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On May 13 2013 20:49 ACrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2013 20:46 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:44 levelping wrote:On May 13 2013 20:34 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:31 Hattori_Hanzo wrote:On May 13 2013 20:28 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:12 Hattori_Hanzo wrote:On May 13 2013 20:06 FetTerBender wrote:On May 13 2013 20:02 lessQQmorePEWPEW wrote:
232 pages for a brat getting fired? I mean could we not see this coming for a while now? Seriously? Calling IdrA a brat considering you will never ever contribute merely a share of what he contributed to eSports since BW and what he achieved in tournaments throughout his long career? If you are not interested in the topic, maybe dont waste your precious time to read & post in it? Edit: Typo I'm sorry but past results ≠ present respect. Judging from this thread and my personal observation, He squandered whatever good will he had remaining with the "bunch of fucks" comment and ragequit with 3K/3K bank and 5 operating bases without even bothering to even attempt to deal with the sky Terran transition. So no, his contributions/achievements/goodwill account despite being so great and mighty once upon a time are now empty. So I guess we should stop respecting BoxeR or NaDa because as you said past results ≠ present respect. Hell Flash isn't God anymore, should we stop respecting him as well. Right? If they were spending it on "I hope you die of cancer" and "You all are a bunch of fucks" and ragequitting in a major tournament. A big loud, YES. You missed point. By a long shot. *Facepalm* And I like how you didn't even know of his clarification of his comments. The cancer one was an over-exaggeration of his feelings for the purpose of comedy and the "you're a bunch of fucks" was directed at butthurt haters like you. And this is exactly my point. You guys don't respect players for their skill, achievements, or results. You only care about their personality. This is why the community is pretty much dead to me. Hell, people disrespect NaNiwa 24/7 and he's probably the second greatest foreigner ever. Except idra doesn't have any relevant contemporary results... His past deeds only go so far. And anyway I don't get this division between results and personality in the first place. Ppeople respect boxer because of his great personality and results. Same for nada and many of the old generation. People still respect mvp because of his results and his never say die personality. I don't get your angst over results... Idra comes as a person. If he talks shit but has good results, people can look over that. But if he isn't getting results and still insists on insulting his own fan base... Overall that is really hard to like. Keep proving my point. Yet you'll stop respecting BoxeR and NaDa if they talked trash right. Real sports and e-sports fans don't give two shits about personality. We only care about good games. Why do you care so much about Idra then? His last good games are long past. Rejoice that EG has the opportunity now to invest into someone who can deliver good games. Every SC2 fan profits (except those interested in Idra's personality, which, according to you, you are not).
Because he was kicked out not for his performance but his personality. Is that so hard to understand? I knew he would get kicked out eventually due to his poor results but not for his etiquette.
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On May 14 2013 04:54 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:52 Plansix wrote:On May 14 2013 02:41 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
this whole "release" is contrived.
Geoff Robinson is hte captain of the team and is not informed of it?
He finds out during a talk show?
LOL
Geoff's "stunned reaction" was great. Give the man an Oscar.
The "release" happens just as "State of the Game" is airing.
Here is what really happened.
Idra got knocked out in the RO32 and realized the competition in the "Challenger League" would be stiff.
He had been thinking of retiring from competitive gaming for at least a year.
So EG, looking for as much publicity as possible cooked up this entire "episode". Idra took a few final shots, knowing full well what would happen.
Then Idra gets to make his big "i quit" announcement with the whole world tuning in.
All we need now is Bret Hart submitting to s SHawn Michael's Sharpshooter in the centre of the ring in Montreal to complete this story. My name is PlanSix and this is my favorite post on the Citadel...I mean Team Liquid. JimmyJRaynor never fails to impress with the level of non-sense he believes is going on. When the real answer could simply be that firing people is not fun and EG just went: “I don’t want to wait. Lets just get this over with and move on. We will tell the players afterwards, but lets get this over with.” or we could just point out that his time line of events isnt correct.
Attempting to correct JimmyJRaynor on facts is normally a fools errand. He has little use for them when laying out his theories of conspiracy.
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this is the first time in months i'm watching Idra's stream. maybe Jim Raynor is right.
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On May 14 2013 04:56 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:52 Plansix wrote:On May 14 2013 02:41 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
this whole "release" is contrived.
Geoff Robinson is hte captain of the team and is not informed of it?
He finds out during a talk show?
LOL
Geoff's "stunned reaction" was great. Give the man an Oscar.
The "release" happens just as "State of the Game" is airing.
Here is what really happened.
Idra got knocked out in the RO32 and realized the competition in the "Challenger League" would be stiff.
He had been thinking of retiring from competitive gaming for at least a year.
So EG, looking for as much publicity as possible cooked up this entire "episode". Idra took a few final shots, knowing full well what would happen.
Then Idra gets to make his big "i quit" announcement with the whole world tuning in.
All we need now is Bret Hart submitting to s SHawn Michael's Sharpshooter in the centre of the ring in Montreal to complete this story. My name is PlanSix and this is my favorite post on the Citadel...I mean Team Liquid. JimmyJRaynor never fails to impress with the level of non-sense he believes is going on. When the real answer could simply be that firing people is not fun and EG just went: “I don’t want to wait. Lets just get this over with and move on. We will tell the players afterwards, but lets get this over with.” EG finds guys like you easy to fool. Of course, this active debate only proves their methods are working well.
Jimmy, it has been established in your blog that you never fact check or research anything before saying it out loud, why would this be any different? Your chain of events is completely off, because Idra made his comments before the round of 32 and before he played. He can't time travel, so he didn't make the comments after losing.
If you are going to make wild claims like this, why don’t you take the effort to at least know in what order things took place? It would go a long way to being just slightly correct. I mean, its really not that hard, the post is date stamped.
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On May 14 2013 04:56 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:52 Plansix wrote:On May 14 2013 02:41 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
this whole "release" is contrived.
Geoff Robinson is hte captain of the team and is not informed of it?
He finds out during a talk show?
LOL
Geoff's "stunned reaction" was great. Give the man an Oscar.
The "release" happens just as "State of the Game" is airing.
Here is what really happened.
Idra got knocked out in the RO32 and realized the competition in the "Challenger League" would be stiff.
He had been thinking of retiring from competitive gaming for at least a year.
So EG, looking for as much publicity as possible cooked up this entire "episode". Idra took a few final shots, knowing full well what would happen.
Then Idra gets to make his big "i quit" announcement with the whole world tuning in.
All we need now is Bret Hart submitting to s SHawn Michael's Sharpshooter in the centre of the ring in Montreal to complete this story. My name is PlanSix and this is my favorite post on the Citadel...I mean Team Liquid. JimmyJRaynor never fails to impress with the level of non-sense he believes is going on. When the real answer could simply be that firing people is not fun and EG just went: “I don’t want to wait. Lets just get this over with and move on. We will tell the players afterwards, but lets get this over with.” EG finds guys like you easy to fool. Of course, this active debate only proves their methods are working well.
It's all a conspiracy really. Kinda like how 20-something year old black rappers somehow control the government #Illuminati. Big conspiracy, indeed. 
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On May 14 2013 04:28 Shady Sands wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:13 CeriseCherries wrote:On May 14 2013 04:02 Doodsmack wrote:
Haie guyz if we get more skinny white nerds typing insults into their keyboard we'll attract more viewers kakaka IdrA is pretty jacked for a "skinny white nerd", haven't you seen him? You pay attention to the physiques of eSports players?
You consciously ignore the physiques of eSports players? If you've seen them on stream or on stage, of course you see it?
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On May 14 2013 04:57 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:Show nested quote +On May 13 2013 20:49 ACrow wrote:On May 13 2013 20:46 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:44 levelping wrote:On May 13 2013 20:34 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:31 Hattori_Hanzo wrote:On May 13 2013 20:28 yeeshdontjudgeme wrote:On May 13 2013 20:12 Hattori_Hanzo wrote:On May 13 2013 20:06 FetTerBender wrote:On May 13 2013 20:02 lessQQmorePEWPEW wrote:
232 pages for a brat getting fired? I mean could we not see this coming for a while now? Seriously? Calling IdrA a brat considering you will never ever contribute merely a share of what he contributed to eSports since BW and what he achieved in tournaments throughout his long career? If you are not interested in the topic, maybe dont waste your precious time to read & post in it? Edit: Typo I'm sorry but past results ≠ present respect. Judging from this thread and my personal observation, He squandered whatever good will he had remaining with the "bunch of fucks" comment and ragequit with 3K/3K bank and 5 operating bases without even bothering to even attempt to deal with the sky Terran transition. So no, his contributions/achievements/goodwill account despite being so great and mighty once upon a time are now empty. So I guess we should stop respecting BoxeR or NaDa because as you said past results ≠ present respect. Hell Flash isn't God anymore, should we stop respecting him as well. Right? If they were spending it on "I hope you die of cancer" and "You all are a bunch of fucks" and ragequitting in a major tournament. A big loud, YES. You missed point. By a long shot. *Facepalm* And I like how you didn't even know of his clarification of his comments. The cancer one was an over-exaggeration of his feelings for the purpose of comedy and the "you're a bunch of fucks" was directed at butthurt haters like you. And this is exactly my point. You guys don't respect players for their skill, achievements, or results. You only care about their personality. This is why the community is pretty much dead to me. Hell, people disrespect NaNiwa 24/7 and he's probably the second greatest foreigner ever. Except idra doesn't have any relevant contemporary results... His past deeds only go so far. And anyway I don't get this division between results and personality in the first place. Ppeople respect boxer because of his great personality and results. Same for nada and many of the old generation. People still respect mvp because of his results and his never say die personality. I don't get your angst over results... Idra comes as a person. If he talks shit but has good results, people can look over that. But if he isn't getting results and still insists on insulting his own fan base... Overall that is really hard to like. Keep proving my point. Yet you'll stop respecting BoxeR and NaDa if they talked trash right. Real sports and e-sports fans don't give two shits about personality. We only care about good games. Why do you care so much about Idra then? His last good games are long past. Rejoice that EG has the opportunity now to invest into someone who can deliver good games. Every SC2 fan profits (except those interested in Idra's personality, which, according to you, you are not). Because he was kicked out not for his performance but his personality. Is that so hard to understand? I knew he would get kicked out eventually due to his poor results but not for his etiquette.
To be fair it was probably a combination of the two. If he was still winning tournaments, sponsors and management would probably be a bit more forgiving about this.
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Unexpected turn of events.
Can't imaging StarCraft e-sports without Idra. I wish him good luck and hope he stops his childish behaviour.
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On May 14 2013 05:07 KaiserJohan wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:28 Shady Sands wrote:On May 14 2013 04:13 CeriseCherries wrote:On May 14 2013 04:02 Doodsmack wrote:
Haie guyz if we get more skinny white nerds typing insults into their keyboard we'll attract more viewers kakaka IdrA is pretty jacked for a "skinny white nerd", haven't you seen him? You pay attention to the physiques of eSports players? You consciously ignore the physiques of eSports players? If you've seen them on stream or on stage, of course you see it?
Look, why don’t we all admit it, Demuslim and Grubby are handsome gents. Idra has worked out and is pretty jacked, but is tough to compete with those handsome lads.
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I think IdrA has gained thousands of viewers since before he had an average of 5000 per day and now 10000 +, funny. He looks more relaxed and liberated to me, who knows, maybe this was a good thing for him instead?
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I'm happy that Idra will be becoming a caster. He has no future as a player. I've been watching his stream since EG fired him, and his mindset hasn't really changed. He's calmer now that he doesn't feel pressure anymore, but he still gives up when he has a disadvantage and he still blames his losses on game balance, and his wins against P and T he chalks up to his opponents being morons.
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On May 14 2013 03:00 LOveRH wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 01:54 TychusFindlaylol wrote:On May 14 2013 01:48 LOveRH wrote:
No. No we don't need more CombatEX. IdrA pissed people off but at least he didn't cheat. There is a big difference between the two players. I wouldn't say they are the same thing..at all... I knew some people will think this. However, another big group of people will think otherwise. Also... "stream cheating" is not cheating according to Blizzard rules, so CombatEX never broke the rules. Besides, I think streamers can delay their gameplay to avoid this. Correct me if I am wrong. I heard he used map hacks as well as other things and he apologized for it later on. I consider any thing that gives a player an unfair advantage to be "cheating",... thought that was the definition of cheating but whatever. CombatEX is a dick, cheater and never can be placed in a rank as a 'Pro' player. IdrA can be a dick, never cheated and has won many tournaments and has a large reputation/following in the gaming community. Again... how do people compare a wannabe pro with a WELL KNOWN Pro?
CombatEX has NEVER used maphacks, nor was he ever accused of it. That is a widely held misconception. The worst he's done in SC2 is streamcheat, which he has apologized for last year and has been clean ever since. There's no denying that he has made some very poor choices in his past, but people grow up and move on. You don't have to like him, but the fact remains that strong personalities like CombatEX, IdrA, iNcontrol, and Destiny (to name a few) attract viewers and help grow the scene, albeit in different ways. I find it particularly disappointing that CombatEX's career as well as a necessary aspect eSports are stunted due to the feelings of a few moderators on TL.
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On May 14 2013 05:21 Empirimancer wrote:
I'm happy that Idra will be becoming a caster. He has no future as a player. I've been watching his stream since EG fired him, and his mindset hasn't really changed. He's calmer now that he doesn't feel pressure anymore, but he still gives up when he has a disadvantage and he still blames his losses on game balance, and his wins against P and T he chalks up to his opponents being morons.
Idra could be one of the best casters of all time IMHO. I was never a fan of his play (TBH i mostly like terrans) but i have heard him cast before and he is always right on the money with his analysis.
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On May 14 2013 05:20 DoSu wrote:
I think IdrA has gained thousands of viewers since before he had an average of 5000 per day and now 10000 +, funny. He looks more relaxed and liberated to me, who knows, maybe this was a good thing for him instead?
i think he says himself that it is a good thing for him and that he wanted to quit pro gaming anyways (being a caster with the EG banner instead).
I tend to agree he cant be a pro gamer due to his psychological issues so why not be a analytical caster instead. He impressed me everytime he did it.
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On May 14 2013 04:56 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:52 Plansix wrote:On May 14 2013 02:41 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
this whole "release" is contrived.
Geoff Robinson is hte captain of the team and is not informed of it?
He finds out during a talk show?
LOL
Geoff's "stunned reaction" was great. Give the man an Oscar.
The "release" happens just as "State of the Game" is airing.
Here is what really happened.
Idra got knocked out in the RO32 and realized the competition in the "Challenger League" would be stiff.
He had been thinking of retiring from competitive gaming for at least a year.
So EG, looking for as much publicity as possible cooked up this entire "episode". Idra took a few final shots, knowing full well what would happen.
Then Idra gets to make his big "i quit" announcement with the whole world tuning in.
All we need now is Bret Hart submitting to s SHawn Michael's Sharpshooter in the centre of the ring in Montreal to complete this story. My name is PlanSix and this is my favorite post on the Citadel...I mean Team Liquid. JimmyJRaynor never fails to impress with the level of non-sense he believes is going on. When the real answer could simply be that firing people is not fun and EG just went: “I don’t want to wait. Lets just get this over with and move on. We will tell the players afterwards, but lets get this over with.” EG finds guys like you easy to fool. Of course, this active debate only proves their methods are working well.
Or maybe, just maybe, management had been considering letting IdrA go since the Capoche incident. And after IdrA broke his empty promise not to troll people needlessly, they decided that was the last straw.
And maybe, they made the phone call but forgot that InControl was going to be on State of the Game, or JP changed the scheduled time of State of Game at the last minute, like he so often does.
HOLY SHIT it makes so much sense!!!!!
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On May 14 2013 04:13 CeriseCherries wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:02 Doodsmack wrote:
Haie guyz if we get more skinny white nerds typing insults into their keyboard we'll attract more viewers kakaka IdrA is pretty jacked for a "skinny white nerd", haven't you seen him?
The physique part wasn't exactly the crux of my point lol. Nerd rage does not create a storyline that attracts more people to esports. Sorry to burst your bubble.
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Northern Ireland23017 Posts
Comparing Idra to CombatEx is a bit of a stretch. That said the latter had a pretty baller run at WCG.
I haven't been here for ages, and TL mods aren't power-mad, so I wouldn't argue against their stance on Combat.
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Northern Ireland23017 Posts
On May 14 2013 05:36 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 04:13 CeriseCherries wrote:On May 14 2013 04:02 Doodsmack wrote:
Haie guyz if we get more skinny white nerds typing insults into their keyboard we'll attract more viewers kakaka IdrA is pretty jacked for a "skinny white nerd", haven't you seen him? The physique part wasn't exactly the crux of my point lol. Nerd rage does not create a storyline that attracts more people to esports. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Divergence of characters does. I love White-Ra and especially Grubby, but if everyone was that well-mannered perhaps that would be boring for some.
In a world where TV has long scraped the bottom of the barrel so thoroughly that it's boring a hole into the ground beneath, it's not much of a stretch to draw the conclusion that people enjoy watching poor behaviour.
Whether the growth of E-sports is limited not by the lack of 'bad boys', but an innate predjudice culturally against gaming is a more interesting avenue of discussion. Within the pre-existing fan base it's clear that a section of the community laps up such behaviour. Sadly or not, it does appear that some feed on negativity rather than positive efforts to move the scene forward.
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Well, EG has just lost their best player.
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On May 14 2013 02:43 Leporello wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2013 02:26 TychusFindlaylol wrote:On May 14 2013 02:16 Leporello wrote:
SC2 is not a sport.
This is why I don't like the term "e-sports". It's a game. Comparing it to WWE/professional wrestling? That's just wrong on several levels. Starcraft and videogames are entertainment. The purpose is to entertain people by either playing or watching others play. It's a game. Compare it to chess, we should compare it to chess, not professional wrestling. We don't need stupid drama and fake animosity from our "athletes" in order to make matches intriguing and entertaining. These aren't athletes, they're gamers. They're not tough, rather, they're smart. I think we need the drama, we need a story behind the match other than "let's win the tournament, GG." These people have stories and they have personalities too. Everybody had matches where they raged, so why is showing that so wrong if it is something we all experienced at some point? Also, do not say the rage and drama is fake cuz it is there. There is even drama among team mates. I mean, these people are working under pressure. You think they are playing, but this is their job. They must show results, or else. It's not just a game for them, so there is drama. Drama that can be used for the benefit of the community but it is not because there is this thing about "let's just be nice and say GG" thing nobody outside this community will enjoy. Muhammed Ali was clever. He'd rhyme and banter in a way that was obviously for pure showmanship -- which is much different than raging at some random stranger that IdrA is laddering against.
Don't compare IdrA to Muhammed Ali. Compare IdrA to Mike Tyson -- the man who wants to eat his competitor's babies and chomp on their ears. Dude, they all did a show, and their show sold to millions. Money talks kid. Look at this thread, and all the views on youtube about this incident. We all bought it. I didn't buy anything. This drama draws attention from within the community, not from outside. We might all talk about it, but it isn't drawing in people. Where do you guys get this idea? Because this thread is large and a YouTube video gets more hits than average -- that's your barometer for success in "e-sports"?
Yes, you bought it. Those ads you see on youtube, the stream and this forum is your way to buy IdrA's BM. You don't pay with money. You pay by looking at those ads, and those companies pay him.
IdrA's BM isn't captivating people to try watching professional video-gaming. It's made no difference. Yes, it's sparked a lot of conversation, but it's mostly an inter-community debate as to what "e-sports" needs to succeed.
This debate is bringing money and popularity to the community and making it succeed.
Let's be real here. If we're trying to make professional video-gaming a more legitimate and accepted form of entertainment, you think IdrA is the answer? Because he appears to me to simply affirm every negative stereotype a person can make about video-gaming.
Yes, he is. What will be of sports if it wasn't because of the drama and beef players have with each other? They wouldn't be what they are now. Those infractions and beef between players and teams built into a solid fanbase and more intense games.
IdrA wasn't BMing his closest rivals, due to his passion for good competition --- rather, he BM'd everybody, and that's a big difference. He recently quit his first match in the biggest SC2 tourney in history with 200/200 supply, and without saying "gg", to an opponent that warranted nothing but respect.
so? He didn't break the rules, and he doesn't need to respect everyone nor people he doesn't know.
IdrA's problem wasn't just his lack of respect towards other players and random ladder opponents. It was his lack of respect altogether -- he didn't even respect the game enough to give an honest performance in the most important match of his career.
He isn't Ali. He is Tyson. And Tyson did not help boxing. In fact, Tyson was probably the beginning of the end for boxing. The sport has been in decline ever since his tenure. People saw him slurring words and acting like an angry lunatic, and the sport really lost a lot of its glamour, due entirely to one man's poor behavior.
What's so wrong about not respecting the opponent? He is on his own right if he doesn't want to respect every other player. He can be douche and still more popular, more famous and richer than someone who says GG all the time and has a few of viewers on his stream. At least, we know who idrA is. I don't even know neither I think most people know who the other guy name was or how he looks like lol. IdrA may have lost the match, but he is by far more successful and known than the other dude... who I still don't even know his name lol
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EPT
