##unvote
##vote Vivax
I feel better about this. I want s&b to have some more time. If he fucks off after the heat is off we can lynch him tomorrow.
Forum Index > TL Mafia |
s0Lstice
United States1832 Posts
August 15 2013 17:36 GMT
#3281
##unvote ##vote Vivax I feel better about this. I want s&b to have some more time. If he fucks off after the heat is off we can lynch him tomorrow. | ||
Acrofales
Spain17728 Posts
August 15 2013 17:37 GMT
#3282
On August 16 2013 02:13 Mocsta wrote: @ Acro.. Im not proclaiming to be an SnB expert. I hate the guys play, and he hates mine. But in all the town games i played with him; he has honed onto oats like a homing missile. Personality 2 rings a big bell. Anyways, my original read on SnB Show nested quote + I don’t get the early plan role thing. But whatevers. Hard guy to read cos of low give a crap factor. I think hes town personally. Cant really pinpoint why though. Overall; I just don’t feel hes been pushing anything… hence town. I already explained to someone else why i said pushing nothing to me was town. It was a personal heuristic, not an SnB one. Regardless, in Sicilian I the memories I have is that he was constantly pushing a mislynch even in death (e.g. the whole SK thing).. so perhaps his general scum meta is to be timid, but i was judging him off the scum snb i just played with 1 week ago. Im also not sure how much I buy the whole oats love story cos showing mindset in night 0.. I have to re-read that whole "redacted" shite, and double check how snb handled the oats/yamato lynch but thats tomorrow too tired gotta sleep. To me, Vivax is still a surer lynch. Ohhhhh... it was Personality 2 where he kept calling Oats scum. But he was town there, so not quite sure how this supports your earlier argument in any way, shape or form. | ||
s0Lstice
United States1832 Posts
August 15 2013 17:38 GMT
#3283
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
August 15 2013 17:38 GMT
#3284
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
August 15 2013 17:39 GMT
#3285
##vote: Vivax Final answer? Maybe... :/ | ||
Onegu
United States9695 Posts
August 15 2013 17:41 GMT
#3286
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Sharrant
Canada543 Posts
August 15 2013 17:47 GMT
#3287
##Vote: Vivax I don't think I need to go too in depth with this, as it seems the majority of lords have come to the same conclusion. He hasn't been loud like I used to expect from him. Nor does he show off the skills he recently has proven he has, in the last two town games we played together he immediately and undeniably showed his townieness in a way that few can. There's none of that here. I'm just retyping my case on Koshi right now and adding in the new developments about him now. I will post it shortly. | ||
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
August 15 2013 17:51 GMT
#3288
On August 16 2013 02:22 Mocsta wrote: SnB.. gimme a read on johnnywup pl0x k 1. he's posted way less than i have. does he have a meta that lets him get away with this? cause i'm pretty sure that i've had some of the lurkiest town games in recent tlmafia history but everyone still wants to kill me fore it. 2. 1.25 pages out of his 4 are trivia talk. excitement/activity disparity before getting his alignment? maybe not, cause being excited about trivia doesn't necessarily mean being excited about playing mafia. still, worth thinking about and means he only actually has 2.75 pages of real filter. 3. rest of page 2 of his filter is talking about setup stuff, specifically whether or not to reveal house names. quick glance at the context of this post reveals that the rayn/onegu and me/clarity things had already been well underway, but he doesn't comment on them at all. okay, he says he's reading the thread, maybe he will comment later? oh wait no. his next post is defending himself after he was attacked for talking about third party or something. As is the rest of page 3 of his filter. okay, i am focusing on defending myself as well, maybe he also was a leading lynch candidate and thought he should, as a townie, do his best not to get mislynched? oh wait no, he had zero votes, one person said he was scum. 4. for bonus points: On August 09 2013 06:48 johnnywup wrote: ok bookmark this post if you want + Show Spoiler [list of house members] + House Tyrell: Kushm4sta johnnywup Sharrant Acrofales House Greyjoy raynpelikoneet FirmTofu Nachomamma8 Risen House Stark strongandbig Clarity_nl Oatsmaster Vivax House Lannister iamperfection Xatalos Grackaroni Gumshoe House Baratheon Chromatically Koshi S0lstice Dandel Ion House Martell Oberyn jrkirby yamato77 Onegu note, this is on the third page (out of 4) of his filter, it's not starting the game out. he's doing this instead of reads, not before good reads can be made. 5. Oh then on page 4, he starts martyring? Sorry bro you don't get to martyr when you don't even have votes on you, and when you haven't made a single scumread. You get to martyr when you've spent two hours arguing with people attacking you while they ignore your cases and reads. 6. for more bonus points: On August 12 2013 18:13 johnnywup wrote: Oh yeah can I remind people to vote yamato77 and not yamato. There was a situation in NWM where an action didn't go on because the name was misspelt, and i don't want that to happen here. 7. okay now we have some reads finally, on the last page of his filter, for the first time all game: On August 13 2013 11:46 johnnywup wrote: i am indeed here and think that ace, jrkirby, yamato, kush, sharrant are scum. ace is being useless and town ace is never useless. jrkirby seems pretty obvious. yamato basically claimed scum. kush is either trolling as town or scum. on sharrant: he PMed acro that he was a cop during d1 it sounds like. makes no sense as town, obviously. but lets just say that town sharrant has a huge town read on acro...except for the fact that he lied who he was going to check in case acro was scum. you wouldn't do that if you had a town read on acro...so sharrant must have been thinking acro was null/scum. if sharrant thought acro was scum/null, why would he PM him at all? it makes no sense from town, like others have said. If sharrant was scum then he would know acro was town (or scum, I guess...). The problem here is he doesn't know acros role...but since they're agreeing on a target he doesn't have to worry about being blocked or anything, I guess. I dunno, it just seems to make a bit more sense as scum, but I really think it's just stupid from sharrants part as either town or scum >_> still think he's scum though. was an ez bus for sharrant to gain cred from, but somewhat scumslipped. acro doesn't think he's scum I think and he's the one who exchanged PMs with him, but from an outsiders POV it looks bad for sharrant @_@ I know I'm not saying anything new but this is the main reason why I think sharrant is scum. also for the record I haven't received any PMs from kush or sharrant since forever. I haven't been sending any to anyone besides acro. oh wait, we have ace (lurker) jkirby (lurker) yamato (redcheck) kush (lurker) sharrant (basically rewrites risen's case). yeah it would be nice if these were real reads that could make me think you are town. 8. later that page: On August 14 2013 17:42 johnnywup wrote: Sorry my Internets being really dumb. mocsta, i had a post that I was going to post about why I thought risen/Koshi is scum, but it boils down to this: Sharrant has a good case on Koshi, I'll let him post it himself. Risen is trying to lynch the guy that gave us scum for free. It seems unlikely to be a bus to me because Yamato wasn't even really in the limelight and no one would give their scum buddy away when they're not even being scrutinized (I think..I've never played as scum). Like, sharrant is the one person who actually gave us scum on a platter, and risen wants to lynch him. What? And if any of you want to point out me agreeing with risens case, yes I changed my mind because I actually thought about it more and I liked it less and less. I'm pretty convinced sharrant is town. Show nested quote + On August 14 2013 16:21 Mocsta wrote: Clarity Regarding onegu Here's a stupid thing.. take it as u want That house list before the night post. He was meant to pm that to me.. instead he posted in the thread. Anyways. He pms going sorry. I'm going to be modkilled what do I do. I suggested apologise to Dr.p and edit out. Anyways. If this guy was a scummer. I imagine first course of action is to go to qt... Not pm me. Weak heuristic I know. So take it as u want. Disagree that first action would be to go to qt. what would that accomplish at all? If anything the fact he wasn't mod killed makes me think he's more likely scum because mods would be less likely to modkill scum. I know that's not a case but it's something to maybe consider. lol. lynch risen for wanting to lynch sharrant. okay you totes didn't call for that the day before. 9. COUNTERPOINT: he says On August 10 2013 06:39 johnnywup wrote: ok im gonna reply to stuff directed at me as I'm going through the thread but literally lol rayn you can't be serious Show nested quote + On August 10 2013 01:25 raynpelikoneet wrote: johnnywup - There are two things why i think johnnywup is mafia. The first one is his overly defensive stance on his 3p thing. When being questioned about that in thread, his first comment is "other people did not find that scummy". That´s really going overboard if you are town, why would you be more interested to tell people that other people did not find you scummy rather than if they thought you were right or wrong and how did you end up in the conclusion? Another thing that stands out is johnnywup´s house member list. In itself list posts are bad, but this is worse. He hasn´t even put a single bit off thought into the lise (notice him not realizing in which house Vivax/Gumshoe are). Scummy as fuck. I'm defensive. Especially day 1. You should know that from NWM. Literally every single game I've played of mafia I've been accused of being mafia day 1. It's just what I'm used to at this point so of course I'm defensive. I care what people think about me because, well, I don't want to be lynched? That should be obvious. 2nd part is literally lol. It took a bit of effort trying to consolidate that. I had to look through almost everyones filter and try and find connections. When it was all done I couldn't find any connection for Gumshoe and Vivax. Go through everyones filter yourself and try and find what house they're in before the time that I posted that list. I literally couldn't find it. It was difficult putting together that list. And you say list posts are bad, yet people were literally asking for one because they wanted to know who's in what house at a glance. So I put one together. How do either of those things point towards me being mafia, at all? So I looked at nuclear winter, like he said. it's true that he was under attack day 1. However, there are a few differences: (1) people were actually voting him. this one is pretty important, there's a difference between being defensive when you're a realistic lynch candidate and being defensive when one or two people call you scum. (2) he didn't only defend. He also attacked - he made a case on waveofshadow and tried to get people to vote wos instead of him. he didn't just quibble with people attacking him. (3) He did other stuff too - he asked people questions that were relevant to scumhunting, and there was none of this filler/policy/rules posting he's been doing this game. he talked much more about game-related items. Seriously, read his nuclear winter filter and compare it to his play this game, there's a clear difference imo. And for more bonus points, well after the end of his "defensive" day 1 and after the pressure (which was super weak to begin with) is turned off, we get this: On August 11 2013 16:50 johnnywup wrote: im not very useful right now tbh. another reason I thought acro would be a good lord is because of lord PMs. Since a lot of people are thinking acro is scum I thought that being able to PM him directly would help people get stronger reads and be able to make stronger cases against him. lol TLDR Here's what I see in johnnywup's filter: 1. very bad filler to content ratio. he posts a lot without much evidence that he's trying to figure out peoples' alignments. 2. no reads until day 3! lol 3. spending an inordinate amount of time defending himself against very weak attacks. i know this might seem hypocritical but there are two differences: he wasn't at risk of dying to the lynch that he was defending against, whereas I very much am, and defending himself was all he had done in the game whereas I have at least made cases and pushed people. 4. clear difference between how he defends himself and how he interacts with the thread in this game and in his previous game, nuclear winter mafia. That game there were clear posts in the thread that you could point to and say "this is a read" or "this is a legitimate attempt to figure out someone's alignment." This game, not so much. So mocsta, thanks for getting me to read his filter. I think he's scum. | ||
Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 17:51 GMT
#3289
On August 16 2013 02:38 Risen wrote: I'd rather kill Vivax over SnB, folks. Too much willingness to kill SnB and he has literally had like 0 defenders the entire game. Lot of Vivax apologists, though. Might be a product of the game format. I think 5 of the 6 lords currently are likely town. That doesn't mean I think one of them specifically is scum but the votes are all town. The reason I've defended vivax a bit really is because his n1 pushing of yamato. At one point he told me he had convinced snb that yamato would be a good shot, and he wanted me to ask snb who he'd think was a good shot, to see if he'd mention yamato. When I did, snb said "I'm just going along with iamp's plan of shooting gumshoe" without giving his own opinion. When I pressed and said something like "so you're claiming no responsibility in the outcome? btw vivax told me you agreed on yamato" snb said "yeah, I do agree with the plan, can't change it now since it's night so am shooting gumshoe, but yamato wouldn't be a bad shot" Lots of paraphrasing to hopefully that made sense. I'm not saying it because I believe that makes snb scummy, I'm saying it because I believe it makes vivax more likely to be town. I have had a bunch of interactions with both players and I believe that they can't both be scum together. I think snb is scummier than vivax. I wanna kill snb. If snb keeps contributing like he has today (I liked the dandel post) I might be willing to yolo lynch dandel, though. | ||
s0Lstice
United States1832 Posts
August 15 2013 18:00 GMT
#3290
Going after yamato in PMs means what exactly. At the end of D1, yamato look pretty clearly bad. The scum team had to recognize this just like the rest of us did. How much credit do we assign Vivax for pushing to make yamato take...1 HP damage? This would be irrelevant just by itself, but even more so if yamato is looking like a lynch tomorrow anyway. | ||
s0Lstice
United States1832 Posts
August 15 2013 18:02 GMT
#3291
On August 16 2013 02:47 Sharrant wrote: Okay, guys, just want to make it clear where I stand. I've been discussing lynching Vivax for some time, and felt like I was chasing my tail as I went back and forth on lynching him, to lynching SnB, to both being town, to both scum, and back around the circle over and over. ##Vote: Vivax I don't think I need to go too in depth with this, as it seems the majority of lords have come to the same conclusion. He hasn't been loud like I used to expect from him. Nor does he show off the skills he recently has proven he has, in the last two town games we played together he immediately and undeniably showed his townieness in a way that few can. There's none of that here. I'm just retyping my case on Koshi right now and adding in the new developments about him now. I will post it shortly. I just want to say that aside from the cop claim you have been entirely unimpactful. I suck at analyzing blue claims, so its neither here nor there for me, so I'm left with the general sentiment that you are just existing. | ||
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
August 15 2013 18:02 GMT
#3292
On August 16 2013 02:51 Clarity_nl wrote: Show nested quote + On August 16 2013 02:38 Risen wrote: I'd rather kill Vivax over SnB, folks. Too much willingness to kill SnB and he has literally had like 0 defenders the entire game. Lot of Vivax apologists, though. Might be a product of the game format. I think 5 of the 6 lords currently are likely town. That doesn't mean I think one of them specifically is scum but the votes are all town. The reason I've defended vivax a bit really is because his n1 pushing of yamato. At one point he told me he had convinced snb that yamato would be a good shot, and he wanted me to ask snb who he'd think was a good shot, to see if he'd mention yamato. When I did, snb said "I'm just going along with iamp's plan of shooting gumshoe" without giving his own opinion. When I pressed and said something like "so you're claiming no responsibility in the outcome? btw vivax told me you agreed on yamato" snb said "yeah, I do agree with the plan, can't change it now since it's night so am shooting gumshoe, but yamato wouldn't be a bad shot" Lots of paraphrasing to hopefully that made sense. I'm not saying it because I believe that makes snb scummy, I'm saying it because I believe it makes vivax more likely to be town. I have had a bunch of interactions with both players and I believe that they can't both be scum together. I think snb is scummier than vivax. I wanna kill snb. If snb keeps contributing like he has today (I liked the dandel post) I might be willing to yolo lynch dandel, though. i'll quote my own pm that you're referring to about the NKs. I was gone when they were deciding on the plan so I just went along with it. (1) There is more to their plan than just shooting gumshoe (2) I'll take responsibility though, I read his filter before I shot him and I decided that he was a good target. (3) I still think Yamato is a decent be for scum btw. Also: I don't want to be lord tomorrow. I will run again to be lord d3 but I will not be active tomorrow and need to re-earn the obvitown-ness I showed n0 (4) Who else would you want to be lord? Commentary: (1) i didn't want to not follow the plan when I hadn't said anything about it before the night phase started. Fucking up something that town had decided could have confused the town, screwed with the intention of the plan, etc (2) Here I was referring to the part where we each have specific time slots to shoot during. The idea was to see who died after how many shots, and i thought people might be basing later decisions off of the assumption that i had gone along with the plan. (3) I stand by this part. I read his filter and decided, if we're using house KP for lurker shots then he was a very good target. (4) obviously i failed at re-earning town reads TT. One other thing: during n2 the only PM vivax sent me about Yamato was basically "what do you think of my case on koshi and oberyn's case on yamato." then in the same PM he asked me a few other questions about my reads on acro and onegu. But he didn't actually try to persuade me at all. IDK what he told you about that exchange but what actually persuaded me on yamato were the points other people made in the thread about how we had to drag reads and contribution out of him like pulling teeth, plus the fact that I thought his push on me was very bad and made me angry at him. | ||
strongandbig
United States4858 Posts
August 15 2013 18:03 GMT
#3293
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Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 18:03 GMT
#3294
On August 16 2013 03:00 s0Lstice wrote: Let's talk about that yamato vivax thing. Going after yamato in PMs means what exactly. At the end of D1, yamato look pretty clearly bad. The scum team had to recognize this just like the rest of us did. How much credit do we assign Vivax for pushing to make yamato take...1 HP damage? This would be irrelevant just by itself, but even more so if yamato is looking like a lynch tomorrow anyway. I was arguing back at vivax that yamato was null in my eyes. Hell, oats was trying to convince me yamato was town during n1! I was one of the few people that had no clear opinion on yamato, and vivax tried to convince me he's scum. Why? A yamato lynch was nowhere near a certainty d2 without the redcheck. Scum could have easily tried to direct the lynch elsewhere. The only reason a scum vivax would do that is if sharrant was scum too and vivax knew the redcheck was going to happen, and I don't buy that. It's not a perfect explanation, I'm not saying vivax is completely town because of it, but it makes him townier than snb, and as I've said they can't both be scum. | ||
Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 18:06 GMT
#3295
On August 16 2013 03:02 strongandbig wrote: One other thing: during n2 the only PM vivax sent me about Yamato was basically "what do you think of my case on koshi and oberyn's case on yamato." then in the same PM he asked me a few other questions about my reads on acro and onegu. But he didn't actually try to persuade me at all. IDK what he told you about that exchange but what actually persuaded me on yamato were the points other people made in the thread about how we had to drag reads and contribution out of him like pulling teeth, plus the fact that I thought his push on me was very bad and made me angry at him. Hmm.. I'm gonna go re-read some pms then. I wasn't trying to imply that you shouldn't have shot gumshoe btw, but the fact that when I asked you who you thought were good shots your answer was "we're shooting gumshoe because that was their plan" | ||
Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 18:09 GMT
#3296
Then he asks me to talk to snb without revealing I talked to him to see if snb mentions yamato. snb, you're saying One other thing: during n2 the only PM vivax sent me about Yamato was basically "what do you think of my case on koshi and oberyn's case on yamato." then in the same PM he asked me a few other questions about my reads on acro and onegu. But he didn't actually try to persuade me at all. IDK what he told you about that exchange but what actually persuaded me on yamato were the points other people made in the thread about how we had to drag reads and contribution out of him like pulling teeth, plus the fact that I thought his push on me was very bad and made me angry at him. This is all correct? Yamato are you around, can you explain this? | ||
Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 18:11 GMT
#3297
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
August 15 2013 18:11 GMT
#3298
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Clarity_nl
Netherlands6826 Posts
August 15 2013 18:11 GMT
#3299
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
August 15 2013 18:12 GMT
#3300
cause I'm obviously town, obviously. | ||
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