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On September 24 2013 00:30 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2013 00:21 Mocsta wrote:On September 23 2013 22:38 marvellosity wrote:On September 23 2013 22:35 raynpelikoneet wrote:On September 23 2013 22:34 marvellosity wrote:
It's funny, because I'd say the players who played in Desert should be the ones with decent townreads on me by now. Why exactly? Because my play is pretty dissimilar, the way I've asked questions and gone about things is quite different. People in Desert *just saw* my mafia play. Yeah.. dunno.. thats a very simplied thing to say. In reality, you were on a scum team filled with 2 lurkers and yourself. FACT: Thats demotivating.
I understand that the champions game would have a much bigger pull to produce effort, but the quality of your play there I think is quite clearly >>> the play in this game. I dont have a hard lean on you; so the above is just my musings. You have no idea how to judge my play, so don't try. Day 1 in that game I also contrived to lynch the cop and didn't do that much else. And I wasn't demotivated by my team in Desert in the slightest. Stop just saying things Moc, it's annoying.
Didn't read like that in the scumqt.
I mean, OK, you stopped some of the other guys from essentially "folding".. but by no means did it read like you were in ya proudest moment.
P.S. I have said twice in this game that I have a lean on you, but have not indulged which way it is.
Not curious?
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On September 24 2013 00:02 kushm4sta wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2013 23:24 marvellosity wrote:
I'll tell you the oddest thing about Mocsta from my perspective.
He came into the thread with his Chairman case, and was really convinced by it, and upheld it repeatedly.
Then Wave expressed some kinda doubts and Mocsta is like "oh yeah, hmm" and just unvotes like that. Seems like he was pushed off it really easily given how absolutely convinced he sounded about it. How can you possibly think mocsta is scum?? He talks way too much to be scum
Marv is right... high activity is not an indicator for me.
As town, even when I want to walk away.. i cant.. its just too tempting to come in and participate - even when I shouldnt (like now)
As scum, im more than happy to walk away once I done my objective to let it unfold.
As an aside, I was really disappointed to read what happened with DP.. sigh.
I always wanted to work with you bud !
I hope once you clear ya mind, you decide to come back in. I was enjoying giving the thread the aussie DP !
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On September 24 2013 00:41 Zaragon wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2013 00:32 Mocsta wrote:On September 23 2013 23:51 Zaragon wrote:
Feels like Rayn is going to be stuck as scum for me after this vote. I already didn't like his play, and now it has gone from slightly scum to solidly scum.
Tofu is likely scum. Town is in a bad situation if he isn't, because that means mafia votes are diffused and less meaningful. But I'll assume town is in a good position, and he is. That makes my Mocsta town read go back up to solid.
The rest of the scum crowd is then probably distributed between Sentinel, Cheesecake, LoneMeow, Kush, Stutters, Cephiro, VE (my gut right now says Sentinel, Cheesecake, VE)
For now I'm willing to believe Marv, Geript and Yamato77 made mistakes for this vote. But Geript is not a town read for me anymore, I haven't liked his play all game so the town feel to his motivations is starting to feel tenuous
Mocsta's switching off Chairman Ray easily is not suspect to me from my read on him, but it's personality based
Oh and I'm finally getting any kind of read on Koshi, and it's slightly town. Cephiro is one fucker I forgot about . Thnx. Lastly, I dont understand your comment on me regarding Chair. If its personality based, surely I can do it as town or scum, no? So is the lack of suspicion then founded on being a prior town read? Yes you are one of my more solid town reads from earlier. Yamato's suspicion changed that a little, but not from much I could see myself. I mentioned I have a read on your personality, earlier. I'm imagining how you would read Chairman Ray, and how you would switch off him. Given it was a good move and it fits my image of your personality to do so as town, I'm trusting my personality and town read on you. They're separate but are supporting each other so far
Problem with those type of reads is that they are not quantifiable to anyone else in the thread.
I completely get that a townie can use a gut read or personality read; but its also an easy avenue for scum to hide in.
Obviously it is up to me to make that distinction. I must say.. you are my biggest question mark this game.
Personally I think you are town based on my heuristics. However, I think the cases/observations have significant merit. Enough to question my read. At the same time, I have no clue what I can ask to establish a more meaningful read.
Lets give this a go and see if your thoughts resonate with mine.
Mattchew: GOGOGOG!
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Marv,
Help an aussie out here.
I know this is an easy thing to do as town or scum... but do you think a scum rayn - early game, would call me out for an unjustified vote on kush? - in such a direct/probing way?
On September 21 2013 11:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Mocsta explain your vote .
My expectation is that a scum rayne woulda tried to shit on me for it. Not necessarily with a vote, but perhaps some type of discredit.
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On September 24 2013 00:58 VisceraEyes wrote:
Mattchew is probably scum. His generic +1 of my yamato suspicion is really strange.
Yeah, but IIRC mattchew is going to be AFK for a prolonged period of time -> domestic flights or something.
I remember lynching a scum promethelax who was on a flight.. man he was pissed haha (btw, that was a scum day1 lynch Umasi)
In all seriousness.. is mattchew a strong enough read to setup a lynch without him mounting a defense?
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Man, this game is seriously fucked up.
Two situations.. Scum is heavily bussing D1... or.. my reads are completely wrong.
Yeah, all the smartarses will come out and say my reads are wrong.. watevz
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On September 24 2013 01:08 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2013 01:06 Mocsta wrote:
Man, this game is seriously fucked up.
Two situations.. Scum is heavily bussing D1... or.. my reads are completely wrong.
Yeah, all the smartarses will come out and say my reads are wrong.. watevz idk you think I'm scum? In that case then they're all wrong.
I do?
I just wanted a deeper explanation to the vote switch. You gave some context, but.. meh.. didnt satisfy me.
I really want to know why you swapped off DP in the first place. I dont believe that was addressed when I asked the first time.
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On September 24 2013 01:11 geript wrote:
What was the point in keeping it on DP? He wasn't getting lynched. It's like being able to have my cake and eat it too.
Nah.. im not buying that.
DP *clearly* was not getting lynched with at least 24hrs left on the clock.
You could argue, he wasnt getting lynched with 40hrs left on the clock.
Throughout the cycle, you kept de-lurking just to smite him with the "vig threat" and even promised to leave your vote on him the whole cycle.
Try again pl0x
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Geript, mav/me still waiting.
I really wonder where the Geript I nk'd night1 in his first TL game disappeared to. I miss that guy  R.I.P
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is there a clear tally?
im not 100% sure what time deadline mz used.
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On September 24 2013 01:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Mocsta and marv, while you are waiting for geript, what do you make out of this Zaragon dude?
His thought process is really weird. He calls out people who voted for CR already assuming FT is scum while he had a townread on FT on D1. It's really weird also because he himself dropped his vote on somewhere where it did have a zero effect to the lynch at all. I mean, looks to me like "at least i don't look bad, now these people look bad when FT flips scum". A lot of assumptions while not taking any responsibility from the lynch himself at all.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=423071¤tpage=112#2231
Points read good; IIRC he had a post where he named 4 town reads (including FT) and then said, its likely one is scum.
Hes wroth further probing for sure, I dont think he is a good vig shot though.
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On September 24 2013 01:41 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2013 01:26 Mocsta wrote:Geript, mav/me still waiting. I really wonder where the Geript I nk'd night1 in his first TL game disappeared to. I miss that guy R.I.P I'm as good as how much time I put in. Just is what it is. IDK like I really don't feel great about my reads as I was pre-aperature. That said, everyone else who played and voted for me in aperature and was town were idiotic. I'm just not feeling this game and I think a large majority of scum are inactive. I actually agree.
Damn CC for being right
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On September 24 2013 01:41 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On September 24 2013 01:26 Mocsta wrote:Geript, mav/me still waiting. I really wonder where the Geript I nk'd night1 in his first TL game disappeared to. I miss that guy R.I.P I'm as good as how much time I put in. Just is what it is.
Yeah ok, but do you get where im coming from with the dropping DP vote.
Its not adding up for me.. I want to believe you are a town; but i dont get how you can troll him all day, and then do a ?serious? vote - that came across as suspect as fuck when it matters.
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On September 24 2013 01:52 geript wrote:
Loo9k i'm 5 beers in righ tnow and I dobut I'll be much help righ tnow. I get it it. My day one was pretty week. I still don't feel good. I'm pretty sure he's alseep or at work right now which I find hilarious. I actually don't have any problem with people who have reasonable suspicions on fit. but it's the unreasonable stuipd shit agait me that really pisses me off. I mean... my scum games are completeliy different in how i vew the game. Whose "fit"
and regarding DP.. you were the one that called him scum and were unreasonable.. you really dont want me to think you are town do you?
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Hello, this is my end of night post. Bit early, but I am too tired and won't be around for deadline + first 1/4 of Day2 (if alive).
Im not that comfortable with this list, cos i only re-read the game up to p60 with full concentration; and then re-read to p73 tired as fuck. THe rest of the game is going off recollection -> but is the most pivotal part... so these reads will prob be meh.. apologies in advance.
1.DarthPunk
2.Rayn
3.Wave
5.Yamato77
6.kush
7.Koshi
8.ObviousOne
10.FirmTofu
11.Pandain
12.Cephiro
13.CC
15.Coag
16.Stutters
19.Sentinel
20.VE
21.Vayne
22.Geript
23.Risen
24.LoneMeow
25.Marv
26.Zaragon
27.MattChew
28.Umasi
29.JustAnotherTownie
9.Chair
4.Gumshoe Blazinghand
14.Xzavier Deconduo
17.Onegu
18.Zenatsu Malongo
Theres obviously something wrong with my list because I find 4 ppl firmly scummy, and 2 mildly scummy; and 3 to 4 ppl are yet to post.
Anyways, light comments on the polarizing reads
(1) Kushmaster
Im not sure why everyone thinks a town kush gives a shit about the game Day1. The games i played with a town kush.. he hates day1 and is content to throw in comments here and there, and start trying once the play count has dwindled. To me, he genuinely seems like he doesnt know who any scum team is; tahts enough for me to give hima town read. When Kush is wrong, he is town; and when Kush is right, he is scum.
(2) FirmTofu
In my opinion he is either a scum agent sent to fuck with the thread (a la Blazinghand role) OR retarded town.
Im inclined to think retarded town. Im not heavily experienced with firmtofu, but I know based on post-game discussions, that he believes he makes beneficial pro-town decisions -> even when the whole thread is against him. This kinda feels like that. I will admit his posting gives me a zen-like calmness too. Its slow and methodical, but in a good way. I kept the read at null cos the above is just all gut. I dont really have a hard stance on him based on filter specifics. I dont think he is a good vig shot as the chances of flipping town are higher than some other choices in my opinion.
(3) Coag
Im not familiar with him at all. But I have noticed that he has made an effort to keep up with the game, and when trolling, actually trolls on current matters, some that are obvious and some more subtle. To me, thats definitely a tick in his favour. I believe the scum version of Coag trolling is Risen.
(4) Sentinel
Right now, if i had to remove a scum read out fo the 4 bold red. Would prob be Sentinel. I dunno, its like he is too scummy to be scum.. fuck i hate that argument.
In regards to vig shots.
Please dont shot the 3-4 replacements. They need to be pressured heavily. They had a 24hr grace period to read the thread, so should be good to go (or at least close) by start of Day2.
Good shots in my opinion {Cephiro / Vayne / Geript} but do what you want in the end.
Cephiro -> Because he was (mildly) present, but I cant really recall a thing about him.
Vayne -> Its clear he wont stop trolling.
Geript -> Its unclear whether hes going to pull his thumb out of his ass.. THis is more a policy vig recommendation though, i dont endorse it on a good play basis.
Nite peepz.
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P.S. I left stutters off the vig list (even though null) as I think he can be pressured to ascertain alignment.
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##vote: pandain
Too little confusion post night flips.
That becomes apparent with yam medic save.
Assuming vig is 1shot..I think it's worthwhile if vig claims. Would be good to confirm whether vig shot vayne or bh. I think it's 95% likely vayne. Plus 1shot is now confirmed town anyways so nothing to lose.
I assume its coag after the exchange between him and VA last cycle.
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Zaragon. The tells on rayn is why he is town.
As scum he uses info advantage to run discredit campaigns.
He is genuinely inquisitive as you pointed out, and is picking and choosing his battles.
Hallmarks of town play, and precisely why rayn is town. He has continued that behaviour throughout the whole game.
You just dropped some points on my ranking , which is going under a total underhaul btw.
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On September 24 2013 21:04 rposelikoneet wrote:
Mocsta, talk to me about Pandain. What do you mean with the "not confused enough about NK's"?
Will provide more when I'm home.
Too hard on phone.
But in short. His post came about 3 to 4min after night post.
Thoughts are too coherent for new Info I think. Consider time to refresh , read post with lots of flavour, and think about outcome, plus type.
Pandain admitted to being a slow typed too.
I'm saying, his point of view is based on info town did not have.
Exacerbated when questioning why yam wasn't shot. For me personally, he wasn't a solid night1 kill. So yeah.
Dunno when I will be home. Plus coming from a port tasting night. So to be honest. I'm a touch hammered. On a side note. Vintage port IS incredible.
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I really wish Dp stayed. That snb post makes me want to put Dp back to null. It's like he knows there's a town read on his former slot and is abusing it.
Uuugggffhhhhhhh
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EPT
