On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
I mean sure, but it's kinda like saying Bisu vs Savior didn't revolutionize BW PvZ. Maybe not to the same extent, but you could make the same argument that people would have figured out what Bisu did even without him. But he was the one to do it, so he deserves credit, as does MarineKing.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
I mean sure, but it's kinda like saying Bisu vs Savior didn't revolutionize BW PvZ. Maybe not to the same extent, but you could make the same argument that people would have figured out what Bisu did even without him. But he was the one to do it, so he deserves credit, as does MarineKing.
The thing is. Bisu came up with that shit, which was a strat that completely revolutionized the way everybody thought about a MU, the when the game was years old and even progaming has been going on for years. Whereas MKP was just the guy who showed a technique that's so basic (from a tactical standpoint... don't get me wrong it's hard to execute, but it requires NO understanding of the matchup whatsoever), that I wonder to this day, how nobody had come up with it to that point.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
I mean sure, but it's kinda like saying Bisu vs Savior didn't revolutionize BW PvZ. Maybe not to the same extent, but you could make the same argument that people would have figured out what Bisu did even without him. But he was the one to do it, so he deserves credit, as does MarineKing.
The thing is. Bisu came up with that shit, which was a strat that completely revolutionized the way everybody thought about a MU, the when the game was years old and even progaming has been going on for years. Whereas MKP was just the guy who showed a technique that's so basic (from a tactical standpoint... don't get me wrong it's hard to execute, but it requires NO understanding of the matchup whatsoever), that I wonder to this day, how nobody had come up with it to that point.
It wasn't just the micro technique, it was the implementation of the micro technique that created an entirely new style of TvZ play that was far more centered on marine aggression, which lasted basically throughout most of WoL.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
If one goes back in time and tries to figure out what actually happened, chances are that it was MVP not MKP which "inventented" marine splitting. In the previous round before MKP faced Fruitdealer/Kyrix, his TvZ style was really weird (like he did some kind of nuke drop on LT) and showed little sign that he had any idea what he was doing (yet still won though).
However, then MVP played Zenio in a bo3, and MVP showed the efficiency of presplitting bio units vs banelings on Jungle Basin, and in the next round we saw MKP split marines as well vs Kyrix.
So my theory is that we actually have to credit MVP more than MKP with revoulutionzing the matchup.
On October 12 2013 00:56 robson1 wrote: although I never understood how anybody did not haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate Marineking as a player. He basically was the embodiment of everything that was wrong with terran in 2010-2011. He basically only won games by baceracing, 2 raxing, and stimming up ramps without vision. He also cockblocked jinro from becoming the one foreigner that made it to the GSL finals. How epic would that MVP vs. Jinro final have been?
so... uninformed
How am I uniformed. Explain it to me. I watched every season of GSL, and I'm very sure I saw every one of his important games in GSL ever.
Yeah don't gimme that Kyrix game. It's not like nobody would have figured that out marine splitting.
It's not like I'm saying he was the worst player in the GSL or anything.
I honestly think MKP vs Kyrix revolutionized TvZ for the rest of WoL. It might have been figured out but the impact he made with just one series just gave Terran a completely different mentality for TvZ.
I honestly think people are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overstating the impact one broadcasted series has on the state of the game. The meta game evolves on the ladder and in teamhouses. Not in a broadcasted game. It's not like MKP game up with that idea right in the game. He probably saw someone on the ladder doing it, or maybe he even came up with it himself, but it's pretty obvious that this would have become standard technique in 2 weeks even without an iconic game.
I mean sure, but it's kinda like saying Bisu vs Savior didn't revolutionize BW PvZ. Maybe not to the same extent, but you could make the same argument that people would have figured out what Bisu did even without him. But he was the one to do it, so he deserves credit, as does MarineKing.
The thing is. Bisu came up with that shit, which was a strat that completely revolutionized the way everybody thought about a MU, the when the game was years old and even progaming has been going on for years. Whereas MKP was just the guy who showed a technique that's so basic (from a tactical standpoint... don't get me wrong it's hard to execute, but it requires NO understanding of the matchup whatsoever), that I wonder to this day, how nobody had come up with it to that point.
It wasn't just the micro technique, it was the implementation of the micro technique that created an entirely new style of TvZ play that was far more centered on marine aggression, which lasted basically throughout most of WoL.
No need to argue about this... I disagree that it was much more than a well done micro trick. I'm not going to hate on him any further...
On October 12 2013 01:32 robson1 wrote: No you guys. MKP has no claim on being the Terran Bisu of WoL I'm sorry.
Why are you in this thread at all? You only came in here to hate on MKP. Please be kind and stay out of threads that involves people you don't enjoy watching and let the people that actually do like the person have a nice hate-free thread.
Why are the SC2 community such an awful place? Because of people like you.
This is honestly the first time I feel heartache for a pro to retire. I am not a super big fan of mkp, but I always know that I can expect some greedy builds and awesome games from him. I would tune in just to watch his games even if I am not supporting him.
His pure bio tvz against Stephano is one of my favourite game to watch and I am still using that build for my tvz.
Losing him gives me a complicated feeling. Watching sc2 suddenly doesn't feel quite the same anymore knowing that you just won't catch any more games of his.
Thing is, having him in the scene gave me hope that one day I can catch some of his games again, maybe streaming or some friendly games.
Now it's just all gone.
Luckily I also watch a little league and so at least I can ask around how he is doing over there. If he can find success and have more fun in league, I would be really happy. #thingsthatmkpdoes would one day be trending on Twitter!
On October 12 2013 01:32 robson1 wrote: No you guys. MKP has no claim on being the Terran Bisu of WoL I'm sorry.
Why are you in this thread at all? You only came in here to hate on MKP. Please be kind and stay out of threads that involves people you don't enjoy watching and let the people that actually do like the person have a nice hate-free thread.
Why are the SC2 community such an awful place? Because of people like you.
No, he is right. MarineKing didnt innovate anything or bring something new to the table. He just did everything better than most Terrans back then, which is sadly, a lot of allins.
EPT
