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Shopify TSL 5 - The Bracket - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
96 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next All
JJH777
Profile Joined January 2011
United States4413 Posts
May 12 2020 02:23 GMT
#41
It is not true that there is no advantage for the winner bracket player. They have to play 1-2 less series to get there. That is enough of an advantage by itself. Especially for Protoss/Terran who rely on prepared builds. Anything more is just dumb and makes the final feel lost already.

Also the point someone made above about the winner finalist not losing any matches and then losing the finals isn't very valid either. For this event that could theoretically happen but most events have group stages and in several SC2 events the winners bracket finalist had lost group stage match(es) while his opponent didn't so it happened that they finished with the same or outright worse series score but still won the event because of winners bracket advantage. How is that fair? Winners bracket advantage is never fair in StarCraft.
Danka
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
Peru1018 Posts
May 12 2020 03:00 GMT
#42
On May 12 2020 11:23 JJH777 wrote:
It is not true that there is no advantage for the winner bracket player. They have to play 1-2 less series to get there. That is enough of an advantage by itself. Especially for Protoss/Terran who rely on prepared builds. Anything more is just dumb and makes the final feel lost already.

Also the point someone made above about the winner finalist not losing any matches and then losing the finals isn't very valid either. For this event that could theoretically happen but most events have group stages and in several SC2 events the winners bracket finalist had lost group stage match(es) while his opponent didn't so it happened that they finished with the same or outright worse series score but still won the event because of winners bracket advantage. How is that fair? Winners bracket advantage is never fair in StarCraft.


This is the same thing I was thinking.
The finals are the finals. The final showdown. You can squibble about who got scratched more to get there but what's important is who wins the final showdown. In other sports, teams will all have varying stats before the 2 best reach the final game, but then, its about what happens on that day.

And so many BO5s is going to be lots of amazing SC2!. Pumped!
<3
Its not the size of the dog in the fight, its the size of the fight in the dog. - Mark Twain
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
May 12 2020 03:02 GMT
#43
On May 12 2020 11:23 JJH777 wrote:
It is not true that there is no advantage for the winner bracket player. They have to play 1-2 less series to get there. That is enough of an advantage by itself. Especially for Protoss/Terran who rely on prepared builds. Anything more is just dumb and makes the final feel lost already.

Also the point someone made above about the winner finalist not losing any matches and then losing the finals isn't very valid either. For this event that could theoretically happen but most events have group stages and in several SC2 events the winners bracket finalist had lost group stage match(es) while his opponent didn't so it happened that they finished with the same or outright worse series score but still won the event because of winners bracket advantage. How is that fair? Winners bracket advantage is never fair in StarCraft.


The entire point of a double elimination bracket is that everyone has to lose twice. The earlier you lose for the first time, the more games you have to play by its very nature. Giving a second chance to everyone except for one player is manifestly unfair towards them. And the argument that "anything more is just dumb and makes the final feel lost already" isn't arguing that it's fair, but rather than this unfairness is acceptable for the sake of entertainment, which is entirely different.
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10675 Posts
May 12 2020 03:21 GMT
#44
Oddly enough it looks like Serral is going to not hit any Koreans until Round 4 potentially, Serral finals anyone?

Vanya, best of luck to you man!

All of the match ups look very exciting.
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
HeroSandro
Profile Joined July 2019
531 Posts
May 12 2020 03:58 GMT
#45
On May 12 2020 12:21 GGzerG wrote:
Oddly enough it looks like Serral is going to not hit any Koreans until Round 4 potentially, Serral finals anyone?

Vanya, best of luck to you man!

All of the match ups look very exciting.

He will most likely play against Reynor, so it going to be tough.
Rob-Zero
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany459 Posts
May 12 2020 04:57 GMT
#46
Poor Heromarine, very likely facing Reynor first and even if he wins that, most likely Serral next. Feels like WCS all over again for him probably XD But at least he got a losers bracket to maybe show some games against competition he does not face so often (koreans).

I´m hyped for this event, as I was for every TSL, can´t wait for it to start already, or better, get some good reads beforehand by the TL.net staff ?!
Dark Age of Camelot - I miss you
Schelim
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Austria11528 Posts
May 12 2020 05:55 GMT
#47
i have to say i don't like anything at all about this format. but i'm looking forward to the tournament and Sean anyways.

will VODs be available? i'm turning 30 this weekend, so i'll be busy Corona-mode-celebrating.
TY <3 Cure <3 Inno <3 Special <3
Geo.Rion
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
7377 Posts
May 12 2020 06:06 GMT
#48
TL could have done a better job rigging the bracket, I mean, look at it, certain players can get into the winners finals by playing only mirror matchups, smh. (Parting, Mana, Showtime, Serral, Sepcial, Time, Cure)
Cool that we have double elim tho, but so many mirror matchups coming up, at least in the upper bracket.
"Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011
yht9657
Profile Joined December 2016
1810 Posts
May 12 2020 06:23 GMT
#49
Zest vs Inno final incoming, mark my words.
dbRic1203
Profile Joined July 2019
Germany2655 Posts
May 12 2020 06:37 GMT
#50
On May 12 2020 15:06 Geo.Rion wrote:
TL could have done a better job rigging the bracket, I mean, look at it, certain players can get into the winners finals by playing only mirror matchups, smh. (Parting, Mana, Showtime, Serral, Sepcial, Time, Cure)
Cool that we have double elim tho, but so many mirror matchups coming up, at least in the upper bracket.

Well obviously non-mirror matches would have been nicer, but as this gives EPT Points, there should be some propper seeding mechanism in place, to make it fair. So nothing realy to do about the mirrors.
MaxPax
Azhrak
Profile Joined January 2011
Finland1196 Posts
May 12 2020 07:27 GMT
#51
What are the broadcasting days? The first day is May 16, but then what?
starcraft2.fi
StarcraftPeffo
Profile Joined May 2019
Italy66 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-05-12 08:04:43
May 12 2020 08:02 GMT
#52
All best of 5 makes me happy, thank you guys :D

Day 9 comes in sunday, right?
Not that i've anything against ZG Wardii e Rotti, just hyped for the comeback
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany6956 Posts
May 12 2020 08:11 GMT
#53
Woah lot of negative feedback here

I'm very happy that we get some high quality Starcraft!

That said, I'd love it to be more group stagey. Groups of 4 (GSL style) or at least Groups of 6 (round robin) . GSL style has incredible hype potential (like the recent group A) while still beeing incredible fair to all players
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
Silvanel
Profile Blog Joined March 2003
Poland4731 Posts
May 12 2020 08:57 GMT
#54
Some viewers (like me for example) are more intrested in fairness than entertainment or to be more specific when i see that rules are not fair to one of the playeres the competition is losing its entertainment value in my eyes. Where is the fun in watching football game when one team starts with 9 palyers and other with eleven? Same with unfair DE.
Pathetic Greta hater.
stilt
Profile Joined October 2012
France2750 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-05-12 08:59:01
May 12 2020 08:57 GMT
#55
This format is such a hype killer.
And even worst, it's the reason why we got some stupid situations where losing brought a better seed.
And no advantage for the player from the winner bracket ?
Wtf
Edpayasugo
Profile Joined April 2013
United Kingdom2215 Posts
May 12 2020 09:12 GMT
#56
INno vs Cure in R3 please
FlaSh MMA INnoVation FanTaSy MKP TY Ryung | soO Dark Rogue | HuK PartinG Stork State
LemonyTang
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom428 Posts
May 12 2020 09:46 GMT
#57
Are servers still being decided by the 'fairest' rule?
Mvp #1
Geo.Rion
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
7377 Posts
May 12 2020 09:51 GMT
#58
On May 12 2020 17:57 stilt wrote:
This format is such a hype killer.
And even worst, it's the reason why we got some stupid situations where losing brought a better seed.
And no advantage for the player from the winner bracket ?
Wtf

unfortunate about the qualifiers, but what's this new outrage about no winner finalist advantage?
It's not a thing, it hasnt been a thing for a long time, and it lead to shitty finals when it was a thing years ago.

The people who usually end up winning the upper bracket are anyways the best players, like Maru, Serral, Dark it's fine that they're "robbed" of a second chance. On the flip side, they're always invited to everything and have highly preferential treatment in the beginning (skipping rounds, being nr 1-2 seed in brackets, the whole group-picking thing in GSL).
Overall it balances out, and it would make no sense to bring back the archaic 1 map advantage from like 2013 or so.
"Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011
Julmust
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Sweden4867 Posts
May 12 2020 10:10 GMT
#59
On May 12 2020 17:02 StarcraftPeffo wrote:
Day 9 comes in sunday, right?


Correct!

On May 12 2020 18:46 LemonyTang wrote:
Are servers still being decided by the 'fairest' rule?


No. There will be another rule in place. There is still a (very) small amount of leeway for server scheduling but it's not the fairest server rule used in the qualifier.
AdministratorI'm dancing in the moonlight
hjpalpha
Profile Joined August 2017
Germany339 Posts
May 12 2020 10:47 GMT
#60
Days 1& 2 are scheduled: (Wiki)TeamLiquid StarLeague/5
LiquipediaSCV ready | SC2-Liquipedia Admin, reviewer and editor | Wax called me a Liquipedia wizard in one of his articles for 2019 WCS Standings
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