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And not they arent scummy except xzavier and you, gotard just made a sheep vote on the person with the most recent votes on him... And I dont know what spicy is thinking as he hasnt said anything...
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On June 06 2013 23:15 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 22:40 Yavanna wrote:On June 06 2013 21:55 Onegu wrote:
Skanjab what is your biggest problem with spicydino is he has had good post on the lurker issue, I am getting a town vibe from him. The strongest read I have is on iVlosk as town t this point, but a wish he would curse less. xzav is also giving me a very strong town vibe. Umasi is my only scummy read as he fueled the iV rant even after it most likely should have been moved on from it. Also the whole brocuff thing. Also what are your guys thought on finding a serial killer? Could you explain this a little further to me? Make believe I have a mental handicap because I don't really see how Umasi's behavior was anti-town. I got more of a bruised ego vibe than anything. I'm open to discussion on it though. Can you add anything to your case that might sway me? In other news, I'm trying to discern atm about LoneMeow. He had some input on the lurker lynch issue but since he's just asked a couple questions without any real opinions of his own. Thoughts? Ok 2 things the first he kept the iV thing going on alot lomger than it needed to be. Secomd and the thing that made me feel the most was he would make a statement and when the majority had different ideals he would conform to them. This is what feels like he is scum.
Why make this statement, why say the whole sheep thing. Very mafia for people to sheep. Form your own opinions people dont sheep.## VOTE Umasi
Day one
Ok this is the first thimg he tells us emotion is scum the procedes to make more confuseing post and get more and more invested in his posts, but even after all of this for a long time and people call him on it he just drops it.Sorry im on a tab and cannot figure out how to quote multiple things I am going to do it in multiple posts.
Scum would benifit from a shitface and you just kept going on. And the blue thing you dont really answer it and I dont see the connection between being blue and being scum. How would someones responses peg them as blue I dont understand this point. And you say Im not going to straight up say you are blue punk but that is almost exactly what you did.
His first defense of firere even though he has said firere was a town feel in his earlier posts.
Why do you think gotard is still scummy? I would like to hear this please. I get the feel of newb town not scum and with fireres vote on him makes me feel even stronger in that opinion.
Why do you cortadict yourself here, you accept he isnt scum but the case against him was rock solid?
Night 1
A couple of things after this I feel more scum on umasi as they bring up good points. Xzav shouldnt be confirmed town at this point. You guys didnt have any thoughts on lonemeow? Could this be edited looks like that would takemsome time to do and I dont think it was at this point but want to ask the question anyway.
I dont see how this clears umasi, yavannas posts could just be looking at who were the most likely people to be lynch at the time. This was so early before votes came in it doesnt mean much imo. Looking at his votes he has voted one dead townie and most likely another in gotard. His posts get more and more scummy also. And his defense is Im going to play how I want not giving much defense at all.
Day 2
And so on I have made case after case on you not just fluff...
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On June 14 2013 06:14 Umasi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2013 21:11 Onegu wrote:On June 11 2013 05:07 Umasi wrote:
I haven't seen them, and have decided to ignore them.
Here's a defense, I guess?
I am going to get lynched this game. It is a fucking inevitability. I've played SUPER SCUMMY according to the thread, so at this point, I'm going to stop all semblance of trying to clear myself of suspicions. If that takes away from my points, so be it, but if I was trying to live, I wouldn't go and do some kind of fucking vote analysis like that, because that paints me in an incredibly unfavorable light (in case you haven't noticed).
Like, saying that out of the four people on Gotard, two were, even possibly THREE, were scum, and I'm one of them?
That's fucking suicidal.
The reason it doesn't clear me is you could wifom yourself into thinking that a scum would do some kind of crazy clever misdirection, but if he wants to continue thinking I'm scum and soft push me, feel the fuck free. After I die and flip town, you will happily look over to the votes and be like "huh does that have merit?"
So think LONG and HARD before you lynch me, then do it, because I'm scummy as shit!
At this point, I don't think I'm going to play by what town SHOULD play by and I'm going to play however I damn well please because otherwise I'll go fucking insane trying to not get lynched while simultaneously pointing out scum because I've played like scum the entire game.
yes. I am a little frustrated. just a teeeeensy bit annoyed, but it's mainly my own fault for playing scummy.
Not even rereading this post. Screw it. Other than his votes this post I have a problem with. Saying yeah I have played scummy all game but think long and hard on it. Playing scummy usally means you are scum in my book. Yeah, it was addressed at me ffer.Anyway, I'm thinking along these lines, I stated them a few pages back, but I'll restate it.If we discount the possibility of a bus day one, which I think we can, with how close the votes were, it means that Yavanna (because no vote, /afk), Me, Lonemeow, and Firere, and Xzav could be scum.Firere was scum! two left.I'm going to take the liberty of considering myself town (woaaaah /everyone flips a bitch)that leaves Yavanna, Lone, and Xzav as possible scummersI think that xzav is town! i have since pretty early on, early in D2 he shook my confidence, but has come back and made me happy. This would mean Lone and Yav are the scumteam. remaining scum team, anyway.If yav is still afk, what is lone going to do, single handedly redirect his entire wagon onto me?....well he could....but he hasn't even made the effort to, imo.or maybe he HAS made the effort, and is incredibly bad at it. He's not the one slamming the nail in the coffin, I am.I think the reason the thread has a low level of activity is the scum is pretty much boned! That's what I'm thinking.I'm pretty sure the cat/yavanna are the scum team. If lonemeow flips town, I'll be extremely surprised and confused, and then will do my best to move on and reevaluate. But Lonemeow NOT being scum means either two things: Xzav IS, or the scum team bussed super early on.in a 4 v 5 vote.I don't see this happening.It may also go partway to explaining why Yavanna was not immediately modkilled.Naturally, the entire theory hinges on two things! A, the lack of a bus, which I talked about, and B, both me and xzav being town.You guys have no fucking idea if either of us are town, but I'm pretty confident Xzav is, and you should probably think I am too, because I don't think people think I'm scum for a good reason anymore, just by virtue of me being a scummy He is doing the same thing firere did in sheeping xzavier but with a few more posts and more emotion. So by his logic xzavier is now scum, I dont see it I see scum sheeping vocal town. Either he is scum or he just skim reads/ ignores posts. Why would you join a game of mafia and do that? And the SK rant doesnt mean anyrhing it is incoherant and not point town or scum imo. Until he addresses my posts on him since day 1 until now and not just ignore me... VOTE: UMASI This is the only thing you've actually said about me, and this is day three, where you have promptly switched to focusing xzav. You have a total of four posts that are three lines or longer that aren't fluff, Onegu. I'm not seeing much effort to contribute, at ALL. Here, I'll address all four of your points after the second paragraph: 1. yeah, by that logic,xzav would be scum, which is why I voted him for a bit. I'm discarding that logic in favor of you and iV. 2. You don't even accuse me of being scum, you're just like "he's not reading" 3. calling my SK rant null is not a case, that's saying it's null. 4. I've asked you to tell me concisely what you want answered, compared to being like "it's somewhere" I don't even know why I'm talking about this. Onegu, go reread xzav, and find reasons to call him scum, CONVINCINGLY, that are not about the jailkeeper post. The reason his jailkeeper post is not relevant is because, if I remember correctly, HE WASN'T EVEN JAILED. I tried to do so, realized it was futile, and decided that in spite of the bus situation, I swapped off of him!
Ok his vote history, his interaction with yavanna and firere (which doesnt matter to much), his lurking and small activity after night 1.
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I really dont understand the case on me at this point as no one has made one just said gone with my feeling and had 3 people sheep...
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On June 14 2013 06:31 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 06:14 Umasi wrote:On June 12 2013 21:11 Onegu wrote:On June 11 2013 05:07 Umasi wrote:
I haven't seen them, and have decided to ignore them.
Here's a defense, I guess?
I am going to get lynched this game. It is a fucking inevitability. I've played SUPER SCUMMY according to the thread, so at this point, I'm going to stop all semblance of trying to clear myself of suspicions. If that takes away from my points, so be it, but if I was trying to live, I wouldn't go and do some kind of fucking vote analysis like that, because that paints me in an incredibly unfavorable light (in case you haven't noticed).
Like, saying that out of the four people on Gotard, two were, even possibly THREE, were scum, and I'm one of them?
That's fucking suicidal.
The reason it doesn't clear me is you could wifom yourself into thinking that a scum would do some kind of crazy clever misdirection, but if he wants to continue thinking I'm scum and soft push me, feel the fuck free. After I die and flip town, you will happily look over to the votes and be like "huh does that have merit?"
So think LONG and HARD before you lynch me, then do it, because I'm scummy as shit!
At this point, I don't think I'm going to play by what town SHOULD play by and I'm going to play however I damn well please because otherwise I'll go fucking insane trying to not get lynched while simultaneously pointing out scum because I've played like scum the entire game.
yes. I am a little frustrated. just a teeeeensy bit annoyed, but it's mainly my own fault for playing scummy.
Not even rereading this post. Screw it. Other than his votes this post I have a problem with. Saying yeah I have played scummy all game but think long and hard on it. Playing scummy usally means you are scum in my book. Yeah, it was addressed at me ffer.Anyway, I'm thinking along these lines, I stated them a few pages back, but I'll restate it.If we discount the possibility of a bus day one, which I think we can, with how close the votes were, it means that Yavanna (because no vote, /afk), Me, Lonemeow, and Firere, and Xzav could be scum.Firere was scum! two left.I'm going to take the liberty of considering myself town (woaaaah /everyone flips a bitch)that leaves Yavanna, Lone, and Xzav as possible scummersI think that xzav is town! i have since pretty early on, early in D2 he shook my confidence, but has come back and made me happy. This would mean Lone and Yav are the scumteam. remaining scum team, anyway.If yav is still afk, what is lone going to do, single handedly redirect his entire wagon onto me?....well he could....but he hasn't even made the effort to, imo.or maybe he HAS made the effort, and is incredibly bad at it. He's not the one slamming the nail in the coffin, I am.I think the reason the thread has a low level of activity is the scum is pretty much boned! That's what I'm thinking.I'm pretty sure the cat/yavanna are the scum team. If lonemeow flips town, I'll be extremely surprised and confused, and then will do my best to move on and reevaluate. But Lonemeow NOT being scum means either two things: Xzav IS, or the scum team bussed super early on.in a 4 v 5 vote.I don't see this happening.It may also go partway to explaining why Yavanna was not immediately modkilled.Naturally, the entire theory hinges on two things! A, the lack of a bus, which I talked about, and B, both me and xzav being town.You guys have no fucking idea if either of us are town, but I'm pretty confident Xzav is, and you should probably think I am too, because I don't think people think I'm scum for a good reason anymore, just by virtue of me being a scummy He is doing the same thing firere did in sheeping xzavier but with a few more posts and more emotion. So by his logic xzavier is now scum, I dont see it I see scum sheeping vocal town. Either he is scum or he just skim reads/ ignores posts. Why would you join a game of mafia and do that? And the SK rant doesnt mean anyrhing it is incoherant and not point town or scum imo. Until he addresses my posts on him since day 1 until now and not just ignore me... VOTE: UMASI This is the only thing you've actually said about me, and this is day three, where you have promptly switched to focusing xzav. You have a total of four posts that are three lines or longer that aren't fluff, Onegu. I'm not seeing much effort to contribute, at ALL. Here, I'll address all four of your points after the second paragraph: 1. yeah, by that logic,xzav would be scum, which is why I voted him for a bit. I'm discarding that logic in favor of you and iV. 2. You don't even accuse me of being scum, you're just like "he's not reading" 3. calling my SK rant null is not a case, that's saying it's null. 4. I've asked you to tell me concisely what you want answered, compared to being like "it's somewhere" I don't even know why I'm talking about this. Onegu, go reread xzav, and find reasons to call him scum, CONVINCINGLY, that are not about the jailkeeper post. The reason his jailkeeper post is not relevant is because, if I remember correctly, HE WASN'T EVEN JAILED. I tried to do so, realized it was futile, and decided that in spite of the bus situation, I swapped off of him! Ok his vote history, his interaction with yavanna and firere (which doesnt matter to much), his lurking and small activity after night 1.
It doesnt matter who was jailed, I posted this already getting a kill on the jailkeeper gives him the best opportunity to win as it makes almost sure there will always be a night kill... Also his sheep vote on me today with no reason is scummy also.
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Spicy can you please post a case not just say you feeling, and gotard can you read posts and not just sheep votes?
Ffer you have some thoughts?
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On June 14 2013 07:05 fferyllt wrote:
I am waiting for an answer to my question to iV.
Think he is working...
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On June 14 2013 07:08 Umasi wrote:
he hasn't been lurking, he has been around.
Pay some attention.
His interaction with yavanna, as ffer pointed out, can be attributed to just misplay/inexperience, and your vote history is as scummy as his, since by voting him you admit that I'm town.
Why are you ignoring all the stuff that says he's town?
Look at his post history and compare it to your own, who has had more positive of an effect upon town? I'll give you a hint, it's certainly not you.
You haven't had much of an effect upon town at all.
What are you talking about, his effect on town was to make a case on someone most likely town, vote a confirmed town. And by voteing him I have not in any way say you are town, if he flips town my vote will go right back on you. And he hasnt been active much after day one, and I have driven discussion on multiple things and asked many people questions to drive discussion. And how are my votes just as scummy? As I have already pointed out I could have saved firere and I didnt vote for a confirmed town...
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I have posted he just looks more scum now because of the jailkeeper post.
Ffery he (iVlosK) his most likely a cop, I know I shouldnt say it but I want you to see that is why he kept posts out of the masoner chat he was saying who he was going to check and why he was so miffed at being roadblocked, the more I have thought about it that is what I convinced myself...
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On June 14 2013 07:36 StiMaDDict wrote:
##Vote: StiMaDDict
After LoneMeow's mislynch (by me), I was both busy irl and afraid to take part in the game. It's all bit too much for me to follow.
Just want to pull out of the game at this point.
Hrmm... Very nice...
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On June 14 2013 07:39 Spicydinosaur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 07:02 Onegu wrote:
Spicy can you please post a case not just say you feeling, and gotard can you read posts and not just sheep votes?
I'll repost what I posted earlier Show nested quote +On June 12 2013 01:59 Spicydinosaur wrote:Here are some thoughts on Onegu. Onegu and Yavanna have this conversation early in the game On June 06 2013 23:15 Onegu wrote:On June 06 2013 22:40 Yavanna wrote:On June 06 2013 21:55 Onegu wrote:
Skanjab what is your biggest problem with spicydino is he has had good post on the lurker issue, I am getting a town vibe from him. The strongest read I have is on iVlosk as town t this point, but a wish he would curse less. xzav is also giving me a very strong town vibe. Umasi is my only scummy read as he fueled the iV rant even after it most likely should have been moved on from it. Also the whole brocuff thing. Also what are your guys thought on finding a serial killer? Could you explain this a little further to me? Make believe I have a mental handicap because I don't really see how Umasi's behavior was anti-town. I got more of a bruised ego vibe than anything. I'm open to discussion on it though. Can you add anything to your case that might sway me? In other news, I'm trying to discern atm about LoneMeow. He had some input on the lurker lynch issue but since he's just asked a couple questions without any real opinions of his own. Thoughts? Ok 2 things the first he kept the iV thing going on alot lomger than it needed to be. Secomd and the thing that made me feel the most was he would make a statement and when the majority had different ideals he would conform to them. This is what feels like he is scum. Yavanna seems to be wanting to get Onegu to explain his posts more in a very odd fashion. In this next quote, Onegu down plays my criticism of firere by saying its just noobish. On June 07 2013 21:54 Onegu wrote:On June 07 2013 21:39 Spicydinosaur wrote:On June 07 2013 14:28 Firere345 wrote:
sorry for it being over 24 hours since my last post. I went to sleep right after my last post and have spent all my free time catching up today(which wasn't much). Fortunately, tonight was my last night of having prior commitments, so I will be much more active.
To meow, who asked my opinion of Vlosk a few pages back, he's obv not my top scum read atm, but engaging shitfests isn't the towniest thing to do. As for my current reads, though, Xzav is the only one who would make me really surprize dto flip scum.
Umasi and Gotard don't have any defense against their accusations, so I find it hard to not be biased by thecurrent town consensus. Gut says both bad, Umasi town, Gotard maf, if only for lynching the one guy who we all should agree is mister town.
As for the jester question, the forum I used to play on was very inconsistent. The OP would only state basic roles, yet there would end up being bus drivers or phychics as flips, so I just wanted to make sure that Jest was not a role and that we wouldn't give up a day 1 loss to a jester. So scummy. Makes excuses for his absence, then promises more analysis that never came and simply sheeps other's opinion. Vote is staying on him. I would really like to hear from him also to see if he really was absent or just lurking. But lets be honest alot of people are sheeping, I think that is just noobish at this point. The thing I have been looking at is offering a thought on someone then sheeping once a majority is on someone else. This next quote is Onegu down playing fferyllt's criticism of Yavanna. On June 07 2013 22:16 Onegu wrote:On June 07 2013 21:44 fferyllt wrote:On June 07 2013 16:40 Onegu wrote:
Ebwop
Say who or what you are thinking dont just fish for ideas. The person I am thinking about is Yavannah. Her posts did get better after I pushed her a little yesterday. As I was driving home last night and thinking about the game I was trying to figure out what it is about her play that still bothers me. And I realized it was the contrast with some of the other players who said they are new to the game. She seems so sure of her town reads. I dont really have that feeling at this point. Has she said this is her first game? So far people have had some very strong reads and I dont think that makes you scummy. Why would scum want to say strong reads at this point when just sheeping is a better way of hideing. The last two quotes I think are far more important than the interaction with Yavanna as she was trying to be friendly with everyone. The subtle defense of two non confirmed scum has me questioning whether his vote for Umasi was just to put a vote on someone else so he wouldnt look suspicious on the wagon.
So you are going off day one interactions with people who barely posted, so after this you think I bussed firere and yavanna as I also made a case on her night one...
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On June 14 2013 07:42 Onegu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 07:39 Spicydinosaur wrote:On June 14 2013 07:02 Onegu wrote:
Spicy can you please post a case not just say you feeling, and gotard can you read posts and not just sheep votes?
I'll repost what I posted earlier On June 12 2013 01:59 Spicydinosaur wrote:Here are some thoughts on Onegu. Onegu and Yavanna have this conversation early in the game On June 06 2013 23:15 Onegu wrote:On June 06 2013 22:40 Yavanna wrote:On June 06 2013 21:55 Onegu wrote:
Skanjab what is your biggest problem with spicydino is he has had good post on the lurker issue, I am getting a town vibe from him. The strongest read I have is on iVlosk as town t this point, but a wish he would curse less. xzav is also giving me a very strong town vibe. Umasi is my only scummy read as he fueled the iV rant even after it most likely should have been moved on from it. Also the whole brocuff thing. Also what are your guys thought on finding a serial killer? Could you explain this a little further to me? Make believe I have a mental handicap because I don't really see how Umasi's behavior was anti-town. I got more of a bruised ego vibe than anything. I'm open to discussion on it though. Can you add anything to your case that might sway me? In other news, I'm trying to discern atm about LoneMeow. He had some input on the lurker lynch issue but since he's just asked a couple questions without any real opinions of his own. Thoughts? Ok 2 things the first he kept the iV thing going on alot lomger than it needed to be. Secomd and the thing that made me feel the most was he would make a statement and when the majority had different ideals he would conform to them. This is what feels like he is scum. Yavanna seems to be wanting to get Onegu to explain his posts more in a very odd fashion. In this next quote, Onegu down plays my criticism of firere by saying its just noobish. On June 07 2013 21:54 Onegu wrote:On June 07 2013 21:39 Spicydinosaur wrote:On June 07 2013 14:28 Firere345 wrote:
sorry for it being over 24 hours since my last post. I went to sleep right after my last post and have spent all my free time catching up today(which wasn't much). Fortunately, tonight was my last night of having prior commitments, so I will be much more active.
To meow, who asked my opinion of Vlosk a few pages back, he's obv not my top scum read atm, but engaging shitfests isn't the towniest thing to do. As for my current reads, though, Xzav is the only one who would make me really surprize dto flip scum.
Umasi and Gotard don't have any defense against their accusations, so I find it hard to not be biased by thecurrent town consensus. Gut says both bad, Umasi town, Gotard maf, if only for lynching the one guy who we all should agree is mister town.
As for the jester question, the forum I used to play on was very inconsistent. The OP would only state basic roles, yet there would end up being bus drivers or phychics as flips, so I just wanted to make sure that Jest was not a role and that we wouldn't give up a day 1 loss to a jester. So scummy. Makes excuses for his absence, then promises more analysis that never came and simply sheeps other's opinion. Vote is staying on him. I would really like to hear from him also to see if he really was absent or just lurking. But lets be honest alot of people are sheeping, I think that is just noobish at this point. The thing I have been looking at is offering a thought on someone then sheeping once a majority is on someone else. This next quote is Onegu down playing fferyllt's criticism of Yavanna. On June 07 2013 22:16 Onegu wrote:On June 07 2013 21:44 fferyllt wrote:On June 07 2013 16:40 Onegu wrote:
Ebwop
Say who or what you are thinking dont just fish for ideas. The person I am thinking about is Yavannah. Her posts did get better after I pushed her a little yesterday. As I was driving home last night and thinking about the game I was trying to figure out what it is about her play that still bothers me. And I realized it was the contrast with some of the other players who said they are new to the game. She seems so sure of her town reads. I dont really have that feeling at this point. Has she said this is her first game? So far people have had some very strong reads and I dont think that makes you scummy. Why would scum want to say strong reads at this point when just sheeping is a better way of hideing. The last two quotes I think are far more important than the interaction with Yavanna as she was trying to be friendly with everyone. The subtle defense of two non confirmed scum has me questioning whether his vote for Umasi was just to put a vote on someone else so he wouldnt look suspicious on the wagon. So you are going off day one interactions with people who barely posted, so after this you think I bussed firere and yavanna as I also made a case on her night one...
Also when xzavier had almost the exact same interactions
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On June 14 2013 07:49 Spicydinosaur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 07:42 Onegu wrote:
So you are going off day one interactions with people who barely posted, so after this you think I bussed firere and yavanna as I also made a case on her night one... u didnt buss firere, your vote was never on him. Yavanna was afk 1/2 way through D1. Scum would know she wasnt around anymore and it would make sense to make a case on her then in the event of a mod kill.
Except it is the same thing as a bus because if my vote goes on gotard he is saved, me not saveing him is the same thing as a bussing him. As in i threw him under the bus because I didnt save him...
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On June 14 2013 07:54 Spicydinosaur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 07:52 Onegu wrote:On June 14 2013 07:49 Spicydinosaur wrote:On June 14 2013 07:42 Onegu wrote:
So you are going off day one interactions with people who barely posted, so after this you think I bussed firere and yavanna as I also made a case on her night one... u didnt buss firere, your vote was never on him. Yavanna was afk 1/2 way through D1. Scum would know she wasnt around anymore and it would make sense to make a case on her then in the event of a mod kill. Except it is the same thing as a bus because if my vote goes on gotard he is saved, me not saveing him is the same thing as a bussing him. As in i threw him under the bus because I didnt save him... the vote was 5-4 in favor of lynching firere. if you switched it would have been 5-5 and firere would still die due to tie-breaker.
When I made my vote day one it was 4 to 1 on gotard I put my vote on him there he gets five votes first, when I make my last post it is 3-2 on firere if I put my vote on gotard then he gets 5 votes first as the 5th and last vote was on firere...
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On June 14 2013 08:03 Umasi wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2013 08:01 StiMaDDict wrote:
Just a side note, I debated whether it would be better to get mod killed by not voting but I decided that it would be disrespectful to other players. I know that the fact that I'm trying to pull out is also a disrespectful thing to do. I apologize sincerely. That's not even an excuse, there's no reason to not wait for the modkill if you wanted to be out of the game Also, why are you responding? You wanted to be lynched didn't you? Why are you defending yourself? You want to attract the lynch, if you want to be out of the game. You elected to vote yourself, so don't resist the lynch.
I guess he could be scum and just gave up after day 2 both his partners were dead...
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Alright since it might save me but still think xzavier is scum...
##UNVOTE
##VOTE STIMADDICT
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But it is plausible he is scum
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On June 14 2013 08:26 fferyllt wrote:
I hate this.
I really hate what is essentially a policy vote on day 3.
Yeah but what do you think? The case on me is terrible and almost non existant, vs someone who it is plausible he is scum, I think he isnt scum, but I think I have a better shot of finding scum later then he does...
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On June 14 2013 08:36 Umasi wrote:
ffer, why is he not scum. Why is the case against onegu better than the new case against stimm?
This, it isnt because the case against me is non existant...
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EPT
