its probably the least solid build and most greedy one at that..... you only fast expand if you scout a robo......


Fast expansions can defend every single build in the current meta game on maps where blink observer is weak, It is by no means greedy as you say. Word of advice, don't scout their base in PvP (Only scout for proxies) as the information you get from a probe scout is completely irrelevant. The extra influx of minerals you get allows you to just play blindly and in conjunction this allows you to efficiently defend both early aggression and latter tech oriented all ins.The advantage you get from fast expand basically gives you free wins/advantages vs both Phoenix/Robo macro plays.

The specific version of fast expand that Rain did is basically willing to sacrifice the nexus, the timings of his units allow him to defend any sort of gateway push that dosen't over commit on killing the nexus. In the scenario that he cannot hold the nexus he simply cancels it and has a huge advantage with quicker tech as the aggressor is committing a vast amount of his resources that only correlates into forcing a nexus cancel. (FF should prevent him from outright killing you)

Not sure what league you are in but in no scenario should you ever be able to reactively fast expand after scouting a Robo considering they should never let your probe see it to begin with.


i am masters in NA only, but it still counts, also, i am saying its only 100% safe to expand once you see the robo or the opponent's nexus, doesnt mean you would normally see it. Also, 4 gate will insta kill a fast expanding player, so does a pure blink allin, this is why pvp is so coinflippy, mostly because you cant scout


No you are completely wrong, if you cant scout 100% then don't even try to scout as its a huge risk. Again when facing a 4-Gate you simply either A) delay it with a 5 Stalker >Expo and proceed to crush it or B) sac your Nexus with the Zealot/Sentry > Expo and utilize your faster tech to your advantage. PvP is not luck based by any means, players choose to make it coinflip by doing rock paper scissors builds.


I have to agree with 1 gate expo is a good build but it can still randomly lose to some all ins and pnix gate allin.
Chicane
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7875 Posts
November 17 2012 09:20 GMT
#6508
On November 17 2012 18:19 Havik_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:18 Resilient wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:17 Corrosive wrote:
if idra wins: omg stephano threw for 20 pages in a row


this will probably happen



Looking at how the brackets have lined up, they'd both want to LOSE this series. Who'd you rather play? Rain or BK? CMON MAN! :p


Well here is the thing. Stephano should feel comfortable with beating HerO and BabyK as opposed to Rain. IdrA is bad against Protoss in general, so avoiding hero and at least making it further in the tournament is better for him. Since they are teammates, it seems best to take that path (though they are both trying to win the whole thing obviously).

There won't be any solid proof that anyone threw the game, but it honestly is a possibility. I hope people realize that... the brackets shouldn't have been presented before groups were finished.
ladyumbra
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Canada1699 Posts
November 17 2012 09:20 GMT
#6509
On November 17 2012 18:18 silent_owl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:17 ninjamyst wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


absolutely nothing but honor...


Do you guys not think there'll be consequences if they do that?


Only if it's as obvious as that series against bratok which i still haven;t forgiven either player for. To be fair I don't think they'd dare do that here especially given how many people would be suspicious of any accidental miss click or miss rally.
Lysanias
Profile Joined March 2011
Netherlands8351 Posts
November 17 2012 09:20 GMT
#6510
On November 17 2012 18:18 Chicane wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 silent_owl wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


EG would clearly suspend them.


Lol... how would they prove it? Stephano would just play worse and no one could say a thing other than speculate.

Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 Lysanias wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


Absolutly nothing, wich makes this bracket system flawed.


Yeah it's so stupid that they know who they will played. That is VERY FLAWED. Even if they do follow the same format, they shouldn't reveal it ahead of time! What were they thinking?!


they clearly were not thinking
FakeDeath
Profile Joined January 2011
Malaysia6060 Posts
November 17 2012 09:20 GMT
#6511
On November 17 2012 18:19 Enchanted wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.

Rain got out micro'd pretty hard in that second game. First game was him botching it but the second he just got out micro'd.


Rain never got out-microed.

He overextended after he pushed back Babyknight initial push.
Ended losing one immortal.
Cost him the game.
Play your best
Laryleprakon
Profile Joined May 2011
New Zealand9496 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6512
Huk didn't go for a gateway timing :O
StarVe
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany13591 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6513
Meanwhile on the other stream, HuK is on three bases in a PvZ without seeming unusually far behind. I think I'm dreaming.
Sabu113
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States11089 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6514
Jesus 12 minute greater spire -.-

Is that fast or standard now?
Biomine is a drunken chick who is on industrial strength amphetamines and would just grab your dick and jerk it as hard and violently as she could while screaming 'OMG FUCK ME', because she saw it in a Sasha Grey video ...-Wombat_Ni
Deckkie
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands1595 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6515
Commercials can be shocking.
Always look on the bright side of life
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18866 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6516
Whoa, Idra toeing that line between acceptable damage and the seed of doom ever so closely.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Zenic
Profile Joined October 2010
53 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6517
On November 17 2012 18:10 X3GoldDot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


was never bullshit in the first place, just 1 even showing for foreigners and people are calling foreigners equal to koreans, when theres more than 20 tournaments where mid code S -code A players beat top foreigners.

The thing is the top code S players also lose to mid code S - code A players or would you really consider the GSL Ro16 (now) the top code S players?

The mid code S/code A players you say are beating the foreigners are players who live outside from korea or at least know the foreigners pretty well. For the most part europeans have a unfamiliar style for the koreans and that's why they are doing that well.
silent_owl
Profile Joined March 2011
Philippines3098 Posts
November 17 2012 09:21 GMT
#6518
On November 17 2012 18:20 ladyumbra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:18 silent_owl wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:17 ninjamyst wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:15 Chicane wrote:
So what's stopping Stephano from losing to IdrA so that he can have a MUCH easier time of having to defeat HerO and then BabyK as opposed to Rain? All the while he would help his teammate get through when IdrA may not be able to beat HerO.


absolutely nothing but honor...


Do you guys not think there'll be consequences if they do that?


Only if it's as obvious as that series against bratok which i still haven;t forgiven either player for. To be fair I don't think they'd dare do that here especially given how many people would be suspicious of any accidental miss click or miss rally.


This.
"If you know your enemy and yourself, you need not fear the results of a hundred battles." - Sun Tzu
Havik_
Profile Joined November 2011
United States5585 Posts
November 17 2012 09:22 GMT
#6519
Did I hear Idra going for a timing attack?


LOLWTFBBQ?
"An opinion is only as good as the evidence that backs it up."- William O'Malley, S.J.
vthree
Profile Joined November 2011
Hong Kong8039 Posts
November 17 2012 09:22 GMT
#6520
On November 17 2012 18:16 FakeDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 17 2012 18:14 vthree wrote:
On November 17 2012 18:09 Havik_ wrote:
So will this end the "foreigners can't keep up with Koreans" bullshit?


I think we have known for a while now that when foreigners play their A game, they have a good shot at beating Koreans. However, outside of a couple players like Stephano and Nerchio, they just haven't been able to do it consistently.


Foreigners playing their A games?

From the upsets i have seen, it was more like Koreans botching their games more than foreigners winning.


Yes, but foreigners often throw even harder when the Koreans botch and give them a lead. The foreigners that won today have played well and won with the lead.
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