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On July 10 2013 04:41 Alakaslam wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On July 10 2013 04:30 austinmcc wrote:TO THOSE WHO ARE UNINVOLVED/HAVING TROUBLE KEEPING UP, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DO THE FOLLOWING:- Choose 3-5 pages of the thread.
- Read those pages
- Pick out the towniest or scummiest post on that page
- Specify WHY you think it's townier or scummier than all the rest
- Type that into a post and post it
- If possible, rinse and repeat (or get otherwise involved)
This thread is large. There are lots of posts. But assuming we don't blow goats, this game will come down to your ability to read people in the thread and the thread's ability to read you (you = anyone who isn't super duper involved). Active townies will get NKed. Active scum will hopefully slip up. Some other scum/town will become apparent because of voting/roles/whatever. But then we will hit lategame and will have a few people that town couldn't read well enough to really lynch, and scum didn't find threatening enough to NK. The more you can contribute to the thread, even in weird sideways ways, the better people can read you as we approach that point and the better lategame townies will be able to read lategame folks. Please don't want until endgame to get involved or try and read the thread. You simply won't be able to. Please find some odd way to get involved now. You are talking to lurkers or everyone? I can follow the thread from my phone. But yes it's a big one! Mainly lurkers, and we've also had a couple "Oh wow, this thread moves too quickly" posts. If the same clump of people are the only active/posting folks, then it makes for a much more difficult endgame than we should be planning for.
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Just based on his last few posts I'd be happy to kill VA.
Anyway I'm going to class, I won't be around for the day post and given my status as confirmed I expect to die so gl everyone. Lynch dandel, austin, vayne, and all those scummy scummy lurkers.
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On July 10 2013 04:42 strongandbig wrote:
Austin what do you think about vayne, if you're town I want to know your read and of you're scum I want to be able to do connection analysis
On July 07 2013 09:26 VayneAuthority wrote:
It's probably a bad idea to do the fake nukes as it narrows down for scum who actually has a nuke when your fake nuke doesn't work.
At least that's my opinion, which is probably wrong.
Like this post, and it's a good touchstone if he ever flips scum. If he's scum, it indicates that any scum with nukes have to set them off in thread.
On July 07 2013 09:48 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2013 09:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 07 2013 09:41 VayneAuthority wrote:On July 07 2013 09:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 07 2013 09:39 VayneAuthority wrote:
doesn't Z-boson just look like a name that's going to flip scum? Do you have anything to say about anything related to the game? what in particular? The chezinu nuke already is weird but we havent seen any flips yet. You were perfectly capable of giving analysis on D1 in Basterd mafia. I expect you a capable doing that here aswell. I'll take a raincheck on that then. I have commented on everything I found interesting so far so I guess I should close the thread now as I'm just spamming at this point.
Very playful start, but some of it, like this post, reads as OVERLY playful. Small scum points.
On July 08 2013 05:24 VayneAuthority wrote:
ON doesn't seem like scum to me, he seems like some one that's gonna die tonight. His play reeks of PR power. Bursting with opinions but hes trying to seem like he's useless or something. That or 3rd party.
Random chime-in when ... rayn asked someone else about ON. This is at a point early on where nobody was really actively discussing ON except rayn occasionally mentioning him. Sticks out as kind of out of place.
On July 08 2013 11:57 VayneAuthority wrote:
Ok interesting. So apparently chezinu is saying his role gives him like a hot potato nuke that keeps bouncing around that you have to send at some one else? That's a pretty interesting mechanic and I really doubt he is scum now after giving us some content. People should consolidate on Dandel or Onegu if they dont like my johnny lynch.
Don't like this post. Someone, I think FirmTofu actually, also pointed it out. Generic comment on chez's claim, which VA believes but misinterprets, and VA doubts Chez is scum because chez made some claim. Bad reason to change your mind on chez (He claimed to have to shoot it off D1, not within the first tiny window, and VA says nothing about chez's reasons for nuking, which are more important than just shooting). This is, imo, a really bad reason to find Chez townie, not thought through, and looks explicitly bad.
Slightly curiously, left his vote on JW for a looooooooong time. Never really followed up on JW, calls it his lynch in the above post, but really hasn't written anything about JW in forever and doesn't push him at all, despite saying things likeOn July 09 2013 03:41 VayneAuthority wrote:
After all, it's not in either of our interests to try to convince the other that they are scum; rather efforts should be made to convince others.
On July 09 2013 04:49 VayneAuthority wrote:your job is to convince others I am scum, why do you want me to respond 0o I read it and it's all fine and dandy but you just don't know my playstyle. It's fine. i.e. Town's job is to convince people of their scumreads and to hop on their lynches, yet VA never pushes JW as a lynch/scumread once the day gets rolling.
Verdict - dem posts be scummy.
Problem - He seems to want to/be fine with lynching DI, and one of the main features of FirmTofu's filters is him going after VA.
The first half of my problems are solved by DI apparently being bus-happy (was that a DI post from a QT or was that someone else who wanted him teammates to bus him and then he might also bus back?). My read on FirmTofu is just wonky based on those two posts I dislike, but I don't love that he is scummy on VA who is scummy on a dude who is scummy. However, that can all be solved out later, and relies on flips and links, but the straight of it is that VA's posts are scummy to me, especially his asking everyone else to make cases on him/push him/convince folks, yet him never doing that himself. The finding Chez townie thing is ... not as explicitly scummy, but I don't love it.
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If still around, snb, can you give thoughts on FirmTofu? + Show Spoiler +On July 10 2013 00:13 austinmcc wrote:I'm interested in Senor Tofu I find most of his posting townie. He tries to drum up support for a VA lynch, follows up on discussions with people, and I don't think I've ever seen scum use the phrase "banana-butthole." During the lynch though, his posts stuck out to me and I disliked them. This one still triggers my scumdar. Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 06:19 FirmTofu wrote:
I don't see how ON's roleclaim is at all alignment indicative. Scum could just as easily have the same role so if his claim changes your opinion of him, I find that very suspicious.
That being said, I am not entirely convinced that ON is scum. I wanted to have a wagon that was at least competitive to the Dandel Ion wagon so that we could get some discussion going.
I can no longer endorse the lynch on ON and I am going back to my best scumread on VA. I tried lynching suboptimally in my last game and it ended up flipping town. I'm not going to make that mistake again. Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 06:31 FirmTofu wrote:On July 09 2013 06:26 austinmcc wrote:
Who, in particular, do you find suspicious within the ON voters? I said "IF". I don't think anyone has switched their voted based on his claim yet, so I don't think anyone on the ON wagon is suspicious as of yet. I will look through it later, but for now, I would like to focus on why VA would be a better lynch than ON. Defenses or accusations based on things that haven't happened but MIGHT are things I find scummy. I associate them with knowledge of alignments, because if you're starting from a position of not knowing alignments, you have to try and figure them out by using what has actually happened. You can't consider what might or might not happen. But if you know alignments, you may just be looking for things to justify the reads you're predisposed to have, including using things that haven't happened. Show nested quote +On July 09 2013 06:38 FirmTofu wrote:On July 09 2013 06:33 austinmcc wrote:On July 09 2013 06:31 FirmTofu wrote:On July 09 2013 06:26 austinmcc wrote:I'm going to crack up and then be sad if I argue about Liquid City with Z-Boson and then this game becomes Liquid City 2.0. I agree that I normally wouldn't jump right to claiming, especially in a game where we've had a good number of other claims. It's not...damning, I think I've seen some people rush to that and I have a pretty godawful history with claiming. On July 09 2013 06:20 Nirvana.Gabo wrote:
ON claimed a PR, i don't see hwy that wouldn't change your view of his alignment 'splain please On July 09 2013 06:19 FirmTofu wrote:
I don't see how ON's roleclaim is at all alignment indicative. Scum could just as easily have the same role so if his claim changes your opinion of him, I find that very suspicious.
That being said, I am not entirely convinced that ON is scum. I wanted to have a wagon that was at least competitive to the Dandel Ion wagon so that we could get some discussion going.
I can no longer endorse the lynch on ON and I am going back to my best scumread on VA. I tried lynching suboptimally in my last game and it ended up flipping town. I'm not going to make that mistake again. Who, in particular, do you find suspicious within the ON voters? Can you give me a ... twitter length summary of why VA is scummy while I poke through filters? I said "IF". I don't think anyone has switched their voted based on his claim yet, so I don't think anyone on the ON wagon is suspicious as of yet. I will look through it later, but for now, I would like to focus on why VA would be a better lynch than ON. On July 09 2013 04:47 FirmTofu wrote:Can we look at Vayne please? He still has not responded to my accusations. Link 1Link 2 Why point out that you find something very suspicious if it hasn't happened? Also, can you walk me through how the switching based on the claim would make you suspicious? Assuming that ON is scum and we have scum on that wagon trying to bus him, scum could be using his roleclaim as a reason to back off. I wanted to anticipate this move and prevent it from happening. Assuming that ON is town and we have scum on the wagon, scum would be looking for a reason to get off the wagon so that they wouldn't be associated with it when the flip comes around. This could be used an excuse to do so. At this point, I don't think there are any scum on the ON lynch so my point happens to be a bit irrelevant. This post also gave me bad feels. Maybe I play scum differently, but I'm not running away from every mislynch, especially when there are like ... 11+ people on a lynch. You're going to get more scrutiny from moving around or moving around with bad reason than you will from just going "Oh case, I sheep, ON scum" and voting once (tell me if you disagree). Maybe it's the difference in thought here, but ... this whole "I don't think there are any scum on the ON lynch" bit is so odd. If you think 11ish townies are all wanting to lynch the same guy and there is NO scum on the lynch, that indicates to me that the dude is scum. The case was made my be, still voting ON, so here Tofu is saying he thinks a townie made a case on a dude, picked up a bunch of other townie votes, had no scum voters, all of which leads him to the conclusion that the lynch is ... on a townie? I don't get that at all. Rest of filter, townie. But filter around the time of the lynch gets really scummy to me, or, at the very least, I just don't understand what he was thinking. Anyone else draw anything from those posts, especially the second one?
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Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice.
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On July 10 2013 05:13 Dandel Ion wrote:
Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice. Working in the name of justice isn't actually all that busy. Also, "justice" is usually just "prison sucks and I'd like out."
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On July 10 2013 05:13 Dandel Ion wrote:
Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice.
Yah... I support any Nuke on Dandel. It'll either force him into the game or out of it.
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On July 10 2013 03:01 raynpelikoneet wrote:Okay, here we go: This is the situation:N1 just started. We mislynched OriginalName. Chezinu launched a nuke on Xatalos, Oatsmaster defended that nuke. A silent nuke was launched towards Meapak. WoS redirected the nuke to NG. Chezinu has claimed his nuke was harmless. Before that Johnnywup claimed that he thinks he has a similar role to Chezinu and had to nuke. He nuked TanGeng. Everybody hit by a nuke died and flipped town. We are 3 townies down. Bad. This means everyone in town is pretty clueless or mafia has the control of the game. These are my thoughts (mainly on the silent nuke - which we know was harmful); Meapak is probably town and the silent nuker is mafia. A townie has no reason to not announce he nuked someone in thread, even if the nuke is silent. If they do not announce it, they are withholding information from the town, information that mafia already has (as they did not launch the nuke in that case). So the silent nuker is mafia, there is no other explanation. WoS is probably town for redirecting the nuke to a scummy guy (NG). As the nuke is from mafia, there is one thing that concerns me. What if Meapak & WoS are both mafia and they made a powerplay with a nuke to "confirm" them. I want to know if that's the case. This is my plan:I claim that i nuked Meapak to throw mafia off their game. Seriously, think about it. You are mafia and some townie claims a nuke you have launched. Would it throw you off? You need to comment on the matter somehow, as by reading my filter there is an obvious lie, just that you know EXACTLY where the lie is (in "i nuked MZ"). Mafia gets confused. As from townies however, i expect four sorts of behaviour: 1) Straight out calling me the stupidest player ever. 2) Analyzing the situation from mafia/town perspective and reach into a conclusion (why would i claim i nuked MZ as either alignment, especially as mafia). 3) Point out the obvious contradiction in my posts and question me about it. 4) Can't understand anything that's going on with me, question me or go back to 1) Who did (1):Meapak and WoS. This is perfectly understandable because they were involved in this particular business from the beginning. I can understand their thought process, insta "wtf is this, this is the stupidest idiot ever". Who did (2):Oats. Oats realized there is no way i would have claimed that nuke as mafia. It makes no sense. As mafia i would not benefit about it at all. Who did (3):Alaskaslam. He did ask the right question when he looked at the situation. This is the correct post to dig up: + Show Spoiler +On July 09 2013 10:34 Alakaslam wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2013 19:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 08 2013 09:02 Ace wrote:On July 07 2013 19:50 raynpelikoneet wrote:On July 07 2013 18:31 geript wrote:
@rayn... was that you? No it was not me. I think town should claim all their nukes so that we can tell for sure if there is an unclaimed nuke that's from scum. I don't see any downside doing so. Either way if this nuke to MZ is from town, please claim it whoever shot it. If nobody claims it probably means MZ is town, i was wrong, and mafia is trying to frame me. Setup is closed and we don't know what role mechanics exist. Claiming nukes this early with little information is pointless. Also, if Scum know who holds nukes that may lead to them NKing Town with KP if they have nukes themselves. This is something i wanted to comment on earlier but forgot. Ace i think you are misunderstanding me; I was trying to say if you are town and launch a nuke you should claim it even if the nuke is silent. This way we know that every nuke not claimed in thread when launched is from mafia (that seems to be the case with the nuke on MZ). Then you didn't claim it until now. So Lying and foolishly so, but I haven't had to play scum ever so idunno, I bet it gets hard. Seeing as I suck this bad at town, I would probably be a day1 red flip come a scum game. But wow I have never seen such a resounding call, well done Mepak_Ziph, you deserve our ears. That's spot on. Why did i not follow my own advice in claiming nukes? Who did (4):Afaik noone. Now about people who are scum and why:What i was looking was behaviour that does not fall into any category i described before. Think about this from mafia pov. You don't know what i am up to. I have obviously fakeclaimed to shot a nuke. I am asking you questions. What am i after? I obviously have some sort of a plan, what do you need to answer? Another behaviour is to straight up say "lol you can't possibly have launched that nuke". Austin: Look at pages 71 -> where i claim. What does Austin do? Avoids the whole claiming thing!! He is happy to ask me about anything else and happy to answer questions about anything else but no, he does not talk aboutthe obvious contradiction in my behaviour. I even try to prod him into discussing it by saying "Are you even reading the thread?", but no, he won't. The obvious answer is that he is uncomfortable talking about something he knows more than he should and he knows i know more than what's been said in thread. I can't find any reason why you would not try to figure out why someone is lying as town. Look at Austin now. NOW he's ready to talk about my motives. rofl. Ace:What Ace does after PC. Calls me scum. Why? Because "i was instrumental in turning the DI lynch around." Yeah, me and only me. Not Austin (who made a case) or any other guy like geript/Xatalos etc etc. But me, who has earlier said "Dandel is town and ON is mafia". Makes sense right? Ace does not account my lie, at all. FUCK I DIRECTED THE POST EARLIER TO HIM. The post where i say "Everyone who is town and nukes should claim their nuke instantly". Ace is not bringing this up, but he is bringing up OTHER stuff why i am scum. If he was town that would be an obvious point to bring up, as i have lied. But as Ace is scum he does not know what i am after, therefore he stays silent and let's someone else bring that up so he can add that to my scumminess-list later. And how does he do that. By saying "Meapak caught rayn in a lie and now he is trying to cover it up". rofl. I already talked about how ridiculous that is in thread. If i was scum there would be no lie, as there is absolutely zero reason to claim the nuke as scum!! Ace usually thinks these things true from every perspective, questions the other person about their motives and makes a decision. What about here? A half-arsed case that does not hold water at any point. Take a look at Ace's filter and you can see how he is just trying to find reasons why i am scum and not trying to figure out if i am scum or not. Ace is mafia. Jampidampi:Jampidampi was the first one to bring up that i fakeclaimed the nuke. His thought process seemed fine until he said "rayn can't have launched that nuke because he nuked Xatalos earlier and that nuke did not fly." Silent nuke is silent nuke and probably launched via PM's, that has nothing to do with ##nuke: commands in thread. That's where his thought process falls apart. I think he is too informed about the situation and is trying to make good posts aboutthe situation. Maju:He asks me a random question about launching a nuke on MZ, then goes back to WoS. Definitely not interested in what happened there.
That are all people who stood out for me last night and this morning. If you want to look closer into this, look at people who did not want to talk about the claim at all, and why.
I agree - except about jampidampi.
1) It's not scummy to make a simple mistake like that (what would be the scum motive for that?)
2) His posts about your claim seemed to make sense otherwise
3) I looked through his filter earlier today and didn't find him scummy in any way, so I find him relatively townish for reasons outside of this incident
The one worrying thing about him is his excessive focus on your claim. It would indeed be an easy topic for scum to appear active and contributive (without actually scumhunting). Probably worth it to keep an eye on him, but definitely not to lynch him (at least at this point).
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On July 10 2013 05:13 Dandel Ion wrote:
Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice.
Get your lazy self together and start playing. The D1 voting behaviour won't keep you out of the fire forever (you might even be nuked at the start of D1 at this rate).
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I think someone quoted a post from Dandel Ion at a ScumQT thread... Something like this: "I have no motivation to play as scum. Just bus me. I will be lynched, it's inevitable." That's what your attitude is emanating right now.
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On July 10 2013 05:20 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 05:13 Dandel Ion wrote:
Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice. Get your lazy self together and start playing. The D1 voting behaviour won't keep you out of the fire forever (you might even be nuked at the start of D1 at this rate).
Justice is more important than winning.
I am a man of principle.
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On July 10 2013 05:22 Xatalos wrote:
I think someone quoted a post from Dandel Ion at a ScumQT thread... Something like this: "I have no motivation to play as scum. Just bus me. I will be lynched, it's inevitable." That's what your attitude is emanating right now.
yeah i might've said that (or something close to it anyways).
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On July 10 2013 05:19 Xatalos wrote:
I agree - except about jampidampi.
1) It's not scummy to make a simple mistake like that (what would be the scum motive for that?)
2) His posts about your claim seemed to make sense otherwise
3) I looked through his filter earlier today and didn't find him scummy in any way, so I find him relatively townish for reasons outside of this incident
The one worrying thing about him is his excessive focus on your claim. It would indeed be an easy topic for scum to appear active and contributive (without actually scumhunting). Probably worth it to keep an eye on him, but definitely not to lynch him (at least at this point). Can we chat about 3)?
I'm interested in your finding his filter townie and why dat be, or whether you have other "reasons outside of this incident." To me, his filter IS dominated by excessive focus on the claim, and so overall I don't love the filter.
Is there something in particular during the early posts that pops out to you as town? Or just his general posting on rayn.
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On July 10 2013 05:23 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 05:22 Xatalos wrote:
I think someone quoted a post from Dandel Ion at a ScumQT thread... Something like this: "I have no motivation to play as scum. Just bus me. I will be lynched, it's inevitable." That's what your attitude is emanating right now. yeah i might've said that (or something close to it anyways).
So you admit to being scum? Or?
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On July 10 2013 05:24 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 05:23 Dandel Ion wrote:On July 10 2013 05:22 Xatalos wrote:
I think someone quoted a post from Dandel Ion at a ScumQT thread... Something like this: "I have no motivation to play as scum. Just bus me. I will be lynched, it's inevitable." That's what your attitude is emanating right now. yeah i might've said that (or something close to it anyways). So you admit to being scum? Or?
No?
I'm saying that I have probably said "something like this" in the past.
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On July 10 2013 05:23 austinmcc wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 05:19 Xatalos wrote:
I agree - except about jampidampi.
1) It's not scummy to make a simple mistake like that (what would be the scum motive for that?)
2) His posts about your claim seemed to make sense otherwise
3) I looked through his filter earlier today and didn't find him scummy in any way, so I find him relatively townish for reasons outside of this incident
The one worrying thing about him is his excessive focus on your claim. It would indeed be an easy topic for scum to appear active and contributive (without actually scumhunting). Probably worth it to keep an eye on him, but definitely not to lynch him (at least at this point). Can we chat about 3)? I'm interested in your finding his filter townie and why dat be, or whether you have other "reasons outside of this incident." To me, his filter IS dominated by excessive focus on the claim, and so overall I don't love the filter. Is there something in particular during the early posts that pops out to you as town? Or just his general posting on rayn.
3 is referring to before this rayn incident. Maybe I should look at it again.
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On July 10 2013 05:13 Dandel Ion wrote:
Sorry guys I'm currently busy in the name of justice.
Sorry guys I'm eating dinner
Screenshot for proof
[img dinner [\img
Don't worry I post minimum no modkilled for now be bak be back
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Loving being a blatant hypocrite 
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On July 10 2013 05:24 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On July 10 2013 05:24 Xatalos wrote:On July 10 2013 05:23 Dandel Ion wrote:On July 10 2013 05:22 Xatalos wrote:
I think someone quoted a post from Dandel Ion at a ScumQT thread... Something like this: "I have no motivation to play as scum. Just bus me. I will be lynched, it's inevitable." That's what your attitude is emanating right now. yeah i might've said that (or something close to it anyways). So you admit to being scum? Or? No? I'm saying that I have probably said "something like this" in the past.
But you admitted that you feel (or at least felt before - what about these days?) unmotivated as scum.
Logical conclusion:
You feel unmotivated as scum. You are usually active and involved as town.
You've clearly felt unmotivated this game (the difference to PTP is crystal clear).
-> You are probably scum.
I think that's a reasonable deduction.
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EPT
