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On October 06 2011 15:19 David451 wrote:Strongly disagree with not including at least one Protoss, like TSL_JYP, especially after you made room for a cheesy Terran like Polt (sure he wins, but he doesn't seem to care about macro, he is like TheBest 2.0), a relatively unproven player like Ganzi (who barely beat MKP and team-killed Taeja via cheese), and even a relatively boring player like TOP (I like the guy but his micro is sloppy and he relies mostly on out-macroing his opponents). What I liked about the BW PowerRank is it took into account players that were revolutionizing their race and how they won their games, not just their win/loss record. The games I've seen from TSL_JYP, even where he has lost, have been *sublime*. His micro is crisp as hell, he innovates the hell out of Protoss, opening doors and timings we've never seen, and his multitasking is top-tier. I always look forward to a match with JYP at the controls. Protoss like JYP are why the race still has a future. Think about this more when doing your next PowerRank. Anyway, I enjoyed the writeup and look forward to the next one. Please don't take my criticism personally, I hope this becomes a regular feature. 
Well it's only very recently JYP has shown results, and honestly they're not as "wow" as people try to make JYP out to be. Sure, he's a potential revolutionary of the Protoss race, and has exciting play. But honestly, only his pvz stands out above the crowd, he recently fell in Code A, fell in IEM and wasn't able to make it through the last up/down round.
Put your fanboy aside, and you'll see he just doesn't have the results (or code S status) to get a look-in for a top ten power rank.
Maybe next time he will? But as far as recent results go, there are more impressive players. And even as far as strategy goes, there are other code A/B players you could be wary of once you stop searching harder than normal for smiley zealot leaders =/
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On October 07 2011 03:07 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 19:35 Tyrant0 wrote:
MVP gets way too much credit. He's arguably number 1, but he's much more mortal than made out to be. Especially when describing his run through champions, when most of the champions ironically can't make this power rank. If there were more tosses in Code S, it might be Bomber coming out ahead with his godlike TvP.
I don't see why Nestea isn't #1 other than by virtue of the fact he lost to MVP, when he's arguably even more monstrous in his other match-ups. How can you be number 1 when both people have 3 gsl titles and the head to head record is 1-8? If anything mvp doesnt get enough credit, sick of listening to tastosis ranting about nestea as if he's a God. Can't wait for mvp to extend his record vs nestea to 11-1 so people like you can shut up.
Because their head to head record doesn't mean everything? I guess players are rated by their ZvT/TvZ alone. If Nestea wins does that mean you shut up?
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On October 07 2011 07:17 Tyrant0 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 03:07 rysecake wrote:On October 06 2011 19:35 Tyrant0 wrote:
MVP gets way too much credit. He's arguably number 1, but he's much more mortal than made out to be. Especially when describing his run through champions, when most of the champions ironically can't make this power rank. If there were more tosses in Code S, it might be Bomber coming out ahead with his godlike TvP.
I don't see why Nestea isn't #1 other than by virtue of the fact he lost to MVP, when he's arguably even more monstrous in his other match-ups. How can you be number 1 when both people have 3 gsl titles and the head to head record is 1-8? If anything mvp doesnt get enough credit, sick of listening to tastosis ranting about nestea as if he's a God. Can't wait for mvp to extend his record vs nestea to 11-1 so people like you can shut up. Because their head to head record doesn't mean everything? I guess players are rated by their ZvT/TvZ alone. If Nestea wins does that mean you shut up?
So nestea has a really good zvz ratio. Woopdeedoo. There are at least 10x more good terran players than there are zerg players for nestea to compete with in zvz. No I won't shut up if nestea wins because he'll stretch his record at best to 8-4. Still a 2-1 ratio bro. Mvp shits all over him.
Mvp has a 71% win ratio, Nestea has a 70% win ratio boosted a whole lot from his zvz record. ZvZ is a joke in korea considering there's like no one for him to compete against whereas for mvp, there's at least 10 top tier terran for him to compete with.
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On October 07 2011 08:46 rysecake wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 07:17 Tyrant0 wrote:On October 07 2011 03:07 rysecake wrote:On October 06 2011 19:35 Tyrant0 wrote:
MVP gets way too much credit. He's arguably number 1, but he's much more mortal than made out to be. Especially when describing his run through champions, when most of the champions ironically can't make this power rank. If there were more tosses in Code S, it might be Bomber coming out ahead with his godlike TvP.
I don't see why Nestea isn't #1 other than by virtue of the fact he lost to MVP, when he's arguably even more monstrous in his other match-ups. How can you be number 1 when both people have 3 gsl titles and the head to head record is 1-8? If anything mvp doesnt get enough credit, sick of listening to tastosis ranting about nestea as if he's a God. Can't wait for mvp to extend his record vs nestea to 11-1 so people like you can shut up. Because their head to head record doesn't mean everything? I guess players are rated by their ZvT/TvZ alone. If Nestea wins does that mean you shut up? So nestea has a really good zvz ratio. Woopdeedoo. There are at least 10x more good terran players than there are zerg players for nestea to compete with in zvz. No I won't shut up if nestea wins because he'll stretch his record at best to 8-4. Still a 2-1 ratio bro. Mvp shits all over him. Mvp has a 71% win ratio, Nestea has a 70% win ratio boosted a whole lot from his zvz record. ZvZ is a joke in korea considering there's like no one for him to compete against whereas for mvp, there's at least 10 top tier terran for him to compete with.
Pretty much this. Saying MVP's 8-1 record vs the second best player in the world is meaningless is absurd. MVP's tvp though not his best matchup, is no where near being bad, as he has defeated the best tosses before. MVP currently has godly TVZ, TVT, and above average TVP. No other player is near that. MVP on his way to his latest GSL win destroyed every past GSL champion easily.
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On October 07 2011 06:15 bittman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 15:19 David451 wrote:Strongly disagree with not including at least one Protoss, like TSL_JYP, especially after you made room for a cheesy Terran like Polt (sure he wins, but he doesn't seem to care about macro, he is like TheBest 2.0), a relatively unproven player like Ganzi (who barely beat MKP and team-killed Taeja via cheese), and even a relatively boring player like TOP (I like the guy but his micro is sloppy and he relies mostly on out-macroing his opponents). What I liked about the BW PowerRank is it took into account players that were revolutionizing their race and how they won their games, not just their win/loss record. The games I've seen from TSL_JYP, even where he has lost, have been *sublime*. His micro is crisp as hell, he innovates the hell out of Protoss, opening doors and timings we've never seen, and his multitasking is top-tier. I always look forward to a match with JYP at the controls. Protoss like JYP are why the race still has a future. Think about this more when doing your next PowerRank. Anyway, I enjoyed the writeup and look forward to the next one. Please don't take my criticism personally, I hope this becomes a regular feature. Well it's only very recently JYP has shown results, and honestly they're not as "wow" as people try to make JYP out to be. Sure, he's a potential revolutionary of the Protoss race, and has exciting play. But honestly, only his pvz stands out above the crowd, he recently fell in Code A, fell in IEM and wasn't able to make it through the last up/down round. Put your fanboy aside, and you'll see he just doesn't have the results (or code S status) to get a look-in for a top ten power rank. Maybe next time he will? But as far as recent results go, there are more impressive players. And even as far as strategy goes, there are other code A/B players you could be wary of once you stop searching harder than normal for smiley zealot leaders =/
I knew it was a mistake to include a specific Protoss, because someone would fly in and be pedantic and completely miss the point (fanboy? jesus). Maybe it should be Puzzle instead of JYP, I've been really impressed with his play lately as well. But to argue that the best Protoss in the world isn't worthy of a PowerRank makes this PowerRank a lot less interesting, as it means the beautiful play in 3 of the 9 matchups is completely excluded.
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is it weird that i still have hope for protoss. Protoss, one day, shall win them all!!! If Killer wins code S (which is very unlikely) im gonna poop and pee my pants at the same time then go to Disney Land Naked. Enough said
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think of the best protoss in the world, and if he played anyone from the top 10, most likely how would it go?
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On October 07 2011 23:45 alexlw92 wrote:
think of the best protoss in the world, and if he played anyone from the top 10, most likely how would it go?
well ryung's at number 4 on the list and MC destroyed him at ipl, does that count?
go clide and go supernova.
mvp doesn't need any support hes already basically got it in the bag.
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it's so frustrating to be a protoss player nowadays. I couldn't bring myself to buy a gsl ticket this time around knowing that protosses had zero percent chance of winning the tournament. Not trying to qq but korean t and z are tearing up protoss players nowadays and I don't see a protoss who can compete consistently with top level players from other races.
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I don't really agree with some of what you said. I can however admit that MVP is an amazing Terran player and is (one) of the best in the world, but he lacks decision making in a big way compared to Nestea. Nestea is, and has been for a long time, the most intelligent SCII player in the world. I foresee a 2-0 win in favor of Nestea.
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On October 09 2011 12:40 OgsStump wrote:
it's so frustrating to be a protoss player nowadays. I couldn't bring myself to buy a gsl ticket this time around knowing that protosses had zero percent chance of winning the tournament. Not trying to qq but korean t and z are tearing up protoss players nowadays and I don't see a protoss who can compete consistently with top level players from other races.
Toss has nothing to complain about. Toss has some issues early game, but that can be rectified quite easily with proper scouting and a good simcity of your buildings. All I hear is people complaining constantly about this and that. I recently switched from Terran to Zerg due to a lack of fun in my Terran games.
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On October 11 2011 17:26 Link_Drako wrote:
I don't really agree with some of what you said. I can however admit that MVP is an amazing Terran player and is (one) of the best in the world, but he lacks decision making in a big way compared to Nestea. Nestea is, and has been for a long time, the most intelligent SCII player in the world. I foresee a 2-0 win in favor of Nestea.
Unfortunately intelligence is one aspect of the game. Mechanics is another, and when you're comparing a-team bw player to 30 year old man, it makes a difference. Looks like your foreshadow was incorrect.
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EPT
