NOTE: This thread isn't for bashing one race (or player) or another, it is a simple analytical discussion about the absence of a protoss bonjwa.
1. How is bonjwa defined? To be able to hold a discussion we need to talk in the same terms, therefore, in this thread, bonjwa will be used for players that have shown, through their history excellent performance.
2. What qualifies as excellent performance? -Outstanding results (trophies etc.) compared to the other players at a certain period of time. -Prestigious Prizes such as a Golden Mouse -Winning 4 MSL or more.
3. Now, we have the criteria. So who are the current Bonjwas? -Boxer (T)-> outstanding play compared to his time, -NaDa (T) -> Outstanding play, golden mouse, -iloveoov (T) -> Outstanding play 2 OSL, 3 MSL -Savior (Z)-> Outstanding play, 1 OSL, 3 MSL -Jaedong (Z)-> golden mouse -JulyZerg (Z) -> golden mouse
So adding them up, we have 3 Zergs, 3 Terrans, and 0 Protoss. So why is that? Is it simply because protoss players have been less skilled? Is it a racial imbalance? Is it the maps? Discuss!
Most people don't really consider July or Jaedong as bonjwas: part nostalgia, part the best players being so much better today than they used to be. As for why there's no Protoss bonjwas: Small sample size.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think Jaedong is part of the current Bonjwa list, he hasn't had a complete period of domination yet, which is why he hasn't been classified as Bonjwa.
I'd say the main reason is that ZvP was easily the most unbalanced matchup until Bisu (and still is pretty unbalanced).
These days it's more of a triumvirate between Flash, Jaedong, and Bisu who take turns being the most dominant player for a few months at a time, so Bonjwas don't really exist.
Read the definition used for bonjwa in this thread. That's why I call him a bonjwa, he has won a golden mouse. I know the community as a whole wouldn't classifiy him and july as bonjwas but, since they won the very prestigious golden mouse I believe they should be classified as so.
bonjwas were recognized as the "heroic figure" for toppling the odds against them. SaviOr was known for his almost orchaestral dismantling of Terrans of the time. BoxeR set out against a predominantly Protoss world. Oov and NaDa were incredible power players that carried that Terran torch when they were considered weak.
Right now people argue over Flash, JaeDong, Stork and Bisu. There's no clear cut power between all of them; any one of them can peak out over the other.
Until theres severe racial dominance (we're seeing it in a lot of zerg play lately) and then a mega overturn in that balance, I doubt "bonjwa" will be recognized.
I like how most people just read the title and posted without reading the OP. I mean it's a dumb idea to make your own definition of bonjwa, but that's what he did and people are just ignoring it.
In the olden days Z>>>P so much it was ridiculous. Most of the skilled players have been around for quite a long time, so it could be a knock-on effect from the old era. I guess a lot would be inspired by the dominance of Z and T players, so there's simply less highly skilled P players about.
A very simplistic view would be that in the current state of the game and maps: Z>P and T>Z more than P>T.
Ptff, Bisu could have been Bonjwa if he didn't choke and get 3-0ed by Fantasy in that OSL.
That was pretty much end of the first and last hope of the emergence of a Protoss Bonjwa.
As far as I am concerned, a bonjwa is a player that has this aura of invincibility, much like Flash, and got enough titles, like at least 3 to 4, to back him up.
I don't know how the Koreans define bonjwa, and couldn't care less.
On February 10 2010 00:34 verzisor wrote: Read the definition used for bonjwa in this thread. That's why I call him a bonjwa, he has won a golden mouse. I know the community as a whole wouldn't classifiy him and july as bonjwas but, since they won the very prestigious golden mouse I believe they should be classified as so.
Neither of them are.
And there already is a protoss bonjwa and his name is Guemchi.
On February 10 2010 00:34 verzisor wrote: Read the definition used for bonjwa in this thread. That's why I call him a bonjwa, he has won a golden mouse. I know the community as a whole wouldn't classifiy him and july as bonjwas but, since they won the very prestigious golden mouse I believe they should be classified as so.
You can't redefine what it means to be bonjwa unless it has been agreed by the community. There is already a predetermined meaning for it, which is being dominant for an extended period of time while your race is seen as weak.
If you change the meaning of bonjwa based on what you think what it means, then this thread is too subjective and I can say that Bisu is a bonjwa.
Bisu is the closes thing to a protoss Bonjwa. 3 MSLs, almost a 4th and revolutionized PvZ which resulted in the era of protoss dominance (6 drgaons). Unfortunately he could never win an OSL. His period of dominance was also cut short.
While I've only been following the scene for a little less than a year, I'll try and throw in my two cents.
Obviously the Z>P balance and 'under development' of the strategies used in that matchup during the early periods of Brood War.
I also think that while the PvT matchup is pretty strong for Protoss, it is much more close in balance than any other non-mirror MU. While more technical builds were introduced in the later years of Brood War for this matchup, it was generally understood and played a lot like it is nowadays earlier than other matchups were. Also, allied mines was imba.
I think Terrans had an easier time than Protoss in general, because their matchup vs Zerg was much easier, especially easier than it is nowadays. This is also due to the 'under development' of strategies and skillsets that modern Zergs need, like mutalisk micro and three hatch orientated strategies.
All of these things made it much easier for Terrans to attain 'bonjwa' status. Not to mention, Boxer's fame brought oov to the proscene and inspired Nada.
Due to the evolutionary cycle of Starcraft, Protoss kind of got the shaft if one was to become a bonjwa. It took a long time to figure out how to play properly versus Zerg (and even now that they 'know', it's still difficult). In this day and age, Brood War is more figured out than ever before, and there are many 'S-Class players' such as Bisu, Stork, Flash, and Jaedong. With competition fierce between these players, it will be too hard for one of them to completely dominate the others. Not to mention, the 'top A' class players are fierce competitors in their own right, such as Effort, Movie, Calm, Fantasy, etc.
Man, I consider a bonjwa some one that has created an era with that certain race. Some one that has brought something new to the game and left everybody in awe. Some one that will always be remembered in the game as a figure that helped evolve the game. Titles don't mean shit because there are plenty of players that deserve titles but just didn't have luck on there side that day. With all that being said, I declare Nal_rA as a bonjwa.
On February 10 2010 00:34 verzisor wrote: Read the definition used for bonjwa in this thread. That's why I call him a bonjwa, he has won a golden mouse. I know the community as a whole wouldn't classifiy him and july as bonjwas but, since they won the very prestigious golden mouse I believe they should be classified as so.
You can't redefine what it means to be bonjwa unless it has been agreed by the community. There is already a predetermined meaning for it, which is being dominant for an extended period of time while your race is seen as weak.
If you change the meaning of bonjwa based on what you think what it means, then this thread is too subjective and I can say that Bisu is a bonjwa.
Now you are the one making shit up too.
A major problem with protoss is the race they are supposed to counter (terran) is the strongest race and their racial advantage goes so far as to basically only make the MU 50/50.
On February 10 2010 00:51 dukethegold wrote: Ptff, Bisu could have been Bonjwa if he didn't lose to freaking Mind in the MSL final.
obligatory "fix'd".
No but really. Why does this even matter? There have always been great and respected Protoss players around all the time. I would even argue that the love for great Protoss players has been more consistent than the respect given to any of the Bonjwas except for Nada.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.starcraft.com.cn/Files/BeyondPic/2006-12/22/20061221110223300.jpg)
